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Right now, who are your Top 5 film composers?

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9 hours ago, JohnSolo said:

It's crazy that at the age of 32, Hurwitz already has two Oscars, two Golden Globes, and a host of other awards under his belt for his score for La La Land. Who knows, maybe he'll be the next Williams.

That would be fine, but who will be the next Goldsmith?

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1 hour ago, Nick1066 said:

Poor Leonard Rosenman.

 

Has he made anyone's list? Even the Top 10?

 

If it's any comfort, Rosenman would be on top of his own list. Rest his soul, but I've never seen anyone as high on himself as that man. I like this STAR TREK IV, but was never really able to get into much else. And I tried several times.

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11 minutes ago, Thor said:

 

If it's any comfort, Rosenman would be on top of his own list. Rest his soul, but I've never seen anyone as high on himself as that man. I like this STAR TREK IV, but was never really able to get into much else. And I tried several times.

 

Well no kidding.  I read a quote of his once bemoaning that his LOTR score was wasted on an inferior film. That's just the kind of thing that, even if true, you don't really say.

 

For the record, his LOTR score is pretty good (though perhaps hasn't aged so well...and does sound remarkably like Star Trek IV), and the main theme is wonderful.  But the movie isn't that bad at all, and in fact the first half is pretty good.  

 

Anyway, if you liked Star Trek IV, you should give his LOTR a try.

 

1 hour ago, BloodBoal said:

He'd probably be in my top 5 composers who scored Tolkien adaptations.

 

Above or below Stephen Oliver and Maury Laws?!

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There are many such Rosenman quotes to marvel over. You mentioned one of the more "mild" ones. He also tended to look down on film, trying instead to highlight his concert music. And whenever someone asked him why he didn't score this or that, or did some small B-movie, he always had an "excuse". Some intriguing interviews:

 

http://www.runmovies.eu/leonard-rosenman-on-scoring-star-trek-iv/

http://www.runmovies.eu/leonard-rosenman/

 

A random quote that illustrates his curious personality:

 

Quote

The EAST OF EDEN score is considered by many (along with Bernard Herrmann and Alex North), to be the score that really brought music in films into the twentieth century. My great admirer was Benny Herrmann at the time.

 

He was really the anti-John Williams when it comes to humility. :)

 

Speaking of John Williams, there were a couple of intriguing quotes as well:

 

Quote

I don’t mean to disparage John Williams, because I think he’s wonderful, but I think that the thing that really gave John Williams this enormous reputation from STAR WARS was the main and end title. That’s about the only thing you can really hear. 

 

Quote

You did HELLFIGHTERS.
John Williams was supposed to do that, but he got appendicitis and I was asked to step in. It had a good ‘western’ theme.

 

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7 hours ago, Nick1066 said:

Ouch. Yeah, those quotes are pretty bad. 

 

Not everyone is as classy as Williams...didn't Horner (RIP) publicly dis Yared's Troy score pretty harshly? Seems I recall something along those lines.  I also think he slammed Wolfgang Peterson in that interview.

 

Horner said that Yared didn't know how to score "big movies", and insulted him throughout the interview, saying his Troy score was "bad". Horner had a pretty huge ego, as you can imagine.

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Horner came off as "full of it" in all of the interviews I read of him in the past. Doesn't make me think less of his melodic skills though. Plenty of talented people have huge egos, some are just making it seem less apparent then others. 

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That's not really my impression at all. Rather, I think he was very "Hollywood-minded", and had trouble adapting to alternative approaches to filmmaking. Like when he said "THE NEW WORLD could have been a great love story a la TITANIC" in the interview with Daniel Schweiger a few years back. He simply didn't get Malick's alternative way of doing things. So that was sorta a limitation in his mindset. But I think he was refreshingly honest in his interviews -- no "ass-kissing", which is to typical of Hollywood folks.

 

I also think he was a very humble and self-critical person when I met him in 2013.

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1) John Williams

2) James Horner

3) Elliot Goldenthal

4) Jerry Goldsmith

5) John Powell

2 hours ago, Richard said:

From what I've heard, in interviews, Horner didn't have a nice word to say about anyone...except Horner...

 

Most people agree, Horner was not a nice person.  Most people agree, he was a very fine composer.

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18 minutes ago, karelm said:

Most people agree, Horner was not a nice person. 

 

What foundation do you have to say that? And who are these "most people"? Quite the contrary, he was a very nice person. Don't conflate honesty in interviews with the degree of "niceness" as a person.

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Just now, Fancyarcher said:

I will I say I did like how open and honest Horner was about current film-scoring in any interview I read of him a few years back.

