The Doctor

Star Trek Discovery - Beware Spoilers!

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On 11/3/2017 at 11:22 PM, Stefancos said:

Klingon really isn't spoken all that much on Star Trek though, before Discovery.

 

Not in the sense that, well, there are no Klingons who speak just the Klingon language and no English, other than the soldiers that die attacking V'Ger in TMP. 

 

But all the series and movies that show Klingons do feature snippets of the language from time to time for effect. 

 

Kirk speaking Klingon to beam himself to the BOP in III. 

I don't remember V that well. 

Lots of Klingonese in Star Trek VI (tach pah, tach pet). 

Pretty sure the Klingons speak Klingon when Riker exchanges with the other officer. 

Klingon singing in Birthright, among others. 

Picard learning the language to be chadich (sp?) as part of the Duras story arc. 

There aren't many Klingons on DS9 until S4, but once they arrive, Dax shows off her skills and we see more Klingons serving in the fleet. 

Voyager has even fewer opportunities for the Klingon language, which is basically used a bit when Torres is irate, has visions, or finds the traveling Klingons in the Delta Quadrant. 

 

But no Klingons in classic era spend all their time speaking Marc Okrand's language as if the universal translator is broken. 

 

And from what I saw of the first ep of Discovery, the Klingons suffer from the same problem as Japanese in films like Tora, Tora, Tora: waiting for the English subtitles on the screen to be read by the viewer with a pause before moving on to the next chunk of text. Very slow and unnatural. 

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The episode where the captain sends that admiral (who is on to him) to the Klingons to get rid of her was quite 'meh' mainly because of the typical Trekkish moral conversations between the female Michael and the newly adopted son of the captain.

 

 

 

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Is that where they pull an Edge Of Tomorrow (Live Die Repeat) thingy? That Mudd dude surely tries to be the new Q.

 

BTW, why did no one talk about the admiral or her capture in this episode? 

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12 minutes ago, Quintus said:

Them liking this was a scientific impossibility anyways, fuck 'em.

 

Yeah, who gives a fuck about those who are actually fans of this franchise!

 

As a former Twin Peaks fan you should know better!

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1 minute ago, Alexcremers said:

Is it really true that Trekkies don't like Discovery? I mean, a lot of the typical Trekkie elements are there. 

 

A lot don't.  I'm slowly warming up to Discovery.  I can't get past the look of the Klingon's and the Klingon ships.  They look freaking ugly.  Klingon Goa'uld Bird Of Prey...really?

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1 hour ago, Alexcremers said:

Is it really true that Trekkies don't like Discovery? I mean, a lot of the typical Trekkie elements are there. 

 

And a lot of the typical John Williams elements are in a Hans Zimmer scores. Violins, for example. Doesn't say that they have much in common.

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2 hours ago, Alexcremers said:

Is it really true that Trekkies don't like Discovery? I mean, a lot of the typical Trekkie elements are there. 

 

You really don't have your ear to the ground on this one.  It's being panned hard by most long-time Star Trek fans, who also mostly hate the Abrams movies too.

 

Paramount isn't making these new movies or this new show for the long-time fans, they are trying to attract a wide audience.  Or with the show, seemingly trying to appeal to both and kind of not pleasing either as a result.

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1 hour ago, Marian Schedenig said:

 

And a lot of the typical John Williams elements are in a Hans Zimmer scores. Violins, for example. Doesn't say that they have much in common.

 

But the reason why I said it is that I do think it's quite Trekkisch. A bit too much for my taste. I was hoping for something completely different, something that would appeal to non-Trek fans. 

 

I think your comparison with John Williams and Zimmer doesn't make sense. 

 

 

41 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

You really don't have your ear to the ground on this one.  It's being panned hard by most long-time Star Trek fans, who also mostly hate the Abrams movies too.

 

 

 

Why? Is the show too Abrams-like for them? Or do they just don't like the look of the show ... I'm asking you because you seem to be 'in the know' of things. 

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26 minutes ago, Alexcremers said:

But the reason why I said it is that I do think it's quite Trekkisch. A bit too much for my taste. I was hoping for something completely different, something that would appeal to non-Trek fans. 

 

I think your comparison with John Williams and Zimmer doesn't make sense. 

 

 

It has a lot of Trek elements, but it's often decidedly un-Trekkish with many of them. Which makes it fail both as Trek and as a standalone thing. E.g. allusions to the prime directive (or its precursor?) in the latest episode, but without any concern for either the moral implications the PD was meant to highlight, nor much of a place in the (thin) story. Or the time loop in the previous one, which as a trope usually derives its fun from a kind of puzzle logic, only the story didn't have much logic. It's mostly just trope/name dropping.

