GAME OF THRONES

[Quintus 5,399]

It was a weirdly slow download, but the audio does sound a bit off to me. Luckily VLC lets you slow it down a tad, and it's easy to rectify.

[Holko 9,499]

Am I the only one with self-control here?

[Quintus 5,399]

For me it's about avoiding spoilers. Game of Thrones nurtures them all over the web, it's always been that way for this show.

[Jay 37,287]

I edited some posts above to put commentary on the episode in spoiler blocks.  People who watch early, please, respect those who don't.  By all means say whatever you want to about the episode, just put it in a spoiler block.  Thanks.

[Marian Schedenig 8,174]

On 14/08/2017 at 5:47 PM, Woj said:

Speaking of which, I wonder if there is precedent for a member of the Night's Watch to legally remove the black to inherit his house, now that his father and brother are ash. 

 

Yes. Jon Snow. And he wasn't even legally the heir of his house.

On 14/08/2017 at 8:32 PM, Bilbo Skywalker said:

"I thought you might still be rowing" was fan service at its finest. 

 

I LOLed.

[Quintus 5,399]

3 hours ago, KK said:

As for the actual content of the episode

  Reveal hidden contents

, well, I think 

Game of Thrones has officially jumped the shark.

 

 

RE: jumping the shark.

If you're referring to the utterly ridiculous stage we've gotten to in regards to intercontinental communication and traveling speeds, I have to agree. I've seen the latest episode, and it's outright flagrantly taking the piss now, and genuinely becoming an issue in as far as this show's storytelling integrity is concerned. There was some talk the other day about lazy writing... now this is what my idea of lazy writing is.

 

It's a damn shame too, because this was otherwise a pretty momentous episode in a lot of respects, let down somewhat by some of the sloppiest, cheapest suspense mechanics I've seen in seven years of Game of Thrones. Arrgghh!

 

But then... dat coda doe. F-U-C-K

 

[Jay 37,287]

1 hour ago, Marian Schedenig said:

 

Yes. Jon Snow. And he wasn't even legally the heir of his house.

 

His argument, though, was that he literally gave his life to the Night's Watch. Sam hasn't. 

[Quintus 5,399]

I see you have put my post in spoiler tags, fair enough. I was careful not to talk about explicit details of course, really only talking about the design and execution of the episode, but I understand if that's an issue too.

[Glóin the Dark 1,219]

We have a real title for Episode 6: Beyond the Wall.

 

1 hour ago, Quintus said:

...VLC lets you slow it down a tad...

 

Ah! I didn't realise it had a fine tuning option for the speed. Cheers!

[Jay 37,287]

On 8/15/2017 at 4:57 PM, BloodBoal said:

We have the title for Episode 6: Death Is The Enemy

 

6 minutes ago, Glóin the Dark said:

We have a real title for Episode 6: Beyond the Wall.

 

Which is correct? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

8 minutes ago, Quintus said:

I see you have put my post in spoiler tags, fair enough. I was careful not to talk about explicit details of course, really only talking about the design and execution of the episode, but I understand if that's an issue too.

 

I thought this:

 

3 hours ago, Jay said:

I think all commentary about the episode including that should be in a spoiler block, as there will be people coming into this thread excited about watching Sunday who don't want to know anything about it before then

 

And this:

 

1 hour ago, Jay said:

I edited some posts above to put commentary on the episode in spoiler blocks.  People who watch early, please, respect those who don't.  By all means say whatever you want to about the episode, just put it in a spoiler block.  Thanks.

 

Was explicitly clear.

 

 

I don't know how to be more clear.

[Glóin the Dark 1,219]

http://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/episodes/7/66-66-episode/index.html

[Quintus 5,399]

20 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

 

Which is correct? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I thought this:

 

 

And this:

 

 

Was explicitly clear.

 

 

I don't know how to be more clear.

 

As I said, I understand. Spoiler tags it is.

 

3 hours ago, KK said:

this raises some good points:

Travel happens instantly on 'Game of Thrones' now, and it's really annoying.

 

 

 

 

After tonight, I agree completely with that. In hindsight, the usual order of 10 episodes would have been better suited to this season probably more than any of the recent ones before it. 

