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The Official Intrada Thread


Trent B

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I wish people were more polite and courteous towards each other on this forum instead of jumping down each other's throats for no reason

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14 hours ago, publicist said:

Yavar, relax, we're not writing a thesis on this shit. And i once saw 'The Chairman' and there sure wasn't a significant amount of music left off (certainly not showstoppers like 'Fire Fight'). 

 

Been meaning to add publicist to my "ignore" list for years.  Time's come.

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THE CHAIRMAN -- music sketches 
J. Lee Thompson; 1969 (20th Century-Fox, 1969)
contains: 
1-1 "Main Title," 9 pages; 
1-2 "Old Times," 1 page; 
3-1 "Goodbye For Now," 4 pages; 
3-1a "The City," 4 pages; 
4-2 "A Late Visitor," 12 pages; 
4-3 "The Airport," 8 pages; 
5-1 "The Schools," 5 pages; 
5-2 "The Red Guard," 5 pages; 
7-1 "Hathaway's Arrival," 6 pages; 
7-3 "The Bottle," 4 pages; 
8-2 "The Students," 9 pages; 
9-1 "The Laboratory," 13 pages; 
10-1 "Hathaway's Plans (part 1)," 5 pages; 
10-1 "Hathaway's Plans (part 2)," 8 pages; 
10-2 "Hathaway's Flight," 20 pages; 
11-1 "The Mine," 9 pages; 
11-2 "The Russians Are Coming," 6 pages; 
12-1 "Countdown," 4 pages; 
12-2 "The Bomb," 2 pages; 
12-3 "End Title," 3 pages; 
12-3 "End Credits," 2 pages; 
"The Chairman Love Theme," 4 pages [not in the hand of Jerry Goldsmith] 

https://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=111632&forumID=1&archive=0

 

Scroll on down that same post and you’ll even see that the reason James Fitzpatrick did not have someone reconstruct this score by ear from the film: some cues are dialed out in it...not everything Goldsmith wrote/recorded made it in.

 

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It does include "The Marketplace" but it's nowhere near complete--there's a LOT more music in the movie. This appears to be just a combination of the original release with "The Marketplace" added from the Varese Fox box.

—Jeff Bond, here:

https://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=84276&forumID=1&archive=0

 

Quote

Very glad to have a good-sounding version of the album...but it is too bad a more complete version can't be put together. Clearly there IS material to be had as evidenced by the Goldsmith @ Fox boxed set--and the final action set piece (post "The Fence" in the film) is as exciting as "Firefight" and "The Fence."

—Jeff Bond again, here:

https://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=27161&forumID=1&archive=1

 

Thus ends my thesis, publicist! I think I’ll trust Goldsmith expert Jeff Bond (who counts this as one of his favorite Goldsmith scores and has no doubt seen the film repeatedly) over your distant memory of having seen the film once...to say nothing of the Herrick Library written cue contents which certainly seem to indicate a lot more music than the short 32 minute album, even though it provides page numbers of written score rather than timings of recorded score (and I concede we don’t know how it matches up with the album exactly due to some title differences).

 

Yavar

 

P.S. A ray of hope appears for Bernstein fans!
http://www.intrada.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=8195&sid=34b091f7ba2c46cf7dc2cf48b6fbc6a0

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New post from Roger

 

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Now that we're halfway through, here's a look at some composers that mostly likely will get some attention this year:

Jerry Fielding, Bruce Broughton, Christopher Young, John Barry, Bill Conti, Lalo Schifrin, Kenyon Hopkins, Frank DeVol, John Barry, Elmer Bernstein, Jerry Goldsmith, and maybe but who knows Basil Poledouris

 

 

http://www.intrada.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=8195

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That's three times he's given us a list of composers for the year

 

His March 17 original list:

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In fact we have many albums done stuck in approvals so March may not have much. But a glimpse of some composers you can expect to see over the next several months - Joel McNeely, John Barry, Jerry Goldsmith, Basil Poledouris (sigh), Bill Conti, John Williams, James Horner, Hugo Friedhofer, Bruce Broughton, Craig Safan, Chris Young, Lalo Schifrin, Sylvester Levay and more!

