SPOILER TALK: Rogue One by Gareth Edwards

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Interesting.

[Luke Skywalker 1,793]

7 hours ago, RPurton said:

I laughed at the Death Star technicians crouching when the laser fires, highlighting the poor control location.

 

They have always crouched, in the original film, and in all videogames featuring that scene...

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Ergonomics wasnt a thing yet in the 70's.

[Quintus 5,399]

To me, Tarkin looks like the reanimated corpse of the late Peter Cushing which has undergone some extensive makeup work in order to get him to resemble consciousness again, yet the eyes are still glazed because the soul behind them is dead. 

 

And it works a treat! 

[Luke Skywalker 1,793]

3 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

Interesting.

We saw ANH yesterday... and really it striked me how much Chris Pine looks like Luke Skywalker in ANH.

 

I think this was mentioned years ago (that he looked  like a young mark hammill). But really, with a little CGI enhacement he could well play him in a movie set in the OT times.

 

And since Simon Pegg has already starred in both Franchises, it's not a problem to have Kirk in SW...

 

 

Maybe this Tarkin-Leia CGI is some kind of test and they are going to do something similar in the Young Han solo film....

 

 

Just now, Quintus said:

To me, Tarkin looks like the reanimated corpse of the late Peter Cushing which has undergone some extensive makeup work in order to get him to resemble consciousness again, yet the eyes are still glazed because the soul behind them is dead. 

 

And it works a treat, because I enjoyed his creepy role very much. 

To me the problem in the eyes were not their 'aliveness' but rather that he seemed not to look whom he was talking to.

 

It was his mouth that gave it away as a CGI.

[Quintus 5,399]

51 minutes ago, Luke Skywalker said:

Maybe this Tarkin-Leia CGI is some kind of test and they are going to do something similar in the Young Han solo film....

 

 

 

I'd watch that. Same goes for Indiana Jones done in the same way. There would be a caveat, though. 

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

2 minutes ago, Quintus said:

To me, Tarkin looks like the reanimated corpse of the late Peter Cushing which has undergone some extensive makeup work in order to get him to resemble consciousness again, yet the eyes are still glazed because the soul behind them is dead. 

 

And it works a treat! 

 

It worked fine for me. And again. I didn't really think of it as bringing back Cushing, as much as bringing back Tarkin.

[Quintus 5,399]

Tarkin was always Peter Cushing first and Tarkin second. 

 

I'd forgotten his character's name till this week actually. 

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I don't disagree. But in Rogue One I didnt really see Cushing, only Tarkin.

[Luke Skywalker 1,793]

On 16/12/2016 at 10:48 PM, Stefancos said:

It wasn't Peter Cushing!

 

If the Clone Wars cartoon had featured Tarkin and resembled Cushing no one would have batted an eye about it!

 

Don't think of it as them using a CGI Peter Cushing, think of it as them using a CGI Tarkin. Like how Yoda went from a puppet to CGI.

I forgot to answer to this.

Yes the Clone Wars and rebels DO feature a CGI Tarkin, and as you say no one complained.

 

 

[leeallen01 2,134]

16 hours ago, Stefancos said:

I wonder. If you were just an average movie goer, who hadn't seen Star Wars in years and didn't really know who Peter Cushing was and that he ever was in Star Wars, would the mocap version stand out in any way?

 

I mean anyone here knows a thing or two about Star Wars and knows the actor playing Tarkin is long dead. So when he appears on screen we know it's a trick. Would someone who doesn't know that be fooled?

 

 

I have also said previously that my mother had no idea Tarkin wasn't real. She knows Leia as a character far more, so she suspected something must have been done, like CGI, or makeup etc, but she had absolutely no idea Tarkin wasn't real.

 

 

Personally I thought both Tarkin and Leia were flawless CGI, minus the mouths. They cannot get the mouths right yet. Mouths move randomly and unique to people, so copying and predicting someones mouth movements digitally doesn't work. The rest of the face mostly remains still. Which is why in moments where Tarkin wasn't talking, it was utterly convincing and quite scary how incredible CGI can be. Leia also looked perfect until she said "hope."

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Did anyone notice Stuart Baird's name in the credits?

 

A telling sign that the film was in trouble at one point and had to be fixed using reshoots and editing.

[Incanus 5,713]

I just wish they had used a Peter Cushing look-a-like actor for him. They used an actor for the wide-shot in RotS (unless they painted CG over him).

This is actor Wayne Pygram in his Tarkin mask. Of course you can only see him from the distance. Up close he looks as creepy as the CG version in Rogue One.

 

 

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

That doesnt look any better then the CGI Tarkin, to be honest. Actually. It's worse.

[Incanus 5,713]

3 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

That doesnt look any better then the CGI Tarkin, to be honest. Actually. It's worse.

I know. That is why Lucas was wily enough to use him only a wide shot from afar.