 

I see that article upset a few sweaty fan boys and girls in the comments though. Always worth it.

 

[crocodile 7,984]

1 hour ago, Quintus said:

 

 

  Hide contents

RE: jumping the shark.

 

If you're referring to the utterly ridiculous stage we've gotten to in regards to intercontinental communication and traveling speeds, I have to agree. I've seen the latest episode, and it's outright flagrantly taking the piss now, and genuinely becoming an issue in as far as this show's storytelling integrity is concerned. There was some talk the other day about lazy writing... now this is what my idea of lazy writing is.

 

It's a damn shame too, because this was otherwise a pretty momentous episode in a lot of respects, let down somewhat by some of the sloppiest, cheapest suspense mechanics I've seen in seven years of Game of Thrones. Arrgghh!

 

But then... dat coda doe. F-U-C-K

 

 

Spoiler

 

That is probably because it actually repeats some of its older tricks again. It was a good episode but I knew exactly where it was going to go. Very predicable.

 

I'm more surprised about Arya/Sansa material.

 

 

Karol

[KK 3,307]

 

It felt cheap and undeserved. And it didn't help that you could predict every beat a mile ahead. Lazy writing indeed.

 

 

And as Lee said, it's a darn shame too, because it could have been such a satisfying moment otherwise. The writers don't seem to know how to stage these big events anymore.

 

And Arya is starting to get on my nerves.
 

 

 

[Bilbo 3,709]

Spoiler

I enjoyed the episode a lot. First time since maybe season 3 that I've actually liked Dany and I thought Clarke and Kit did a great job in their scene together at the end. She seemed like a real person again and not "Queen Dany". More of this side of her please but no more dragon casualties.

 

Fast travel doesn't bother me at all. We spent 6 seasons of people complaining about how you only got to see characters for 10 minutes an episode and their story over 2-3 episodes could have been done in one. Now when they're doing that people are complaining it's too fast. Alright, Raven to Dragonstone was a bit of stretch but fuck it. It's become good v evil fantasy and it's damn good television.

 

On the slim chance the final books come out I think people will be disappointed that it too became "good v evil" but once you had White Walkers that was inevitable. 

 

People just thought Martin was clever because all the characters that weren't important for the end game were presented as main characters and killed off. This hasn't come from nowhere. Go back and watch the first season and it's clear who the really important characters are. 

 

Also yeah, Arya is acting like a little brat. Not crazy about the new Sansa but Arya is acting like a child... who's trained to kill. 

 

[Quintus 5,399]

Out of curiosity, did they change the actor who plays the Night King? I've been thinking he looks a little different to the character seen at Hardhome, but I can't quite put my finger on the reason why.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

1 minute ago, BloodBoal said:

 

Yep.

 

 

Yeah, the new one looks... stoned or something. Not nearly as menecing as the first guy!

[Incanus 5,713]

The first one definitely looks considerably more impressive than the second.

[Quintus 5,399]

Do we know why they recast the part? The original actor was so much more sinister in appearance. This new Night King looks more like an IT engineer.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

If it's on the internet it's true.

 

God BB. 

[Holko 9,499]

46 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

(trivia bit: he also played the guy that was turned into a White Walker by the Children Of The Forest in Season 6).

 

I believe that first Walker IS the Night King, that's why he played him in the flashback.

[Wojo 2,453]

13 hours ago, Jay said:

His argument, though, was that he literally gave his life to the Night's Watch. Sam hasn't. 

 

Right. In Sam's case, you could make an analogy that if an unwanted son sent to the Night's Watch wanted to reclaim his family house, he could hire assassins to murder his kin, which would permit the survivor to break his vows and return south. 

 

Look at the late Maester at Castle Black. He was the last confirmed Targaryen in Westeros, and even though he was past his fathering years, he was not permitted to rebuild his house. He was kept in a safe place, forgotten or ignored by even King Robert. 

 

Jon's watch ended with his death, and I remember he was basically appointed as the Lord of Winterfell and King in the North because of his leadership abilities and there were no other known male Starks at the time. Bran has dibs, but Bran's not in it. 

 

I digress. 

