The Rise of Skywalker Star Wars IX The Rise of Skywalker (JJ Abrams 2019)

[Nick1Ø66 4,689]

I think you're confusing what you regard as the character's irredeemability with a lack of conflict.

 

He can be both conflicted and irredeemable (e.g. Gollum).

[Chen G. 3,944]

Oh, sure.

 

But I do think that in the case of The Last Jedi, specifically, much of his internal conflict is a charade for Rey.

 

But I'll agree that its not all an act. Ultimatelty, there's ambiguity there.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Rey... I think your friend Ren is real screwed up.

[Kasey Kockroach 2,343]

You EEDIOTS!

[Pellaeon 593]

I have zero predictions or hopes for Episode IX. I believe Abrams is capable of producing a good film, but it could go in any direction right now, and I have no way of predicting it. TLJ did a very poor job at set up. It’s unusual for the first installment of a trilogy to end with such momentum on a cliff, and the second installment to be all nicely wrapped up, isn’t it? It’s like all the torches have been passed, and now we’re at a pretty stable status quo. You know? Where is the Ring? Well, I guess they pretty much have to reopen the book on the quest to discover Rey’s true significance, since that is the only possible unifying element in this trilogy. I mean it’s that or just blow up another Death Star.

[Balahkay 627]

Prepare yourself for Starkiller II.

[Chen G. 3,944]

30 minutes ago, Pellaeon said:

It’s unusual for the first installment of a trilogy to end with such momentum on a cliff, and the second installment to be all nicely wrapped up, isn’t it?

 

Well, The Fellowship of the Ring had quite an open ending, followed by a more conclusive ending in The Two Towers, leading into Return of the King. Although its not a good comparison because its essentially one movie split three-ways, rather than three films made by different people, as is the case here.

 

Really, the only thing I'm worried about regarding IX (outside of the inherent issues of a concluding chapter) is that Carrie Fisher's death would deny this episode of having a through-line to the original film, in the way that the previous two had.

[mrbellamy 6,272]

On June 25, 2018 at 2:30 PM, Chen G. said:

Why?

 

Its not just that its Hayden, its that there's no need to smack Kylo around. There's a need for him to die.

 

If Kylo turns to the light, it would be the biggest cop-out in the history of blockbusters, which is really saying something. I said as much after "The Force Awakens", but its all the more true after "The Last Jedi". What can a villain do, that Kylo didn't perform or attempted, which would make him irredeemable?

 

There's literally no narrative reason for him to be redeemed apart from "well, that's what happened in Return of the Jedi." Plus, there's too much satisfaction to be found in the death of a villain for the chance to be wasted.

4

 

I'm not saying Anakin should turn Ben full-on back to the light but I think some sort of meeting between those two would make a lot of sense. Ben Solo's a guy obsessed with his grandfather's legacy in TFA, then with killing that history in TLJ, and so those two meeting each other looking around the same age in episode 9/9 could be a significant moment for the saga, however that goes.

 

I think what should probably happen in the end is he saves the galaxy from himself, either intentionally or inadvertently. Ben Solo/Kylo Ren is a self-destructive character and I think his final act will somehow bring about the collapse of the FO and himself in the process. Or maybe Rey makes a choice that sets the FO's destruction in motion and then Ben is given a choice where he can actually stop it and he lets it happen by not acting, and there's a little mystery as to whether it was deliberate inaction or if he dies eternally conflicted.

[Chen G. 3,944]

5 minutes ago, mrbellamy said:

Ben Solo/Kylo Ren is a self-destructive character and I think his final act will somehow bring about the collapse of the FO and himself in the process.

 

That's actually a neat idea!

 

Now you're thinking like a dramatist!

[Nick Parker 3,040]

5 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

 

Now you're thinking like a dramatist! 

 

 

[Nick1Ø66 4,689]

I just hope Williams manages to fit thematic material from all nine episodes into the end credits. It's a moral imperative.

[Chen G. 3,944]

YES!

 

Either that, or add a new "Star Wars: A Musical Journey" disc to the soundtrack album. 😉

[Kasey Kockroach 2,343]

I hope he uses the Force theme enough times! 

[Nick Parker 3,040]

1 minute ago, Nick1066 said:

I just hope Williams manages to fit thematic material from all nine episodes into the end credits. It's a moral imperative.

 

Oh man, if we thought he got nostalgic in Revenge of the Sith....

