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James Horner's "Collage: A Concerto for Four Horns and Orchestra"


TownerFan

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It's interesting though. For a long time now John Williams is being accused of not stepping out of his comfort zone. So was Jerry from the 90's onwards, so was Barry, and so was Horner in the post Titanic part of his career.

 

Why do people always demand for composers to reinvent themselves after they reached a certain age, or a certain stage of their career? 

Once you reach that certain age of stage often the only reason you would make any radical change is necessity. And if you are rich, successful and still in demand that trigger for change isnt really there.

 

 

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But that was always a superficial argument because even these three composers are so vastly different that i always found it laughable to lump their approach together.

 

I agree with Newman, David who said in an interview about Horner that it's a bit futile to rate a composer by his Hollywood scores because however you twist and turn it, the requirements of big studio productions are going to mute their musicality to a point where it becomes a left-handed compliment to pat, say, Horner on the back for staying true to himself or implying that there just isn't anything beyond noble horn calls and luxurious strings in divisi that the composer should possibly tackle.

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I never compared these composers music directly, which you can see if you bothered to actually read my post. I was comparing the criticism that is leveled at their later works.

 

But i agree with Newman. Anything written for film is subject to the aproval of the director or studio. Certainly in these times.

 

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I read everything you write with great interest my friend. I just don't really agree with it in this case.

 

Critiquing a piece because of what it isnt, or what it should have been rather then what it is really doesnt interest me that much.

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But that's the nature of the beast. If not put into historical context we would still celebrate the brilliant idea of putting Carmina Burana behind epic battles or movie trailers. Again and again.

 

Horner is arguably the most idiosyncratic steward of a legacy of borrowing, self-quotations and so on. It isn't just a lovable trait or, like in Goldsmith's case, an extended shrug towards the working conditions and lowered expectations of assignments he got. This will always be a point of reference for reflections of him (maybe even an interesting psychological portrait) and given the tendency to retreat to a very narrowly drawn palette of gentle americana built on the very same intervals, instrumental choices etc. it's a fair point that he wrote himself into a corner. As i said, nice to listen to, but knowing that Horner's abilities are of a far greater reach than., say, Rachel Portman's, it's a shame he didn't utilize his musical talents towards more varied style (especially of works where he actually had the leeway).

 

 

 

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I guess I agree. But I've long got over that inherent weakness in Horners music and just accept those limitations he seem to have imposed upon himself.

 

A score like The Perfect Storm becomes a lot better once you get past the fact that it's Apollo 13 + Braveheart + Titanic with a dash of Sneakers. 

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It's purely an intellectual exercise (writing about it). As a listener, i feel that i often choose the newer pieces in lieu of the old ones (special favourites excepted) and i don't care much - Horner was right in that the public at large wouldn't give a shit about recurring ideas - but i see no point writing about it without mentioning the inherent limitations of such approach.

 

We had many quarrels over the years here what constitutes highs and lows (y'know, Williams 'golden' period, Goldsmith bad 90's phase and so on) and it often didn't get anywhere because you can't really separate general trends in films, culture etc. from the composer persona. Horner in that respect is a more interesting subject because many of the musical choices he made were absolutely his own (not so much mandated by the production team, James Cameron excepted) and given the increasingly limited variations thereof, sometimes interrupted by very bold choices (think 'Four Feathers') make him imho one of the more enigmatic composers in recent Hollywood.

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Very true. The absurd re-occurance of the 4 note danger motif in so many of his works alone is a good example. At first it just seems lazy, but after a while you figure there must be some idea or purpose behind it. It goes beyond self reference or being lazy.

 

The "painter" analogy is one that is now frequently applied to Horner as an explanation of his stylistic musical choices. And while there is some merit to it it still doesnt quite convince. There's something oddly baffling about that aspect of Horner which has actually becomes rather fascinating.

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I listened to the CD yesterday and it's probably my favorite release of the year.

 

Really nice music here. 

 

Though the Aliens track doesn't really jive with the vibe of the rest of the CD

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1 hour ago, Stefancos said:

Very true. The absurd re-occurance of the 4 note danger motif in so many of his works alone is a good example. At first it just seems lazy, but after a while you figure there must be some idea or purpose behind it. It goes beyond self reference or being lazy.

 

The "painter" analogy is one that is now frequently applied to Horner as an explanation of his stylistic musical choices. And while there is some merit to it it still doesnt quite convince. There's something oddly baffling about that aspect of Horner which has actually becomes rather fascinating.

 

My half-assed theory is that he had personal demons that slowly took hold of him as he became a film music legend, a Faustian bargain if you like:

 

- a strong desire to be a successful serious composer, a wish that remained forever elusive

- the various and very obvious classical citations at the beginning of his career being a mixture of cynism towards Hollywood dumbass-ery and real joy of applying his idols' works in his film music

- the realization that his film career was a double-edged sword: he became insanely rich and successful early on, but the outlet in film for his musical talents was limited and reigned in by dubious commercial considerations

- later the embracing of all these compromises, probably happening in the early 90's and acceptance that even on respectable movies like 'Glory' he so craved musical sophistication didn't necessarily plays a huge role (a process completed at last after 'Titanic' made him immortal; i to this day think he was pressing on with a musical aesthetic he had serious misgivings about but later saw as an unavoidable necessity in the commercial Hollywood world he was cemented into)

- the classical quotations then almost disappeared and made way for a much more overt habit of obsessive citing of his own vastly more limited traits, probably also out of a mixture of cynism (give them what they want) and a growing delusion about the actual musical qualities of his work (understandable, having to write this stuff in often insanely short periods of time and also being hired again and again for exactly that kind of sound)

- finally, muted despair that even after having reached these highs to still get little respect and even worse, being subjected to a rapidly artist-unfriendly environment where the composer was more like a handyman, the 5th wheel on a soundtrack cluttered with sonic overkill

 

Of course his infatuation with self-quotation started much earlier, but it was more playful and less rigid and probably wouldn't have made much of an impact on his later image if he for instance would have started scoring french art movies or Errol Morris-documentaries{insert own esoteric choice here} that probably would have challenged him much differently. When in the mid-2000's he opened up with the kind of interviews that betrayed a deeply hurt soul, it was too late to change gears completely and he was stuck with what he had. Which for many of us remains a gift that keeps on giving but i imagine that a composer of Horner's vast knowledge and love of the classical repertoire probably was much more annoyed at having to supply third-rate copies of current blockbuster music in parts of, say, 'Spider-Man'. 