 

7x6 is nuts. Nuts! I'll honor the gag rule until Sunday. 

[Jay 37,287]

You don't have to not talk about it, you simply have to click the spoiler button before typing whatever you want to type

 

[Muad'Dib 1,801]

We must resist till Sunday!!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

My household is super busy getting ready to move house on Saturday, so I'm finding it very easy to resist watching the leaked episode.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Quintus 5,399]

It turned out it was an FLV file, which my phone then wouldn't cast to my TV in the living room. So in the end I looked it up on Kodi and found it instantly - the exact same version (after all that). The sound was definitely ever so slightly off, and it was quite distracting (only for certain characters though) for the first 15 mins, but I literally forget about it after that. The image was good (it improves over time). I'm fussy, but I watched this and it was perfectly fine on the upstairs HD TV.  Of course, I wouldn't want to watch it blown up on a 50 inch 4K set. I imagine it looks very sharp on a monitor or a large tablet device, though.

[Wojo 2,453]

2 hours ago, Jay said:

You don't have to not talk about it, you simply have to click the spoiler button before typing whatever you want to type

 

 

I didn't know that was for spoilers on mobile. Thanks. 

[Jay 37,287]

Any time

[Wojo 2,453]

I watched it on VLC on my laptop connected to the 65 using two connected HDMI cables, slowed to 0.9X to offset the pitch issue. 

 

There were some moments in the fight scenes when faces were blurry and it was impossible to tell who was who. That could be the video quality at fault. 

[Wojo 2,453]

 

Spoiler

I disliked that the episode did a poor job communicating the number of men in the Fellowship of the Wight. Seven men are seen walking north from Eastwatch: Jon, Jorah, Gendry, Clegane, Beric, Thoros, and of course Tormund, an absolute delight in this episode. His dick/cock joke was gold. 

 

But I swear they had an advance scout that was tossed by the bear (who I thought was Gendry for a while), though only Thoros was cared for. And at the rock island, after Gendry left, they still showed at least seven companions, until this hooded bearded extra holding a pole fell into the horde. Hell, I thought the screaming wight WAS Thoros who had died in the fighting and turned that quickly, until we see he's not dead until the next morning on the island. 

 

I guess they picked up wildling porters along the way to carry supplies, and I just missed it. 

 

I wasted a lot of time and mental strength rewinding certain spots to catch faces and keep track. 

 

Clegane's second rock toss, while there because the script needs the horde to advance onto the ice, is important because it shows the dead army has no creativity. Nobody wants to take a chance if they assume they will fail. No dead body wants to test the ice, just like no wight is shown testing the magic barrier at The Wall because no dead thing observed Bran crossing. This is why they are still wandering in the wilderness like Moses. 

 

But now that the dead army has an air force..... 

 

[Jay 37,287]

It was never just 7 people.  It was the 7 named characters (Jon, Hound, Gendry, Thoros, Berrick, Tormund Jorah), plus 6 redshirts, for 13 total companions.  You could see them all in the end of last week's episode.  I ever commented on it right after it aired:

 

On 8/13/2017 at 10:16 PM, Jay said:

Well that had to be the fastest paced episode they've ever done. 

 

Eastwatch was dope in the opening credits. Didn't notice which city they took out to include it... Probably Pyke? 

 

I loved how the group going north of the wall at the end had a bunch of red shirts with them, to make battles more exciting next week. I'm sure Bran will warg into animals to save them all last minute. 

 

 

EDIT: Here's the scene on youtube. You can see the lead redshirt behind the Hound at 0:27 and all the redshirts at 0:45 and 0:53

 

 

 

[Quintus 5,399]

1 hour ago, Woj said:

 

  Hide contents

I disliked that the episode did a poor job communicating the number of men in the Fellowship of the Wight.

 

 

 

Agreed. I had to reassess the situation more than once due to this.

[Jay 37,287]

There was 13 companions!

[Bilbo 3,709]

9 minutes ago, Quintus said:

 

Agreed. I had to reassess the situation more than once due to this.

 

Yeah, it wasn't clear was it? I usually don't have an trouble following anything in this show but there were times when they made it deliberately feel like there were 7 and then a redshirt popped up. 

