NEW Star Wars Soundtrack Box in 2007

[GoodMusician 56]

yea... I know people who've listened to ROTJ and said it sounded fine...

I almost died...

I'm a string player as well, so I know what strings should sound like... and I also listen for them. ROTJ murders their sound to the point where they are almost not present.

ESB is ok, but the sound is definately tinkered with... why they felt the need to narrow it is beyond me...

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

I'm a string player as well, so I know what strings should sound like... and I also listen for them. ROTJ murders their sound to the point where they are almost not present.

Luke and Leia is mostly strings and it can be heard... :spiny:

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Listen to Through the Flames from the Anthology. Then listen to The Main Reactor on the SE.

[fommes 153]

What I mean is a perfect sequence of music,IN ORDER,that starts at the beginning of ESB and concludes with Han Solo entering the rebel base on Hoth WITHOUT the "other stuff",which could be put elsewhere on the album.

I know what you meant actually Could you provide timings? Which other stuff shouldn't be in there? Do you mean alternates etc. I know about the first 1:14 on track 4 which is an alternate for the opening.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

I think the film version put in track 4 is the only "other stuff"

[Ollie 1,059]

What I mean is a perfect sequence of music,IN ORDER,that starts at the beginning of ESB and concludes with Han Solo entering the rebel base on Hoth WITHOUT the "other stuff",which could be put elsewhere on the album.

Oh you want the chopped hacked version ala TPM Ultimate Edition instead of the original complete cues as Williams wrote and intended them to be.

[Vaderbait1 1]

The TPM UE gets a bad rep. It's not nearly as bad as the beginning of ESB in the film. Don't even attempt to sequence the music in ESB, the edits are akin to the Arena Battle in AOTC.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

NOT THAT much...

At least Williams got to composed some music for ESB scenes...

[Vaderbait1 1]

True, at least it's new music. I simply meant that it was butchered together where it couldn't possibly sound good without sound effects to cover things up.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Yes but that's why Nick Redman and Mike Mattesino did not release a 2 CD set with those edits, but with what John Williams composed for the film instead.

Makes sense, doesn't it?

[John Crichton 4]

The TPM UE gets a bad rep.  It's not nearly as bad as the beginning of ESB in the film.

Now I'll be the first to argue that bad music editing didn't start in the prequels (There's some real "gems" in Jedi in particular), but this comparison is just silly. All those final film edits in the OT didn't find their way onto CD. And they aren't nearly as bad as the ones in the prequels. Well, TPM and AOTC at least. Other than the tracked music ROTS seems to come of pretty well editing wise.

[Ollie 1,059]

The TPM UE gets a bad rep.  It's not nearly as bad as the beginning of ESB in the film.  Don't even attempt to sequence the music in ESB, the edits are akin to the Arena Battle in AOTC.

Uh yeah............ :spiny:

[Vaderbait1 1]

The problem with TPM isn't the jarring edits that obviously don't sound good together (at least when compared to the beginning of ESB and the end of AOTC), it's that some people didn't like that it wasn't how it was originally recorded. I'm talking the quality of the edits here. I never could tell that TPM was torn apart and re-edited back before I became an audiophile, but I could tell right away AOTC and ESB were.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

That's just a load of crap!

[Vaderbait1 1]

Well, maybe not ESB, but AOTC was god-awful. I didn't notice the differences in ESB until I tried to edit it.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

That's the point. In TPM and AOTC one can hear the edits while seeing the film.

TESB's edits are no were near as bad.

[robthehand 3]

I actually think TESB's edits helped the film (mostly). The scenes where music was written by cut probably work better because of it. TPM's edits are horrible and messy, while AOTC (I believe) actually has a few jump-cuts in the music.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

I actually think TESB's edits helped the film (mostly). The scenes where music was written by cut probably work better because of it.

Definitely. It was a poorly spotted film, but most of it was luckily corrected at the final stages of post-production.

[Henry B 50]

I have to admit, the Phantom Menace Ultimate Edition was my first CD (set) ever, and when I got it, I couldn't tell it was hacked apart at all. When I played the TPM computer game, I thought, "huh, I don't recognize this action music, was it for a cut scene?"

Hah.

The funny part is that TPM isn't even edited for a good reason. Listen to d2 t17 "The Republic Pilots Take Off Into Space," then listen to OST t12 "Panaka and the Queen's Protectors." Up to 35 seconds, the original cue in fact matches the film perfectly. It didn't need to be resequenced and looped at all.

[Demodex 557]

I'd like a version of the SEs that includes every piece of music recorded.  I would like it in chronological order and not all screwed aroudn with like ANH SE was, but preferably without any irritating edits.   Same goes for the PT.  Give it to us as it was recorded in chronological order.