 

His April 2nd update:

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An update to the list: Joel McNeely, John Barry, Jerry Goldsmith, Basil Poledouris (maybe...no promises yet), Bill Conti, John Williams, James Horner, Hugo Friedhofer, Bruce Broughton, Craig Safan, Chris Young, Lalo Schifrin, Sylvester Levay, Richard Band, Laurence Rosenthal, Jerry Fielding, Bear McCreary, Randy Edelman, possibly Frank DeVol and more! And sometimes more than one by these composers! This includes some world premieres, reissues, expansions...a little of everything.

 

And now his June 17th update: 

Quote

Now that we're halfway through, here's a look at some composers that mostly likely will get some attention this year: 

Jerry Fielding, Bruce Broughton, Christopher Young, John Barry, Bill Conti, Lalo Schifrin, Kenyon Hopkins, Frank DeVol, John Barry, Elmer Bernstein, Jerry Goldsmith, and maybe but who knows Basil Poledouris

 

Out of the composers listed, we already got:

 

McNeely - Iron Will

Williams - Monsignor

Safan - Son of the Morning Star

Fielding - Lawman

Band - Unlucky Charms

Edelman - Backdraft II

 

 

That means the composers we haven't gotten yet are:

McCreary (though it seems 99% sure they are releasing Happy Death Day 2U tonight)

John Barry

Jerry Goldsmith

Basil Poledouris

Bill Conti

James Horner

Hugo Friedhofer

Bruce Broughton

Chris Young

Lalo Schifrin

Sylvester Levay

Laurence Rosenthal

Frank DeVol

Kenyon Hopkins

Elmer Bernstein

 

 

 

Still hoping the Schifrin is EARTH STAR VOYAGER!

 

I wonder what the most likely Horner is?

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1 hour ago, Jay said:

New post from Roger

 

I had shared this with my added in P.S. above, but I should have done what you did and actually quoted his words here.

 

Great job summing up the info about the three lists. One thing to point out: we can pretty much ignore the first list at this point, because the second list is identical to it (even listing in identical order), up until the first ends at Levay and the second list starts adding on more with Band and Rosenthal.

 

The third and most recently list on the other hand, adds composers but also omits a number of them that were on the previous list (including, sadly for me, Friedhofer).

 

59 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

He wrote John Barry twice. 

 

This may have been a mistake, or it might also be Roger indicating that there are two Barrys coming up. I remember (last year, I think it was) he previously did an "upcoming on Intrada" list that included Horner no less than *three* times, which was surely intentional.

 

Yavar

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59 minutes ago, Jay said:

I wonder what the most likely Horner is?

 

I would bet it's a continuation of their series of MCA expansions since they've been on such a roll with those over the past year (*batteries not included, Balto, Apollo 13, An American Tail were all MCA titles...to say nothing of the other Universal Music Group titles they've been expanding by other composers, like Goldsmith's The Lonely Guy and The Mummy, and Silvestri's Mummy Returns). So here's a list of the remaining unexpanded MCA Horner titles:

The Land Before Time (this seems most likely due to the general popularity of the score and amounts it's selling for on the secondhand market; only a little over 10 min of missing music)

Dad (anyone know how much unreleased music there is for this score?)

An American Tail: Feivel Goes West (also seems extremely likely that Intrada would expand the sequel score like they did the first)

We're Back! A Dinosaurs Story

Casper

 

Those five are I think the most likely, with the two animated titles topping my guess list.

 

The Man Without A Face is on the Phillips label and A Beautiful Mind is on the Decca label, which are both UMG-owned, and there's also The Pursuit of D.B. Cooper which had a soundtrack release on Polydor (a UMG-owned label which originally released Cocoon, already longer ago expanded by Intrada) including a couple of score cues.

