.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,364]

Grand Budapest should win, Theory of Everything will win

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I would like Grand Budapest to win it even though Interstellar is the best Zimmer score since Hannibal.

Desplat's score's is really wonderfully quirky and inventive and works brilliantly in the film.

[Uni 306]

I agree with Stefan. Grand Budapest should win.

I also agree with Jason. Theory of Everything will win (the GG was the forecast).

[Bilbo 3,709]

Imitation Game should win, Theory of Everything will win.

[publicist 4,643]

Both are conventional Desplat scores...a little statue in the shape of James Horner would be most fitting.

[RedBard 71]

Imitation Game for the substance.

Interstellar for the innovation. Sorry I couldn't say that with a straight face.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

It's certainly the most innovative nominee.

[publicist 4,643]

Nah, even that it shares with GBH. Both have enough predecessors, i doubt anyone besides you reads THAT much into INTERSTELLAR's sound.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Both are conventional Desplat scores...a little statue in the shape of James Horner would be most fitting.

Budapest Hotel is conventional?

[publicist 4,643]

IMITATION/EVERYTHING

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Nah, even that it shares with GBH. Both have enough predecessors, i doubt anyone besides you reads THAT much into INTERSTELLAR's sound.

GBH is pretty par for the course as far as quirky, ethnic, WA mode Desplat goes. Interstellar similarly has its roots in earlier Zimmer stuff but I think takes it all to much fresher territory. Using the organ free of either religious or spooky associations is also pretty significant and has received a lot of attention from the "organ world." The now tiresome story about the genesis of the score also lends an air of "innovation" to everything.

But really, innovative, let's think about it... which is more likely to inform the new studio-pushed scoring aesthetic for the next ten years that we'll all grow very weary of?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

IMITATION/EVERYTHING

One of them is not by Desplat...

[publicist 4,643]

In name not, maybe. It sounds exactly like Desplat...so much in fact i had to check Spotify which Desplat score i was listening to.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Zimmers tireless self promotion about the "avant garde" creative processes of his scores are actually starting to grate a bit.

And using an organ in a non catholic way can hardly be seen as the hight of innovation

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Zimmers tireless self promotion about the "avant garde" creative processes of his scores are actually starting to grate a bit.

And using an organ in a non catholic way can hardly be seen as the hight of innovation

As I said, the tiresome story of the score's origins... but that doesn't have any effect on the quality of the music, or at least, it shouldn't color your thinking about it.

And you underestimate the significance of the use of that instrument in this context. Really, get in touch with people in that world and you'll see how notable it is.

[RedBard 71]

What gives? I see the poll listing for Jóhann Jóhannsson, but where's the poll listing for Johann Gambolputty?

*Sigh*

Johann Gambolputty de-von-Ausfern-schplenden-schlitter-crass-cren-bon-fried-digger-dangle-dungle-burstein-von-knacker-thrasher-apple-banger-horowitz-ticolensic-grander-knotty-spelltinkle-grandlich-grumblemeyer-spelter-wasser-kurstlich-himble-eisen-bahnwagen-guten-abend-bitte-ein-nürnburger-bratwürstel-gespurten-mitz-weimache-luber-hundsfut-gumberaber-schönendanker-kalbsfleisch-mittleraucher-von-Hautkopft of Ulm?

Wrong Johann!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Underestimate? The organ use is the scores signature.

But its hardly innovative since is grounds the score in Zimmers prog rock roots

[RedBard 71]

Zimmer and roots in prog rock?

...

...

...

Actually, not all that surprising when I contemplate it.

[publicist 4,643]

But really, innovative, let's think about it... which is more likely to inform the new studio-pushed scoring aesthetic for the next ten years that we'll all grow very weary of?

I don't know if that's a tangible for 'innovative-ness'. And i really don't think INTERSTELLAR's sound is as easily apply-able to dozens of genres like the Batman ostinato. I heard a lot of Mike Oldfield, Philip Glass, tangerine Dream and so on. That's not a petty criticism, i just heard it and if you wouldn't have beaten the drums so loudly here i wouldn't have considered the score as something that even strives to be that hot new a thing.

The Desplat has a playful edge that i would want to win for the sheer lightness in contrast to all the heavy drama stuff that gets awarded usually.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Zimmer and roots in prog rock?

...

...

...

Actually, not all that surprising when I contemplate it.

Zimmer is in essence a pop music composer.

[publicist 4,643]

Nothing wrong with that.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Stefan, the pipe organ's history is far richer than its sparing use in prog rock.