 

I would have wanted to see some actor looking more like Cushing playing Tarkin or perhaps only that they had shown him in passing but they had a curiously large role for him in Rogue One. The CG solution just feels weird as he looked liked a wax puppet.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Quintus 5,399]

The Charles Dance idea is still the best one. Maybe he turned them down. 

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

4 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

You're a fucking idiot.

 

I can understand now why you're so interested by the whole virtual reality thing. It seems you care less and less about real life... You make me sick, really, not virtually!

 

That's why I love JWFan. None of you are real. Just letters on my screen.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[crumbs 14,305]

Maybe they'd rather save an actor of Charles Dance's caliber for a villain of his own, rather than just playing Peter Cushing? That would be an utter waste of his talent.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

10 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

Indeed! If you were to meet us in real life, you'd say we don't look as we real as we do on the forum, and that you'd just prefer to talk to us there! You fucktard!

 

You would not be recognizable to me. The concept of you as a corporeal entity does not compute!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

I'll send you a CG copy of me. I'm sure you'll love it.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

1 hour ago, Stefancos said:

Did anyone notice Stuart Baird's name in the credits?

 

A telling sign that the film was in trouble at one point and had to be fixed using reshoots and editing.

 

I noticed, yes.

 

But then, if you have a movie as action-heavy as Rogue One, you might as well bring in one of the top action editors, so I didn't think too much of it.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

He has a second reputation though, as a fixer of problem films. Trying to edit something acceptable out of a mess.

 

 

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

He directed my favourite TNG film.

[mstrox 6,647]

Saw this over the weekend and loved it for the most part.  Here are my completely disorganized thoughts.

 

I loved all of the new characters and their journey.  I honestly went into this movie thinking that some of the characters would make it out alive, so I was a bit bummed out.  My wife cried through the end credits about it - she liked them all too.

 

Agree with most reviews I've seen that the second half of the film is much stronger than the first - basically everything with the main crew, from Jyn seeing the Stardust hologram to Jyn and Cassian waiting for their demise, was great great, IMO.    The first half was a bit scattered - reminded me of Guardians of the Galaxy, where the beginning (after the Earth prologue) was all over the place and doing a lot of heavy lifting/set-up too fast.

 

I left the theater thinking, "wow, Rogue One has the visual effects Oscar locked down" for the Tarkin and Leia stuff alone.  My spouse didn't even know they were CGI.  Surprised to see the reactions here.

 

The movie seemed to want to be its own thing, but it kept too many toes in "classic Star Wars."  All of the cameos make sense to me- including Tarkin and Leia - except for Dr. Evazan and Ponda Baba (the cantina aliens on Jedha) - repeating an exact line of dialogue from Star Wars and then the camera lingering on them for a few seconds afterward for some reason.  Kind of a similar problem with Bail Organa's first appearance - I'm happy that he was there, but when he first appeared the camera hung on him for a few seconds and he got a weird dedicated bit of scoring that seemed to want us to feel some emotional weight to his presence.

 

The Vader scene - both Vader scenes, but mainly THE Vader scene - feel like they belong in a different movie.  I liked them a lot, but they don't really "fit."  It makes this much less of a "stand-alone," and more of a connective tissue to the Episodes.  Which is fine, but a disservice in the long run to the story of the Ersos, the Rogue One rebels, and Krennic.

 

Oh, and I hated hated HATED the pun Vader made: "try not to CHOKE on your aspirations."  Seemed mustache-twirling to me in a way that the character previously hadn't been (kind of like having a lava castle).

 

I hope the Blu-ray is chock full of deleted scenes - seeing what got changed/reworked would be really interesting on this movie in a way that "cut for time" scenes .

 

Guess it's easier to come up with nitpicks than it is to come up with positive things, but like I said - I loved everything that involved the new characters.

 

 

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

5 minutes ago, mstrox said:

All of the cameos make sense to me- including Tarkin and Leia - except for Dr. Evazan and Ponda Baba (the cantina aliens on Jedha) - repeating an exact line of dialogue from Star Wars and then the camera lingering on them for a few seconds afterward for some reason. 

 

Also, how did they end up in Mos Eisley if they were on Jeddha only a few hours (?) before it got blown to kingdom come?

[mstrox 6,647]

I guess we can just assume they were on their way to their ship.  Yep, another close call for Dr. Evazan and his old pal Ponda Baba.

[Romão 2,274]

Well,to be fair, I assume a few days passed between Leia sending R2 to Alderaan and Luke actually arriving on Mos Eisley

[Quintus 5,399]

1 hour ago, crumbs said:

Maybe they'd rather save an actor of Charles Dance's caliber for a villain of his own, rather than just playing Peter Cushing? That would be an utter waste of his talent.

 

Good point. Pity they'll never do this though, he'd be ideal as a grand Star Wars villain. 