 

EMI (which owned the Angel and Virgin labels) was also absorbed by Universal Music Group a couple years ago, which could potentially add other possibilities to Intrada's Horner UMG licensing, like Courage Under Fire, The Name of the Rose, Red Heat, Glory, and Willow (additional cues for the latter would have to be licensed from Disney now that they bought Lucasfilm).

 

Of course, at any point Intrada might also do an expansion of a Disney-owned Horner (which now includes Willow thanks to the Lucasfilm purchase, but even might be one which they previously released but in incomplete form, like Honey I Shrunk the Kids, The Journey of Natty Gann, or Something Wicked This Way Comes).

 

It *won't* likely be Field of Dreams, since that's a Sony Music-owned album, unless it's one of the two Roger already had in the works before the moratorium. Jumanji, The Spitfire Grill, The Devil's Own, Deep Impact, Bicentennial Man, Freedom Song, Enemy At the Gates, Iris, Sneakers, Legends of the Fall, A Perfect Storm, The Four Feathers, Windtalkers, The Missing, the two Zorro scores, The Amazing Spiderman, Southpaw, The Magnificent Seven, and To Gillian on her 37th Birthday are in the same Sony boat. It also probably won't be an expansion of Another 48 Hrs., because that was a Scotti Bros. album, owned by Volcano, now owned by Epic (a division of Sony Music...Wikipedia is helpful when it comes to tracking down label ownership). It also probably won't be an expansion of My Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys, the original album of which had two Horner score cues...Sony again:

https://www.discogs.com/Various-My-Heroes-Have-Always-Been-Cowboys/release/4810728

 

Personally if I'm hoping Intrada has one Horner in the works already licensed from Sony Music...it's Sneakers. That one really needs an expansion. Ditto A Perfect Storm. But I'm not holding my breath. There is also Legends of the Fall, but at least for that there was a complete isolated score track so we Horner fans have recourse...

 

One entry at SoundtrackCollector has me confused:

http://soundtrackcollector.com/title/7626/Once+Upon+A+Forest

 

Is Once Upon a Forest Fox Records, or RCA (which would make it another Sony Music title)?

If expansions of Bopha! or The Pelican Brief ever come out, I would expect them more from LLL, as they previous expanded the other Big Screen Records Horner. And of course there's a batch of Varese-controlled Horner titles as well, starting with Brainstorm and going through the 2010s...

 

Yavar

P.S. Now watch me get egg on my face when Intrada suddenly announces something out of left field like an expansion of their Thunderheart album, lol!

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1 hour ago, Yavar Moradi said:

EMI (which owned the Angel and Virgin labels) was also absorbed by Universal Music Group a couple years ago, which could potentially add other possibilities to Intrada's Horner UMG licensing, like Courage Under Fire, The Name of the Rose, Red Heat, Glory, and Willow (additional cues for the latter would have to be licensed from Disney now that they bought Lucasfilm).

 

Do we know for certain that UMG got hold of all the EMI soundtrack titles? I'm asking because UMG weren't allowed to purchase EMI's classical music catalogue, which now is owned by Warner.

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5 hours ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Thus ends my thesis, publicist! I think I’ll trust Goldsmith expert Jeff Bond (who counts this as one of his favorite Goldsmith scores and has no doubt seen the film repeatedly) over your distant memory of having seen the film once...to say nothing of the Herrick Library written cue contents which certainly seem to indicate a lot more music than the short 32 minute album, even though it provides page numbers of written score rather than timings of recorded score (and I concede we don’t know how it matches up with the album exactly due to some title differences).

 

I prefer 'A Shot in The Dark' or 'Hallelujah Trail'.

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23 minutes ago, publicist said:

 

I prefer 'A Shot in The Dark' or 'Hallelujah Trail'.

