THE BFG OST ALBUM Discussion

[ocelot 508]

As a composer (many on here are) my jaw dropped at the sheer amount of orchestration in this score. From the Debussy "Jeux" like sections in Dream Country, to the aforementioned Tchaikovsky ballet inspired main theme, the Offenbach/Ponchielli's dance of the hours Frolic (anyone feel the dancing ostriches and hippos from Fantasia at the end?) lol, to the Prokofiev's Cinderella-like waltz "To Giant Country". Those are the only things I have listen to so far and holy hell, just orchestrationally it's MASSIVE. Can not comment on thematically since I am not listening to the rest yet. I'm gonna wait. BTW is it 4 flutes in all this?

[King Mark 3,625]

it's definitely getting better and better as I re-listen to some cues

 

it doesn't matter that it sounds like Harry Potter alternates in some cases, they are still equally good cues

3 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

 

The same's true for Harry Potter 1.

 

 

 

 

Well, I think the HP books were read by as many adults than children. I never heard of BFG before

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

2 minutes ago, king mark said:

it's definitely getting better and better as I re-listen to some cues

 

it doesn't matter that it sounds like Harry Potter alternates in some cases, they are still equally good cues

 

 

Well, I think the HP books were read by as many adults than children. I never heard of BFG before

 

I meant Harry Potter 1 more as a comparison in the sense another film that a lot of very young children will see but which also contains a very complex and elaborate score.

[ocelot 508]

The BFG is by Roald Dahl for crying out loud, not some unknown author. He also gave us Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, Charlie and the Great Glass Elevator, James and the Giant Peach and Fantastic Mr Fox amongst others!!!!!

 

Edit: I forgot Matilda!

[King Mark 3,625]

Well, I've just learned something

 

i wasn't really exposed to these books when I was young

[ocelot 508]

6 minutes ago, king mark said:

Well, I've just learned something

 

i wasn't really exposed to these books when I was young

His first book was The Gremlins, which were about little mischievous mythical little creatures that wreck havoc... Sound familiar?  Spielberg didn't use the same plot as the book and changed the local but the idea of Gremlins and what they were came from Roald Dahl's book, The Gremlins. I loved his books as a kid!

[Dixon Hill 4,232]

27 minutes ago, publicist said:

After having skimmed through it while doing the extremely pleasant chore of preparing my tax declaration i say it's 70% Potter outtakes with a heavy dash of Rimsky-Korsakov for which i am just not the right audience. 

 

Whenever it's more sweetly melodic it's nice in that innocuous Horner children's score way just with more of a waltzy kind of feeling (too seldom!).

 

Will give it two more whirls but great shakes it ain't, compositionally it's all been there before and better. Some of the flute work threatens to become more unique but drowns in a sea of self-referential quotations. After Tintin and TFA i become more and more convinced that this isn't stuff Williams should spend his precious afternoons with.

 

But... it's better than what anyone else could do!  Beyond their comprehension, even!

[Damien F 1,742]

The album is now on Spotify in Ireland which usually means it's available in UK too.

[artguy360 1,843]

It's definitely an album with a lot of fun musical moments but I'm struggling to think much of it beyong that. Really fun orchestrations throughout the score. But the main theme for Sophie sounds kind of unfinished to me. It sounds like it is halfway to a memorable theme but doesn't make the full distance.

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

50 minutes ago, TheWhiteRider said:

1 hour ago, publicist said:

After having skimmed through it while doing the extremely pleasant chore of preparing my tax declaration i say it's 70% Potter outtakes with a heavy dash of Rimsky-Korsakov for which i am just not the right audience. 

 

Whenever it's more sweetly melodic it's nice in that innocuous Horner children's score way just with more of a waltzy kind of feeling (too seldom!).

 

Will give it two more whirls but great shakes it ain't, compositionally it's all been there before and better. Some of the flute work threatens to become more unique but drowns in a sea of self-referential quotations. After Tintin and TFA i become more and more convinced that this isn't stuff Williams should spend his precious afternoons with.

