Sign in to follow this  
toothless

The temp track thread

Recommended Posts

Well, Spielberg did it on Jurassic Park (with the Brachiosorious cue) and Henry V again.   That's why it would more enter into the temp track territory here, it's a lot more harder to say than comparing something like Debussy's La fille aux cheveux de lin and Episode 1.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do we know as a fact Spielberg used those as temp tracks, or are we just assuming? 

 

The Conan/Total Recall one was mentioned as a FACT for probably hundreds of times, and I'm reliably informed that this wasnt actually the case.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When the only reference is in two back-to-back directed by Spielberg movies, without any other cases of temp tracking in any other movies  (things like Hanson / E.T. and Dvorak / Jaws seems not temp tracking but Johnny being post-modern in his writing), and with the original score only couple of years before, it is questioning that it could enter into temp track territory.  Steven *was* trying to bring his mojo back, and trying new things in the director's chair.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PLANET OF THE APES was temped with...nothing, as Franklin J. Schaffner hated any temp music!

 

Toto was asked to look to Shostakovich as inspiration, for DUNE; "low, and slow" was the brief.

 

JW was told to "lean on" THE MISSION, while composing EOTS.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 18.6.2017 at 6:48 AM, Stefancos said:

So you are just assuming?:

 

That's the problem with these threads. 90% of the time, it's just fans speculating based on some similarity they hear (that may be more or less farfetched/coincidental). Very rarely is there actual confirmation of which tracks were used as temp.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Thor said:

 

That's the problem with these threads. 90% of the time, it's just fans speculating based on some similarity they hear (that may be more or less farfetched/coincidental). Very rarely is there actual confirmation of which tracks were used as temp.

 

This is my problem with threads like this as well.  More accurate title would be, "Music that sounds like other music."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with you both. Nonetheless, I think there are differences between music that sounds like another and the blatant rip off we hear from time to time. But yeah the title of this thread is a bit extreme. :P

 

 

3 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

or "Music that may or may not have been inspired by other music which may or may not have served as temp track music".

:lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, toothless said:

I agree with you both. Nonetheless, I think there are differences between music that sounds like another and the blatant ripoff we hear from time to time. 

 

Well, 'blatant ripoff' is still subjective. Only on very few occasions have I bought into the 'blatant ripoff' thing without actual confirmation from the production sources, like -- say -- the Bates/Goldenthal/300 ordeal (I assume this was confirmed later on, in the trials) or Horner/Gayanneh/ALIENS (I don't think this was ever confirmed from inside sources, but it seems obvious).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had a long debate at work about whether temp tracks should be used. I argued that if a director falls in love sufficiently with a particular cue in a scene, and subsequently removes the freedom of the composer to write what they want from the scene, their role is hugely diminished. In those cases I think licensing the temped music is a better choice.

 

Can't find it on YouTube, but Debney's Launching the Attack from 'The Ant Bully' is a clear replication of a cue from JNH's Atlantis (I haven't listened for a while so I'm not sure which cue it is).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

Can't find it on YouTube, but Debney's Launching the Attack from 'The Ant Bully' is a clear replication of a cue from JNH's Atlantis (I haven't listened for a while so I'm not sure which cue it is).

 

(starting at 3:28)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/18/2017 at 6:26 AM, Stefancos said:

Do we know as a fact Spielberg used those as temp tracks, or are we just assuming? 

 

Yes, Spielberg always used temp tracks. Even JW himself said it in an interview from 1993 (published on the Soundtrack! magazine)

 

 

Screen Shot 2017-06-28 at 14.21.04.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Disco Stu said:

There goes peoples precious theory that no filmmaker would dare show Williams an edit with temp music, which I always thought was wishful thinking.

 

:(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes (or at least that he only used them occasionally). 

 

*The above is in regard to showing Williams the film with the temp track. Obviously I always presumed Spielberg used them when editing. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Temp tracks are an important tool in the directors arsenal to make clear to a composer what he's looking for stylistically/rhythmically/thematically etc. Especially considering most directors aren't musically literature.

 

It doesn't mean they paste in a piece of music and tell the composer "give me that!"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Stefancos said:

Temp tracks are an important tool in the directors arsenal to make clear to a composer what he's looking for stylistically/rhythmically/thematically etc. Especially considering most directors aren't musically literature.

 

It doesn't mean they paste in a piece of music and tell the composer "give me that!"

 

I agree that they can be a way to communicate to the composer what sort of thing they want, but they've then got to be able to let go of the temp and allow the composer to do their thing. Clearly sometimes that doesn't happen and the composer is given no freedom.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jurassic Park is plagued with temp-track! Doyle's Henry V, Zimmer's Backdraft, Williams' own JFK, Close Encounters and there's surely more I'm not remembering right now... TLW seems to have some Silvestri's Predator 2 temp-tracked in there, particularly during The Raptors Attack.

 

Thinking that Spielberg, as efficient as he is, would not use temp-track is quite foolish. Remember Jaws was tracked with Images, but that was one of those cases that Williams decided to go against the man as he felt the film had a different tone instead, both the primal side of the shark and the pirate-like nature of the second half of the film. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

 

I agree that they can be a way to communicate to the composer what sort of thing they want, but they've then got to be able to let go of the temp and allow the composer to do their thing. Clearly sometimes that doesn't happen and the composer is given no freedom.

 

But then the same could be said about any other department: should a director let the costume designer, or the production designer do their thing? Should a director allow the actors to play the scene as they like? Clearly there has to be a compromise and a trust, but it's foolish to think that the director should not have control over the work of every department.

Why film music fans think music should be given a "special consideration" by the director is beyond me. Clearly,film composers understand the limits of the medium much better than fans.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The 90s called; they want this discussion back! :D

 

Seriously, though, even if the topic is still relevant, it's been discussed so many times now, that I often hear from composers participating in panels I host that they'd rather steer clear of the topic altogether. Which is fine by me, because I've kinda tired of it too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Muad'Dib said:

Jurassic Park is plagued with temp-track! Doyle's Henry V, Zimmer's Backdraft, Williams' own JFK, Close Encounters and there's surely more I'm not remembering right now... TLW seems to have some Silvestri's Predator 2 temp-tracked in there, particularly during The Raptors Attack.

 

Any specific examples of cues in Jurassic Park where there was temp track? (also, are you just assuming temp track, or has it been confirmed?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this