Memoirs Of A Geisha: Good, Bad or Indifferent?

[Josh500 1,615]

Confluence was by far my most favourite but I thought it was a missed opportunity.

Missed opportunity for what?

JW wrote it, it can be heard quite loudly in the movie, we got the track on the OS album. Could we wish for more?

I think he meant the score in general, not just that one track Josh.

Again, missed opportunity for what?

He saying "Confluence" should have been further developed and used throughout the movie?

[WilliamsStarShip2282 308]

Confluence was by far my most favourite but I thought it was a missed opportunity.

Missed opportunity for what?

JW wrote it, it can be heard quite loudly in the movie, we got the track on the OS album. Could we wish for more?

I think he meant the score in general, not just that one track Josh.

In fact, this score should have received an Oscar just for the 3 set pieces alone: "Going to School," "The Chairman's Waltz," and "Becoming a Geisha."

I would not include Going to School in that list as it is so heavily temp track influenced.Later Williams did wonders with the material in his Suite for Cello and Orchestra where Last Emperor stylings were much less blantant and development of his own ideas more extensive. As the Water... or Confluence would be my choices.

definatly confluence!

has everyone heard the duet piano and cello album he and yo yo ma did? pretty good stuff. too bad its only three tracks...

Yes the three pieces are lovely indeed. And have you heard the Suite from Memoirs of a Geisha for Cello and Orchestra? It is definitely one of the best reworkings of his score material into an independent suite.

yes. All the reworkings sounded great. He did rework some other tracks from Geisha for a concert setting though, but i dont think they were ever recorded. I really loved the chairmans waltz. Not sure if i like the original or the new one better.

[Incanus 5,714]

Confluence was by far my most favourite but I thought it was a missed opportunity.

Missed opportunity for what?

JW wrote it, it can be heard quite loudly in the movie, we got the track on the OS album. Could we wish for more?

I think he meant the score in general, not just that one track Josh.

Again, missed opportunity for what?

He saying "Confluence" should have been further developed and used throughout the movie?

I can't speak for Salacious but I would interpret his sentence Geisha was indifferent to me , Confluence was by far my most favourite [track] but I thought it was a missed opportunity. to mean that he thought the score in itself was a missed opportunity meaning it could have been better and that Confluence was just his favourite track from the score.

yes. All the reworkings sounded great. He did rework some other tracks from Geisha for a concert setting though, but i dont think they were ever recorded. I really loved the chairmans waltz. Not sure if i like the original or the new one better.

Do you happen to know which pieces were they?

[WilliamsStarShip2282 308]

Confluence was by far my most favourite but I thought it was a missed opportunity.

Missed opportunity for what?

JW wrote it, it can be heard quite loudly in the movie, we got the track on the OS album. Could we wish for more?

I think he meant the score in general, not just that one track Josh.

Again, missed opportunity for what?

He saying "Confluence" should have been further developed and used throughout the movie?

I can't speak for Salacious but I would interpret his sentence Geisha was indifferent to me , Confluence was by far my most favourite [track] but I thought it was a missed opportunity. to mean that he thought the score in itself was a missed opportunity meaning it could have been better and that Confluence was just his favourite track from the score.

yes. All the reworkings sounded great. He did rework some other tracks from Geisha for a concert setting though, but i dont think they were ever recorded. I really loved the chairmans waltz. Not sure if i like the original or the new one better.

Do you happen to know which pieces were they?

never mind, they were the reworked ones. he did them at his last concert in boston last year. Its was sayuris theme, going to school and brush of silk. but they did sound a little different fomr the reworked ones and the originals. but i could be wrong, my memory is a bit hazy

i do know though, that there is one version of sayuris theme that was never recorded, but the score was published. i only heard it a few days ago.

[KK 3,307]

never mind, they were the reworked ones. he did them at his last concert in boston last year. Its was sayuris theme, going to school and brush of silk. but they did sound a little different fomr the reworked ones and the originals. but i could be wrong, my memory is a bit hazy

i do know though, that there is one version of sayuris theme that was never recorded, but the score was published. i only heard it a few days ago.

[media=]

I never heard this arrangement before. And although its not my favourite one, I think it's absolutely beautiful, especially at 3:30. Thanks for sharing!

[Incanus 5,714]

Yes that is an arrangement Williams originally made, I think, for the concert at USC Thornton School of Music in 2007 and was played by the Thornton Symphony. A beautiful variation on Sayuri's themes.