But... it's better than what anyone else could do!  Beyond their comprehension, even!

 

The Jolly Brothers are distributing their best again.

 

If this is not your thing, why to bother?

[artguy360 1,843]

Concerning the fact that this is a score to a children's film, the music is definitely whimsical and playful, but there doesn't seem to be a strong theme or themes that children will remember or hum after leaving the theater. Home Alone and Harry Potter both have thay element of instantly recognizable music/melodies. This score seems to lack that so far which seems especially odd for a JW children's film score.

[Quintus 5,399]

Outside of Hook (which I've outgrown) I'm not much of a fan of Williams in whimsy mode, so I'll probably not enjoy this much and will likely skip it. I could never get into his Potter stuff and I can't stand the majority of War Horse either, with its twee quasi Walton/Elgar pretense. I didn't fancy the movie anyway, so I can't act surprised really. 

[Alex 2,833]

I think it's just nice to hear JW tackle this sort of film again. It makes a change from the War Horse/Lincoln/Munich kind of films. Apart from Episode VIII (if he scores it), none of his future projects really excite me.

[Quintus 5,399]

His Ready Player One I cannot wait for, actually. 

[filmmusic 1,823]

5 hours ago, Jay said:

Overture is a total misnomer; it's nothing more than the first chunk of the end credits, repeated as it's own track, like what he did on the JP and Minority Report OSTs.

I wonder if he maybe could have written it for a teaser/trailer for the film, but the big minds decided to go with the usual trailer music instead..

 

edit: hmmm, on the other hand, it doesn't sound so.

[Thor 7,465]

OK, listening for the first time on Spotify now (forgive me if I haven't read the preceding 27 pages[!] of this thread).

 

It's weird. When I heard the snippets in Cannes, I was skeptical. Then the sound clips gave me hope. Then when I'm listening now, the "whimsicality" that I discerned in Cannes is back with a vengeance. Don't get me wrong -- the score is quite good, and I love the thematic snippets (brief as they may be), but it's not even in the same ballpark as HOOK, HOME ALONE or HARRY POTTER (with whom it is relevant to compare).

 

On the other hand, the first impression is MUCH better than TFA, and that grew on me quite a bit, so maybe the same will happen here too.

 

In either case, his greatest 2010s work remains WAR HORSE to me.

[publicist 4,643]

2 hours ago, hornist said:

If this is not your thing, why to bother?

 

Which is exactly the same question i could ask you. Why bother? it's my opinion and i wouldn't dream of suppressing it for your comfort.

[Bespin 8,478]

It's on iTunes too... Play!

 

EDIT: Geezz, they still have only 30 sec. extracts. I wonder why I pay 10 $ a month for their streaming service...

 

Spotify Then...

 

Is the album also produced by John Williams?

[Bilbo 3,709]

3 hours ago, dfenton85 said:

The album is now on Spotify in Ireland which usually means it's available in UK too.

I noticed that but the CD isn't out for another week right? I'll check Tower on my lunch break just in case.

[Bespin 8,478]

Reminds me a lot of Lincoln!

[crocodile 7,984]

Really really really hate to say this but...

 

This score is not my cup of tea. It's the first time ever that I'm left completely unimpressed by a John Williams score. Like, ever. Never thought this day would come. How depressing. I can always find stuff to appreciate/enjoy in virtually any previous score of his. A theme, single pieces, concept itself... Nothing at all stands out in The BFG. I've been struggling to even finish the album. It's like a B side of material (wisely) unused in other fantasy films. Sad day indeed.

 

And it's also a third successive Spielberg film I won't be watching.

 

Karol

[Bowie 45]

Not that Oscars matter but does anyone else get the feeling Williams may not make the cut this year? A mid-year Spielberg flop is not great for his chances, given of course that the score itself won't blow any minds, regardless of its inherent decent quality.

