Arpy 4,145 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Just now, Muad'Dib said: Lion King and Prince of Egypt say hello. Both good, expressive scores, yet his recent output has been somewhat of a mixed bag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 1 minute ago, Disco Stu said: 23 and 19 years ago, respectively. Got any examples more recent? The Lion King remake! Bilbo and Disco Stu 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Arpy 4,145 Posted July 20, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 20, 2017 Interstellar was a wonderful score with an emotional core. Unlucky Bastard, Disco Stu, DominicCobb and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 1 minute ago, RPurton said: Interstellar was a wonderful score with an emotional core. That's the ticket. Agreed. Arpy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 25 minutes ago, Quintus said: In retrospect the scene does lay it on too thick, I'd have preferred something more subtle myself. But a couple of culprits here constantly act like it destroys the film and it has essentially become the main takeaway of Schindler's List on this site. It certainly does not but it is the apotheosis of the movie were Spielberg's emotional indulgences and Williams' musical pathos make for a rather unholy alliance - and i say that as a german who probably was raised with a much more conscious idea of what is suitable in a Holocaust context and when we saw 'Schindler' in our school back in early 1994, there were many who objected to that 'Hollywood kitsch' ending that cheapened what came before in the movie and the actual event - it felt like sugar coating. That may be a german viewpoint not entirely justified in the context of an american dramatization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muad'Dib 1,802 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 19 minutes ago, BloodBoal said: The Lion King remake! Nice save! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUMENKOHL 1,068 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 52 minutes ago, publicist said: It seems designed for a more movie-naive age, though. It's basically the blunt Demille version (note how Spielberg basically reworks Chaplin's 'Great Dictator' finish). I would have preferred a more subtle scene and bet it would have driven home the point better. So many people cringe about the scene and that cannot have been Spielberg's intention. Nah, not people who don’t spend time dissecting movies to fulfill themeselves. It’s about on par with the rest of the film, maybe slightly worse or slightly better depending on your taste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedigoScan 324 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 from what I hear, this really is a score you shouldnt listen to before seeing the movie (much like Gravity) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 2 hours ago, Sally Spectra said: I never knew there was a problem with the "I could have done more scene" until I read all the complaints about it on the internet. I'm sure to many people this is the moment when the film stopped being distant and cold, but yeah, others find it way too melodramatic compared to the rest of the movie. It's completely unnecessary too, in my opinion. It's Spielberg not trusting the audience to think for itself. I forgot, there's a second slip-up: The girl with her red coat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 1 minute ago, Alexcremers said: I'm sure to many people this is the moment when the film stopped being distant and cold, but yeah, others find it way too melodramatic compared to the rest of the movie. It's completely unnecessary too, in my opinion. I forgot, there's a second slip-up: The girl with her red coat. "distant and cold" is not how I would describe what came before. Maybe, "disturbingly matter-of-fact" and it's an astounding watch. And then to see Schindler finally let himself comprehend the enormity of the horror is such an emotional catharsis, as Quintus said, for the audience. I don't think it's easy or unnecessary. Bilbo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 "Distant and cold" is how it must have felt for typical Spielberg fans because the critical consensus (as well as my opinion) was that Schindler's List was surprisingly restrained for Steven Spielberg. Then came the 'I could have done more' scene ... Still, 98% of the movie is still great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 The red coat scene is possibly the biggest lasting memory of the film for most people, it's iconic. I swear Alex is a fucking muppet sometimes. BLUMENKOHL 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 It's broad strokes but it's visual. it doesn't speak. That's a big advantage over the other sequence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 If I'm correct, Spielberg uses a little girl in Munich to extract an emotion form the audience as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Probably my favorite sitcom .