Sandor 796 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Tried listening to it yesterday once again.... Had to turn it off somewhere during the abysmal 'We Shall Do It!'..... I just can't get into it.... Want to like it though........ I was wondering: is there anyone out there who really enjoys this musical..? And what is it exactly that makes it so cringeworthy..? Is it the compositions, or perhaps the performances..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Never heard it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandor 796 Posted April 5, 2016 Author Share Posted April 5, 2016 Just now, Stefancos said: Never heard it. Maybe better to keep it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,465 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 There are one or two songs that are OK, but on the whole it's just insanely grating -- especially that "screaming" track (I've forgotten its name). Doesn't help with the dry sound either; it sounds like it's recorded inside a telephone booth. Haven't played it in years, though. Perhaps it's time I give it another chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 903 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 From the video description : "Audiences reportedly threw vegetables & fruit at the stage." Perhaps with singers with less grating voices and a symphonic accompaniment, I could like it more. I also recall liking a couple of the songs, but I'm too afraid to get the CD out for a listen. I actually have the LP as well back home in Australia. I bought it with such high expectations^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,713 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Yeah there are a couple of songs I can listen to without cringing in there but overall it is not one of Williams's shining hours. Plus the performances of the singers can be downright embarrasing. I have often wondered if this 50 minutes is all there is to this musical or was there possibly indicental purely orchestral music composed for it as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete 903 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 This guy likes it! Quote The singers manage the material well-enough, James Smilie as the King is best, but Lewis Fiander as Thomas (for this recording) is an aural abomination. I cannot believe they got him for a recording session- he has the harshest, most grating, non-singing voice I have ever heard. Really murderous vocalisations that are never on the note.. What on earth were they thinking??! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,496 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 38 minutes ago, Stefancos said: Never heard it. You...are...impotent! 13 minutes ago, pete said: This guy likes it! A good, honest estimation of the re-recording. I don't mind it. Granted, it's not West Side Story, but, at least, it's not Rent. The best bits are definitely the two instrumental peices, which were joined together to form a sort of mini-suite, on a (I think) Jane Eyre boot. I like the song that starts "Look Around You". Remember, as our old mucker Incanus says: we are not hearing the original cast album. Perhaps the Palace Theatre can shed light on the whole TATK story? pete 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarpia 132 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 I honestly enjoy Man of Love, Improbable as Spring and So many other Worlds. I still enjoy a few listens to Look Around You and A New Way to Turn too, especially for their harmony, simple and beautiful. Thinking on it, I could say I enjoy quite a bit from this work (I even sing Man of Love while walking through the street). It's a guilty pleasure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 2 hours ago, Stefancos said: Never heard [of] it. Me neither. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Long after Williams has passed away, and every single note of every other score has been released, listened to and discussed....then maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 It's Johnny's equivalent of Going for Gold. So bad it's good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,285 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 3 hours ago, Stefancos said: Never heard it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,477 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Just heard one song and I didn't like the performance. So I can't really judge. But I don't have any interest in it. It may need a newer recording. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loert 2,510 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 I've only listened to Am I Beautiful on Youtube. At first I was repulsed by it (that hi-hat + harpsichord...yikes), but after a few more listens I began to appreciate it a bit more, and even enjoy it. But listening to that song, I can't help but feel like the singer is fighting against the orchestra, as if she was trying to sing along to a standalone orchestral piece. Everything's just a bit too busy IMO. (I can also hear this sort of overwriting in TOD's "Anything Goes", but in that case I don't mind because the accompaniment is so effin' AWESOME!!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,232 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 1 hour ago, Sharky said: It's Johnny's equivalent of Going for Gold. So bad it's good. And it's bad for the same reason: awful lyrical content and vocals, not bad music! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus 390 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 It was certainly a child of its time, but not without charm. Its tunes are stronger than its lyrics, which again are stronger than the book, which, in my opinion, seems frustratingly tepid. I don't really see much promise of a musical in it to begin with. Seems labored, at best. I don't think musical theater quite gels with Williams' temperament. To be a good composer of musical theater is to be a thespian perhaps first and foremost (which is why Sondheim excels at it). There's an earnestness to Williams' score that, although at times quite lovely on its own, ends up revealing everything else wrong with the show. It would have needed just a touch of cynicism to counterbalance all the sugar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 The music isn't that bad. It's endearing in its own way, and clearly a product of its time. Lyrics and performance on the other hand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 I gave this a shot some years back and just couldn't get through it. There is no trace of it left in my memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,465 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Williams has a tendency to "over-orchestrate" now and then, especially when he's doing film musical adaptations, IMO. I know it's probably sacrilege to say so, but I don't think Williams' Oscar-winning work on FIDDLER ON THE ROOF is particularly impressive. It's like a WALL of sound, and the few traces of Bock's more folksy, "raw" compositions are practically buried. I feel the same way about his other work in the genre too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 I imagine that instruction came from the director/production staff though. They probably told him what they were looking for with the orchestration/sound. I doubt that Williams, at that time at least, just went off on his own and did what he wanted with that size project without checks and balances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,477 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 I always though John Williams often, if not always, managed to do what he wants to do... He's maybe a Jedi or just have the right attitude. Or maybe I idealize him a bit too much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 John Williams has to do what the director tells him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,465 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 Maybe. But then the directors of all the musical adaptations he worked on must have said the same thing ("Go for HUGE and a WALL OF SOUND, John, and orchestrate the HELL out of this!"). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,477 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 44 minutes ago, Thor said: (...) I don't think Williams' Oscar-winning work on FIDDLER ON THE ROOF is particularly impressive (...) I feel the same way about his other work in the genre too. Adapting a score written by another is perhaps not the most gratifying experience on earth. I think in adaptations like Fiddler, Mr. Chips and Tom Sawyer, no one ever complained that they sounded too much like "John Williams". Keep in mind the "genre" of these movies (musicals) and the years they came out... That's (very popular) Entertainment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loert 2,510 Posted April 5, 2016 Share Posted April 5, 2016 It may be a WALL of sound...but what a WALL of sound it is! Once 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarpia 132 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 On 05/04/2016 at 0:26 PM, TheGreyPilgrim said: And it's bad for the same reason: awful lyrical content and vocals, not bad music! I agree. Well constructed and more meaningful lyrics would make this musical far more enjoyable. I still never judge a musical until I've seen the full play, but the poor writing of this one is evident from just listening the numbers on the recording. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryant Burnette 654 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 "We Shall Do It" is one of the worst things I've ever heard. I think the lyricist rhymes "imagine it" with "Plantaganet" in that one. Just awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 But those do rhyme! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 It's a dreaded half-rhyme! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,625 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 I don't like the lyrics but I tried focusing on the underscore.. I think if we had the isolated orchestral score, we'd think it's better than most of his works from that period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,713 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 17 minutes ago, king mark said: I don't like the lyrics but I tried focusing on the underscore.. I think if we had the isolated orchestral score, we'd think it's better than most of his works from that period. From around 1975? Hmmm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,465 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 Well, we can't blame Williams for the lyrics, at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,713 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 8 minutes ago, Thor said: Well, we can't blame Williams for the lyrics, at least. I think he should have gone all "Herrmann" and burned the lyrics in front of the unbelieving eyes of the lyricist and then proceeded to demand new better lyricist for the project, one worthy of his music! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stempel 136 Posted April 6, 2016 Share Posted April 6, 2016 I like this three Songs. Am I Beautiful? Man of Love Improbable as Spring Scarpia 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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