[Lockdown 238]

I really love this score. Especially after seeing the film.

8 hours ago, Not Mr. Big said:

Agreed.

 

Disagreed.  

Sorry, crappy wi-fi.

 

[Josh500 1,615]

OK, I got it.

 

Gotta say, it's okay (yes, just okay), but I'm not blown away. Far from it. Tintin is like ten times better. I think I even prefer "The Book Thief" over this....

 

That said, last track is the best. Like a best of. But who knows, the whole score will grow on me once I watch the movie. 

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

22 minutes ago, crocodile said:

Really really really hate to say this but...

 

This score is not my cup of tea. It's the first time ever that I'm left completely unimpressed by a John Williams score. Like, ever. Never thought this day would come. How depressing. I can always find stuff to appreciate/enjoy in virtually any previous score of his. A theme, single pieces, concept itself... Nothing at all stands out in The BFG. I've been struggling to even finish the album. It's like a B side of material (wisely) unused in other fantasy films. Sad day indeed.

 

And it's also a third successive Spielberg film I won't be watching.

 

Karol

 

I have been struggling to even finish the JW album two times, Dracula and Indy 4. Now on my way to the theater, no idea how the music is...

 

Maybe you should also watch these films to learn what it is all about.

[Muad'Dib 1,800]

I really like the mysterious witch-like theme from Witching Hour, and To Giant Country and Frolic are great material, but apart from that I couldn't get too much into this score.

 

Spielberg talked a lot about how the book was very much in the vein of old-school Disney (Pinocchio, Snow White and so on) so I was expecting a score in that vein. Very whimsy but at the same time quite dark, but there isn't much of the latter. The orchestrations are bloody fantastic though, and the orchestra sounds so fucking good, which compensates for a lot in my ears, but the more cutesy parts -which is most of the score- don't interest me at least right now. 

 

Wasn't there supposed to be a trio with flute, tuba and something else? A really particular trio piece. Maybe I missed it.

[crocodile 7,984]

18 minutes ago, hornist said:

 

I have been struggling to even finish the JW album two times, Dracula and Indy 4. Now on my way to the theater, no idea how the music is...

 

Maybe you should also watch these films to learn what it is all about.

Don't get me wrong. Compositionally it is excellent. The orchestrations are better than anybody else's in this business. From that perspective, the score is a confirmation of John Williams' skill and impeccable craft. But, at this point, I bet even his farts are impressive in their wonderful harmonic complexity. It's not even that I need to have big hummable themes (not there are any in The BFG), it's a sense of purpose I'm looking for. And The BFG is aimless, weightless and, frankly, quite boring.

 

It probably doesn't help that I dislike great portions of Home Alone, Hook and his Harry Potter scores (with the exception of Azkaban). You know, all the cutesy and breezy underscore in between good bits. I like my fantasy music bit weightier, perhaps bit edgier and better defined. And this score largely consists of fluffy underscore that could drive me into diabetes. I'm not saying that this particular one should be "edgier" but, surely, there must have been a way to make it a bit more interesting.

 

I am heartbroken.

 

Karol

[Jay 37,285]

7 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said:

 

The same's true for Harry Potter 1. The score is so elaborately and densely orchestrated - beyond the scope of children to even notice or appreciate. It is extraordinarily complex even in its beginning when the orchestra swirls with malice around the main theme.

 

But look at it another way - scores like Harry Potter 1 and BFG might also end up being the first introduction for many children to orchestral and/or symphonic music. They might not get the music fully, but they will remember the sound. This is the capacity of aesthetic surprise - children can slowly be surprised into appreciating more complex things. And a Williams score is a good place to start. I mean all children have to start somewhere to start admiring other things.

 

I think a lot of Williams music worked for me this way in my younger days (specially when I saw E.T.), the complexity of the music definitely made an impression on me and made me want to understand it better. And the more I understood it, the more pleasure I got out of it - the development of taste, as people might call it.