This is an instrument that ruled music for many years and in modern times has been reduced to a sideshow in the circus of contemporary religion. Or totally replaced by praise bands or some similar shit. It's instead now the go-to color for when someone wants to evoke the "oooohhhh spooky" atmosphere or for wedding scenes in soap operas and sitcoms. Within the community around the instrument, there's recently been a huge push to bring it back to widespread relevance. And this is in stark opposition to people who continue to push a very dogmatic, conservative view of the instrument and its "appropriate" use. So for it to show up in a blockbuster score, freed from all tired associations, is a big deal, actually. The only other score I can recall that did that was Jerry's TMP. Every other use constitutes a furthering of the pipe organ stereotype. This score should be commended for many things, but the least of them is certainly not what it's done to bring the venerable old king of instruments back into the spotlight.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Yep, once again Jerry was there way before Zimmer.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Would you like to respond in a substantial way?

Ha!

[publicist 4,643]

What about its actual USE was so groundbreaking? I just don't hear it.

[RedBard 71]

Zimmer and roots in prog rock?

...

...

...

Actually, not all that surprising when I contemplate it.

Zimmer is in essence a pop music composer.

As long as he's versatile in more than just pop.

At any rate, Interstellar's music was supposed to be awe-inspiring-bass-bass.

Instead, it was just bass-bass.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

But really, innovative, let's think about it... which is more likely to inform the new studio-pushed scoring aesthetic for the next ten years that we'll all grow very weary of?

I don't know if that's a tangible for 'innovative-ness'. And i really don't think INTERSTELLAR's sound is as easily apply-able to dozens of genres like the Batman ostinato. I heard a lot of Mike Oldfield, Philip Glass, tangerine Dream and so on. That's not a petty criticism, i just heard it and if you wouldn't have beaten the drums so loudly here i wouldn't have considered the score as something that even strives to be that hot new a thing.

The Desplat has a playful edge that i would want to win for the sheer lightness in contrast to all the heavy drama stuff that gets awarded usually.

Oh I'm not saying it strives to be a hot new thing. Just that Zimmer seems to often fall victim to such aping.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

What about its actual USE was so groundbreaking? I just don't hear it.

I actually agree.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

What about its actual USE was so groundbreaking? I just don't hear it.

I actually agree.

LOL. Shocking!

Well what exactly do you guys mean? The way it was written for and integrated into the overall textures? What?

No, Zimmer is not radically augmenting the pipe organ literature with this score. But it is a fresh way of approaching the instrument's context, of integrating it into contemporary textures, and of blending it with synthetic colors.

[publicist 4,643]

OK, Zimmer used organ, and i'm sure it took a lot of time and effort to achieve the effect he wanted, but its application to me is KOYAANISQATSI paired with selected Mike Oldfield concept albums. I liked the 'curious' passages way more for their light and airy confusedness, for the lack of a better word. Like the first minutes of the Murph-cue you posted.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Zimmer uses the organ very effectively as the driving force for much of the score. At times it functions almost as a percussion instrument in the action material.

It certainly does not feel remotely catholic, despite the religious aspects that the story does have.

But none of that makes it groundbreaking for me. In what way does Zimmer use the organ unlike any one before him? And mixing it with a prerecorded synth patch of an organ doesn't count!

[RedBard 71]

OK, Zimmer used organ, and i'm sure it took a lot of time and effort to achieve the effect he wanted, but its application to me is KOYAANISQATSI paired with selected Mike Oldfield concept albums. I liked the 'curious' passages way more for their light and airy confusedness, for the lack of a better word. Like the first minutes of the Murph-cue you posted.

So you're saying the score was basically "minimalism meets ambience"?

Just trying to get some clarity in your visualization of the music.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

In essence, yes.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

OK, Zimmer used organ, and i'm sure it took a lot of time and effort to achieve the effect he wanted, but its application to me is KOYAANISQATSI paired with selected Mike Oldfield concept albums. I liked the 'curious' passages way more for their light and airy confusedness, for the lack of a better word. Like the first minutes of the Murph-cue you posted.

The Koyaanisqatsi comparisons always seem lazy to me. Yes, Glass used a digital pipe organ patch in there. Yes, there's a ground-bass thing. But to write it all off as a rehash of that is... yeah, lazy. Which Oldfield albums? I don't recall any with similarities.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I would agree with that, though Glass was clearly an inspiration.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

But none of that makes it groundbreaking for me. In what way does Zimmer use the organ unlike any one before him? And mixing it with a prerecorded synth patch of an organ doesn't count!

No not just synth organs but other synth colors. I'm not familiar with any scores or even concert music that so extensively melds an actual acoustic pipe organ with synthesizers.

And I'm still not sure what you're asking exactly: how does he use it compositionally unlike anyone before him, or contextually?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Contextually

[publicist 4,643]

OK, Zimmer used organ, and i'm sure it took a lot of time and effort to achieve the effect he wanted, but its application to me is KOYAANISQATSI paired with selected Mike Oldfield concept albums. I liked the 'curious' passages way more for their light and airy confusedness, for the lack of a better word. Like the first minutes of the Murph-cue you posted.

The Koyaanisqatsi comparisons always seem lazy to me. Yes, Glass used a digital pipe organ patch in there. Yes, there's a ground-bass thing. But to write it all off as a rehash of that is... yeah, lazy. Which Oldfield albums? I don't recall any with similarities.