[Nick1Ø66 4,689]

        ----------->To wit, which theme will comprise the very last notes at the end of the end titles for Episode IX? Williams final word on Star Wars, if you will. And who will make the decision as to which theme that will be?

 

And will he go out with bombast, or understatement? 

[Chen G. 3,944]

Its got to be The Force theme.

 

2 minutes ago, Nick Parker said:

Oh man, if we thought he got nostalgic in Revenge of the Sith....

 

In Revenge of the Sith the credits function as a "next time, on Star Wars", although it does get a bit repetitive with the Throne Room.

[MikeH 768]

1 minute ago, Nick1066 said:

        ----------->To wit, which theme will comprise the very last notes at the end of the end titles for Episode IX? Williams final word on Star Wars, if you will. And who will make the decision as to which theme that will be?

 

Whatever it is, it’ll be awesome. And then they’ll butcher it on the Blu Ray. 

[Nick Parker 3,040]

2 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

Its got to be The Force theme.

 

 

In Revenge of the Sith it functions as a "next time, on Star Wars."

 

On the album, especially, it's an explosive extravaganza of his farewells to Star Wars, such as including the Throne Room and Finale.

[Chen G. 3,944]

Again, to my mind its a "next time on Star Wars" kind of thing, which to my mind isn't the greatest thing since all the other themes in the suite are introduced in the underscore itself, so all Williams is left with is retreading re-retreading the Throne Room.

 

But I couldn't agree with @Nick1066 more - he needs to utilize the end-credits (at least on album) to provide a satisfying cap to all the nonet.

[Arpy 4,145]

Yeah, the Throne Room segment in the end credits suite goes on and on, like the ending of Return of the King. 

Alright Johnny, you can stop now. Johnny?

[The Illustrious Jerry 3,356]

4 hours ago, Chen G. said:

Either that, or add a new "Star Wars: A Musical Journey" disc to the soundtrack album. 😉

Arrange a Star Wars Symphony!

[Kasey Kockroach 2,343]

He should use Powell's Chewie theme! 

[The Illustrious Jerry 3,356]

On June 26, 2018 at 3:07 PM, someonefun124 said:

Prepare yourself for Starkiller II.

I had a crazy dream that the First Order made loads of smaller Starkillers-one for each system of planets- and would fire if anyone got out of line in that part of the Galaxy. Unfortunately, JJ Abrams decided that you only needed to blow up the main one two knock out all the others, so they did that and it was over. I must admit the shot in my mind of hundreds of little space battle stations blowing up was quite neat, but dernit this better not happen. 

[Pellaeon 593]

I do wonder if Mustafar will feature in this movie. It’s not really like J.J. to include Prequel elements, but, the volcano battle was well known from the early 80s, and he has to throw a bone to the PT because this has to be the grand finale of all three trilogies at least to some degree.

 

You know, let’s go find the MacGuffin in Vader’s castle and then accidentally throw a few characters into the lava.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

It all has to come back to Vader somehow. Star Wars is the tragedy of Anakin Skywalker afterall.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

Throne Room and Finale is literally better than everything.....except Ben's Death and the Tie Fighter Attack which is the best action music in all 5 real Star Wars films. 

[Pellaeon 593]

37 minutes ago, Margo Channing said:

It all has to come back to Vader somehow. Star Wars is the tragedy of Anakin Skywalker afterall.

 

To me, Star Wars will forever be The Adventures of Luke Skywalker first and foremost.

 

33 minutes ago, JoeinAR said:

Throne Room and Finale is literally better than everything.....except Ben's Death and the Tie Fighter Attack which is the best action music in all 5 real Star Wars films. 

 

Hard to beat Throne Room.

 

But okay, I’ll bite, 5?

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

9 minutes ago, Pellaeon said:

 

To me, Star Wars will forever be The Adventures of Luke Skywalker first and foremost.

 

Admiral Lucas disagrees.

[Pellaeon 593]

Yeah, I know circa the Prequels production he said, see, it’s really a self-contained 6-part epic centered on Anakin. I’m sure that’s truly how he preferred to think of it during those years—not before, that I know of, nor since, obviously, because the Sequel Trilogy by all accounts was his idea. Anyway, I’m not constrained to agree with him.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

The sequel trilogy isn't even THX certified.