How in the world was ANH "all screwed around with"???? It sounds great. And where are these irritating edits? I can't hear any of them.

[Henry B 50]

The Star Wars SE does combine several cues that should have been left separate, like "X-wings Draw Fire" and "Use the Force." However, it's completely in chronological order, with the exception of "Princess Leia's Theme," "Binary Sunset (Alternative)," and the five takes of "Main Title."

[Ollie 1,059]

That's the point. In TPM and AOTC one can hear the edits while seeing the film.

TESB's edits are no were near as bad.

He speaks the truth.

[King Mark 3,631]

Well except the tracking of Hyperspace over the snowspeeder search at the beginning.That has always bothered me.

K.M.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

I think the snowspeeder music might have been to "jolly" for that scene. Hyperspace has more urgency to it.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

If the boxed set has complete "as-recorded-by-Williams" versions from all 6 films, it will be my favorite boxed set in the history of mankind.

If its repackaged poop that we already have, and especially no prequel expansions... then we should send them back and demand a refund.

Personally, I feel like they will be improvements. The other ones are still in-print, so why would they release them again? Its nonsensical! Sony released the repackaged ones because they won the rights to and the previous publisher stopped printing them. Unless Sony lost the rights, I see absolutely no reason why these won't be more definitive versions.

But will it be all 6 scores? Or just the OCT?

-Chris

PS- I love all ESB music, but the edits still work in the film - though I'd love a DVD with all of the music properly replaced. AOTC was the only one where the edits were terrible throughout. TPM and ROTS were only poorly edited in small spots (in comparison to Clones, that is).

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

Well except the tracking of Hyperspace over the snowspeeder search at the beginning.That has always bothered me.

K.M.

That bothered me in the same way the 'missing' piano hits for the AT AT did.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

Yep. And for some reason, I love the Anthology's louder percussion in Luke's 1st Crash. As I also do with the Sith mixes that have louder percussion as well.

[Ollie 1,059]

If its repackaged poop that we already have, and especially no prequel expansions... then we should send them back and demand a refund.

-Chris

If that's the case I wouldn't even waste my time buying it in the first place.

[ymenard 54]

ANH:SE > TESB:SE > ROTJ:SE > ROTS > AOTC > TPM >(insert every other release) > TPM:UE

I cannot even listen to the TPM:UE, edits flow in average each 30 seconds. My ears hurt. It's got a nice sound quality, for sure. And it's a nice Johnny score. But everything else is pure edited crap-o-matic.

To even compare the RCA/Victor stuff to it is pure blasphemy on this board. There's perhaps half a dozen edits in TESB and ROTJ. There's hundreds of them in the TPM:UE. It's not even an uneducated opinion, it's heresy!

[Trent B 337]

As I said I for one will buy this box set in a heart beat. It's great to speculate but there's such a thing as over-speculating. We just have to wait until the time grows closer to get more offical information. Only 9 months left gents.

[Demodex 557]

I don't hear any edits when I listen to TPM:UE.

[ymenard 54]

Just search the board demodex, far since the release have we talked about it's mediocrity here on the various boards... Nobody was ever able to defend TPM:UE, 'cause it's impossible.

There are edits everywhere, by the _hundreds_ It's impossible to keep a correct tempo all throughout the two CD's because of all the pitched up, pitched down, stretched up or cut out notes, passages, instruments, etc... It's ear grating, because you know that Johnny would NEVER write such passages, it's against the normality of classical writing. And if you listen to the "other" alternative versions, you'll understand that a nicely done version like the RCA/Victor (giving us non-edited versions conducted by Johnny himself) would be amazing and really put the score on the same level than the original trilogy.

It's a fact man not an opinion. You will understand someday!

[King Mark 3,631]

I don't hear any edits when I listen to TPM:UE.

8O

You can start with "Anakin Takes Off in his Spaceship"

[Henry B 50]

The sound quality of the TPM UE is excellent, and it certainly surpasses that of the "remastered" OT scores.

[GoodMusician 56]

Not to be rude... and as much as I agree with many of the sentements/resentments here... I think we should perhaps get back on topic...

If the rhumor is to be believed, that they are indeed selling a box set of all 6 films scores, It would be great... the fan boys dream... but alas, I believe it to be just a dream. So lets examine this:

In my efforts with Episode I, I have found that... there is almost no "Good way" to present a score.

You can do it "as recorded," but then you loose the transitions that John Williams INTENDS to be there... such as in TPM between "Main Title" and "Arrival at Naboo" or "It was a Sith" and the track I call "Crisis on Naboo." (right after Qui-Gon is attacked as they leave Tatooine and then the camera jumps to a night shot of the naboo palace in Theed)

Those transitions are MEANT to be there. That is TRULY the intention of John Williams (if you are going to TRULY go by his intentions)... But if you present everything, and as recorded, you loose those.