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As good a theory as any i've read. It's for certain that Horner felt himself a composer for the concert hall who ended up in film. You can hear that in nearly everything he's ever composed. His early film scores have a joy to them even when the films were substandard. That joy continued through the 80's as he realized he was a success and his music was heard. Later on it become more measured, restrained, more professional.

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One thing that always really struck me about Horner. For someone who was so longing for intellectual challenge and artistic expression, his choices of projects and dramatic tastes were somewhat limited. It became obvious to me after the whole debacle with Terrence Malick. He had a great artistic schizophrenia. Criticising Hollywood for its limitations and then picking yet another clichéd melodrama to work on. Slagging off Marvel and then doing Spider-Man. Strange man.

 

Karol

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6 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

Yet if you listen to his Spider-Man, it doesnt sound anything like the cookie cutter Marvel scores we are used to. Every time I hear it I'm surprised this was composed for a modern superhero film.

 

Remember that he became out of fashion and had a last few scores rejected.  His style didn't fit the remote control mold of the day and those that hired him wanted old fashion sensibilities rather than drones+arpeggios.

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Woah Collage is terrific; I'm going to give it a second listen now (although the last part has been playing on repeat already). The opening of part 6 is absolutely sublime. Stunningly gorgeous. And the build-up at the middle of that part is so exciting!

 

This concerto really seems to have touched something emotionally in me. Maybe it has to do with Horner's death. It feels like proper closure for Horner's death. The shimmering textures... so beautiful. 

 

I haven't heard much Horner, really. (There are so many older film scores by various composers and I'm so new to fandom that it's so overwhelming. Eventually I'm sure I'll be able to listen to all the major ones at least. I have a feeling he will eventually become one of my very favorite composers.)

 

But I noticed that this concert work was very "accessible" for a concerto, almost like a film score. With Williams, I'm used to concert works taking several listens to "get" (at least the few I've listened to). This was very different. Is that typical for Horner's concert works?

 

"Star Trek" quotes abound in part 6. :)

 

It's a little annoying that they separated a one-movement work into six tracks. But I guess they wanted to keep lengths short.

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There arent a lot of concertworks around from Horner. This is something he only recently started to get into. And yes it's much closer to his film work them Williams' concert works are to his.

 

I wonder if that's because he wanted to play it safe and write the type of music he was known for?

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4 hours ago, Stefancos said:

I wonder if that's because he wanted to play it safe and write the type of music he was known for?

 

Following my theory above i guess he really was obsessed with his own oeuvre to the point where every new piece was a kind of career retrospective. The necessity to deal with outside influences in film music might have been a blessing in that regard.

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5 hours ago, Stefancos said:

Yet if you listen to his Spider-Man, it doesnt sound anything like the cookie cutter Marvel scores we are used to. Every time I hear it I'm surprised this was composed for a modern superhero film.

It does follow modern trends but those elements are so well handled and mixed together that you get to see what modern scores could sound like if a proper musician is handling them. It almost made me care about the movie.

 

I had the same impression when I heard last years' Creed. Sure, it does everything that a modern score would but it does it with so much grace. And it has a kick ass theme that you can actually remember long after leaving cinema.

 

And with Elfman' Age of Ultron too. He managed to assimilate all tired Marvel fingerprints and mannserisms (among them the trademark ostinatos punctuated by anvil hits) and make them work with his almost swashbuckling theme.

 

So yeah there is a way to have both old and new. It just requires a composers who know what the hell they're doing.

 

Karol

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  • 8 months later...

I'm listening to this CD again now.  I forgot how truly great "First in Flight" is (Track 1 Conquest of the Air and Track 4 Kitty Hawk).  This is seriously great Horner music right here, worth the whole price of the CD just for those 2 tracks

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I just finished the Aliens suite, meaning I've listened to all of the CD that isn't the Collage part.

 

I feel like Iris, Wolf Totem, For Greater Glory, and to a lesser extent Legends of the Fall jive well with the First in Flight music and general tone of the whole CD, but the Aliens suite kinda sticks out like a sore thumb.  It isn't as well performed (especially in the first half) and is too action-y compared to everything else on the CD.

 

Man that Wolf Totem music sounds great though, eh?

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I concur.  It isn't as tight as it should be and it's under-tempo.  Just doesn't fit with the other titles.  Kinda like how "Follow Me" stands out in Always.

 

Or, to be crass, it stands out like a turd in a punch-bowl.  (With all due credit to Up the Academy.)

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I adore "Collage" itself as well (probably more than the flight pieces, although they are good). 

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I think I just haven't "gotten" Collage yet.  I think its a piece that desires a more dedicated listen as oppossed to the way that the rest of the CD can be easily casually enjoyed.  I DO like it, and I DO like the whole CD, but for me by far the First In Flight pieces are the highlights, and one of my favorite Horner works

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