I think Williams has never made quite so many different concertized versions or arrangements of one theme before.

[KK 3,307]

Yes that is an arrangement Williams originally made, I think, for the concert at USC Thornton School of Music in 2007 and was played by the Thornton Symphony. A beautiful variation on Sayuri's themes.

I think Williams has never made quite so many different concertized versions or arrangements of one theme before.

Well its one of the projects he really loved. I believe he really enjoyed scoring Memoirs of a Geisha. He obviously put a lot of passion into it, and it shows (or at least for me it did).

[Brónach 1,302]

I'm kinda lost with all these arrangements and concert versions and suites and what nots.

[King Mark 3,630]

hey the version above is really nice

Should have been on the OST

[Miguel Andrade 1,263]

"Memoirs of a Geisha" is a lovely wonderful score and surely one of my all time favorites. As others have mentioned, "Confluence" and "As the Water..." are some of the definitive highlights, though I find the whole album as a wonderful experience. Williams' expansions upon some of the material for his 6-movement suite sounds just like a new cello concerto and deserves to be performed more often on its full form -- instead of doing just half of it like last year in Boston.

The video posted is indeed of the same version as Williams premiered with the USC Thornton Symphony. He also prepared a suite for woodwinds that was recorded for a NPR show back in 2006 or something by US Marines Band. And then the three pieces for cello and piano that were released on iTunes only -- Sony has included "Going to School" track on compilations before, but has been missing the opportunity to release the whole thing on CD, God knows why.

[Thor 7,490]

I've actually attached the concert versions of the three tracks as a 'bonus' in my iTunes.

[WilliamsStarShip2282 308]

"Memoirs of a Geisha" is a lovely wonderful score and surely one of my all time favorites. As others have mentioned, "Confluence" and "As the Water..." are some of the definitive highlights, though I find the whole album as a wonderful experience. Williams' expansions upon some of the material for his 6-movement suite sounds just like a new cello concerto and deserves to be performed more often on its full form -- instead of doing just half of it like last year in Boston.

The video posted is indeed of the same version as Williams premiered with the USC Thornton Symphony. He also prepared a suite for woodwinds that was recorded for a NPR show back in 2006 or something by US Marines Band. And then the three pieces for cello and piano that were released on iTunes only -- Sony has included "Going to School" track on compilations before, but has been missing the opportunity to release the whole thing on CD, God knows why.

its really unfortunate that so much of his music that has ACTUALLY BEEN RECORDED, has never been released

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

I've posted my thoughts on this score before:

I think talking about elegance in the Deathly Hallows thread, I have to say Memoirs of a Geisha the score is Williams' most elegant score since he converted to throwing notes on the page for superficial complexity (his modern style). [i call it the composer's lens flare ailment]

This is a score that you listen to, and know that despite the fact that it may not be littered with notes to create that false sense of "sophistication" and "complexity," you can see each note that was placed on the page arrived there through hours of thinking and exploration and headache. You can hear how difficult a score it was to write. And Williams came through. And the score has a depth and beauty and grace that you rarely get, even from the maestro circa new millenium.

[King Mark 3,630]

its really unfortunate that so much of his music that has ACTUALLY BEEN RECORDED, has never been released

Well, some guy here said the master tapes were laying around on some shelf in soundstage somewhere

[Josh500 1,615]

Listened to this again, and yeah, I am very impressed with "Going to School." It's not the best track or piece, maybe, but I love the way it starts, the cello solo that follows, that buoyant and cheerful tone that it evokes. Remarkably well done!

But yeah, the entire score is JW at the top of his game...

[A24 4,331]

Listened to this again, and yeah, I am very impressed with "Going to School." It's not the best track or piece, maybe, but I love the way it starts, the cello solo that follows, that buoyant and cheerful tone that it evokes. Remarkably well done!

Funny, because Williams stole that from the temp track (David Byrne - The Last Emperor).

[crocodile 7,999]

Wasn't that inspired by Philip Glass' Kundun or something like that?

Karol

[Brónach 1,302]

Kundun is from 1997. The Last Emperor from 1987.

[A24 4,331]

Wasn't that inspired by Philip Glass' Kundun or something like that?

If so, I would like to hear it. Is the track on youtube? Spotify? There are so many ways to find the truth these days.

Kundun is from 1997. The Last Emperor from 1987.

Oh, that settles it then.

[TownerFan 4,983]

Funny, because Williams stole that from the temp track (David Byrne - The Last Emperor).

