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Old JWFAN v New JWFAN


BloodBoal

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31 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

I actually prefer the instrumental version of the Blue Fairy theme track much more than the vocal one, and rarely listen to the end credits opera piece.

 

Horner would have made far better use of the two main themes in that score. 

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Ha!
 

NO.  The score is a masterpiece, Williams absolutely nailed it.

 

If you're going by the crappy 2001 OST program maybe you could think that but listen to the first 2 discs of the LLL set (ignore the third disc of bonus tracks) and it just might change your opinion of the score.

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1 minute ago, Lonnegan said:

Horner would have made far better use of the two main themes in that score. 

 

He would've milked them for their worth, I'm sure, along with avoiding the emotional ambiguity of Williams's settings (i.e. the atonal synth figures).

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19 minutes ago, Koray Savas said:

I don't understand how a Zimmer army doesn't include me :P

 

18 minutes ago, Jay said:

Cause you never post any more?

 

Since Koray posted 19 minutes ago, the above statement is, clearly, not true.

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27 minutes ago, Sharkus Malarkus said:

 

He would've milked them for their worth, I'm sure, along with avoiding the emotional ambiguity of Williams's settings (i.e. the atonal synth figures).

 

What I meant was he would have furnished the Blue Fairy and absolutely gorgeous Where Dreams Are Born melodies with luxuriously soothing strings instead of the painful soprano warbling. 

 

Just no bag pipes either, James! 

 

I'm talking pre Titanic Horner here. 

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6 minutes ago, Lonnegan said:

 

What I meant was he would have furnished the Blue Fairy and absolutely gorgeous Where Dreams Are Born melodies with luxuriously soothing strings instead of the painful soprano warbling. 

 

There's a lengthy rendition of the Blue Fairy theme without vocals on the LLL CD.

 

There are several passages featuring the Where Dreams Are Born melody without vocals on the LLL CD as well.

 

You don't know what you're talking about mate!

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34 minutes ago, Lonnegan said:

 

What I meant was he would have furnished the Blue Fairy and absolutely gorgeous Where Dreams Are Born melodies with luxuriously soothing strings instead of the painful soprano warbling.

 

Would it have been much better with a boy soprano, though? For me, sopranos > trebles.

 

1 hour ago, Jay said:

Cause you never post any more?

 

I don't post much these days either. I think I got such a high billing because somehow I've got a reputation here as a second in command to TGP, plus some of my contributions to the Gladiator quotes thread. BB improved on them, of course.

 

 

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36 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

There's a lengthy rendition of the Blue Fairy theme without vocals on the LLL CD.

 

There are several passages featuring the Where Dreams Are Born melody without vocals on the LLL CD as well.

 

You don't know what you're talking about mate!

 

Actually, I do. The piano renditions, while nice, aren't really as satisfying to me as something more symphonically fleshed out would have been. I can hear the soft cellos playing in the background of WDAB, and I spend the whole time wishing they were the focus of the entire sound and theme. Endlessly frustrating whenever I listen. 

 

I'm very fussy with piano as film underscore. 

 

Then again, at least it isn't more of that fucking done to death ruminative piano the newbies here (and you?) love so much lately. It's frickin' everywhere. The video above reckons it is written by committee?  

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7 minutes ago, Lonnegan said:

 

Actually, I do. The piano renditions, while nice, aren't really as satisfying to me as something more symphonically fleshed out would have been. I can hear the soft cellos playing in the background of WDAB, and I spend the whole time wishing they were the focus of the entire sound and theme. Endlessly frustrating whenever I listen. 

 

I wasn't talking about piano renditions at all.  Listen to the LLL CD Quint, then come back and talk about the score.

 

7 minutes ago, Lonnegan said:

I'm very fussy with piano as film underscore. 

 

Then again, at least it isn't more of that fucking done to death ruminative piano the newbies here (and you?) love so much lately. It's frickin' everywhere. The video reckons it is written by committee? 

 

Huh?  Like what's in all modern trailers lately?  That shit sucks!

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It was very choppy when I watched it too... usually Google Drive is perfect though so I just figured it was my connection

 

Youtube would take it down because their software would recognize it as a copyrighted work.

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1 hour ago, Jay said:

 

I wasn't talking about piano renditions at all.  Listen to the LLL CD Quint, then come back and talk about the score.

 

Can you be more specific? I've made enquiries about this exact subject before here and KK among others stated the vocal and piano versions are all that are available. I'd also tried a YouTube deep search at the time. 

 

1 hour ago, Shatner's Rug said:

You don't like piano underscore? Ohh I'll be careful not to like it so much in future.

 

It's nice. But not ideal. 

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There is a track on the LLL set called A.I. Theme. There are two versions of it in fact. And one of them is orchestral with no soprano. The Search for the Blue Fairy track on the original 2001 album is an edit of a vocal version of this track and film cue. But there is an instrumental version as well and there is no piano in it. And it's not on Youtube.