[Jay 37,287]

There was never only 7 of them though.  You saw all 13 together at the end of last week's episode.  I think you guys are just struggling from watching a 3rd generation pixelated copy, not a case of the filmmakers failing to depict the situation correctly

[crocodile 7,984]

13 companions travelling towards the mountain...

 

Karol

[Wojo 2,453]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

It was never just 7 people.  It was the 7 named characters (Jon, Hound, Gendry, Thoros, Berrick, Tormund Jorah), plus 6 redshirts, for 13 total companions.  You could see them all in the end of last week's episode.  I ever commented on it right after it aired:

 

 

 

EDIT: Here's the scene on youtube. You can see the lead redshirt behind the Hound at 0:27 and all the redshirts at 0:45 and 0:53

 

 

 

 

Well fuck. Those are split second moments. It's a shame we need to hit pause to properly understand the storyline and know how many disposable characters were sent north because I still count seven. I see shapes of others, but I'm not going to sit and count. 

 

I was only remembering the money shot of the backs of all seven named men, but one of your other six was holding the camera for that shot. 

 

Besides, I started the new episode at midnight, so I was beyond comprehensive reasoning. 

57 minutes ago, Jay said:

 I think you guys are just struggling from watching a 3rd generation pixelated copy, not a case of the filmmakers failing to depict the situation correctly

 

Not at all. The video quality is fine. The audio was higher pitched but after the titles roll, who cares? We're counting shapes of people, not hairs on their fur coats. 

[Jay 37,287]

Game of Thrones 7x06 Beyond The Wall

 

 

An episode both exquisitely satisfying and ridiculously frustrating at various times, a true mixed bag.

Winterfell - By far the most frustrating of the only 3 stories told this week.  I would argue that the entirety of these scenes shouldn't have been a part of this episode; It would have been better to focus the entire ep on the Fellowship & Tyrion/Dany, and that's it.  It would have lent to such a more satisfying, tight, cohesive episode!  t was so annoying to go from a tense moment north of the wall back to Arya/Sansa bickering.  I would have moved some Winterfell scenes this season up an episode or two, in order to fit all these scenes into last week's episode, and make this one stronger! 

Even still, these scenes are not very good, are they?  I held out hope, a fool's hope I suppose, that Arya knew that Littlefinger was setting her up last week.  It is so frustrating to see that she fell for all his tricks!  The most annoying part of watching a show is when the viewer feels smart than the characters you are following, and that happened with this storyline in spades.  The entire "problem" Arya has with Sansa could all be worked out if they just sat down and rationally talked to each other, but Arya wouldn't let that.  And the way it ended with the dagger reversal was just kinda weird.  Sansa was just as annoying as Arya, too.  In one scene she's saying how she will be protected from Littlefinger, in another she's seeking his council and doing what he says.  WTF?  I hope next week explains this better somehow.

Another weird thing was the really weird Sansa/Brienne scene.  It seemed random and unexplained to me that Cersei asked Sansa to come to King's Landing, and that Sansa decides to send Brienne instead of just ignoring it.  They made a big deal of the fact that winter is now here, travel is now harder, Cersei will never attack the north during the winter, etc, but now she wants Brienne to risk traveling in shit conditions to go to King's Landing?  I also hope this is some kind of setup like she wants Arya and/or Littlefinger to think Brienne is gone, but she isn't or something, I dunno.  

Disappointed by all Winterfell scenes!

Dragonstone - GREAT conversation this week between Dany and Tyrion at Dragonstone early in the episode.  I loved how it started friendly and amicable, then grew more and more sour as it went on.  I think Dany has every right to not be that happy with Tyrion right now, as his military plans all failed them and his meeting with Jaime seems dubious to say the least.  I don't mistrust Tyrion, but you can't blame Dany for doing so.  It was kind of out of left field that he brought up her succession, almost like he was testing her temper or something.  Oh, and it was funny in the beginning when Tyrion had to tell Dany that Jon liked her   BTW, wtf ever happened with the dragonglass mining, are they done?  5% done, 50% done?  Is there a plan of getting it north and forged into weapons?  Who knows!