[Incanus 5,713]

1 minute ago, Quintus said:

 

Good point. Pity they'll never do this though, he'd be ideal as a grand Star Wars villain. 

Agreed. He is ideal as any villain.

 

Actually I'd like to see him playing some kind of kindly and friendly character for a change. I am sure he would agree. His typecasting as the icy British patrician villain is a bit unfortunate no matter well he does it.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

He should play Rey's father!

[Incanus 5,713]

14 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

He should play Rey's father!

Rey's Dad: You're blessed with abilities that few men possess. You're blessed to belong to one of the most powerful families in the galaxy, and you're still blessed with youth. What have you done with these blessings, eh? You served as a glorified bodyguard for one ex-Stormtrooper and an old smuggler - one a mad man, the other now dead.

Rey: Poor Kylo Ren. Brave man, terrible judgement. 
Rey's Dad. Attacking him was stupid. 
[Rey's Dad starts butchering the stag] 
Rey's Dad: Dances don't act like fools. 

 

[leeallen01 2,134]

I'm going to describe a scene alteration that may not have worked, but would have been truly chilling and shocking.

 

Imagine if instead of just Rebels in the corridor with Vader, there was also Jyn, Cassian and Bodhi (The Imperial pilot)

 

Here's the full idea: Jyn and Cassian both make it to the top of the tower together. Krennic appears and shoots Cassian, but it doesn't kill him.

 

Krennic has Jyn at gun point, and the Imperial pilot, Bodhi, who escaped death earlier, is piloting the TIE fighter (From the unused trailer shot) and shoots Krennic with it, killing him. But it is too late to send the plans, because the Death Star fires, destroying the dish. Jyn grabs the plans and an injured Cassian, and they manage to get into the TIE fighter with Bodhi, and escape back to the rebel fleet.

 

Onboard the rebel ship, Jyn and Bodhi, rush down the corridor with Cassian, helping him to walk. Jyn falls through the door as it closes. Jyn has the Death Star plans, but she wont leave Cassian and Bodhi, who are trapped along with the rebels. Vader then appears, slaughtering the rebels with ease, as Jyn desperately tries to open the door from her side, to save them. Bodhi pulls at the door but it wont open. Cassian, on the floor from his injury, now turns to look at Jyn. "Go," he tries to shout, as Vader approaches, still slaughtering rebels. Bodhi shouts "run!" as Vader cuts him down. Cassian looks up at Vader, but he doesn't even slow down, swinging his lightsaber at Cassian, and killing him.

 

The door opens and Jyn runs to the ship with the plans, as Vader pursues, killing the final three rebels who stand in his way. Jyn takes a few steps onboard the Tantive IV as she is violently pulled back. It's Vader. He uses the force to pull her back out of the ship towards him. Jyn intentionally drops the plans as she flies backwards.

 

"Launch!" shouts a rebel, as the doors close and Jyn's fate is unknown. Someone then picks up the plans that Jyn let go of, and takes them to Leia.

[Luke Skywalker 1,793]

3 hours ago, Incanus said:

I just wish they had used a Peter Cushing look-a-like actor for him. They used an actor for the wide-shot in RotS (unless they painted CG over him).

This is actor Wayne Pygram in his Tarkin mask. Of course you can only see him from the distance. Up close he looks as creepy as the CG version in Rogue One.

 

 

He could really play Picard without much make up

[leeallen01 2,134]

He'll always be Scorpius.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[leeallen01 2,134]

7 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

I actually thought about that, and apparently rumors say that that's how (some of) the main characters were supposed to die.

 

I think the scene would have had much more of an impact that way. However, what you would gain in horror factor, you'd lose in emotional impact. I think that ultimately, I prefer how the characters die in the final cut (even if there's still the problem of emotional attachment).

 

 

Agreed.

 

I think the Vader scene is perfect, because it involves horrific things happening to soldiers we don't know. Which is exactly like war.

 

 

[Bespin 8,480]

In the new movie, do they explain where Anakin's took his new accent?

 

Darth Vader Helmet (batteries not included, but comes with a british accent)

 

[mstrox 6,647]

He's like Madonna.  He got married to a guy from Space Britain, and then all of a sudden he had a goofy-sounding accent.

[Jay 37,323]

No.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

It's simple.

 

He became evil.

 

All evil people have British accents.

 

It is law.

[DominicCobb 194]

Vader doesn't have an British accent.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Sttt...Don't tell them.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

You'd hear him stroking his semi while doing it though!

 

 

[leeallen01 2,134]

His "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" clearly had a New Zealand twist to it.

 

"I foind your lick of feeth disterbing, but no worries mate."

[KK 3,307]

8 hours ago, BloodBoal said:

Indeed! If you were to meet us in real life, you'd say we don't look as we real as we do on the forum, and that you'd just prefer to talk to us there! You fucktard!

 

But are any of us real? Or are we just figments of Steef's imagination?

[BloodBoal 7,538]