 

Karol

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Really? I wonder why nobody mentioned this at the time - because it was precisely this information which held me back from making a purchase. I need to acquire these cues can urgently, actually. 

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Not till October Richard, cheers mate. 

 

4 minutes ago, TheWhiteRider said:

I'm almost certain I can recall telling you this exact thing when you were looking for wedding music. 

 

Maybe I misinterpreted your tip to mean the piano version, which is on the OST. Karol just helped me out via PM so let me listen and I'll be back. 

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The Blue Fairy Theme appears in 10 tracks on the LLL CD

 

1-20 Immaculate Heart
1-21 To Manhattan
1-22 A.I. Theme (instrumental version)

2-3 Finding the Blue Fairy

2-8 The Specialist Visits
2-9 The Reunion
2-11 A.I. Theme (vocal version)

3-9 Finding the Blue Fairy (alternate)
3-10 Finding the Blue Fairy (orchestral excerpt)
3-12 The Reunion (alternate)

 

It only appears with vocals in 2 of those 10 tracks, in tracks 2-3 and 2-11.  Its appears in brief passages in in 1-20, 1-21, 2-9, and 3-12; the fully orchestral renditions you're looking for would be in 1-22, 2-8, 3-9, and 3-10.

 

 

EDIT: In fact, here:

 

1-20 Immaculate Heart - short solo line @ 0:09
1-21 To Manhattan - piano @ 0:53
1-22 A.I. Theme (instrumental version) - orchestral arrangement of the theme
2-3 Finding the Blue Fairy - vocals @ 2:29
2-8 The Specialist Visits - orchestra @ 1:14
2-9 The Reunion - short passage at 0:26
2-11 A.I. Theme (vocal version) - vocal arrangement of the theme
3-9 Finding the Blue Fairy (alternate) - orchestra @ 2:29
3-10 Finding the Blue Fairy (orchestral excerpt) - orchestra at 0:13
3-12 The Reunion (alternate) - short passage at 0:26

 

 

29 minutes ago, TheWhiteRider said:

I'm almost certain I can recall telling you this exact thing when you were looking for wedding music. 

 

Yes, we've been over all this before.

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19 hours ago, Jay said:

Why was I represented with Dark Knight (at least I assume that's what it was) music?

 

3 hours ago, Jay said:

I still don't understand why I was scored with Zimmer music instead of Williams or Giacchino?

 

2 hours ago, Jay said:

I figured it was, but wasn't sure.

 

Don't understand why I would be scored by it, but whatevs!

 

It's simple, really: this moment isn't about you. It's all about TGP, who gets to kill two foes in just a few seconds. Plus consider what is heard right before the Dark Knight stuff comes in. Plus knowing the title of the track helps understanding it all. ;)

 

 

 

On an unrelated note: for people lamenting the fact they didn't appear in the video, you have to consider that there is still a shitload of roles to fill, should that video ever get a sequel.

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1 minute ago, BloodBoal said:

It's simple, really: this moment isn't about you. It's all about TGP, who gets to kill two foes in just a few seconds. Plus consider what is heard right before the Dark Knight stuff comes in. Plus knowing the title of the track helps understanding it all. ;)

 

Gotcha

 

What is the track called?

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1 hour ago, Sharkus Malarkus said:

 

Would it have been much better with a boy soprano, though? For me, sopranos > trebles.

 

 

Nearly missed this reply. 

 

Yes, a boy's voice would have been far more preferable in this instance. Howard Shore has a fine and highly agreeable choral aesthetic, especially for solo vocalists. 

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When I joined this site three years ago, this was my ultimate goal.  The crusade is accomplished, the truth spread, equality achieved for Zimmer fans everywhere.  I suppose now I should retire.  

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26 minutes ago, Jay said:

The Blue Fairy Theme appears in 10 tracks on the LLL CD

 

1-20 Immaculate Heart
1-21 To Manhattan
1-22 A.I. Theme (instrumental version)

2-3 Finding the Blue Fairy

2-8 The Specialist Visits
2-9 The Reunion
2-11 A.I. Theme (vocal version)

3-9 Finding the Blue Fairy (alternate)
3-10 Finding the Blue Fairy (orchestral excerpt)
3-12 The Reunion (alternate)

 

It only appears with vocals in 2 of those 10 tracks, in tracks 2-3 and 2-11.  Its appears in brief passages in in 1-20, 1-21, 2-9, and 3-12; the fully orchestral renditions you're looking for would be in 1-22, 2-8, 3-9, and 3-10.