You want to go by JW's intention, then that's another option... and a possible one... but then you get the OT's SE's. People complain not only about the sound on them, but that they don't preserve the clean endings...

Then you have the other option which is present it as it is in the film as the UE did...but then you have all the edits. That takes time to clean them, and then you have the problem of people complaining lol.

Then you have the original albums which are really more like Concert suites that, instead of being arranged and recorded for the album as they were back when John Williams started (Goodbye Mr. Chips, Checkmate etc.), these are created by using the film recordings and editing them together to create "mock" concert suites.

So, now when you go to release the music... you're presented with a problem.... Just how do you do it and keep the integrity and keep the fanbase happy.

If you include too much music, no one will buy it because it'll become $40 quite easily... but if you don't include it all... you have people complaining, but a bigger profit.

The Episode I edits I've done easily fit on 2 disks... but with all the alternates and first runs and maybe some interviews--while still perserving some flow to the cd's (ie: not putting all 6 DOTF recordings one after another) you easily get 4 disks...that's ONE score...

So Episode I is like 4 disks... Episode II is about 3... Episode III is at least 2... and then the OT's have already been released to a "satisfactory" release... (another 6 disks)... you get a 15 DISK BOX SET! (And even with just the OSTs you get a 12 disk! That's still... HUGE!... that would easily be $100+

And what I mean by "satisfactory" towards the OT's, I mean "satisfactory" by GL standards. As much as I wish he would, he's not gonna call in John Williams and the LSO and re-record the complete score, altearnates and all, for the ROTJ... which would be my DREAM... to have it all... no edits... no missing segments...

They arn't going to do that... and I doubt they've found the masters again... So asking for more from the OT is beating a dead horse... there really isn't any more...

It's the Prequils that will get the most attention...

I just feel this rhumor is, sadly, a fanboy's dream. I could imagine a Prequils box set, with complete scores of each... but not a Saga edition (atleast, not with anything except the OSTs).

[King Mark 3,631]

I don't think we'll even get expanded AotC and RotS.

k.M.

[skyy38 21]

What I mean is a perfect sequence of music,IN ORDER,that starts at the beginning of ESB and concludes with Han Solo entering the rebel base on Hoth WITHOUT the "other stuff",which could be put elsewhere on the album.

Oh you want the chopped hacked version ala TPM Ultimate Edition instead of the original complete cues as Williams wrote and intended them to be.

What Williams wrote and intended and what wound up on the final version of the film are two distinct and separate issues.I don't mind extras and outtakes and alternate cues but PLEASE don't insult my intelligence(not you mark ) by goofing up the chronological order of the tracks for the sake of "variety",which was the chief reason given for the sequencing order of the Star Wars ST when it was first released in '77.It was f*cking CONFUSING when I was listening to one part of the "movie" and then all of a sudden you're pushed forward to another section just for the sake of "variety".I mean where the hell was the first 5 seconds of "Battle of Yavin" for petes sake? I was always wondering about that up until the SEST was released.

Empires problems date back to vinyl also.After the crawl and the brief reading of the Imperial motif,it goes right into something totally foreign instead of the gentle, whistling,strings and winds probe droid music.And what do we get 17 years later on CD?THE SAME DAMN THING!Give me a break!

I will figure out the timecode for the parts that I am talking about lotman.

It's the Prequils that will get the most attention...

I just feel this rhumor is, sadly, a fanboy's dream. I could imagine a Prequils box set........

Is "prequils" what you take before "Nyquil"?

8O

LOL

[King Mark 3,631]

Empires problems date back to vinyl also.After the crawl and the brief reading of the Imperial motif,it goes right into something totally foreign instead of the gentle, whistling,strings and winds  probe droid music.And what do we get 17 years later on CD?THE SAME DAMN THING!Give me a break!

.

I agree about the probe droid landing music.I've wanted to re-edit that where it is in the film.At least we have the cue on the SE.

K.M.

[Henry B 50]

Actually, skyy38 is right. There are several cues misplaced on the ESB and RotJ SEs (apparently, nobody thought we'd notice?). These include "The Probe Droid," an alternative section of "Carbon Freeze," (it's simply mixed in and follows the film version), the alternative "Han Solo Returns" is mixed into "Luke Confronts Jabba," the film version of "The Emperor Arrives" is pasted before "The Lightsaber," and the alternative version of "Funeral Pyre for a Jedi," follows the film version.

Anything I missed?

