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The Official Intrada Thread


Trent B

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Miles better than what Edelman offered in the rewrites. While 'Legend' was an early indication how composers were regularly treated from the 90's onwards, 'Robin Hood' and 'Last of the Mohicans' are prime examples for the ill consideration and indecision towards scores. Kamen was forced to produce 2 hours of music in a few days, Jones rewrote and rewrote before being unceremoniously dumped (though there wasn't enough time to replace the score whole).

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4 hours ago, Woj said:

Is Robin Hood really worth the hype? I don't think I've listened to it more than three times in my life in its entirety. I just skip from the main titles to the Bryan Adams song. 

 

Surely the Bryan Adams song is also something you’d want to skip?

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I always have found the three Kamen/Adams tunes from Robin Hood, Don Juan DeMarco and The Three Musketeers to be to the detriment of their respective scores.

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I don't think they mesh well with the score itself for me. I mean their adaptations always feel like intrusion of a different kind of sensibility into the score proper.

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2 hours ago, Stefancos said:

They arent supposed to mesh with the score proper.

I think he means themes within underscore, not songs themselves.

 

Karol

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18 minutes ago, crocodile said:

I think he means themes within underscore, not songs themselves.

 

Karol

Exactly.

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8 hours ago, Woj said:

Is Robin Hood really worth the hype? I don't think I've listened to it more than three times in my life in its entirety. I just skip from the main titles to the Bryan Adams song. 

 

Yes, the album was not a good selection of highlights from the entire score.

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16 minutes ago, publicist said:

Another spreadsheet?

 

Can’t have enough spreadsheets.

 

I know there’s quite a bit of music missing from the final two major set pieces, on the original album both appear to be combined into The Abduction and Final Battle Track. 

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1 hour ago, publicist said:

What do you get from that? Apart from the overture it's really mediocre, even by 1991 standards (which were significantly lower than, say, Korngold). 

 

I wouldn't be so harsh. The writing is very solid and competent, both in the action department and in the more lyrical passages. The quieter moments have some nice troubadour-like ornaments that I particularly like (apparently, Kamen wanted to do the whole score just on period instruments, but the filmmakers wanted a more traditional approach). Some nice oboe and flute solos in some sequences as well. Kamen wrote in a very "busy" fashion, with lots of notes, perhaps sometimes he went a tad too far in terms of thickness during some accompaniment scoring (nowadays this kind of writing would very much be jettisoned for being "too distracting"), but I sincerely prefer such a balls-to-the-wall approach than most of anemic atmospheric scoring that became the rule a few years later.

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9 minutes ago, TownerFan said:

Kamen wrote in a very "busy" fashion, with lots of notes, perhaps sometimes he went a tad too far in terms of thickness during some accompaniment scoring (nowadays this kind of writing would very much be jettisoned for being "too distracting"), 

 

It may be that kind of Tiomkin-like approach that turns me off. 

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It's understandable. A few nights ago I caught 101 Dalmatians live action remake on TV and the music in that movie is so loud and busy to the point of becoming insufferable. But it's surely very well-written music, so it might be better to listen to it away from the movie itself.

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Is Robin Hood better than The three Musketeers?

I've only listened once to the former (didn't catch me) but many times the latter, which I consider Kamen's best score, from the 10-15 that I have listened to.

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2 minutes ago, filmmusic said:

Is Robin Hood better than The three Musketeers?

 

Loads and loads better

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15 minutes ago, TownerFan said:

 

I wouldn't be so harsh. The writing is very solid and competent, both in the action department and in the more lyrical passages. The quieter moments have some nice troubadour-like ornaments that I particularly like (apparently, Kamen wanted to do the whole score just on period instruments, but the filmmakers wanted a more traditional approach). Some nice oboe and flute solos in some sequences as well. Kamen wrote in a very "busy" fashion, with lots of notes, perhaps sometimes he went a tad too far in terms of thickness during some accompaniment scoring (nowadays this kind of writing would very much be jettisoned for being "too distracting"), but I sincerely prefer such a balls-to-the-wall approach than most of anemic atmospheric scoring that became the rule a few years later.

Agreed 100%. It's not for everyone, of course; but I consider this work to be his magnum opus, especially knowing the constraints and time crunch in which he produced it. You're right on about the troubadour-like ornaments; the frequent use of the Dulcimer really brought this home, along with what sounds like a pan-flute(s) at times. This is the last of my childhood Holy Grail soundtracks, so I couldn't be more excited for it. 

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1 minute ago, crocodile said:

In terms of Kamen action scoring his magnum opus would be Die Hard 2.

 

Karol

Interesting. I shall have to give this one a re-listen. 

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2 minutes ago, jwalk713 said:

Interesting. I shall have to give this one a re-listen. 

Don't be put off by the relatively slow build up though. It's the kind of score that gradually gets more exciting. The final act is an action music heaven.

 

Karol

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At 110 minutes plus this new presentation would give the score a whole new life. Looking forward to it ie. I really hope it is ROBIN HOOD and not THE THREE MUSKETEERS. It would be quite a shock if it turned out to be the latter. 😁

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7 minutes ago, crocodile said:

Don't be put off by the relatively slow build up though. It's the kind of score that gradually gets more exciting. The final act is an action music heaven.

 

Karol

I absolutely love a good build-up like this. :) I'll hop on it at once. 

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I would think Roger would classify 1993 as "mid 90s", not "early 90s"... but its hard to know for sure of course.

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4 hours ago, jwalk713 said:

Agreed 100%. It's not for everyone, of course; but I consider this work to be his magnum opus, especially knowing the constraints and time crunch in which he produced it. You're right on about the troubadour-like ornaments; the frequent use of the Dulcimer really brought this home, along with what sounds like a pan-flute(s) at times. This is the last of my childhood Holy Grail soundtracks, so I couldn't be more excited for it. 

 

I will give it a try. Maybe the 15 years since i last heard it made all the difference.

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4 hours ago, jwalk713 said:

Interesting. I shall have to give this one a re-listen. 

 

4 hours ago, crocodile said:

Don't be put off by the relatively slow build up though. It's the kind of score that gradually gets more exciting. The final act is an action music heaven.

 

More importantly, don't be put off (like I was) by the lame original album. I hope the expansion gets a re-release someday.

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