 

With the admiral being first captured by the Klingons, the next story being completely unrelated to any of it, and the one after that returning to it while apparently also dropping in a Paul Stamos is being affected by the spore drive storyline that goes nowhere and has no use at all in that particular episode, I'm getting a strong feeling that they ended up with a lot of loosely related material for this season and didn't find a conclusive way to edit into a coherent string of episodes.

 

At the moment, it's about as sketchy and unfocused as the main title music. And about as Trekkish - the music has the Courage fanfare as a kind of  curiosity item that doesn't have much in common with the rest of it.

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58 minutes ago, Alexcremers said:

Why? Is the show too Abrams-like for them? Or do they just don't like the look of the show ... I'm asking you because you seem to be 'in the know' of things. 

 

Just spend 5 minutes browsing articles online.  The show is panned by pretty much everyone.  Though of course, many hold out hope it will be better.  It's been renewed for a second season, so there is of course a chance it WILL get better - most (all?) Trek shows are better in their later seasons than they are in their first.

 

And for long time Trek fans, its never about the look, its about the stories and characters.  Of course if things look good its a plus, but many would prefer a show that looks more modest and tells great stories, than one that looks like an expensive film but tells the most boring stories imaginable.

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1 hour ago, Jay said:

Paramount isn't making these new movies or this new show for the long-time fans, they are trying to attract a wide audience

 

Paramount isnt involved with Discovery. They don't own the rights to Star Trek anymore. CBS does. They actually have to license from CBS when they wanna make a movie.

25 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

It has a lot of Trek elements, but it's often decidedly un-Trekkish with many of them. Which makes it fail both as Trek and as a standalone thing. E.g. allusions to the prime directive (or its precursor?) in the latest episode, but without any concern for either the moral implications the PD was meant to highlight, nor much of a place in the (thin) story. Or the time loop in the previous one, which as a trope usually derives its fun from a kind of puzzle logic, only the story didn't have much logic. It's mostly just trope/name dropping.

 

With the admiral being first captured by the Klingons, the next story being completely unrelated to any of it, and the one after that returning to it while apparently also dropping in a Paul Stamos is being affected by the spore drive storyline that goes nowhere and has no use at all in that particular episode, I'm getting a strong feeling that they ended up with a lot of loosely related material for this season and didn't find a conclusive way to edit into a coherent string of episodes.

 

At the moment, it's about as sketchy and unfocused as the main title music. And about as Trekkish - the music has the Courage fanfare as a kind of  curiosity item that doesn't have much in common with the rest of it.

 

Pretty much agreed. It has Star Trek elements, but very few of it comes together so far.

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Lakeshore Records will be releasing the original score on CD

 

Quote

Lakeshore Records will release the first soundtrack album for the CBS All Access sci-fi drama Star Trek: Discovery. The album features selections of the original music from the show composed by Emmy Award winner Jeff Russo (Fargo, Legion, The Night Of, Snowfall, Power). The soundtrack will be released digitally and physically over the next couple of weeks. To pre-order the CD version (which is currently set for a December 15 release), visit Amazon. Check back on this page for the full album details.

 

 

http://filmmusicreporter.com/2017/11/03/lakeshore-records-to-release-star-trek-discovery-soundtrack/

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The last two episodes of this show haven't been very good. That time travel episode was something that's been done on Trek many, many times before (the time travel, not the discotheque & bad rap music), and much better at that. I don't even know what the episode with the Pandora planet was supposed to be about, except to manufacture a confrontation with the "Klingons" before the finale. And every scene with those Klingons is painful to watch. I can honestly say at this point I look forward to The Orville every week more than this.

 

It's an OK sci-fi TV show, maybe even above average on its own terms. But it just doesn't feel like Trek at all to me.

 

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2 hours ago, TheGreyPilgrim said:

Looks like the great Jason Issacs can't even save the show on his own as its one virtue.

 

They barely seem to be giving him a shot.

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Into The Forest I Go

 

The last one before the hiatus and it's actually a pretty good one overall. Solid action scenes, a few good scenes with Lorca and Stamets, and a fairly clear and focused objective.

 

Storytelling still feels clumsy and all over the place though. And the science is...odd.

 

This episode confirms that ever since Stamets hooked himself up to the spore-drive he hasnt had any medical checks at all? How is that believable? Does Starfleet even know that they ditched the Tardigrade? 

How does doing 133 microjumps help Discovery get data from the two sensors on the Klingon ship any faster?

 

All the stuff with Ash and the PTSD is very convenient and over rather the top. 

Cornwell and L'Rell are both alive, and both dumped in a room with no security for some reason?

 

 

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11 hours ago, Stefancos said:

Into The Forest I Go

 

The last one before the hiatus and it's actually a pretty good one overall. Solid action scenes, a few good scenes with Lorca and Stamets, and a fairly clear and focused objective.