[King Mark 3,631]

At least they are there

K.M.

[Indiana_Fett 0]

At least they are there

K.M.

I agree.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

Me three.

I am hoping that it is a proper representation of complete scores for all 6 films. I understand this is difficult on TPM because he supposedly scored and re-scored the final reel 2 or 3 times... but I believe it can be done on 2 CDs. look... most of us have made respectable 2-CD edits concerning TPM, so there is no reason to believe that all of the people at Sony or Lucasfilm will be too incompetant to do it. Especially if they've heard one of ours or they are a knowledgable insider.

Extras from all 6 scores could probably fit on 1 CD if you cared (but if we had well-done 2-CD sets to all 6 scores, extras would just be a cherry on top of a massive sundae, and not totally essential). But if we had 1 true representation in this boxed set, then I don't think that it is impossible.

I, for one, will only buy it if it IS NOT a re-package of the SEs and UE AND it has unreleased music. Because if it is, it would be the holy grail of my CD collection.

Any repackage of the UE would be a massive slap in the face of the fans - AND a huge public relations mistake - considering the stink we all raised when it was originally released. The OCT is well-represented when you combine the original albums, the Anthology boxed set and the SEs - so it would also seem like piling on points when the game is 142-3. So a repackage of the SEs would be a waste of time and also a waste of money in terms of packaging and advertising.

Considering these things... if you ask me... it will be an all-new boxed set. My only question is.... is it all 6 scores? Or only the OCT?

[King Mark 3,631]

I'll be happy if it only has the unreleased music from AotC and RotS.I can live with a homemade edited TPM and without the few seconds of music missing from Empire and Jedi.The unreleased bits from TPM have shown up time and time again in many videogames over the years.I'm doubting there are completely new and unheard cues from TPM left.

I do think there are completely new and unheard cues from AotC and RotS that didn't even make it into the film.

K.M.

[Trent B 337]

I'll be happy if it only has the unreleased music from AotC and RotS.I can live with a homemade edited TPM and without the few seconds of music missing from Empire and Jedi.The unreleased bits from TPM have shown up time and time again in many videogames over the years.I'm doubting there are completely new and unheard cues from TPM left.

K.M.

Indeed. I also doubt there is any new unheard music from TPM left. I think we pretty much have everything from The Phantom Menace now.

We can only speculate at this point what this box set will be (if it's true, which I think it is). We only have just over 9 months until the offical 30th Anniversary for Star Wars and for Celebration IV. Hopefully by then we'll get more information.

Edit: I am honestly hoping it will be the original intended editions for the Prequels for this supposed box set. Only time will tell when we get more solid offical information.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

I agree. It is only acceptable if it has expanded Clones and Sith scores. It is true that the previous releases of the OCT and TPM leave somehing more to be desired... but Clones and Sith are the only two really lacking.

BTW, Trent... I'm still waiting for your edit of Sith. Been waiting since last Feburary I think! 8O

[King Mark 3,631]

Well there is one cue from TPM i wonder about.What music originally scored The Gungans Retreat,since that cue on the UE was proven to go in the pod race(it's Anakin Defeats Sebulba in the OST and there was a "making of" documentary matching that cue to the end of the pod race).I'm wondering if this is the only remaining cue we haven't heard..or has this been elucidated since I last wondered about it...

K.M.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

I'm actually wondering if I would run out straight away and buy a 12-disc set, if I already have half of those.

But they'll probably release the scores seperately as well, just like they did with the 2004 re-release of the OT.

[Goldsmithfan 6]

Actually, skyy38 is right. There are several cues misplaced on the ESB and RotJ SEs (apparently, nobody thought we'd notice?). These include "The Probe Droid," an alternative section of "Carbon Freeze," (it's simply mixed in and follows the film version), the alternative "Han Solo Returns" is mixed into "Luke Confronts Jabba," the film version of "The Emperor Arrives" is pasted before "The Lightsaber," and the alternative version of "Funeral Pyre for a Jedi," follows the film version.

Anything I missed?

The film version of "The Emperor Arrives" right before "The Lightsaber" is the only thing that really distracts me. And man, does it distract the hell out of me. Couldn't the alternates have all waited until the end of the discs???

[John Crichton 4]

While I also think that we have most/all of TPM now, I can't help but wonder if there's bits from Williams original Battle of Naboo still out there that haven't seen the light of day yet. The final pieces of the puzzle, so to speak.

[Henry B 50]

Nobody really knows how the cue "Laser Fight March" ends. And, of course, the film version of "Augie's Great Municipal Band" is unreleased.

KM, there's a short action cue that is probably "The Gungans Retreat." It's not nearly as long as the film scene, but it's something.