The BFG THEMES Discussion

[crumbs 14,306]

18 minutes ago, mrbellamy said:

Yeah, I definitely think of that one as Poe's too. My first viewing of the movie it struck me as a Poe/Finn friendship theme, but when I realized the "Farewell & The Trip" statement starts right on that shot of Poe in his X-Wing, that kinda cinched it for me as his alone.

Yep, pretty much this. Although the first two statements involve both Finn and Poe, the final statement is clearly representative of Poe's successful destruction of Starkiller base, with that glorious celebratory rendition.

 

18 minutes ago, mrbellamy said:

I still have a hard time justifying why Finn's Theme (Follow Me) is considered his, though. Besides the fact that John Williams said so....I don't really get any specific association with him in the film, I just think of it as an action motif.

I think the inclusion of the motif in the End Credits immediately after Rey and Kylo Ren's theme suites seals the deal for me about what it represents. Especially when Poe's Theme becomes intertwined with it and the Resistance March follows that. Boyega's third billed from the new cast, after Ridley & Driver and before Isaac, so the theme's placement makes sense in this regard.

 

Might be mis-remembering but didn't an early interview with JJ specifically state the order of new themes in the End Credits suite, when he was gushing about the TFA score pre-release?

[JacksonElmore 69]

yeah i remember seeing that link somewhere else but i never looked into it...I thought it was clickbait or something. At that time there were soo many fake articles about star wars shit that it was hard to know what was real or not. 

 

Do you know why it's only used in the first half of the film? In my opinion i think it may be because the film gets much darker and its a light and fun theme, but then again I feel like williams would be able to find a way to use it/not make a character theme that doesn't have depth? I'm sure he will expand on it if he does ep 8/9 but it's weird to me that we don't hear it post rathars. 

[crumbs 14,306]

11 minutes ago, JacksonElmore said:

Do you know why it's only used in the first half of the film? In my opinion i think it may be because the film gets much darker and its a light and fun theme, but then again I feel like williams would be able to find a way to use it/not make a character theme that doesn't have depth? I'm sure he will expand on it if he does ep 8/9 but it's weird to me that we don't hear it post rathars. 

 

Spoiler

 

Agree with this. Finn also changes quite a lot in the second half of the film, after deciding to abandon Rey at Maz's Castle. The theme is very clever in how it represents Finn's schizophrenic personality in the first half, but as the film darkens and he becomes more heroic with his rescue of Rey, it's less appropriate to use that theme. It would be very out of place in his lightsaber fight or when he's near-fatally wounded.

 

The final shot as Rey kisses him on the forehead and promises to see him again could only be scored with Rey's Theme, IMHO.

 

 

Spoiler text because it's not the TFA thread.

[JacksonElmore 69]

4 minutes ago, crumbs said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Agree with this. Finn also changes quite a lot in the second half of the film, after deciding to abandon Rey at Maz's Castle. The theme is very clever in how it represents Finn's schizophrenic personality in the first half, but as the film darkens and he becomes more heroic with his rescue of Rey, it's less appropriate to use that theme. It would be very out of place in his lightsaber fight or when he's near-fatally wounded.

 

The final shot as Rey kisses him on the forehead and promises to see him again could only be scored with Rey's Theme, IMHO.

 

 

Spoiler text because it's not the TFA thread.

Oh yeah, forgot this was supposed to be BFG theme discussion

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

Just now, JacksonElmore said:

Oh yeah, forgot this was supposed to be BFG theme discussion

I forgot that The BFG even exists.  

[Will 2,215]

@crumbs @JacksonElmore

 

Finn's theme actually does appear one more time after the rathtars sequence - in Landing at Lightspeed (Falcon lands on Starkiller), at the beginning of the cue.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

I still like the theory put forth on Star Wars Oxygen that it's a new theme for the Falcon. Name a time when it's used and the Falcon isn't on screen

[TownerFan 4,983]

21 hours ago, Marcus said:

The theme I refer to as 'Sophie's Theme' is heard in track 2 at 02.50. I think of it as musically depicting her loneliness, so one could also refer to it as a 'loneliness theme', or an 'orphan theme' (the theme you're talking about is simply the B theme of the 'Sophie&BFG Relationship Theme').

 

The main theme -being a relationship theme- also 'subs' for her, but this film isn't so much about Sophie, as it's about Sophie and the BFG.

 

Again, I don't think we should take these leitmotifs too literally. 