 

 

 

Yes but Harry Potter and ET are actually good films.  The BFG is not a very good film, that's what I meant.  They took a very simple, very shallow script and got tons of top notch Hollywood talent to make it into a movie, including the world's best composer who gave his all to construct a really dense score with lots of themes... and the movie will be a flop and a footnote in both of their discographies.

[JacksonElmore 69]

52 minutes ago, crocodile said:

Really really really hate to say this but...

 

This score is not my cup of tea. It's the first time ever that I'm left completely unimpressed by a John Williams score. Like, ever. Never thought this day would come. How depressing. I can always find stuff to appreciate/enjoy in virtually any previous score of his. A theme, single pieces, concept itself... Nothing at all stands out in The BFG. I've been struggling to even finish the album. It's like a B side of material (wisely) unused in other fantasy films. Sad day indeed.

 

And it's also a third successive Spielberg film I won't be watching.

 

Karol

i kinda thought this until i saw the movie. Not that the movie was....good, but it put a lot of the music in context. And after a few listens to the album, theres a lot of stuff that I really love and stuff that stands out to me.

[Quintus 5,399]

7 minutes ago, crocodile said:

I am heartbroken.

 

Karol

 

Really? It's only music. This sounds so emo! 

[Jay 37,285]

5 hours ago, artguy360 said:

Concerning the fact that this is a score to a children's film, the music is definitely whimsical and playful, but there doesn't seem to be a strong theme or themes that children will remember or hum after leaving the theater. Home Alone and Harry Potter both have thay element of instantly recognizable music/melodies. This score seems to lack that so far which seems especially odd for a JW children's film score.

 

It's interesting that post-KOCS seems to switch between scores with strong memorable themes and ones without.  War Horse, Lincoln, TFA have these long-lined memorable melodies, Tintin, Book Thief, and BFG have shorter themes.  Interesting.

[crocodile 7,984]

Just now, Lonnegan said:

 

Really? It's only music. This sounds so emo! 

It's a betrayal!

 

Karol

[Jay 37,285]

56 minutes ago, Bowie said:

Not that Oscars matter but does anyone else get the feeling Williams may not make the cut this year? A mid-year Spielberg flop is not great for his chances, given of course that the score itself won't blow any minds, regardless of its inherent decent quality.

 

This score has a 0% chance of getting an Oscar nomination.

 

That's not a remark on its quality, just how the industry works these days.

 

The 5 scores nominated for Best Score will all be oscar bate movies released in Nov/Dec.  Maybe Rogue One has a chance, being Desplat.

[JacksonElmore 69]

If you don't want to watch the movie with the music in context that's fine, but then you can't make blanket statements about the album without fully understanding it. I understand your disappointment and part of me agrees, but just because you don't hear an imperial march like theme after your first listen through doesn't mean it's shit. 

[crocodile 7,984]

Never said that. I love War of the Worlds and that one had barely any thematic material whatsoever.

 

And after three listens now.

 

And yes, I  can judge albums based on album experience.

 

Karol

[Jay 37,285]

No one should really make final judgement on  the album without listening to it 2-3 times.

[Quintus 5,399]

Never a good start though is it... having to brute force enjoyment out of a score. I don't normally do that sort of thing. 

 

Rewatches of a movie I enjoy can be a good avenue for a growing fondness of its music, though. That's typically been my method. 

[JacksonElmore 69]

1 minute ago, crocodile said:

Never said that. I love War of the Worlds and that one had barely any thematic material whatsoever.

 

And after three listens now.

 

Karol

oh okay, sorry then.

[publicist 4,643]

It's like with parents that can't face the fact that their baby is ugly. 

[Jay 37,285]

Karol, you shouldn't feel you have to apologize for liking or not liking something.  Own your opinions.

[Bespin 8,478]

Honestly, I didn't finished the album, stopped it after the half. It really seems to be a child movie with a lot of goofy action and very few moving moments. Well... Now, I'm not sure anymore to go see the movie in theater.

