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SafeUnderHill

The Prophecy

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Yes, there is a storyboard video of a completely different version of the prologue, but I doubt that's what Shore scored, not only because the previz is longer than the track (7 minutes long compared to the 4 minutes of the track), but also because this version didn't go further than the storyboard stage.

Here it is, by the way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYvYzSzpogE

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Yeah, but even if it was edited, I doubt that it was meant to score that version of that prologue, which as I said, didn't go beyond the storyboard phase. Why would they record music for something they're not even sure they're going to shoot?

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On 8/29/2013 at 7:00 AM, BloodBoal said:

Yeah, but even if it was edited, I doubt that it was meant to score that version of that prologue, which as I said, didn't go beyond the storyboard phase. Why would they record music for something they're not even sure they're going to shoot?

That brings me to something, in some of the trailers, there is Dialogue by Gandalf that was not in the movie, perhaps this dialogue was recorded for a version of the prologue? I seem to recall the EE commentaries saying that numerous candidates were considered for narrating the prologue...

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I believe they shot Gandalf telling Frodo the story that eventually became the prologue (Sauron's downfall) in Bag End, which obviously ultimately moved to a self-standing prologue narrated by Galadriel in the final cut. I'm sure along the way there was a version narrated by Gandalf too. There is even more recordings of Gandalf's narration for it in some of the video games.

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There is even more recordings of Gandalf's narration for it in some of the video games.

Really? which ones?

I've only played the RotK game, but it does have narration by McKellen that is not in the films. It sounds like material that was recorded exclusively for the game, though, and in many cases seems to be based on dialogue from the films.

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There were many, many iterations of the prologue, both editorial and musical. There is an alternate on the rarities disc (with the book) that expands on the material heard in The Prophecy.

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There were many, many iterations of the prologue, both editorial and musical. There is an alternate on the rarities disc (with the book) that expands on the material heard in The Prophecy.

Oh cool, I only remember a version that I thought was practically the same as the film version except it featured the Gondor theme when the soldiers were marching.

That's the one Jim was referring to.

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Indeed. And it's more like the OST version than the film version.

Yeah but contains some similar elements that found their way into the final film version but really the Prophecy on the OST sounds like a condensation or edited down version of the alternate Prologue found on the Rarities.

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Indeed. And it's more like the OST version than the film version.

Yeah but contains some similar elements that found their way into the final film version but really the Prophecy on the OST sounds like a condensation or edited down version of the alternate Prologue found on the Rarities.

It's more or less the second half of the version on the rarities.

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I think the version of POWER OF MORDOR in "The Prophecy" is an alternate for the REVELATION OF THE RINGWRAITHS statement in the Rarities "Prologue".

Compare 2:11 of "The Prophecy" to 2:45 of the Rarities "Prologue".

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I believe The Power of Mordor is in there. That doesn't reappear again until Return of the King.

Except for that short moment in Council of Elrond. ;)

So there's no real analysis of 'The Prophecy'? It seems mostly like it is not made up the themes listed in Doug's list (except Gollum's theme near the end). Are the phrasing suggesting the History of the Ring (sounds like it to me)?

The alternate Prologue features The Power of Mordor in a lengthy development with additional choral material unique to this version of the prologue, Footsteps of Doom, Gondor (Second Age variant, which is not end like either the Decline or the Ascension variation), The Ringwraiths Theme (with the lyrics from Battle of Dagorlad not the usual Revelation of the Ringwraiths), Nameless Fear, Gollum's Pity and the Shire theme hinted in the trumpet at the end.

The similarities between the final film version mostly have to do with the footage of the Misty Mountains and Gollum, scored with Gollum's Pity and the subsequent Nameless Fear.

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I believe The Power of Mordor is in there. That doesn't reappear again until Return of the King.

Except for that short moment in Council of Elrond. ;)

Indeed! Having just revisited a pile of Fellowship material I should have remembered that!

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I believe The Power of Mordor is in there. That doesn't reappear again until Return of the King.

Except for that short moment in Council of Elrond. ;)

Indeed! Having just revisited a pile of Fellowship material I should have remembered that!

And that is the only time we hear it before RotK. A really subtle hint before it is unleashed in full in the siege of Minas Tirith as the Nazgûl descend on the city. It was interesting to find out that Shore had written right in the beginning. I remember making the connection while watching FotR (having listened to the OST countless times) and then again in RotK although it took a bit more time to connect the phrases from OSTs Prophecy track with the militant screaming chant where the melody is slightly obscured. It was more the rhythm of the words that made the connection for me initially.

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I believe The Power of Mordor is in there. That doesn't reappear again until Return of the King.

Except for that short moment in Council of Elrond. ;)

So there's no real analysis of 'The Prophecy'? It seems mostly like it is not made up the themes listed in Doug's list (except Gollum's theme near the end). Are the phrasing suggesting the History of the Ring (sounds like it to me)?

The alternate Prologue features The Power of Mordor in a lengthy development with additional choral material unique to this version of the prologue, Footsteps of Doom, Gondor (Second Age variant, which is not end like either the Decline or the Ascension variation), The Ringwraiths Theme (with the lyrics from Battle of Dagorlad not the usual Revelation of the Ringwraiths), Nameless Fear, Gollum's Pity and the Shire theme hinted in the trumpet at the end.

And cor anglais history of the ring

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I believe The Power of Mordor is in there. That doesn't reappear again until Return of the King.

Except for that short moment in Council of Elrond. ;)

So there's no real analysis of 'The Prophecy'? It seems mostly like it is not made up the themes listed in Doug's list (except Gollum's theme near the end). Are the phrasing suggesting the History of the Ring (sounds like it to me)?