 

Very much agree with you, especially the last statement. I think Williams often uses the leitmotif approach without a too specific link to a locked character/situation, but more as recurring material to sustain the narrative and make it flowing in musical terms. Of course there are many examples of very specific character leitmotifs in a lot of his works, but more often than not he uses themes not just as mere "melodic identification" for characters/locations, but more as musical material to sustain ideas and glue everything together, as he does here.

[Jay 37,346]

That does seem to be the case here

[publicist 4,643]

That is the case for almost any Horner, Goldsmith or Williams score within this genre. 

[JacksonElmore 69]

1 hour ago, Disco Stu said:

I still like the theory put forth on Star Wars Oxygen that it's a new theme for the Falcon. Name a time when it's used and the Falcon isn't on screen

I could be an ass and say that it isn't on screen during follow me until the very end?

[Disco Stu 15,495]

4 minutes ago, JacksonElmore said:

I could be an ass and say that it isn't on screen during follow me until the very end?

 

I take issue with your use of evidence. Hardly seems fair!

 

In all seriousness, I do think of it more as a great new Star Wars action motif than a character theme, taking its rightful place on the shelf next to The Asteroid Field and The Forest Battle.  I just thought the argument from David Collins on the Oxygen podcast was a good one!  And I do refer to it as The Falcon in my head since I associate it more with that track than "Follow Me"

[JacksonElmore 69]

Man I get excited every single time I hear the ending minute of the forest battle. It's so jolly. I can imagine it just bringing down the house In a live performance 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Much like with Leia's Theme, Han Solo and The Princess, and Marion's Theme from Raiders, I find that often when I try to hum that main Forest Battle melody I end up humming the music from the chase sequence at the beginning of Last Crusade instead or vice versa!

[Will 2,215]

5 hours ago, JacksonElmore said:

Man I get excited every single time I hear the ending minute of the forest battle. It's so jolly. I can imagine it just bringing down the house In a live performance 

 

Yes, there was a time a couple years ago, back when I was a pretty new JW fan (and had not yet discovered these forums) that I was captivated by that ending - I remember I would play it repeatedly, over and over and over again.

[King Mark 3,631]

there's too many false endings in that track

[JacksonElmore 69]

there's too many false endings in that track

nah

it builds anticipation and it ends perfectly. Keeps you on your toes, perfect for an action track

If he ended Princess Leia's theme like that it would be a different story

[Jay 37,346]

Yes the false endings in that track are amazing, the best use of false endings ever

[Incanus 5,714]

After seeing the film a couple of notes on the themes:

 

To my mind the Sophie/The BFG Friendship theme seemed to relate almost exclusively to the BFG himself and his work in delivering the dreams to people. Sophie's theme has those two parts, the lonelier one which forms the ending half of the full theme and the optimistic opening half (heard e.g. in the Overture) which seems to emerge stronger as she embraces her friendship with the BFG.

 

Unknown Theme #2 (Lonliness/Orphanage Theme?)
02 The Witching Hour 2:50-3:56
13 There Was A Boy 2:00-2:29

 

This one does indeed seem to be a theme for Sophie's loneliness and her sorrow for being at the orphanage.

 

The little lilting piano idea found in below moments is a small motif for the boy that BFG took home but who was eaten by the giants and appears when Sophie first finds the boy's abode in the tree hollow and the second time when she sees the drawings and gets her idea to call the queen for help.
15 The Boy's Drawings 0:58-1:06
15 The Boy's Drawings 2:49-2:55

[Jay 37,346]

Makes sense, thanks!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Forgive me if this is mentioned elsewhere in the thread (I didn't see it with a cursory skim) but shouldn't there be an instance of the main theme listed for "Dream Country" from 6:21-6:28?  It's a short but clear quote of the beginning of the main theme, right?

 

 

 

[Jay 37,346]

Yup, I hear it!  Good catch!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Man this score has grown on me.  I mean, not to the degree which TFA grew on me this past January but I do like BFG more with each listen.  I went like 10 days without listening to it at all and when I returned to it today I was struck by how much I liked it.

[Jay 37,346]

Yea its a grower for sure

[filmmusic 1,826]

OK, I watchecd the film for the first time yesterday (among my worst Spielberg films along with 1941 and Indy 4) and then I watched it again today taking notes about the themes.

 

what Jay refers to as the unknown theme 1 I would call the

Family theme or Family Happinness theme.

It appears:

- when sophie looks at the bed of the doll house in the beginning (thinking of a warm home maybe?)

-when the BFG reads to her to sleep (like a father reads his daughter)

-when Sophie tells the BFG to "make them happy" (in the blowing dreams scene)

-in the end when Sophie wakes in the morning in her warm bed at the queen's home (finally finding a family?)