That's what you in your expected self-defensive way were bound to say, of course. Kind of like Thor obviously finding fundamental differences in IMITATION GAME and THEORY OF EVERYTHING.

Now it's quite a thing to do a full turnaround and claim the comparisons are moot - re-hash of course being your choice of words to denounce what never was intended as derogatory but flatly fact-stating. Hardly a fan of 'serious' music would have not noticed the similarities. You just overstate (to me) the things Zimmer did differently which to me amounts to extreme fiddling in the mixing booth that hardly affects the basic impression.

Again, i wouldn't be devastated if Zimmer got an award for this score, why should i, i rather like it.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

It is a rather good score. A bit repetitive, but good.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Well if you're reading my posts with a self-defensive tone then that's my own fault - but I assure you it's not the case here. I'm not interpreting you as being derogatory or anything. I simply think the Glass comparisons are shallow, and don't at all get the Oldfield ones. I'm surprised no one has brought up Solyaris. Much more tangible link to be made there, even though it's not original music.

And I suppose if you don't count what happens behind the scenes as significant, then no, this score is, from a compositional and production standpoint, not terribly innovative.

But again, contextually, as Stefan asked, well, see some of my above posts. I believe I've already made that clear. It's a space movie with a score based heavily on the pipe organ. It's pretty different. And it could go a long way in restoring that instrument to wider relevance.

[RedBard 71]

It may just be my limited experience, but from what I currently understand, there really are no extended techniques on the organ by virtue of how it produces pitches. It's essentially a giant pitched aerophone.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

You haven't actually. Just the usual fanboy diatribe.

Its the best Zimmer score in about 10 or 12 years. But in the grand scheme of film music that really doesn't amount to all that much.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

Stefan, the pipe organ's history is far richer than its sparing use in prog rock.

This is an instrument that ruled music for many years and in modern times has been reduced to a sideshow in the circus of contemporary religion. Or totally replaced by praise bands or some similar shit. It's instead now the go-to color for when someone wants to evoke the "oooohhhh spooky" atmosphere or for wedding scenes in soap operas and sitcoms. Within the community around the instrument, there's recently been a huge push to bring it back to widespread relevance. And this is in stark opposition to people who continue to push a very dogmatic, conservative view of the instrument and its "appropriate" use. So for it to show up in a blockbuster score, freed from all tired associations, is a big deal, actually. The only other score I can recall that did that was Jerry's TMP. Every other use constitutes a furthering of the pipe organ stereotype. This score should be commended for many things, but the least of them is certainly not what it's done to bring the venerable old king of instruments back into the spotlight.

Stefan, if the above post reads to you like typical fanboy diatribe, then I'm afraid you actually are an idiot.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

It's all a bit vague for me I fear. The use of the organ in sci-fi is hardly new.

What does "within the community around the instrument" even mean?

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

The pipe organ community. People who play the instrument, like listening to it, that sort of thing. It's a weird but extensive musical niche.

Please, list for me all of the sci-fi scores that feature the pipe organ, prominently or otherwise.

[publicist 4,643]

Well if you're reading my posts with a self-defensive tone then that's my own fault - but I assure you it's not the case here. I'm not interpreting you as being derogatory or anything. I simply think the Glass comparisons are shallow, and don't at all get the Oldfield ones.

But they aren't! You can't act as if a highly influential score for a documentary from the early 80's has not happened especially if its use of organ (at times) is eerily similar to Zimmer's score.

Though i might have a bit more of an objective view, all things considered. You seem obviously profoundly moved by all this (movie/score, i mean) which is fine but now we have arrived at what none of us really wants, namely page-long rants trying to out-eloquent each other to prove what is essentialy unprovable...especially within the rather flippant topic of likely oscar winners.

[Dixon Hill 4,234]

I'm not acting as if it never happened. I just don't see that the similarities are anything more than passing, existing at the outermost level of what the two scores are and never much deeper.

Otherwise I agree completely.

[publicist 4,643]

After listening to MR. TURNER i at least have to recommend the Academy for nominating a recalcitrant chamber music score - in lieu of more surface gloss.

[KK 3,307]

What I heard of that score in the context of the film sounded quite interesting. I think it might be the most intriguing of the bunch, though I have to listen to the album to make a better assessment.

And to sum up Interstellar's merit to just its use of the organ doesn't do it justice, and is rather silly. It's not in innovation that this score shines, but in how Zimmer is able to pull together so many different stylistic vices from both his personal career and the works of others to create a substantial creative effort. Yes, there's Glass here, some Parsons there, Zimmer's take on Strauss now and then, and many other avant-garde techniques. But Zimmer clearly did his research, and tried a lot of things to create a unique soundscape for this film, which is more than can be said for many of the other nominees or film scores of the year. It's not the best score of Zimmer's career, it's not the best thing since sliced bread, but it is one of most valiant and respectable efforts of the year.