Tom 4,654 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 I realize this is borderline stupid, but with the thread in general discussion about Rinzler and his clear dismissal of Disney SW, I thought this might make a good discussion. Does Williams' involvement in the new SW episodes make them more legit or not (whatever this means to you)? A good test case would be, do the "anthology" episodes have the same SW artistic legitimacy as the episodes? If so, then Williams' involvement makes no difference on this score (okay, pun intended). If not, then maybe Williams' role is important. Will 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post crumbs 14,307 Posted June 30, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted June 30, 2017 He's one of the few bridging links that tie all the films together, it absolutely plays a big part in legitimizing the new trilogy. In ten years when they do X, XI and XII it'll be hard to accept those as part of the fabric of Star Wars, because they won't have that John Williams link. Will, John, curlytoot and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 it 'll be like the Bond film after John Barry stopped scoring them .They don't feel as real James Bond movies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Yes. It's also one of the reasons why I don't see Rogue One or any of those hideous clay-mation cartoons as "real" Star Wars movies. Cerebral Cortex and crumbs 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,284 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 They do for me. Much as I enjoyed TFA, I probably wouldn't be half as interested in these movies without JW. crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 4,654 Posted June 30, 2017 Author Share Posted June 30, 2017 Well, it is a clear "yes" for me. I was wondering if I was in the minority (with respect to Jwfaners). Perhaps not. I do wonder if I judge (and even experience) RO more harshly because of this. The movie seems so uninspired and derivative to me. almost like a transformers movie. However, I know that is a common objection to TFA, which I do think has many derivative elements, but I still experience it as something more. crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Yes, Star Wars without John Williams is just not the same. We've heard it in cartoons, video games, amusement park attractions, and even 1 big budget film with a very competent composer who himself idolizes JW. But none of those versions of Star Wars music are as good as JW's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 This isn't a stupid question at all. Perhaps if Jerry Goldsmith had scored the JJ Abrams Star Trek flicks they would have felt legitimised to the core fan base. aj_vader 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpy 4,145 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Yes, Williams was one of the big players brought on for TFA affectionately called (along with Kasdan, Kennedy, Lucas) the 'Star Wars Brain Trust'. Will 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 2,245 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 6 hours ago, king mark said: it 'll be like the Bond film after John Barry stopped scoring them .They don't feel as real James Bond movies Barry didn't score three of the Moore films. Does that make them less valid to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,495 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 I disagree. Williams' "sound" is unquestionably an important part of these films and even franchise as a whole, but it's only one out of many important ingredients. It can feel perfectly legitimate without him. I'd even be pro a completely different musical approach at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,516 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Thor's right. If, and when, X, XI, and XII, are made, JW will either be retired, or... It would be nice to keep "core musical themes", but, since most of the characters from I - IX, will be deceased, there will be nothing to stop the makers of these films using new musical expressions, for the SW universe. Star Wars is not Luke's Theme, nor The Imperial March, nor (please, no!!!) Jedi Rocks. It's much, much more than that. That fans of the films treat the scores as an integral, and very welcome part of the whole story, is a testament to both the enduring power of the music, and JW. Disney knew what it was buying. For $4 billion, it got a bargain, and it intends to mine its property for all it's worth. If any more films are made (and I mean proper SW films, not these scrappy pieces of shoe-leather), then I, for one, probably, won't be here...but other people will. As long as the SW universe is represented musically, with excitement, honesty, and care, then I'll be somewhere... laughing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FC4L 87 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Are Harry Potter 4-8 not legitimate Harry Potter films? This is such a stupid topic. Love the Jerry Goldsmith scoring JJ's Trek considering he didn't even score all of the previous 10 Trek films. Dumb topic is dumb. Summer must be pretty boring for some of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Jay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 37 minutes ago, FC4L said: Are Harry Potter 4-8 not legitimate Harry Potter films? This is such a stupid topic. Love the Jerry Goldsmith scoring JJ's Trek considering he didn't even score all of the previous 10 Trek films. Dumb topic is dumb. Summer must be pretty boring for some of you. *shrugs* I dunno, I think this