 

Storytelling still feels clumsy and all over the place though. And the science is...odd.

 

This episode confirms that ever since Stamets hooked himself up to the spore-drive he hasnt had any medical checks at all? How is that believable? Does Starfleet even know that they ditched the Tardigrade? 

How does doing 133 microjumps help Discovery get data from the two sensors on the Klingon ship any faster?

 

All the stuff with Ash and the PTSD is very convenient and over rather the top. 

Cornwell and L'Rell are both alive, and both dumped in a room with no security for some reason?

 

 

 

 

Ya the mid-season finale had some plot holes but I looked past them. 


When Stamets was talking with Lorca about getting the data from the jumps and Stamets pointed out the dark areas being possible doorways to alternate realities...it makes me wonder if at the end they jumped into an alternate reality.

 

Did you notice the boobies shot from the Klingon female when it showed her and Tyler doing it?

 

Makes me wonder if Tyler was in fact Klingon altered to look human. Some think it's an albino Klingon that was altered to look human.

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Yes, people have been speculation about the Ash/Voq theory ever since Tyler showed up.

 

Weird that for an episode dealing with cloacked Klingon ship that are undetectable there's a short scene where one of the bridge crew said the shils sensors are detecting a cloacked Klingon ship approaching.

 

Also, does the ship of the dead have shields? How can Burnham and Tyler beam down to it?

 

There's a lot of very long established Trek "rules" that they seem to be ignoring, at random.

 

And yes, we saw Klingon titties.

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Watched the mid-season finale last night, by far the best episode yet. 

 

The show still isn't there (but what Trek show is this early on) but this last episode has given me the most hope yet that this series might end up being something good after all. Lorca's speech about getting back to exploration after the war was basically the creative team on the show speaking directly to us...basically saying, "we get it, just hang in there."  At least that's how I interpreted it. 

 

On 11/14/2017 at 5:04 AM, Stefancos said:

 

Also, does the ship of the dead have shields? How can Burnham and Tyler beam down to it?

 

 

 

They dealt with that...mentioned that the ship loses their shields for a moment during the cloaking process (c'mon man, you know that!)

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Star Trek: Discovery is a show that needs to find itself.

 

All of the things that were a big part of it's marketing campaign, having 2 women of colour in positions of authority, having a lead who's the stepdaughter of Sarek of Vulcan, war with the Klingons, Harry Mudd, setting the show 10 years before TOS. Discovery isnt really about any of that.

 

TOS had a core idea, pretty much straight away. TNG, DS9, Voyager and I'm presuming Enterprise had one too. But not straight away, or not successfully straight away. The writers and producers took the elements that worked and built on that.

 

Discover has elements that work. It needs to hone those. It needs to find it's own way, be it's own thing, yet still be Star Trek.

 

Apparently the Klingon War is over. It should be, it hasnt done much for the show. 

The endless and clunky Klingon dialogue needs to go. I get what they are trying to do, but it isnt working. Go back the English. The last ep sorta did that. It worked.

I like Tilly. But her role on the ship right now is to give the more important people on the show someone to talk too. Give her more to do, give her agency.

Do more with Culbert. The doctor has always been an importnat part of any Star Trek crew. Make him more than Stamets partner/husband.

Fix Burnham. The bones of the character are interesting. But they went from a character who's looking for redemption to someone with daddy issues and social awkwardness. Martin-Green delivers is you give her better material.

 

Make Lorca the key element of the show. Make his relationships with the individual crewman on Discovery far more prominent. Jason Isaacs is the best actor on the show and he needs to be used to his full capacity. Like Patrick Stewart. the idea of a morally duplicitous Starfleet captain played by Jason Isaacs is solid gold. It needs to be mined!

 

The first "chapter" of Discovery, as CBS has taken to market these first 9 episodes, is deeply flawed. Considering what happened back stage this was perhaps unavoidable. And I'm sure the remaining episodes of the season won't be able to fix everything. But it could start.

 

I believe in Star Trek: Discovery!

 

 

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Apparently, Sonequa Martin-Green was told early on that her character will eventually become Captain, but it hasn't been decided how or when.

 

Of course, of that could change, depending on fan reaction and how the show evolves.  And that plan may have gone out the airlock after Fuller left. I also would like to see Lorca become a more central character.  In fact I'd like to just see it become more of a genuine ensemble like the other shows, with the Captain being the character everyone else pivots around.  

 

38 minutes ago, Alexcremers said:

 I'm simply not a big fan of Michael & Ash. (hopefully I will not be condemned as a racist now)

1

 

What do you have against a human/klingon pairing?

 

Racist!

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