No, not at all. The rhythmic accompaniment in the percussions is quite similar, but then the piece goes on a road of its own. Interesting to note that Williams eliminated the percussion part from the concert suite and wrote a wonderful new accompaniment rhythm.

[Incanus 5,714]

Funny, because Williams stole that from the temp track (David Byrne - The Last Emperor).

No, not at all. The rhythmic accompaniment in the percussions is quite similar, but then the piece goes on a road of its own. Interesting to note that Williams eliminated the percussion part from the concert suite and wrote a wonderful new accompaniment rhythm.

True he went to a new refreshing direction with the Cello Suite version but the original suffers from temptrackitis not matter how you look at it. I think either Williams' hands were pretty much tied in this particular case or curiously he wanted to please Marshall by sticking close to his temp music.

[TownerFan 4,983]

I'm not denying the similarity, but I guess it's likely that both Williams and Byrne looked at the same source of inspiration, i.e. traditional folk Eastern music.

[Josh500 1,615]

Listened to this again, and yeah, I am very impressed with "Going to School." It's not the best track or piece, maybe, but I love the way it starts, the cello solo that follows, that buoyant and cheerful tone that it evokes. Remarkably well done!

Funny, because Williams stole that from the temp track (David Byrne - The Last Emperor).

That's what shallow listeners always say, yes.

Listen to what Maurizio says!

Interesting to note that Williams eliminated the percussion part from the concert suite and wrote a wonderful new accompaniment rhythm.

You mean the version found on this album? http://www.amazon.co...a/dp/B000KWZ7DS

Yeah, I prefer the original version...

[A24 4,331]

Funny, because Williams stole that from the temp track (David Byrne - The Last Emperor).

The rhythmic accompaniment in the percussions is quite similar,

Not only that, it's also the exact same buildup. Yes, the melody is different but the first minute is the same. I can't listen to it without thinking The Last Emperor!

[Salacius 7]

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[Taikomochi 1,136]

While I definitely see the similarities between "Going To School" and TLE, I just think GTS is much more interesting. TLE "Main Titles" just gets boring and repetitive after about 20 seconds, whereas GTS just builds into such wondrous beauty. If anything, I am impressed that Williams was able to accomplish so much while sticking so closely to a temp track.

As for the score on the whole, it's my favorite of Williams' work, and of all time, actually. It's so subtle and beautiful. I recall not finding the score that interesting, not having seen the film, but when I finally did see it, I was just floored by the combination of visual and music as Chiyo ran through that red archway. The violin solo complimented the lush cinematography. The film is melodramatic, but the musical flourish on "Confluence" made it work, made it bring a tear to my eye.

[JWfangirl1992 18]

Memoirs is definitely one of my favorite Williams' scores. It can be so dramatic "Sayuri's Theme" and "The Fire Scene/The Coming of War" but yet so light and fun, "The Chairman's Waltz." Until I learn how to play the "Theme from Sabrina" on piano "The Chairman's Waltz" is without a doubt my favorite piece to play. It is not overly challenging but definitely not a piece to be underestimate and it is without a doubt FUN to play. If you're a pianist and you do not have the sheet music to Memoirs I highly suggest you purchase it!

[Josh500 1,615]

Thanks Incanus, That's what I meant, and Josh500 , sorry I didn't make it clearer. Off course it's a good score, it's John's music meaning it's a cut above the rest, but for a Williams score I was expecting better that's all.

Uhhh, okay, I understand what you mean.

However, for the movie that we got, I don't see how JW could have written a better score. Really, now. The movie is mediocre at best, but the score is absolutely mind-blowing. It's not an achievement to be taken lightly, IMO.

[indy4 155]

Memoirs is definitely one of my favorite Williams' scores. It can be so dramatic "Sayuri's Theme" and "The Fire Scene/The Coming of War" but yet so light and fun, "The Chairman's Waltz." Until I learn how to play the "Theme from Sabrina" on piano "The Chairman's Waltz" is without a doubt my favorite piece to play. It is not overly challenging but definitely not a piece to be underestimate and it is without a doubt FUN to play. If you're a pianist and you do not have the sheet music to Memoirs I highly suggest you purchase it!

I would not classify "The Chairman's Waltz" as light and fun. It seems very dark and painful to me.

Anywho I agree it's a great score, and a very restrained score. It's not really until the last 2 tracks that we get really emotional music, but even then it's a very watered down emotion compared to what Williams often writes. It's gorgeous, but in a very different way than usual.

[Salacius 7]

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