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicCobb 194 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 There is a pretty pervasive (and one might say sophomoric) attitude that Spielberg is too much a sentimentalist and that that's a bad thing. Sentimental or not, as long as it's effective, that's the sign of a good filmmaker. You can emotionally distance yourself from the film and try to "analyze" where it isn't "realistic," or whatever your metric is, but the truth of the matter is that that scene in Schindler's is an incredibly effective release, and Spielberg 100% makes it work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 10 minutes ago, Alexcremers said: If I'm correct, Spielberg uses a little girl in Munich to extract an emotion form the audience as well. Do you mean the one who almost got blown up by the telephone bomb? That was an expertly executed suspense sequence, very Hitchcockian. The little girl was just there to up the ante, thrill-wise. Great scene, one of the best of that movie Quintus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 18 minutes ago, publicist said: It's broad strokes but it's visual. it doesn't speak. That's a big advantage over the other sequence. That's the thing about it, it's purely visual; it isn't manipulative at all to me. I can't really describe what my emotions were when I first watched that sequence, but I certainly don't find it especially moving. More than anything, striking, is how I'd describe it. I honestly don't think Alexcremers understands Schindler's List, same as he didn't get 2001: A Space Odyssey. He's sort of the weird inverse here of Drax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Eh? Disco Stu 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 19 minutes ago, Sally Spectra said: Yes, and a more offensive spectacle I cannot recall! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 At least you're entertaining with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 3 minutes ago, TheGreyPilgrim said: Yes, and a more offensive spectacle I cannot recall! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 I really need to get past that first season of Seinfeld. I want to like it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 23 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: Do you mean the one who almost got blown up by the telephone bomb? That was an expertly executed suspense sequence, very Hitchcockian. The little girl was just there to up the ante, thrill-wise. Great scene, one of the best of that movie Yes, I was immediately reminded of the girl with the red coat in Schindler's List. Easy manipulation tricks kinda spoil it for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 20, 2017 Being manipulated by a master filmmaker is one of life's pleasures. Bilbo, DominicCobb and Not Mr. Big 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 We all like to think we're strong enough not to be hypnotised. "Ha! That doesn't affect me!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 34 minutes ago, DominicCobb said: There is a pretty pervasive (and one might say sophomoric) attitude that Spielberg is too much a sentimentalist and that that's a bad thing. Sentimental or not, as long as it's effective, that's the sign of a good filmmaker. You can emotionally distance yourself from the film and try to "analyze" where it isn't "realistic," or whatever your metric is, but the truth of the matter is that that scene in Schindler's is an incredibly effective release, and Spielberg 100% makes it work. It's not a matter of realism. It's when you feel things are getting way too melodramatic to convey an emotion. The 'I could have done more' scene would have been more powerful if Schindler didn't have a breakdown. That leaves it up to us but Spielberg doesn't trust his own audience. 6 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: Being manipulated by a master filmmaker is one of life's pleasures. It's not masterful. It's overcooked. Masterful is when you don't know when you are being manipulated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 20, 2017 This approach to wanting films to be almost ascetic in their storytelling, or that those kind of films are somehow "purer," is such horse crap to me. These are tricks that storytellers have been using for thousands of years, now applied in a new medium. Putting a child in danger is an old easy trick, one that Spielberg used masterfully in that Munich sequence. He was practically winking at the audience, "Did ya think I was gonna kill the kid? But you weren't sure, were ya?" It was great! Spielberg doesn't just trust his audience, he's in constant conversation with them and their expectations. Like all the best old Hollywood directors were. Loert, Fancyarcher, DominicCobb and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 5 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: This approach to wanting films to be almost ascetic in their storytelling is such horse crap to me. I definitely agree with this part of your post. Some people just wish every single film on the planet was made by Stanley Kubrick. And what a thoroughly dull medium it would be. Sharkissimo and Not Mr. Big 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 How is that a conversation?! That doesn't make sense. He's actually dictating us what to think and how to feel. 8 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: Spielberg doesn't just trust his audience, he's in constant conversation with them and their expectations. Like all the best old Hollywood directors were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicCobb 194 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 15 minutes ago, Sally Spectra said: We all like to think we're strong enough not to be hypnotised. "Ha! That doesn't affect me!" Hence "sophomoric." 