post needed John Williams to really work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 TWOK, TSFS, THV, TUC and G just aren't real ST movies. Not Mr. Big 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,480 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Williams is the final barrier to the disapearance of all my interest for Star Wars. crumbs and justaguy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 Bespin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,480 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 ...It's a scene that occurs in a french cozy cabaret on the moon of Jedha... Involving several plastic puppets of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted June 30, 2017 Share Posted June 30, 2017 2 hours ago, FC4L said: Are Harry Potter 4-8 not legitimate Harry Potter films? Bad example. Only one or two of the films come close to being as good as the books. I actively try to forget most of those movies. But yeah, that's not because of a lack of Williams. I don't think the Star Wars films without Williams will be less legitimate. Possibly less good. Not Mr. Big and Arpy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Everyone here considers them canon except me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FC4L 87 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 16 hours ago, BloodBoal said: Says the guy who has nothing better to do than post in a thread to say how dumb it is! On 6/29/2017 at 7:18 PM, Tom said: I realize this is borderline stupid, but with the thread in general discussion about Rinzler and his clear dismissal of Disney SW, I thought this might make a good discussion. Does Williams' involvement in the new SW episodes make them more legit or not (whatever this means to you)? A good test case would be, do the "anthology" episodes have the same SW artistic legitimacy as the episodes? If so, then Williams' involvement makes no difference on this score (okay, pun intended). If not, then maybe Williams' role is important. When the OP starts a stupid thread claiming it is to be a stupid thread you don't have a leg to stand on calling out a poster who reinforces the very first sentence posted in the thread. The defences that come out trying to support the stupidity of the thread just make it even more hilarious. Most Harry Potter films aren't legit because they don't live up to the books? What the fuck does that even mean? They lived up to the book's author's approval. I guess the 6 or 7 Harry Potter films that aren't really Harry Potter films (not because Williams didn't score them but because.... reasons) are not legit but the 3 Star Wars films, scored by Williams, that the internet has nothing better to do over a decade later but continue to shit on the creator's vision are? As stated by the OP, dumb thread is dumb. It's not even borderline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Why? I think the question is perfectly valid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Wojo 2,453 Posted July 1, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 1, 2017 TFA is legitimately more Star Wars than Episodes I, II, and III. Holko, John and pete 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 And thankfully it's scored by the perfectly legitimate John Williams! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Oh brother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 1, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted July 1, 2017 4 hours ago, FC4L said: When the OP starts a stupid thread claiming it is to be a stupid thread you don't have a leg to stand on calling out a poster who reinforces the very first sentence posted in the thread. The defences that come out trying to support the stupidity of the thread just make it even more hilarious. Most Harry Potter films aren't legit because they don't live up to the books? What the fuck does that even mean? They lived up to the book's author's approval. I guess the 6 or 7 Harry Potter films that aren't really Harry Potter films (not because Williams didn't score them but because.... reasons) are not legit but the 3 Star Wars films, scored by Williams, that the internet has nothing better to do over a decade later but continue to shit on the creator's vision are? As stated by the OP, dumb thread is dumb. It's not even borderline. I sense a lot of anger in you. Did Tom do something to offend you? Ricard, crumbs and Not Mr. Big 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,516 Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 20 hours ago, BloodBoal said: But what if Aznavour wrote a Star Wars song? Did you have to?! Now you've done it. Now you've done it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryant Burnette 654 Posted July 2, 2017 Share Posted July 2, 2017 On 6/30/2017 at 9:37 PM, FC4L said: dumb thread is dumb Meme-speak isn't necessarily the path to having one's opinion be taken seriously. That said, I kind of agree: it's a dumb topic. The new Star Wars films ARE legitimate. There is no debate to be had on that topic, any more than there is on the subject of whether the Earth revolves around the sun (it does). One can debate their merits endlessly, but there is no debate as regards the legitimacy: these are films made by the company that is legally allowed to make them, and that is the end of that. The question is: does Williams' presence make the films more palatable to the sort of people who argue over this sort of thing? For now, that's a demonstrable "yes." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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