[Balahkay 627]

1 hour ago, Pellaeon said:

I do wonder if Mustafar will feature in this movie. It’s not really like J.J. to include Prequel elements, but, the volcano battle was well known from the early 80s, and he has to throw a bone to the PT because this has to be the grand finale of all three trilogies at least to some degree.

 

You know, let’s go find the MacGuffin in Vader’s castle and then accidentally throw a few characters into the lava.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if Abrams did throw at least a small bone to PT for the final episode considering he did for TFA.

 

[Pellaeon 593]

Can you be more specific? I don’t see it.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

People on the internet love vague posting.

[Balahkay 627]

There are podracer flags somewhere among the other flags.

[Chen G. 3,944]

1 hour ago, Pellaeon said:

To me, Star Wars will forever be The Adventures of Luke Skywalker first and foremost.

 

As indeed it would be to any discerning viewer.

 

Lucas making three prequels is one thing, and him changing the first three to fit with the prequels is another, but to use both of those aspects of his work to completely re-contextualize what this body of work is about, and to claim that "it was always about the redemption of Anakin" is just...just...

[Pellaeon 593]

11 minutes ago, someonefun124 said:

There are podracer flags somewhere among the other flags.

 

The way I heard it, some podracer flags can be seen in the trailer clip of this shot, but Abrams ordered them removed from the film cut because he didn’t even want that easter egg from the PT.

I’m sure there’s more to it than that, but, whatever. It’s kind of neat but it doesn’t change much either way. The biggest bone to the PT in TFA that I can think of was using McGregor’s voice.

[Chen G. 3,944]

Did he? I haven't watched the film in quite some time, but if memory serves me well its just audio from the originals.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

1 hour ago, Pellaeon said:

 

To me, Star Wars will forever be The Adventures of Luke Skywalker first and foremost.

 

 

Hard to beat Throne Room.

 

But okay, I’ll bite, 5?

Star Wars, ESB, RotJ, TFA, and TLJ. I ignore the prequels because they are insufferable garbage, and the 3 films that do not feature Williams as composer are intersting but not memorable. Okay Rogue One is just bad filmmaking.

 

[Balahkay 627]

Apparently, both the voices of McGregor and Guinness were used during the vision scene with McGregor recording new dialogue.

 

[Holko 9,499]

They took a Guiness quote saying "afraid" and cut off the beginning and end to form "Rey". "These are your first steps" was newly recorded by Ewan.

[Naïve Old Fart 9,507]

2 hours ago, Pellaeon said:

 

You know, let’s go find the MacGuffin in Vader’s castle and then accidentally throw a few characters into the lava.

Don't get in a lava, about it.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Margo Channing said:

The sequel trilogy isn't even THX certified.

 

How wude!

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

2 hours ago, Pellaeon said:

To me, Star Wars will forever be The Adventures of Luke Skywalker first and foremost.

 

Just pull an Alien 4 and make a clone of Luke, then the saga can go on forever to the immense joy of @Chen G.!

[Arpy 4,145]

3 hours ago, Pellaeon said:

 

To me, Star Wars will forever be The Adventures of Luke Skywalker first and foremost.

 

I've always seen it as following the Skywalker family with the three distinct eras for Anakin, Luke, and now Rey. 

[Luke Skywalker 1,793]

Rey? Ben-Ren

[Pellaeon 593]

1 hour ago, Arpy said:

I've always seen it as following the Skywalker family with the three distinct eras for Anakin, Luke, and now Rey. 

 

Always?

 

3 minutes ago, Luke Skywalker said:

Rey? Ben-Ren

 

He’s a Solo.

[Holko 9,499]

He's the son of Leia Skywalker, he doesn't carry the name only because of the custom to be named after daddy.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

This thread is trash.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

5 hours ago, Luke Skywalker said:

Rey? Ben-Ren

 

She's Luke's daughter and the reincarnation of Anakin.

[Chen G. 3,944]

10 hours ago, Arpy said:

I've always seen it as following the Skywalker family with the three distinct eras for Anakin, Luke, and now Rey. 

 

I would say the through-line for all three trilogies is the conflict between good (Jedi, the Republic and/or Rebels/Resistance) and evil  (Sith, Empire and/or First Order), which makes sense. Conflict is, after all, at the heart of any narrative, including over-arching narratives of multi-entry film series such as these. Hell, it’s in the name: Star WARS.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Are Snoke and Kylo technically Sith or just dark force users?