15 minutes ago, Alexcremers said: It's not a matter of realism. It's when you feel things are getting way too melodramatic to convey an emotion. The 'I could have done more' scene would have been more powerful if Schindler didn't have a breakdown. That leaves it up to us but Spielberg doesn't trust his own audience. How dare someone who's just gone through an insanely harrowing and traumatic experience have a breakdown knowing that there are people who died he might have been able to save? Sharkissimo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 54 minutes ago, DominicCobb said: You can emotionally distance yourself from the film and try to "analyze" where it isn't "realistic," or whatever your metric is, but the truth of the matter is that that scene in Schindler's is an incredibly effective release, and Spielberg 100% makes it work. For you. An important distinction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 16 minutes ago, Alexcremers said: How is that a conversation?! That doesn't make sense. He's actually dictating us what to think and how to feel. Suspending your disbelief, giving yourself over to a story, is one of my favorite things about being alive. And holding that suspension, playing with it, seeing where he can take the viewer, is part of a conversation with the storyteller, no matter if it's film, a play, a novel. The way he gets nervous laughter from the audience when the pressure is relieved as he goes right up to the line of killing the kid and then doesn't. Spielberg is so good at constructing these suspense scenes across his career. 5 minutes ago, publicist said: For you. An important distinction. True. What works for one, doesn't for another. No such thing as an "objectively good" artist. Sharkissimo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,333 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 19 minutes ago, DominicCobb said: How dare someone who's just gone through an insanely harrowing and traumatic experience have a breakdown knowing that there are people who died he might have been able to save? You're trying to play the realism card. However, the real Schindler didn't cry while falling into the arms of Itzhak Stern. I would have made the scene more subtle so that it can go into different directions. I would allow the audience to participate and to think for themselves. I wouldn't turn it into a big melodrama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicCobb 194 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 21 minutes ago, publicist said: For you. An important distinction. Fair enough. 15 minutes ago, Alexcremers said: You're trying to play the realism card. However, the real Schindler didn't cry while falling into the arms of Itzhak Stern. I would have made the scene more subtle so that it can go into different directions. I would allow the audience to participate and to think for themselves. I wouldn't turn it into a big melodrama. Not about realism. It's more so about believability - buying the scene and the emotion. Spielberg made a choice there and I buy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2,274 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Well, the score is out there already... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Lol at the people trying to force the thread back to Zimmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,527 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Yes, I'll be buying a physical copy, tomorrow, along with WFTPOTA, and VALERIAN... ...and the OCTOBERON re-isssue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 And that the second score this day is hastily listened through to form a rash response that will probably be 'meh'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 TheUlyssesian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 It will be effective in the movie, which is the yardstick by which a good soundtrack album is to be measured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedigoScan 324 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 having seen the prologue I am sure the soundtrack will have almost nothing directly from the movie either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 I probably will only see the movie next week. These base chords + heavy bass pulse approach just isn't getting me anywhere, musically. Works great for certain movies, but apart from that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 The first review that actually makes me want to see the movie. Quote In its vast cinematic glory and intimate emotional appeal, Dunkirk encourages us to hail heroes whenever we have the slightest excuse, and give considerable pause before calling anyone a coward. In this it’s a war film of considerable, uncommon valor. http://www.larsenonfilm.com/dunkirk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antovolk 95 Posted July 20, 2017 Author Share Posted July 20, 2017 Skimmed through the score album now. Yeah, it's what I suspected. More 'suite'-y versions of what you hear in the film, WITHOUT the ticking (in the film it runs all the way through), and in some cases (such as The Mole, The Oil etc) it's cut down versions of what you hear in the film. But holy fuck, listening to Variation 15 and the End Titles again (presented as in the film unlike everything else)....feeling a lump in my throat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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