Incanus 5,713 Posted September 16, 2017 Share Posted September 16, 2017 16 hours ago, BloodBoal said: This! Anyway, I don't see much of a point of repeating material already found on an album elsewhere, just because it underscored an important scene in the film so "it should be there". Not only is it a waste of CD space, but the reasoning behind their inclusion just doesn't make much sense to me. Because it "fills narrative holes", so to speak? It's done in an artificial way. Not interested. Plus, I'm sure even if a composer participated himself in the selection of the tracked music, he would be against its inclusion on complete release (since, given the chance, I'm sure the composer would have preferred writing a new piece of music instead of simply reusing one). A cue is written specifically for a scene: the composer wrote it with that scene in mind, he wrote it in a such a way that it would match the emotion found within that scene, and that it would musically convey the narrative of that scene. Put that cue in another context, and you rob it of its meaning. All this to say: no, tracked music doesn't belong on complete releases! Quite. I agree. Verily I say. Indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 OK, I really understand all your points, but hear me out. This might just be personal opinion or empty reaching for justification, so feel free to call bullshit on all this. If we look at a complete film score presentation as a narrative experience in the context of its movie (which I don't see why we wouldn't for complete releases, why would we want them to be complete and chronological then?), I think Chamber really suffers from the exclusion of some of those cues. I'll first have a look at the complete score as actually recorded. Take the Three Note Loop. In this movie it has been demoted to a general mystery motif. It builds throughout the score, its final appearance is Hagrid being revealed as the culprit by Tom. This feels cheap, to have the major mystery theme build up to a fakeout and never be heard again when the mystery itself continues. The main revelation and turning point of the movie is Voldemort being revealed to have been behind everything. Therefore, we don't hear his theme for the majority of the score, and we don't hear it in this presentation at all. We lose a crucial plot point and link to the previous score and film. The final action setpiece in the movie has 3 climaxes: the henchman's death (ending of Dueling the Dragon), the villain's death (Riddle's Demise), and the triumphant escape/return (Fawkes heals Harry), so it's minor climax-major climax-minor climax. By excluding the middle one, we only get two minor climaxes back to back, making the first one seem more important than it was written to be, and thus weaker, and making the second one much less catharctic. Now, if we include the cues The Opening Sink, I Am Lord Voldemort, and Riddle's Demise, we get a much more satisfying experience. The Three Note Loop is present for the two major mystery payoffs of finding the Chamber and the main culprit. The latter of these also transforms into Voldy's motif, tying them together again, and of course finally presenting it in this score. Riddle's Demise includes it again, and restores the climax structure so it has an actual payoff which the third and minor climax can resolve. These are not even last-minute choices, since the cue list calls for them to be tracked. The only unclear thing is why these weren't rerecorded with minor adjustments, like so many other cues in this score. (Although the Opening SInk seems weird to me - it possibly includes a new overlay for the 3 Note Loop.) Any thoughts on it like this? I know some of you will say I take it too close with the movie, but with a complete presentation I really can't separate them, and I'm not even sure one should. Brundlefly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,319 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 My thoughts are unchanged. There is no reason to include music tracked in from SS on a COS expanded score release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 6,647 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 I agree with @Holko. I think the score should include tracked pieces from the film, if they help the album program flow in a pleasing way - if it's done at the composer's request or discretion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Chamber is also a pretty unique case. I wouldn't mind it much with that specific score. But in general, I agree with BB's above post. Holko 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Only a Sith deals in absolutes!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wojo 2,453 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 30 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: Only a Sith deals in absolutes!!! And you're absolutely sure of that? Disco Stu and Pieter Boelen 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Just now, Woj said: And you're absolutely sure of that? I think you've just uncovered that Obi-Wan was always a secret Sith. If "only a Sith deals in absolutes" and Obi-Wan intends that statement as one of absolute truth then.... gasp! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 On 15.9.2017 at 4:04 PM, Holko said: Yes, but with Chamber, the composer intended those big cues to be tracked. CoS will have a few narrative gaps, since the tracked music won't be included on the complete score. Unlike the JP Collection the left space is needed for alternates and source music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bollemanneke 3,338 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 I hope any expanded HP2 release contains tracked music. After all, wouldn't it slightly broaden the general public's interest in COS's case? If you remove tracked music, there really are big holes in the score, story-wise. Myrtle's Tale just doesn't work for me if it doesn't contain that three note loop material and Tom Riddle needs to die too. And as has been pointed out already, JW wanted that music to be tracked. PS: Lots of people seem to assume such expanded releases are coming in the very near future. Dare I hope too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 At this point, the HP scores coming very very soon is just an inside joke based on far-fetched overexplanations of very wide statements. But they're definitely coming this Black Friday! bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 It will just be included if John Williams requests it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Nobody knows anything. We're only hoping. Just now, Holko said: At this point, the HP scores coming very very soon is just an inside joke based on far-fetched overexplanations of very wide statements. But they're definitely coming this Black Friday! Yep. Well, except that last part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brundlefly 2,385 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 11 minutes ago, BloodBoal said: And I doubt Williams would request it. I would doubt it, if he hadn't decided to put "tracked"/repeated music on the JPC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 4 minutes ago, Brundlefly said: I would doubt it, if he hadn't decided to put "tracked"/repeated music on the JPC. JPC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Jurassic Park Collection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 Did JW put tracked music inside the chronological program? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasm[+]Donor. 75 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 I do have a question for the LLL guy, how do you select the alternates you put in your editions: for instance in the Waterworld CD you have several alt, is that all there is or do you select the best of the alternates? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,319 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 They always include everything recorded whenever possible, of course. bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasm[+]Donor. 75 Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 thank you for the info dude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manakin Skywalker 4,891 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 12 hours ago, Orgasm[+]Donor. said: I do have a question for the LLL guy, how do you select the alternates you put in your editions: for instance in the Waterworld CD you have several alt, is that all there is or do you select the best of the alternates? I'm pretty sure nobody from LLL is on these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3,709 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 5 minutes ago, Manakin Skywalker said: I'm pretty sure nobody from LLL is on these forums. No, there is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bollemanneke 3,338 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 But they post more often in Film Score Monthly. Traitors! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 They value quality over quantity here at JWFAN, as it should be! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 At least Doug has our back on twitter. Bilbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Does he, really? I think it's all hypocrisy. Doug doesn't like us. Nobody does... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 It's true. They can make fun of us, but nobody can take our dignity!!!! Oh wait... bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 31 minutes ago, BloodBoal said: Does he, really? I think it's all hypocrisy. Doug doesn't like us. Nobody does... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,319 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 5 hours ago, Manakin Skywalker said: I'm pretty sure nobody from LLL is on these forums. http://www.jwfan.com/forums/index.php?/profile/21685-la-la-land-records/ Manakin Skywalker 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 6,647 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 18 hours ago, Orgasm[+]Donor. said: I do have a question for the LLL guy, how do you select the alternates you put in your editions: for instance in the Waterworld CD you have several alt, is that all there is or do you select the best of the alternates? I'm the LLL guy. We only pick alternates if they have really cool electric guitar riffs. I'm currently boiling a big pot of hot dogs and will include one wiener with every copy of E.T. ordered from the LLL store. Have a great day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,319 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Quote Here are LLL's release dates for the next 15 months 2017: SEPTEMBER 26 OCTOBER 10 OCTOBER 13 OCTOBER 24 NOVEMBER 7 NOVEMBER 28 2018: JANUARY 9 JANUARY 23 FEBRUARY 6 FEBRUARY 20 MARCH 6 MARCH 20 APRIL 3 APRIL 17 May 1 MAY 15 MAY 29 JUNE 12 JUNE 26 JULY 10 JULY 24 AUGUST 7 AUGUST 21 SEPTEMBER 4 SEPTEMBER 18 OCTOBER 2 OCTOBER 16 OCTOBER 30 NOVEMBER 13 NOVEMBER 27 http://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=118900&forumID=1&archive=0&pageID=11&r=567#bottom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstrox 6,647 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Was really hoping for an August 14 release next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 The August 7 release will more than make up for that. Believe me! bollemanneke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Just now, mstrox said: Was really hoping for an August 14 release this year heh. NO RELEASES ON JANUARY 16TH, NO DEAL Manakin Skywalker and bollemanneke 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3,709 Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 AUGUST 21 2018 is bad. That could clash with the All-Ireland hurling finals. That's affecting a big slice of their target audience. bollemanneke and Manakin Skywalker 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasm[+]Donor. 75 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 I dont know if someone has an answer to this one but why has LLL not released beverly hills cop 3? I dont remember the movie maybe there was nothing new in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 I hear the Sept 4th release will include the mixing bowls in the final cue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 3 hours ago, Orgasm[+]Donor. said: I dont know if someone has an answer to this one but why has LLL not released beverly hills cop 3? I dont remember the movie maybe there was nothing new in it. There was. It had the best variations on the Axel F theme actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasm[+]Donor. 75 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 so was it a question of licencing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 I have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasm[+]Donor. 75 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 too bad ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corellian2019 384 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 On 9/30/2017 at 0:03 PM, Orgasm[+]Donor. said: I dont know if someone has an answer to this one but why has LLL not released beverly hills cop 3? I dont remember the movie maybe there was nothing new in it. MV's words: Quote One of our goals when we first started working with paramount was to release Harold's scores to the BHC films. Perhaps, one day, we'll get around to doing the 3rd one. In the meantime, enjoy (and purchase), these two incredible scores! MV http://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?forumID=1&pageID=6&threadID=117627&archive=0 Orgasm[+]Donor. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 Nile Rodgers of the all-time great disco band Chic did the Axel F remixes for BEverly Hills Cop 3. Fun music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3,709 Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasm[+]Donor. 75 Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 Damn I had forgotten that fucking frog.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 Hateful thing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo 3,709 Posted October 1, 2017 Share Posted October 1, 2017 You’re welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,319 Posted October 2, 2017 Share Posted October 2, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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