 

a YouTube interview in which he is with your blue scarf?

 

 

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13 hours ago, karelm said:

Most people agree, Horner was not a nice person.  

 

Being a nice person is overrated these days. You don't get anything or anywhere in life for being "nice." You don't get respect from other guys, and you don't get the hot girls.

 

Personally I'm only nice to my girlfriend, family, and close friends. To everybody else I'm one mean son of a gun.

 

So James Horner was right! 

13 hours ago, karelm said:

 

5) John Powell

 

What good scores did he write!?

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1 hour ago, Josh500 said:

 

Being a nice person is overrated these days. You don't get anything or anywhere in life for being "nice." You don't get respect from other guys, and you don't get the hot girls.

 

Personally I'm only nice to my girlfriend, family, and close friends. To everybody else I'm one mean son of a gun.

Riiiiggght. 

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43 minutes ago, Disco Stu said:

 

Evolution

the original Bourne trilogy

X-Men 3

Horton Hears a Who!

How to Train Your Dragon 1 & 2

 

To name but a few.

 

Out of these, I have only seen the Bourne trilogy, and the music didn't particularly stick in my mind....

 

Hmmm. I guess I need to revisit these movies.

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2 hours ago, Josh500 said:

 

Being a nice person is overrated these days. You don't get anything or anywhere in life for being "nice." You don't get respect from other guys, and you don't get the hot girls.

 

Personally I'm only nice to my girlfriend, family, and close friends. To everybody else I'm one mean son of a gun.

 

So I take it your girlfriend isn't hot?

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1 hour ago, Nick1066 said:

 

So I take it your girlfriend isn't hot?

 

Of course she is.

 

Once she's your girlfriend, that's different. Of course be nice to her. You should avoid being the "nice guy" around hot girls whom you aren't dating yet. 

 

Hell, don't you know anything? 

1 hour ago, Disco Stu said:

 

Rude and uncalled for.

 

Some people are just clueless. You gotta feel sorry for them. 

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1 minute ago, Josh500 said:

 

Of course she is.

 

Once she's your girlfriend, that's different. Of course be nice to her. You should avoid being the "nice guy" around hot girls whom you aren't dating yet. 

 

Hell, don't you know anything? 

 

Of course I do. I self-identify as a hot girl!

 

Please respect this.

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3 minutes ago, Nick1066 said:

 

Of course I do. I self-identify as a hot girl!

 

Please respect this.

 

Sure, whatever.

 

But enough about this. We're here to talk about our Top 5 film composers....

 

 

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On 9/22/2017 at 4:30 PM, Thor said:

 

 

What foundation do you have to say that? And who are these "most people"? Quite the contrary, he was a very nice person. Don't conflate honesty in interviews with the degree of "niceness" as a person.

 

There were session players who were quite indifferent to his death based on experiences they had in sessions.  And I have heard many of them from people who worked with him in various capacities.  This stuff comes up frequently in hearing of stories of him at work.  One could say he didn't handle stress well and passed it on to the orchestra and his team.  That is not considered a good trait.  He was not known to be a nice person to those who worked with/for him.  He would fire someone in front of the group to humiliate them rather than privately and some of them were quite prominent.  Remember this is a tight community of musicians who mostly all know each other.  He told the horn section during a session of some very difficult passage, "I don't give a f_ck your tired let's do another take."  Some of my friends were fired by him only to be re-hired next time he needed their skills.  The way they made it sound was he was sort of a man with a child's attitude.  I will also say I heard he mellowed through a few humiliations late in life.  Early in life (I have a friend who knew him before he was famous as a high school teen in LA then known as Jamie and how great his ego was even then that it was offensive and annoying to friends and classmates.  This same person also grieved at Horner's loss.  What is undeniable, he was truly talented and a very gifted composer.  In retrospect we do not let his personality quirks cloud our judgement of his music.  But it is part of the complicated story of James Horner.  You should remember with all this said, he is one of my top five favorites but is not generally considered to be a nice guy and I frankly think that is irrelevant to this discussion. 

On 9/23/2017 at 6:05 AM, Josh500 said:

 

Being a nice person is overrated these days. You don't get anything or anywhere in life for being "nice." You don't get respect from other guys, and you don't get the hot girls.

 

Personally I'm only nice to my girlfriend, family, and close friends. To everybody else I'm one mean son of a gun.

 

So James Horner was right! 

 

What good scores did he write!?