 

What Jay calls the b section of Giant country i'd say it's a theme of its own for the bad giants.

Some of the instances it appears:

-BFG goes to giant country in the beginning (but we don't know if he's bad or good yet)

-he tells sophie the giants' names

-Sophie: "they'll catch me" (about the giants)

-giants awake

-Fleshlumpeater finds the blanket

-Fleshlumpeater sees them when they return

-shadows of giatns when BFG is mixing the dreaqm

-BFG arrives at giant country with the army

-giants sleeping

-Sophie: "you're a very bad giant" (to fleshlumpeater)

 

although it does appear some other times:

BFG to Sophie when he takes hes in his home:

-"you have no place to go"

-"You is not very clever"

-"I cannot be right all the time"

 

About the Friendhsip theme I'd definitely say it's the BFG (not the film, but the character) theme.

It appears:

-when BFG says giants have no parents and about how old he is

-walks in his shattered cave

-Sophie to queen: SHould we call him?

-BFG walks towards the Queen

-He talks to her

-Sophie to BFG: will I still have you etc. (in Sophie's future)

-Fleshlumpeater grabs the BFG

-BFG's home in the end

[Kasey Kockroach 2,344]

On 7/25/2016 at 12:39 PM, Disco Stu said:

Man this score has grown on me.  I mean, not to the degree which TFA grew on me this past January but I do like BFG more with each listen.  I went like 10 days without listening to it at all and when I returned to it today I was struck by how much I liked it.

It's quite pleasant, just not particularly compelling. But rest assured, it doesn't need to be, especially given the film in question.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

5 minutes ago, kaseykockroach said:

not particularly compelling

 

Both 2016 and current day Stu disagree.

 

Not all music has to be as ADD as you and your cartoon music!

[Kasey Kockroach 2,344]

There are TWO Stus!? 

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

Disco Twu

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Just now, kaseykockroach said:

There are TWO Stus!? 

 

I regenerated at the end of 2017

[Kasey Kockroach 2,344]

In somewhat seriousness, I merely meant that I don't find it particularly captivating as a musical narrative. It's very pleasant sugary music, I just never hear a story coming out of it. 

[Jurassic Shark 12,054]

6 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

 

I regenerated at the end of 2017

 

Like a lobster shedding his exoskeleton and growing a new and bigger one?

 

On 25.7.2016 at 7:39 PM, Disco Stu said:

Man this score has grown on me.

 

Me too, and I just bought the soundtrack before it goes OOP.

[Disco Stu 15,495]

7 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

Like a lobster shedding his exoskeleton and growing a new and bigger one?

 

More like

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,054]

1 minute ago, Disco Stu said:

 

More like

 

 

Oh, you turned into that actor. Loved you in Broadchurch!

[Disco Stu 15,495]

8 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

Oh, you turned into that actor. Loved you in Broadchurch!

 

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

11 hours ago, filmmusic said:

OK, I watchecd the film for the first time yesterday (among my worst Spielberg films along with 1941 and Indy 4) and then I watched it again today taking notes about the themes.

 

 

 

 

After seeing the film(first time for me it was terrible, second time actually quite nice) how do you like the score, did it make it easier to understand why it is like it is?

 

I really love this score now. In Chicago concert it was definitely a (surprise)highlight for me. With A New Beginning and Jane Eyre.

 

 

[Jay 37,346]

Wow @filmmusic thanks for those notes about the themes, I'm sure you're right about them!

[Chewy 2,388]

Still no news on the FYC...it's incredible how we see hundreds of copies of Lincoln or TFA FYC on Ebay but absolutely nothing for the BFG.

[Jay 37,346]

[Disco Stu 15,495]

Maybe they only printed like, 2.

[The Illustrious Jerry 3,356]

"What if I told you that the only copies of the BFG FYC were now under the control of the dark lord of the Sith."

"That's impossible."

[Jay 37,346]

I've been enjoying this score this month, already listened to it several times.  That caused me to revisit this theme list.

 

I went ahead and cleaned up the main post based on observations made subsequently in later pages I had never factored in before.

 

Now that I have, I was wondering if anybody else wanted to give the album a fresh listen and agree/disagree with anything - any theme appearances I missed, or different ideas on what the themes represent, etc.

 

I was kind of surprised to revisit this and find ELEVEN freaking themes.  I think Johnny was really into this story!

[GerateWohl 4,356]

Back to the topic. In the BFG score there is this soft theme later in the film which is probably the mentioned "family theme". I thought, it sounds like a shadow of "song for world peace". Anyone else that impression?