The alternate Prologue features The Power of Mordor in a lengthy development with additional choral material unique to this version of the prologue, Footsteps of Doom, Gondor (Second Age variant, which is not end like either the Decline or the Ascension variation), The Ringwraiths Theme (with the lyrics from Battle of Dagorlad not the usual Revelation of the Ringwraiths), Nameless Fear, Gollum's Pity and the Shire theme hinted in the trumpet at the end.

And cor anglais history of the ring

I can't recall hearing it in this incarnation of the piece. Time stamps?

Or would you be refering to the version in the LotR symphony?

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I believe The Power of Mordor is in there. That doesn't reappear again until Return of the King.

Except for that short moment in Council of Elrond. ;)

So there's no real analysis of 'The Prophecy'? It seems mostly like it is not made up the themes listed in Doug's list (except Gollum's theme near the end). Are the phrasing suggesting the History of the Ring (sounds like it to me)?

The alternate Prologue features The Power of Mordor in a lengthy development with additional choral material unique to this version of the prologue, Footsteps of Doom, Gondor (Second Age variant, which is not end like either the Decline or the Ascension variation), The Ringwraiths Theme (with the lyrics from Battle of Dagorlad not the usual Revelation of the Ringwraiths), Nameless Fear, Gollum's Pity and the Shire theme hinted in the trumpet at the end.

And cor anglais history of the ring

I can't recall hearing it in this incarnation of the piece. Time stamps?

Or would you be refering to the version in the LotR symphony?

The Evil/History hybrid appears on cor anglais - it could be that?

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I have a question about the Soundtrack version of "The Prophecy". Why is there a non film version on the official soundtrack as opposed to the film version that is on the expanded/complete set?

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Every single track on the FOTR OST is different from the film version in some way. Shore crafted the listening experience he wanted for the OST regardless of how PJ changed stuff in the final cut.

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Yes I think this was discussed and speculated on before and people did tests with the lengthier version of the alternate Prologue found on Rarities disc (of which the Prophecy is a shorter edit) and set it against the Prologue footage.

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The entirely different thematic take on the material is what is actually the most interesting thing about it. Plus that the piece of music is brilliant and would have made a great overture for the film. But then again I love the film version to bits too as it sets the thematic board very well and prepares the audience for what is to come musically by introducing many of the central themes and especially the History of the Ring theme.

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I think they had some different ideas for the character who would do the voice over, Gandalf or Frodo at one point if I remember correctly.

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It always seemed pretty obvious to me.

I mean, the title card would have never played without music.

It's possible the music scoring it wasn't on the track. And it's not immediately obvious to me which part of it plays over the titles.

00:00 - 00:37: New Line/Wingnut title card

00:37 - 00:45: The Lord Of The Rings title card

Of that I'm pretty sure.

After 00:45, of course, since this version of the prologue music was most likely for a very different edit of the sequence, there's no way to really know for sure what it was meant to underscore.

I think they had some different ideas for the character who would do the voice over, Gandalf or Frodo at one point if I remember correctly.

Yep.

I also remember that in the FOTR audio commentary, Boyens said Galadriel was going to narrate the epilogue of ROTK, but obviously they changed their minds in between the moment they recorded the commentary and the final edit of ROTK....

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It always seemed pretty obvious to me.

I mean, the title card would have never played without music.

It's possible the music scoring it wasn't on the track. And it's not immediately obvious to me which part of it plays over the titles.

00:00 - 00:37: New Line/Wingnut title card

Meaning when Galadriel's narration begins correct?

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Yep.

I haven't tried to sync that, but I'm certain it would work.

The whole pre-LOTR title card music in Prologue: One Ring To Rule Them All is 40 seconds long, so it more or less matches the 37 seconds of The Prophecy (maybe Galadriel/Frodo/Gandalf's narration was originally a bit different and shorter).

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There are three possiblities:

1: The scene was shorter

2: The OST and Rarities version of the prologue are two different takes on the sequence but there is some stuff in the Rarities version that was also in that earlier version but was edited out

3: The OST and Rarities version of the prologue are two different edits of the same version (very unlikely)

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The entirely different thematic take on the material is what is actually the most interesting thing about it. Plus that the piece of music is brilliant and would have made a great overture for the film. But then again I love the film version to bits too as it sets the thematic board very well and prepares the audience for what is to come musically by introducing many of the central themes and especially the History of the Ring theme.

Maybe it should still be an overture. That actually seems like a good idea. Play it over a black screen, then start the movie. Great mood setter.

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On 8/29/2013 at 6:10 AM, SafeUnderHill said:

Thinking about how Doug Adams can't answer questions about the hobbit yet, does this mean he's 100% open to talking about the LOTR scores or are there still unanswered questions? I'd love to know what the prologue on the fellowship OST was exactly meant to score.

 

On 8/10/2014 at 0:33 PM, SafeUnderHill said:

Just a quick question, is the track from the FOTR OST 'The Prophecy' discussed or analysed anywhere (perhaps in Doug's book?, but that seems to focus on CRs). Originally I was bummed the soundtrack didn't contain the great music from the film and the title music, but lately I've grown very fond of it. It sounds so ancient and precious, I know it scored an earlier shorter version of the prologue. Perhaps this version contains scenes from the final version, just not all of them. In which case, has anyone tried to sync it to clips from the prologue?

 

On 8/8/2015 at 11:59 AM, SafeUnderHill said:

I don't know how much people have figured out about the placement of 'The Prophecy' over footage from the LOTR prologue, but I asked Doug about the main titles.

https://twitter.com/DougAdamsMusic/status/630011871693828096

 

This is hilarious.  Apparently, every August, @SafeUnderHill thinks about The Prophecy again and posts about it.  You can set a clock to it!

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