North of the Wall - SO MUCH OF THIS WAS SO FOOKIN GREAT!  Loved a bunch of Tormund's lines like the dick/cock stuff, him talking about Brienne, etc.  I liked Jorah and Jon talking about Longclaw, Gendry talking about Melisandre, etc.  I loved all the gorgeous Iceland scenery shots throughout the episode.  The wighted bear scene was a pretty cool sequence, adding some nice early tension to everything!  The trap they set for the wights was cool, I loved how Longclaw slicing through the Walker made all but one fall down.  I don't remember, did any fall down when Jon killed the one walker with it at Hardhome?  Also, anytime you have men fighting undead with various weapons ranging from long sword to hammers to flaming swords to daggers, how you can you complain?  This is what we're here for!

The chase onto the frozen lake was fine I suppose, pretty intense when you see their numbers and how complete surrounded they are.  The whole "wights can't go in the water" thing has always been a stretch even in the otherwise amazing Hardhome sequence, but we'll forgive it.  It's once they settle in that things just get annoying.

OK.  They are in the deep north, in a world where its ALWAYS winter.  That ice wouldn't crack, it would be INCHES if not FEET thick!  Also, EVEN if it did, it would re-freeze VERY quickly.  It seems they probably stayed on their little rock island for maybe 2 days before Dany showed up, the ice would have reformed LONG before that.  Come on!

Now, you may say "the Night King knew that, he was purposely starving them out, as they are mortal, and he has unlimited time.  Plus, he knew Dany would come with dragons, and he wanted one", well, that is possible, but if that isn't mentioned next week, I'm going to assume that wasn't the writer's intention, and its just lazy storytelling!

And unfortunately that's the smaller of the lazy storytelling surrounding this sequence!  You have the implausibleness of Gendry RUNNING back to the wall, sending a raven to Dragonstone, Dany receiving it, getting on a dragon, flying north, and being able to even FIND them once north, all before they froze to death?  RIDICU FUCKING LOUS!!!!!!  

Even worse, is when she does show up, we have a repeat of the stupidest aspect of LAST week's episode!  That's when Jaime and Bronn magically survive underwater for 10 minutes and swim to the other side of a lake in heavy armor, where no enemy soldiers are waiting for them.  Now just one week later, you have Jon Snow falling into FREEZING COLD water and magically surviving for long enough that the enemies have all wandered away for him to come back up.  WHY WRITERS, WHY??  You are doing SO MUCH RIGHT why make these little mistakes that makes things seem so stupid!??!

If you ignore these elements, this whole sequence really is pretty good though!  Fantastic special effects, a bunch of good fighting, a fucking undead villain hurling a javelin at a flying dragon to instantly kill and and claim as their own, this is bad ass shit!  I just wish the bad storytelling surrounding these amazing moments wasn't so distracting.

Instead of all the Gendry running / raven to Dragonstone business, they should have had Dany decide to come up on her own.  Maybe she's already in the north for some other reason so not so far away, maybe Bran sends her a telepathic message, I dunno, I'm sure there's a better solution someone will come up with.

I also REALLY didn't see the point of including Jon's ice fall and rescue by Benjen (and then Benjen's death).  Here's what I mean:  How different would the episode have ultimately been if instead of all that, they remaining heroes simply all climbed on Drogon and flew off together.  You could even still do all the bed recovery stuff with Jon - everything would have been the same!  Instead, we got the pointless situation where they leave Jon underwater, even though every single person watching knows he's going to be fine, and then the silly SUDDEN appearance of Benjen, arriving at just the right time, after we already had Dany showing up at just the right time, etc.  And even then, why did Benjen put Jon on his horse and instead of them simply BOTH getting on the horse together.  And on the topic of horses, why the F didn't the Fellowship just freaking bring their own horses on this mission?  Since their mission was to capture a wight, wouldn't mobility be key to go in, snag one, and dart out?

It may sound like I'm shitting all over the episode, but I really did ultimately like it and liked much more about it than I didn't.  It's just so frustrating that the writing takes all these stupid shortcuts and goes cyclically through the same pointless and unnecessary story beats instead of being better than all that.  It's a damn shame!

