The Force Awakens The Force Awakens - Complete Score Breakdown & Chronological Order (Film Spoilers Allowed)

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

2 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

16 minutes ago, Mr. Breathmask said:

Drunk?

 

Not yet...

 

It's four o'clock on a Friday afternoon. What are you waiting for?

[Will 2,215]

@Fennel Ka, have you been able to find anything in the 3D Blu-ray yet?

 

Also, if you update your edit in the future could you add this unused rebel fanfare statement (not sure where it was supposed to go, maybe you'd have a guess)?

 

 

[Faleel 5,340]

Already did, as  alternative to Landing at Lightspeed.

[Will 2,215]

@Fennel Ka, I was just rewatching the 60 Minutes Overtime clip and I noticed this segment:

 

 

The very end reminded me a little of the documentary material you put in your initial edit as the beginning of "Starry Night (Alternate 3)" (although I presume you actually meant "Village Attack"). This file: https://www.dropbox.com/home/SWJW Team Folder?preview=65+Starry+Night+(Alternate+3).flac. Specifically, about the 3 second mark from that alternate reminded me of the very end of the above embedded 60 Minutes clip. Is there any chance they could be connected (for instance, some - the stuff at the beginning in your edit's track - of the material you thought was from Village Attack was actually written for the final act)?

 

One possible theory is that the Scherzo for X-Wings material above could be supposed to lead right into the stuff at the beginning of that supposedly Village Attack alternate. The lead-in between the alternate and the actual film Village Attack stuff on your edit sounds pretty good, though, so I wonder what you think about this possible theory. 

 

If the two bits have no connection, then what do you think the Scherzo bit might be? Just the ending of a bit of the concert suite they were recorded (perhaps they recorded in many segments and edited together, since it's so difficult)? 

 

[Faleel 5,340]

I think that was the segue to Rey vs. Ren

[Will 2,215]

1 hour ago, Fennel Ka said:

I think that was the segue to Rey vs. Ren

 

Must be an alternate, though, right? Doesn't sound like the film version of the segue. But, yes, I agree now. And the Village Attack alternate must indeed be for that scene. 

[crumbs 14,301]

I like that Williams says he intentionally restrained Rey's Theme from reaching its most "triumphant" potential in TFA.Lines up with why he said he wanted to return for VIII.

 

The more confidence Rey gains as a character, the more the music will reflect that. Lots of potential there.

 

Just imagine how much less powerful that Force Theme appearance would be when Leia hears Luke calling her at the end of Empire, had the theme already had similarly triumphant statements in ANH.

[Faleel 5,340]

It did.....

28 minutes ago, Will said:

 

Must be an alternate, though, right? Doesn't sound like the film version of the segue. But, yes, I agree now. And the Village Attack alternate must indeed be for that scene. 

Sounds the same to me, just edited dow , ad with a clean ending.

[Will 2,215]

On 1/7/2017 at 9:14 PM, crumbs said:

I like that Williams says he intentionally restrained Rey's Theme from reaching its most "triumphant" potential in TFA.Lines up with why he said he wanted to return for VIII.

 

You're referring to this quote? 

 

 

 

Quote

Rey - her theme has a musical grammar that is not heroic in the sense of a hero's theme. It's kind of an adventure theme that maybe promises more, then resolving itself in the most major triumphant resolutions. 

 

The bolded word is very tricky to hear but that's my best guess. It's quite an important word for figuring out the meaning of the quote. 

 

I'm not really sure if he's saying that he restrained the theme. 

 

On 1/7/2017 at 9:29 PM, Fennel Ka said:

Sounds the same to me, just edited dow , ad with a clean ending.

 

 

The woodwind flourish heard above isn't in the final film cue though (well, at least the version we can piece together; I suppose it's possible that the film cue diverged from the Scherzo concert arrangement, which you used for filler, in the places it was cut). It's in the concert version, I think, however. 

 

I guess it's possible what we're hearing is part of the concert arrangement edited with the very end of the film cue -- in which case it'd all have been released. 

[crumbs 14,301]

42 minutes ago, Will said:

The bolded word is very tricky to hear but that's my best guess. It's quite an important word for figuring out the meaning of the quote. 

 

I'm not really sure if he's saying that he restrained the theme. 

 

He says than. "It's kind of an adventure theme that maybe promises more than resolving itself in the most major triumphant resolutions." It's such a brilliant analysis of the theme, really. It begins with gentle innocence (Jakku), grows in confidence (Takodana) then hints at her character's triumphant destination (finding Luke) before the delightful coda brings the piece full circle to where Rey began (an orphan looking for a family).

 

When all is said and done, I think we'll look back on Rey's Theme as the "first movement" for her character.

