Christopher Tolkien Resigns from Tolkien Estate

[Bilbo 3,709]

http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2017/11/15/104426-in-historic-move-christopher-tolkien-resigns-as-director-of-tolkien-estate/

 

I was going to put this in the Amazon thread but I think it’s worthy of its own. This is big news and explains certain aspects of reporting around the Amazon deal. 

 

The TV rights had to be sold for all this to happen.

 

 

 

It really is the end of an era with Christopher resigning and it would appear that Beren and Luthien really was the swan song. I know people joke about the Tolkien shopping lists being published next but to think that what we’ve been given (which is quite a lot) is the end is quite sad.

 

My bookshelf is as crammed as it is because of this man, it’s sad to see him go. 

[Quintus 5,399]

Well, he is 92.

[Holko 9,519]

As grumpy as stubborn as he could be, it's still sad to see him resign. My first thoughts were "Yeah, Silmarillion series! And the parts of the History of Middle-Earth that people actually care about can finally be translated!" but then I realised his resignation means the trilogy of the Great Tales will not be finished by his rework of the story of Tuor and the fall of Gondolin, and I just became really sad. But the old trooper is bloody 93, after all, it's a small miracle he still got out Beren and Luthien as it is.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

He hasnt aged a day!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,714]

Double

 

But he is 92 after all. And has done all the fans of his father's works such an important and lasting service (while trying to honour and preserve his father's legacy) in editing and researching Tolkien's extant unreleased works beyond The Hobbit, LotR and the Silmarillion, that it is quite immeasurable.

 

I am rather dreading the Tolkien Expanded Cinematic Universe now.

[Quintus 5,399]

Have we had Dúnedain Happy Meals yet? I can't wait! 

[KK 3,307]

End of an era indeed! Guess it was only a matter of time.

[Nick1Ø66 4,711]

 

Yes, end of an era. Unlike a lot of offspring of famous people, he did his father's legacy proud, and has managed to maintain the integrity of the entire enterprise for decades. This will open up, of course, the endless franchisement of Tolkien, across multiple mediums (as the younger generation has long wanted to do), but I can't help think that something very special has been lost.

 

In honour of Christopher Tolkien I'll revert back to my old avatar until such time as I deem appropriate.

[Barnald 365]

If the new proprietors are solely interested in cash things could get very ugly. I await news of a Tolkien theme park (and BB's inevitable guesses at the attractions) with great trepidation.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Barnald 365]

Christ I just thought of the prospect of them sanctioning authors to 'expand the Middle-earth canon'. Should finally present a chance to 'amend' a few of those long troubling 'issues' and 'omissions'.

[Incanus 5,714]

It's official fan fiction time!

[Chen G. 3,949]

The man is 92 years old, so this was bound to happen.

 

Christopher's work on his father's writing is staggering. Tolkien wasn't the most organized writer, so the job of compiling his works was absolutly immense and while I might not agree with some of his editorial choices and I certainly don't share his views of film adaptations, I can't help but be awe-struck by his work.

 

Its a shame he couldn't complete the "trilogy" of the great tales, with the fall of Gondolin and Earendil's Voyage. Although, to be fair, the most character-driven version of the story is incomplete and while the continuation of the story can be drawn from earlier drafts, they are hard to reconcile with the later version of story. Originally, the siege of Gondolin was to feature what were essentially World War I tanks! Although the same is true for Beren and Luthien.

 

As for what this bodes for the Middle Earth cinematic universe, I hope for good things. I'm not sure about the upcoming television adaptation, but I think that the great tales would make for a killer 4-5 films and, potentially, scores.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Barnald 365]

20 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

Oh boy... Middle-Earth books by Terry Goodkind! Stephenie Meyer! Twilight Over Mirkwood, developing the tragic love story between Kili and Tauriel into three books.

 

Stop saying these things, it's making me ill.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

J.K. Rowling Takes A Crack At Middle-Earth Writing! "A Hamfist Of A Hobbit: The Tale Of Bumbly Bagford Bumblefoot" To Be Published Soon!

[Holko 9,519]

The sequel's better, in which Eldarion finds a secret ultra-ring with which he travels back in time while Sauron's daughter tries to stop him!

[Nick1Ø66 4,711]

56 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

J.K. Rowling Takes A Crack At Middle-Earth Writing! "A Hamfist Of A Hobbit: The Tale Of Bumbly Bagford Bumblefoot" To Be Published Soon!

 

OK you almost made me spit out my tea!

[Jay 37,346]

3 hours ago, Quintus said:

Have we had Dúnedain Happy Meals yet? I can't wait! 

 

 

We have had this:

 

 

 

 

[Quintus 5,399]

Bloody hell I'm starving.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I could murder a burger, actually.

[mstrox 6,651]

They didn't do a Denny's layout for BOFA?

 

I had always assumed that the lighter marketing push for BOFA was financially related (cut losses, etc) - for instance, the lack of the promised LEGO Hobbit video game BOFA add-on.  But I wonder if the actual reason was related to Tolkien estate litigation.

[Nick1Ø66 4,711]

One can only hope that as a result of the lawsuit, that the new deal with Amazon includes pretty strict rules on what kind of product tie-ins will be allowed.

 

[KK 3,307]

1 hour ago, BloodBoal said:

Oh boy... Middle-Earth books by Terry Goodkind! Stephenie Meyer! Twilight Over Mirkwood, developing the tragic love story between Kili and Tauriel into three books.

 

[Jay 37,346]

12 minutes ago, mstrox said:

They didn't do a Denny's layout for BOFA?

 

It probably wasn't worth it for Denny's to continue the partnership by that point.  The movies may have technically made a lot of money but they weren't really warmly received / discussed widely by the general public like say, new Star Wars films are

[Chen G. 3,949]

Which is a shame!