Eastwatch - I kind of didn't like having all this wrapup happen in the same episode instead of being saved for next week.  It would have been pretty badass to just end the episode with our crew all flying away on their dragons (if they didn't do the stupid Jon underwater sidestep), or fadeout on Benjen's attack while Jon rode away if they did.  End on a high note like Hardhome or the season 2 and 4 episode 9 battles!

Instead, all this wrap up was... fine I guess.  But it made things feel rushed.  What I mean is, after this one skirmish, now Jon is willing to bend the knee, and now Dany is willing to ignore Cersei and focus on destroying the white walkers instead.  I know they killed on of her "children" and all, but I feel like just having a week in between gives both the viewer more time to ponder everything, and makes it seem like more thought had gone on in both Dany and Jon's minds before they had this scene.

The scene with the wights dragging the dragon (heh) out of the lake and the Night King turns it into undead was of course freaking bad ass (and explains why they focused on the dragon's eye so much last week when Jon pet it, to contrast to the blue eye this week).  But I have to ask... where did they get all that perfect chain from?  And how did they wrap it around the dragon?  Kinda weird.  

Also, why are they sailing back to Dragonstone instead of just flying back?

Overall, MOSTLY great, INCREDIBLY frustrating in some details, can't wait for the season finale.  I have no idea what to expect with any of the Winterfell / King's Landing / Cersei stuff... Cersei has some kind of plan I am sure, but what?  And will it work?  Will there be any major character deaths?  Will the Walkers break through the wall?  
 
We'll find out in 10 days!

 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

So you gave in too?  It'll just be and me and BB left to discuss on Monday.

 

And I'm sure as hell not gonna go back and read all these spoiler tag posts 

[Jay 37,287]

Just now, Disco Stu said:

And I'm sure as hell not gonna go back and read all these spoiler tag posts 

 

Why not?

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Not interested in the thoughts of those who lack self-control!

 

[crocodile 7,984]

While I do largely enjoy the series to this day, something is missing. As the story gets bigger and bigger it also becomes more cliched and predictable. I always liked the character moments about this the most as well as the historical/cultural references. The sheer depth and richness kept me interested - it made it seem like a real place with real people and ideas. But now it is a more generic fantasy epic. Enjoyable one but bit impotent. I frankly don't care if they stop the white walkers. In fact might be better if Darth Maul slaughters everyone as they all built a world and society that is impossible to live in.

 

Karol

[Jay 37,287]

Lacking self control would be reading spoilers about what happens instead of waiting to watch the final finished episodes.

Watching a finished episode in completely normal HD quality on a different day than the one it airs is not the same thing.

[Quintus 5,399]

3 hours ago, Jay said:

There was never only 7 of them though.  You saw all 13 together at the end of last week's episode.  I think you guys are just struggling from watching a 3rd generation pixelated copy, not a case of the filmmakers failing to depict the situation correctly

 

Nope. It wasn't pixelated in the slightest. Otherwise I'd never have given it the time of day, let alone watched it.

 

Maybe some us don't do a fucking headcount every time we see generic group shots of the cast and extras? Yep, I reckon that's it.

 

2 hours ago, Woj said:

 We're counting shapes of people, not hairs on their fur coats. 

 

Not if you're Jason. He counts and logs the fibre strand types into his database. 

 

57 minutes ago, Jay said:

Game of Thrones 7x06 Beyond The Wall

 

  Hide contents

It was so annoying to go from a tense moment north of the wall back to Arya/Sansa bickering.  I would have moved some Winterfell scenes this season up an episode or two, in order to fit all these scenes into last week's episode, and make this one stronger! 

 

 

Spoiler

I didn't mind the way these scenes back at Winterfell were intercut with the action up north, it didn't bother me compared to the far worse problems I had with the episode.

 

 

Quote

 

Spoiler

Sansa was just as annoying as Arya, too.  In one scene she's saying how she will be protected from Littlefinger, in another she's seeking his council and doing what he says.  WTF? 

 

Spoiler

This though was extremely sloppy stuff, it's all getting a bit messy all of a sudden isn't it.

 

 

[Jay 37,287]

Spoiler

It feels sloppy yet I hold out hope it will be explained next week