 

 

EDIT: In fact, here:

 

1-20 Immaculate Heart - short solo line @ 0:09
1-21 To Manhattan - piano @ 0:53
1-22 A.I. Theme (instrumental version) - orchestral arrangement of the theme
2-3 Finding the Blue Fairy - vocals @ 2:29
2-8 The Specialist Visits - orchestra @ 1:14
2-9 The Reunion - short passage at 0:26
2-11 A.I. Theme (vocal version) - vocal arrangement of the theme
3-9 Finding the Blue Fairy (alternate) - orchestra @ 2:29
3-10 Finding the Blue Fairy (orchestral excerpt) - orchestra at 0:13
3-12 The Reunion (alternate) - short passage at 0:26

 

My understanding is 'The Reunion' is the only fully fledged version of the 'Where Dreams Are Born' theme which doesn't have the accompanying vocal. It it led by the piano instead and features those lovely warm strings playing beneath. Am I wrong about that? 

 

This is what I'm getting at in this whole discussion. 

 

Sadly, the music Karol kindly helped me out with is not the same thing. 

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38 minutes ago, Richard said:

If I ever got married, I'd like my bride to walk up the aisle to "Journey To Blofeld's Hideaway".

 

Quite a pleasing choice. 

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46 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

On an unrelated note: for people lamenting the fact they didn't appear in the video, you have to consider that there is still a shitload of roles to fill, should that video ever get a sequel.

30 million dollars. And because I like you I'm selling myself cheap today.

 

Karol

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31 minutes ago, Lonnegan said:

 

My understanding is 'The Reunion' is the only fully fledged version of the 'Where Dreams Are Born' theme which doesn't have the accompanying vocal. It it led by the piano instead and features those lovely warm strings playing beneath. Am I wrong about that? 

 

This is what I'm getting at in this whole discussion. 

 

Sadly, the music Karol kindly helped me out with is not the same thing. 

 

"Where Dreams Are Born" is just an arrangement of Monica's Theme.  Monica's Theme appears at:

 

1-07 Reading The Words @ 5:13

1-11 Canoeing With Pinocchio @ 0:53

2-06 Stored Memories @ 0:15

2-07 What Is Your Wish @ 3:10

2-09 The Reunion @ 0:53 

2-10 Where Dreams Are Born @ 0:00

3-01 For Always @ 0:17

3-11 What Is Your Wish (Alternate) @ 3:10

3-12 The Reunion (Alternate) @ 0:53

3-14 For Always @ 0:17

 

But yes, the b section you're talking about is really only in "The Reunion", "Where Dreams are Born", and the "For Always" songs.  It represents David and Monica's reunion, which does't happen until the final scene of the film, so that makes sense.  So yes, THAT "theme" (b section) already had all its appearances on the OST.  It was the Blue Fairy Theme that the LLL CD gave more justice to.

 

 

Monica's Theme b section ("The Reunion Theme")

 

2-09 The Reunion @ 2:06

2-10 Where Dreams Are Born @ 1:20

3-01 For Always @ 1:24

3-12 The Reunion (Alternate) @ 2:03

3-14 For Always @ 1:24

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Just now, Stefancos said:

I suppose i have to be greatful Alvar didn't translate my name to Stefanus.

That was a PG-13 cut. Wait for the expanded Ultimate Version coming out on Blu-ray. ;)

 

Karol

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10 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

"Where Dreams Are Born" is just an arrangement of Monica's Theme.  Monica's Theme appears at:

 

1-07 Reading The Words @ 5:13

1-11 Canoeing With Pinocchio @ 0:53

2-06 Stored Memories @ 0:15

2-07 What Is Your Wish @ 3:10

2-09 The Reunion @ 0:53 

2-10 Where Dreams Are Born @ 0:00

3-01 For Always @ 0:17

3-11 What Is Your Wish (Alternate) @ 3:10

3-12 The Reunion (Alternate) @ 0:53

3-14 For Always @ 0:17

 

But yes, the b section you're talking about is really only in "The Reunion", "Where Dreams are Born", and the "For Always" songs.  It represents David and Monica's reunion, which does't happen until the final scene of the film, so that makes sense.  So yes, THAT "theme" (b section) already had all its appearances on the OST.  It was the Blue Fairy Theme that the LLL CD gave more justice to.

 

 

Monica's Theme b section ("The Reunion Theme")

 

2-09 The Reunion @ 2:06

2-10 Where Dreams Are Born @ 1:20

3-01 For Always @ 1:24

3-12 The Reunion (Alternate) @ 2:03

3-14 For Always @ 1:24

 

This is most helpful (and finally definitive, I hope). Thank you for the information.  

 

To repeat the sentiment one last time: it is a big shame no other arrangements or tribute versions of Monica's beautiful theme exist. Anywhere. Such a waste of a seemingly underrated piece. 

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Frankly I've always found the Blue Fairy Theme to be superior to Monica's Theme and the Reunion Theme, and also frankly I don't think anything in the AI score is really wedding-appropriate.  There's much more romantic film music out there.

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I disagree on both accounts. It was only a possibility for that sort of usage, though. I just happen to think it is one of JW's finest ever melodic compositions. 

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