 

Although, again, it was an unmitigated financial success.

 

Its a very similar case to Jackson's own King Kong, in a way.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Jackson has gotten a lot of mileage with the streetcred he got from the LOTR films.

 

But he needs to do something properly good again.

[John 2,032]

To celebrate the release of BOTFA, Denny's should've offered a fried fish special; a dish that takes up room on the plate, but offers little to no actual substance.

[Nick1Ø66 4,711]

Yeah. Jackson's in serious danger of becoming George Lucas. The similarities between the PT and The Hobbit are bad enough already (though The Hobbit, for all its flaws, aren't nearly in prequel territory badness).

 

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Not even near!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

You cannot be her. She is far away. She... she is far, far away from me. She walks in starlight in another world. It was just a dream. Do you think she could have loved me?

[Barnald 365]

It did to be fair, and I say that as someone infinitely more fond of these films than most on here (SUH probably notwithstanding).

[John 2,032]

I've always had my issues with the Hobbit trilogy, but I've also always been quite fond of them, as it was around the time of their release that I became a Middle-earth fan. I guess it's just the nostalgia factor.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Am I the only one moved by those staves?

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Bilbo 3,709]

I’m perfectly fine with the Hobbit films. I can enjoy them for what they are rather what they could or should have been. 

 

I enjoyed all the build up and the event. Nostalgia probably is the driving factor but whatever. I’d hapoiky take what we got over it not happening at all.

[Incanus 5,714]

1 hour ago, Holko said:

The sequel's better, in which Eldarion finds a secret ultra-ring with which he travels back in time while Sauron's daughter tries to stop him!

Sauron's Daughter! That's a tantalizing opening for a 10-book series full of Tolkien magic and whimsy by G.R.R. Martin (coming in 2030 or later!). It will be the start of the Tolkien Dark Universe where incest, very explicit depictions of violence and sexposition will be the norm. Much more relatable to a modern audience. More real!

[Holko 9,519]

The Hobbit films (especially BotFA) got better for me each viewing. In the theatre, I was initially disappointed a bit, then at the Extended Hobbit Marathon with my friend, I thought they weren't bad at all for what they were, then when I got the boxset on DVD last christmas, I really enjoyed them. Guess I lowered my expectations after each viewing and it really helped.

[Incanus 5,714]

Just now, Holko said:

The Hobbit films (especially BotFA) got better for me each viewing. In the theatre, I was initially disappointed a bit, then at the Extended Hobbit Marathon with my friend, I thought they weren't bad at all for what they were, then when I got the boxset on DVD last christmas, I really enjoyed them. Guess I lowered my expectations after each viewing and it really helped.

If I ever learned something from Christopher Tolkien it is not to lower my expectations when it comes to Tolkien! 

[KK 3,307]

32 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

Jackson has gotten a lot of mileage with the streetcred he got from the LOTR films.

 

But he needs to do something properly good again.

 

Indeed. LOTR gave him legendary status. He became a brand name, almost on par with Cameron.

 

The Lovely Bones and The Hobbit proceeded to drag him down to a now largely forgettable director who made big-budget movies. I don't think he will be taken seriously like he used to, which is a shame indeed.

[Chen G. 3,949]

1 hour ago, Holko said:

The Hobbit films (especially BotFA) got better for me each viewing. In the theatre, I was initially disappointed a bit, then at the Extended Hobbit Marathon with my friend, I thought they weren't bad at all for what they were, then when I got the boxset on DVD last christmas, I really enjoyed them. Guess I lowered my expectations after each viewing and it really helped.

 

My experience is the opposite, in some ways: I entered the film with low expectations, having heard all the bad buzz and the rants on the split to a trilogy. But when I watched it, I loved it. Couldn't wait for The Desolation of Smaug. Watched that - mind was blown.

 

Over multiple rewatches I still enjoyed it a lot, but not quite as much, and my appreciation went from based largely on fanhood to one based on a critical examination of the film's strengths and weaknesses.

 

I still unabashedly love The Desolation of Smaug. The best act in the trilogy, when it is viewed as a single film.

[Barnald 365]

I appear to have mustered some Hobbit love, who knew? Actually I remember Bilbo liking them, I always knew he was a good egg. Unlike BB, who is inherently evil.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

I'm glad you have BS on your side, Barny!

[Incanus 5,714]

2 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

I'm glad you have BS on your side, Barny!

Here at the end of all things.

[Barnald 365]

35 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

I'm glad you have BS on your side, Barny!

 

Well I'm quite used to being associated with BS.

[Chen G. 3,949]

1 hour ago, Nick1066 said:

Yeah. Jackson's in serious danger of becoming George Lucas. The similarities between the PT and The Hobbit are bad enough already.

 

Jackson is nothing like George Lucas. The main criticisms against Lucas are his lack of willingness to collaborate, and his poor interaction with actors.

 

Peter Jackson is the opposite: he allows actors to have input on the script to the point of rewriting the screenplay on an almost daily basis, he uses the workshop meetings as think-tanks for design; he rehearses scenes extensively with actors (to the point of sending the camera crew away and clearing as much as an hour out of his schedule to sit with the cast) and takes an insane number of takes until the performances are just right.

[KK 3,307]

36 minutes ago, Barnald said:

 

Well I'm quite used to being associated with BS.

 

Who?

[Barnald 365]

The films have obvious Jackson faults (like the insistence on terrible comic relief and juvenile humour, present also in LOTR), but I refuse to condemn him too harshly given the circumstances of the production. If he had a two year pre-production period (even a year), no stomach ulcer, and had two years between films, we undoubtedly would have seen a far better final product. I also don't think we can underestimate the role of New Line with LOTR and that of WB with The Hobbit. But this is a can of worms I can't be arsed to open again.