 

And that's fine! I love both those scores and would be ecstatic for either to get a complete release from one of our specialty labels. But *this* particular upcoming Intrada release is almost certainly not going to be one of those, no matter how much you prefer it! You are ignoring the evidence staring you right in the face, if you think it's going to be either title (especially "A Shot in the Dark" because it never had an original LP album at all.)

 

24 minutes ago, Kasey Kockroach said:

Ewww, it's you again! The Anti-Thor! 

 

Not *exactly*. Thor thinks 99.9% of scores play better in truncated and mixed-out-of-order form, no matter how great they are. I'd think that the anti-Thor would have the position that 99.9% of scores play better in complete and chronological form, no matter their quality. That's not my position.

 

Plenty of scores (by lesser composers, I would say) don't play great in complete form. Listening to the average Brian Tyler score in complete form is torture (and I like a lot of Tyler just fine, but he doesn't vary his material enough in interesting ways to play in complete/chronological form without losing my attention/patience). I completely understand Thor's point of view that scores can come across as much better/stronger in truncated form, on album outside of the film context. But I just don't think that applies to 99.9% of Jerry Goldsmith (or Elmer Bernstein, or Basil Poledouris, or Miklos Rozsa, or...) scores. And it's not only about the era. I get bored listening to a lot of complete Victor Young scores as well...he's good at writing themes, though, so I'm likely to enjoy a Victor Young compilation that just gives me main themes from his films. But he doesn't usually vary those themes in interesting enough ways IMO, and I don't want to hear the same theme presented in the same straightforward way, over and over...not even for a famous and beloved film/score like Shane.

 

27 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Do we know for certain that UMG got hold of all the EMI soundtrack titles? I'm asking because UMG weren't allowed to purchase EMI's classical music catalogue, which now is owned by Warner.

 

I'm not 100% sure about these more recent developments as its been a few years since I worked full time as a music buyer in the retail music industry. I did a Google search and found this on Wikipedia, which seems to indicate some truth to your statement (but it's such a mess, with Universal, Warner, *and* Sony splitting up EMI):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMI#Sony/Universal/Warner_sale

 

Yavar

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5 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

And that's fine! I love both those scores and would be ecstatic for either to get a complete release from one of our specialty labels. But *this* particular upcoming Intrada release is almost certainly not going to be one of those, no matter how much you prefer it! You are ignoring the evidence staring you right in the face, if you think it's going to be either title (especially "A Shot in the Dark" because it never had an original LP album at all.)

 

So be it. I still think this obsessed quibbling is somewhat unhealthy - do people really need to amass such profound knowledge on a comparably trivial topic like this to post their preferences in a forum thread? I mean really...

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There's nothing wrong with a label head giving out clues for an upcoming title, forum members guessing what title the clues could be for, and responding to each other about why guesses fit or don't fit the clues provided.

 

If you don't want to participate... then don't!

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Jay's not proposing to do anything against it, far as I can see. But if you're free to post your uninformed guesses about what it could be which ignore the actual statements/evidence from the label in question, we are also more than free to post and correct you and tell you why you are wrong. And you can reply and make fun of our "profound knowledge on a comparably trivial topic". And we can say, "thanks for complimenting us by calling our knowledge profound...and if you find the topic so trivial, why are you here still arguing with us"?

 

:D

 

Yavar

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40 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Not *exactly*. Thor thinks 99.9% of scores play better in truncated and mixed-out-of-order form, no matter how great they are. I'd think that the anti-Thor would have the position that 99.9% of scores play better in complete and chronological form, no matter their quality. That's not my position.