[Will 2,215]

1 hour ago, crumbs said:

 

He says than. "It's kind of an adventure theme that maybe promises more than resolving itself in the most major triumphant resolutions."

 

Ah, that's what I thought at first but I didn't think the meaning made sense. I still don't think that he's really saying anything about expanding on it in the future (not that I don't think he will!)

[Faleel 5,340]

Crumbs' reading sounds grammatically off to me.

[Will 2,215]

38 minutes ago, Fennel Ka said:

Crumbs' reading sounds grammatically off to me.

 

Technically there's nothing wrong with it grammatically, I think ... but something about it is a little weird, if that's what you mean. 

[crumbs 14,301]

Well, the other way is a contradiction, isn't it? Does, 'it's a theme that promises more then resolves itself in the most major triumphant way,' sound like Rey's Theme? It's a contradiction.

 

Williams could easily have dialled up the theme to resolve more "triumphantly" if that was his intention.

 

[Will 2,215]

39 minutes ago, crumbs said:

Well, the other way is a contradiction, isn't it? Does, 'it's a theme that promises more then resolves itself in the most major triumphant way,' sound like Rey's Theme? It's a contradiction.

 

Williams could easily have dialled up the theme to resolve more "triumphantly" if that was his intention.

 

 

I don't know. I totally see your point. The fact that Williams starts the sentence saying it's not like a hero's theme would seem to indicate that he's saying that he doesn't give Rey's theme major, triumphant resolutions. 

 

However, the way he says "major, triumphant resolutions" always made me think he was talking about what he did in TFA. Which isn't so far fetched. I thought Rey's theme did soar quite high. I mean, listen to this (it's somewhat arguable whether it's triumphant, but nobody can say it's not major!):

 

 

I'd be interested in hearing what others think. @Jay?

 

--------------------------

 

Just spotted another slate in the Blu-ray featurette that I don't recall ever being mentioned:

 

6M50 R v2

 

It's "Han and Leia" (seemingly the final film version, if what we're hearing is exactly what they're seen playing). 

 

Cool!

 

I presume the "R" means "revision"? And "v2" means it's the second revision, meaning at least three versions of the cue exist (or could this even be the fourth if JW went R, R v1, R v2?) 

 

Or could the "v2" include the initial version, meaning that it's possible that only two versions exist? 

[crumbs 14,301]

There was an alternate used in some promotional material. The main difference was Leia's Theme being played on flute or some other instrument, I think.

[Will 2,215]

Just now, crumbs said:

There was an alternate used in some promotional material. The main difference was Leia's Theme being played on flute or some other instrument, I think.

 

Yep. I just checked and it seems we only know of one alternate. Leia's theme is on French horn and the transition to the love theme is shorter and not as good. Those are the main differences. 

 

However, there could be other alternates we don't know about!

 

I'll be interested to see what Jay and others familiar with JW's cue lists can say about what the slate might mean for the number of versions! Perhaps the "v2" indicates that there are only two versions total! 

[Jay 37,287]

I'd guess second version of the Revised 6m50

[Will 2,215]

Just now, Jay said:

I'd guess second version of the Revised 6m50

 

So at least three versions total?

[Jay 37,287]

Sure, why not

[Will 2,215]

1 minute ago, Jay said:

Sure, why not

 

One question: Does R necessarily indicate a major revision while "v" would indicate a minor change? 

 

[Jay 37,287]

Nah, that notation can change from composer to composer, and even project to project for that composer

 

There's no set of rules everyone follows explicitly with this stuf

[Faleel 5,340]

Will, the HaL alternate is cut down in the stereo rip.

[Will 2,215]

12 minutes ago, Fennel Ka said:

Will, the HaL alternate is cut down in the stereo rip.

 

Oh. Might explain why the transition of Leia's theme to her and Han's is so short! 

[BloodBoal 7,538]

Could we please stop using acronyms for tracks and cues titles? Thank you!

[Will 2,215]

19 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

Could we please stop using acronyms for tracks and cues titles? Thank you!

 

It confused me too at first but I got it eventually. 

[BloodBoal 7,538]

For most people, this is what HAL is:

 

[Will 2,215]

Huh? 

[Jay 37,287]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_9000

[Will 2,215]

Haven't seen it. Might very soon though. 

[Faleel 5,340]

Some people have jobs and only seconds to post something.

[Will 2,215]

1 hour ago, Fennel Ka said:

Some people have jobs and only seco bbc.co ds to post some thing.

 

What?

[Faleel 5,340]

Some people have jobs and only seconds to post something.

 

[Will 2,215]

24 minutes ago, Fennel Ka said:

Some people have jobs and only seconds to post something.

 

Ah, yes, of course. I personally appreciate your comments and don't really care if you use abbreviations. 