 

The next "real" Star Wars is when?

 

 

[Quintus 5,399]

2 minutes ago, Jay said:

Karol, you shouldn't feel you have to apologize for liking or not liking something.  Own your opinions.

 

*Noble horns*

 

God bless America. 

[crocodile 7,984]

6 minutes ago, JacksonElmore said:

oh okay, sorry then.

Hopefully I'm just having a bad day and my mood affects my appreciation. Or something. But then, I'm not in a bad mood at all.

 

Need to believe I will start to like it... if I try hard enough.

 

(is it time for a Rocky-like montage sequence?)

 

Karol

[JacksonElmore 69]

3 minutes ago, Bespin said:

Honestly, I didn't finished the album, stopped it after the half. It really seems to be a child movie with a lot of action and very few moving moments. Well... Now, I'm not sure anymore to go see the movie in theater.

I personally suggest you do, if anything just to give the music another chance. Not a very good film though so it might even make it worse. 

 

All i can say is that for some reason i'v grown to really like this score just in the past 12 hours. I find some parts touching and other parts very very exciting and fun. The scene that "To Giant Country" accompanies made me appreciate the track a bit more, and it is one of the only glimpses at adventure we get musically. 

[Jay 37,285]

15 minutes ago, Bespin said:

Honestly, I didn't finished the album, stopped it after the half. It really seems to be a child movie with a lot of goofy action and very few moving moments. Well... Now, I'm not sure anymore to go see the movie in theater.

 

The next "real" Star Wars is when?

 

 

 

Episode 8 opens December 15, 2017.  But we might get "The Kidnapping of Edgardo Mortara" before then.

[JacksonElmore 69]

Jay,

at this point, if you had to give this score a letter grade what would it be?

[Jay 37,285]

3 minutes ago, JacksonElmore said:

Jay,

at this point, if you had to give this score a letter grade what would it be?

 

Compared to all scores JW has ever written, a solid B I guess.

 

Compared to all scores written for 2016 films, a strong A+

[crumbs 14,300]

56 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

This score has a 0% chance of getting an Oscar nomination.

 

That's not a remark on its quality, just how the industry works these days.

 

The 5 scores nominated for Best Score will all be oscar bate movies released in Nov/Dec.  Maybe Rogue One has a chance, being Desplat.

 

Don't the musician wing determine the nominees for this category? Would've thought Williams was almost the Meryl Streep of the Best Original Score category nowadays, getting a nomination on name alone. But yes, the date of the film's release, the lukewarm reception and the genre itself are all working against him.

 

I can already imagine the eventual nominees. All five will be ~40 minute scores with an endless series of "delicate" piano solos and the occasional violinist interrupting. Oh, and they'll all have exotic European names (the most exotic of which will win).

[Damien F 1,742]

28 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

Compared to all scores JW has ever written, a solid B I guess.

 

Compared to all scores written for 2016 films, a strong A+

 

I just finished my first listen and I think that is a fair assessment. For me, Sophie's theme is his least engaging primary theme of his semi-retirement period but it is still nice and warm with some lovely performances especially that piano rendition in Finale. What I love about the score though is the great soundscape and orchestration - really great orchestration actually especially the woodwinds. The woodwinds really get a great workout. The evil giants motif is a great children's movie bad guy theme too - full of maliciousness without being too overbearing for the genre.

 

I'd rate it 4/5 in terms of overall musical listening experience and the compositional skill on display. In terms of Williams' career, it'll be an average entry and below Tintin, War Horse, Lincoln and TFA from this later period.

[Alex 2,833]

I definitely enjoyed it a lot more second time around. Overall I'd say it is a more consistent listening experience than TFA, but the individual highlights of TFA are far superior. My favourite cues are "To Giant Country", "Frolic" and "Sophie and the BFG". Wasn't planning to go and see the film but may do now just to get the music in context.