 

Plenty of scores (by lesser composers, I would say) don't play great in complete form. Listening to the average Brian Tyler score in complete form is torture (and I like a lot of Tyler just fine, but he doesn't vary his material enough in interesting ways to play in complete/chronological form without losing my attention/patience). I completely understand Thor's point of view that scores can come across as much better/stronger in truncated form, on album outside of the film context. But I just don't think that applies to 99.9% of Jerry Goldsmith (or Elmer Bernstein, or Basil Poledouris, or Miklos Rozsa, or...) scores. And it's not only about the era. I get bored listening to a lot of complete Victor Young scores as well...he's good at writing themes, though, so I'm likely to enjoy a Victor Young compilation that just gives me main themes from his films. But he doesn't usually vary those themes in interesting enough ways IMO, and I don't want to hear the same theme presented in the same straightforward way, over and over...not even for a famous and beloved film/score like Shane.

 

 

 

I find it just depends on the specific score in question rather than the composer in general. Some films are structured in a way that allows the composer to keep the music interesting in complete form, sometimes not and it's just the theme repeated over and over, making a complete listen a slog. Bruce Broughton's Baby's Day Out is one of my favorites, top-tier for me as far as 90's comedy scoring goes. But good lord, the 80-minute complete listening that Intrada put out was not ideal (my 49-minute playlist, based somewhat off the promo release's tracklist, is where it's at). 

There's also cases where I actually enjoy the album and complete score equally, and sometimes go with the former playlist when I want to hear the score but don't have time for the whole thing (The Lost World, Gremlins 2). 

And often, I enjoy a complete score being released so that I have the power to decide for myself what music I want to include or exclude from my own playlist. But in general, more often that not, I find the composer had it right with what music to include or exclude from their original album (Christopher Young is practically the king of well-put together albums, and I'm usually fine with Goldsmith's and Horner's, with rare exceptions).

 

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34 minutes ago, publicist said:

Because it annoys you.

 

Hehe. I guess we should leave to to third parties to judge which of us comes across as more amused and which of us comes across as more annoyed, here. ;)

 

Speaking for myself, I think my post above displays at best a mild shrugging exasperation tied in with my amusement.

 

Yavar

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3 hours ago, Yavar Moradi said:

And that's fine! I love both those scores and would be ecstatic for either to get a complete release from one of our specialty labels. But *this* particular upcoming Intrada release is almost certainly not going to be one of those, no matter how much you prefer it! You are ignoring the evidence staring you right in the face, if you think it's going to be either title

 

Why? With Bernstein added to the lineup, the description seems to fit The Hallelujah Trail perfectly. With most of the actual score missing from the album release, it would be beyond wonderful if it turned out that the tapes weren't lost to water damage after all.

5 hours ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Personally if I'm hoping Intrada has one Horner in the works already licensed from Sony Music...it's Sneakers. That one really needs an expansion.

 

I'm a big fan of the score (it's without a doubt my favourite Horner score), and of the film, too. And yet I don't really recall anything significant missing from the album. The existing release plays perfectly and sounds great. I'd buy it of course, just in case, but it never seemed to me that a new release was necessary for this one.

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26 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

Why? With Bernstein added to the lineup, the description seems to fit The Hallelujah Trail perfectly. With most of the actual score missing from the album release, it would be beyond wonderful if it turned out that the tapes weren't lost to water damage after all.

 

Yes it is now *possible* (though in no way more likely than the Barry or Goldsmith options that have been bandied about). It would still be a particular surprise to me, because it was no mere rumor that the score was destroyed by water damage, but a story relayed by Robert Townson in painful detail, in the liner notes for another Bernstein release. There's a difference between tapes being "lost" (could be in somebody's basement) and something being described in detail as physically destroyed (apart from the first couple minutes of the main title). But *maybe* someone uncovered a dupe that was made for Elmer himself, and only recently recovered from his own collection somehow. It's possible.
 

26 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

I'm a big fan of the score (it's without a doubt my favourite Horner score), and of the film, too. And yet I don't really recall anything significant missing from the album. The existing release plays perfectly and sounds great. I'd buy it of course, just in case, but it never seemed to me that a new release was necessary for this one.

 

Hmmm...well, it just so happens at least that a 2 hour *something* did leak some time ago, for this fine score. If you heard it you might change your tune. :)

 

Yavar

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