 

--------------

 

 

@Fennel Ka, at 4:06 in the above video until 4:28, there's some interesting music. 

 

The first bit is almost identical to a bit near the start of the March of the Resistance concert arrangement, but the opening is interesting and the clean ending is too. After that, until 4:28, we hear some softer music, either still part of the same cue, or a different one. 

[leeallen01 2,133]

Have I or anyone previously pointed out how the flute introduction for Rey sounds like Luke and Leia's Theme? I may be having a break down, so excuse me if I'm wildly wrong or that it has surely been mentioned before.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I think i pointed it out at the time.

[leeallen01 2,133]

Yeah no doubt it's been talked about. I'm just re-listening to the Force Awakens all the way through, and noticing little things and connections, and it's been a while since I talked about it, so it's difficult to remember if I've noticed them before.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Dude!

[Faleel 5,340]

59 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

I think i pointed it out at the time.

Actually you pointed out that part of That Girl with the Staff sounded like Luke and Leia, not Rey's Introduction, which is in The Scavenger.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Really?

[Will 2,215]

On 1/11/2017 at 5:27 PM, Will said:

 

Ah, yes, of course. I personally appreciate your comments and don't really care if you use abbreviations. 

 

--------------

 

 

@Fennel Ka, at 4:06 in the above video until 4:28, there's some interesting music. 

 

The first bit is almost identical to a bit near the start of the March of the Resistance concert arrangement, but the opening is interesting and the clean ending is too. After that, until 4:28, we hear some softer music, either still part of the same cue, or a different one. 

 

Just wondering if you have any idea about this, @Fennel Ka. 

[Faleel 5,340]

I have no inkling of what it might be other than an alternate Ways of the Force.

Also it was impossible to rip, as it was mixed in mono

[Will 2,215]

4 hours ago, Fennel Ka said:

I have no inkling of what it might be other than an alternate Ways of the Force.

Also it was impossible to rip, as it was mixed in mono

 

Hmm... That's an interesting thought - perhaps Williams did have versions of the final act that included the March of the Resistance, but ultimately they weren't used. I know others have commented on the lack of that theme during the final battle, despite the Resistance's major role. 

 

Of course, you might be suggesting that ONLY the little bit between the MOTR segment and the definitely Ways of the Force music is from an alternate Ways of the Force?

[Faleel 5,340]

I definitely think that little bit is potentially an alt Ways of the Force

[Will 2,215]

15 minutes ago, Fennel Ka said:

I definitely think that little bit is potentially an alt Ways of the Force

 

Yeah, for that little bit you're probably right. I wonder though if the MOTR bit is part of the same cue, or is different. 

[Will 2,215]

@Fennel Ka, are you considering adding trailer music to your edit? 

 

(specifically, trailer 1, trailer 2 (see also here for something interesting related to that second teaser), and the end of the 60-second TV spot (possibly written by JW for teaser 2) - some of which we're not sure is Williams or even doubt is him, but I think it's better to err on the safe side of making sure to include everything Williams rather than leaving stuff off)

 

Also, have you been able to take a look at the 3D BR yet? (sorry I've asked you about this so many times, I'm just excited to hear if there's anything new!) 

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

I wonder if the alternate Jedi Steps ending at 3:50 was Williams.  This suite does take some liberties with the material but that particular moment just sounds right to me.  

[Will 2,215]

19 hours ago, Not Mr. Big said:

I wonder if the alternate Jedi Steps ending at 3:50 was Williams.  This suite does take some liberties with the material but that particular moment just sounds right to me.  

 

Interesting. I do like that alternate too.

 

There is an alternate Jedi Steps (presumably; it sounds quite different, more sorrowful almost) in one of the docs, but it doesn't include the Force theme bit.

 

I do remember too that the production team wasn't sure until late whether they were going to end with a shot of Rey's face or the helicopter shot. Maybe this could have been for the Rey's face shot? I wonder if I can find that article...

EDIT: 

 

Here we go:

 

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/behind-screen/star-wars-producer-dishes-films-867387

 

Quote

Co-producer Ben Rosenblatt answered questions about how the film was made and the ending. The final shot of the film was lensed from a helicopter, looking down at Rey and Luke, but Rosenblatt admitted that director J.J. Abrams was conflicted about using that shot or concluding with a close-up of Rey. He added that the decision was driven by John Williams' score, and it "left you with this sweeping emotional epic [feel], and you’re going to see a lot of that in Episode VIII.”

 

Hmmm... That makes it sound like the score was the same for both final shots, kind of. 

[crumbs 14,301]

They might have workshopped it on the scoring stage, when JJ decided to switch the shots around.

 

The final seconds of Jedi Steps always sounded a little unrefined to me, until I got used to it. I found it a jarring transition into the End Credits on my first viewing.