 

Perhaps.  One could counter argue being an ass is overrated too so your point isn't very convincing.  I know many assholes with horrible lives.  There are many things more important in life than gaining the respect of others.  I will tell you I know a holocaust survivor who was very impressed and held a respect for his captures when they arrived in his memory as a young boy watching the arrival of the nazi army compared to his own army.  They had respect for those soldiers in a way.  You overestimate respect and your "hot girls" analogy demonstrates immaturity.   Look up the "white rose" group during the Nazi regime to learn the definition of bravery of heroism.  Honesty and truth to one's voice despite the intense pressure are far more important.  Respect can imply complacency to the popular thinking and some might rightly despise or fear that.  

 

Good Powell scores: My opinion is not so much of the projects he has scored as it is on the quality of the work he has produced.  How to Train Your Dragon 1 and 2 are very fine.  I thought Chicken Run had some very fine musical sequences.  He has a wide vocabulary and range of technique and dramatic expressive range plus a real command of technique. 

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10 hours ago, Josh500 said:

 

 

Great choice! Which scores by him do you have, and which do you like best?

 

Listening to this now. Slightly reminiscent of JW's War of the Worlds. Might have been one of JW's inspirations....

 

https://youtu.be/PDeU42u2s2Y

 

Most of his scores available on CD are related to the sci-fi / Kaiju genre. The are quite a few compilations featuring music from the many films he’s scored.

 

In my collection

 

Godzilla

King Kong vs Godzilla

Mothra vs Godzilla

Ghidorah the 3 Headed Monster

Monster Zero

Destroy All Monsters

Godzilla vs Gigan (no original compositions, just tracked music from various films Ifukube scored)

Terror of Mecha-Godzilla

Godzilla vs King Ghidorah

Godzilla vs Mothra

Godzilla vs Mecha-Godzilla

Godzilla vs Destroyer

Varan

The Mysterians

War of the Gargantuas

Dogora

Frankenstein Conquers The World

Rodan

King Kong Escapes

Lattitude Zero

Space Ameoba 

Daimajin trilogy

Battle in Outer Space

Little Prince And The Eight Headed Dragon 

Birth Of Japan

Atragon

Tale of Osaka Castle

Whale God

plus numerous compilations of other films he’s scored.

 

 

My favorites are Godzilla, Rodan, King Kong vs Godzilla, Varan, Godzilla vs Mechagodzilla and Little Prince And the Eight Headed Dragon.

 

 

 

I have quite a few CDs of his non film works, which I highly recommend.

 

some of the pieces from those I recommend;

 

Sinfonia Tapkaara

Ballata Sinfonica

Symphony Concertante for Piano and Orchestra

Symphonic Ode - Gotama The Buddha (which is a reworking of his score to Buddha)

Overature to the Philippines. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, karelm said:

There were session players who were quite indifferent to his death based on experiences they had in sessions.  And I have heard many of them from people who worked with him in various capacities.  This stuff comes up frequently in hearing of stories of him at work.  One could say he didn't handle stress well and passed it on to the orchestra and his team.  That is not considered good, Thor.  Sorry, he was not known to be a nice person to those who worked for him.  He would fire someone in front of the group to humiliate them rather than privately and some of them were quite prominent.  Remember this is a tight community of musicians who mostly all know each other.  He told the horn section during a session of some very difficult passage, "I don't give a f_ck your tired let's do another take."  He would literally call them to the podium to berate them sort of stories.  Some of my friends were fired by him only to be re-hired next time he needed their skills.  The way they made it sound was he was sort of a man with a child's attitude.  I will also say I heard he mellowed through a few humiliations late in life.  Early in life (I have a friend who knew him before he was famous as a high school teen in LA then known as Jamie and how great his ego was that it was offensive and annoying to everyone.  We see glimpses of this in early interviews.  Aren't you a film music historian?  You would know this.  What is undeniable, he was truly talented and a very gifted composer.  In retrospect we do not let his personality quirks cloud our judgement of his music.  But it is part of the complicated story of James Horner.  You should remember with all this said, he is one of my top five favorites but is not generally considered to be a nice guy and I frankly think that is irrelevant to this discussion. 

 

Well, I've never worked with Horner, but I've spent some time with him -- both during my interview and later in the evening (including some of his closest). So at least I have some first-hand experience rather than second-hand stories or urban legends to go on when assessing his "niceness". Again, I separate strongly between this very personal trait and being honest in interviews or uncompromising in work situations. Apples and oranges. James Horner was a nice guy, period. 

 

You really have no right to call someone 'not nice' without ever actually having met said person. Same with members on a messageboard, really. I've seen some despicable internet personalities over the years (there is one, in particular, on FSM right now), but I really don't know how that person is IRL.

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