The Last Jedi THE LAST JEDI - OST Album MUSIC Discussion (No Movie Spoilers)

[ocelot 508]

2 hours ago, bollemanneke said:

When can we expect to know more about a Hal Leonard suite? Is there an established timeframe for these publications?

Depends if the existing material already has the piece/s or if Williams is rewriting things into a suite. Plus, after they have it, they take time to go through every note to make sure there are no slip ups and for some odd reason they told me that takes a ton of time. I called them once as they were on the cusp of releasing the score to that centennial thing Williams and Spielberg did (forgot the name) and they said they put that on hold to rush out one of his film ones. So depends on demand as well.

 

Just now, filmmusic said:

 

Well, if I don't like it they will come after me!

 

Ok, seriously now:

I love too Williams, that's why I am here, and I'd like to love every score of his.

But yes, I don't think I'll chage my mind about TLJ. As I didn't about TFA.

But at least you have his previous 6 Star Wars to like. I think my favorite score is TPM. Love his writing in that. But I am loving this new trilogy as well. I love that he keeps growing and changing, but when someone changes their style or it grows with the person, because music is subjective, it can't appeal to everyone. Anyway, good luck on your dissertation. 

[filmmusic 1,822]

4 minutes ago, ocelot said:

But at least you have his previous 6 Star Wars to like. I think my favorite score is TPM. Love his writing in that. But I am loving this new trilogy as well. I love that he keeps growing and changing, but when someone changes their style or it grows with the person, because music is subjective, it can't appeal to everyone. Anyway, good luck on your dissertation. 

Ah, thank you very much! You've been most kind!

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

37 minutes ago, ocelot said:

Hey, he's still firmly in his 80s

 

It's the new 70s.

 

24 minutes ago, filmmusic said:

Well, if I don't like it they will come after me!

 

Only Zimmer does that

[Alex 2,833]

I'm actually finding myself drawn more to Rose's theme than Rey's 😬 *hides*

[Ricard 2,242]

17 hours ago, Jack said:

I started an analysis for shits and gigs, and to distract me from perpetual existential crisis. Here's the first half:

 

Star Wars: The Last Jedi OST Review / Musical Analysis

Introduction

Mixing / Mastering

What initially stands out for me is the mixing and mastering of the album, which hits you straight away upon listening to 01 Main Titles and Escape.

 

The entire album is heavily limited, mixed meticulously, and makes use of modern mastering techniques such as multi-band compression. There’s no doubt that this is the loudest original Star Wars album release to date. Aesthetically, the techniques used create an epic, large, punchy sound, with bass rolls and strikes that caused my ADAM A8X monitors to boom beautifully, and the trumpet highs of the fanfares and action pieces to almost pierce the ears, were they not being hugged by a warm, analogue-sounding bus compression. The percussion hits are particularly explosive when they occur! Sometimes the limiting gets a bit too close to brick-walling for my personal liking, with sections sounding as if they’re fighting for headroom.

Track-by-track analysis

01 Main Titles and Escape

The track of course starts with the iconic Star Wars / Luke’s Theme fanfare. The performance is very similar to the TFA performance, if not identical. What does sound different is how punchy it is. The main titles segue into a homage to the mysterious piccolo solo that featured in the same way in ESB. This is my favourite of the main title segues, so it was a pleasure to hear it played here with such articulacy.

 

The track quickly enters an urgent-sounding, militaristic section, with a pounding, rhythmic bass pedal, and fast fanfaric brass/winds, reminiscent of RoTS / BoTH material to my ears. The track is frenzied, with shifting textures constantly as the story develops.

 

Kylo Ren’s Theme makes its first appearance with a bang at 1:57, orchestrated identically to how we’ve heard it in TFA. I’ve noticed that Williams seems to give the ‘B section’ of Kylo Ren’s Theme a bit more room to breathe in this score – I’m referring here to the ominous rising bass phrase – it’s a bit more fleshed-out and developed throughout the score.

 

The cue continues in various (likely edited) directions, before a triumphant rendition of the Rebel Fanfare erupts at 2:40. Other theme appearances are a lively and triumphant Poe’s Theme at 3:01, March of The Resistance at 3:17, an allusion The TFA ‘Falcon’/Chase theme at 4:20, orchestrated wonderfully, Battle of the Heroes at 6:15, and others (I think there may be a new Luke on the Island Theme that occurs at around 4:03).

 

Overall, the orchestration is absolutely stellar. Reminiscent of the end-reel action cues for TPM. Rich, detailed, colourful, and innovative. Shout-out to the Superman-esque bass ostinato! Very exciting track. The feel is dominant, urgent, frenzied and triumphant, told in Williams’ usual story-telling drama style.

02 Ahch-To Island

This track begins with The Jedi Steps theme introduced in TFA. The cue alludes to a fragment of Battle of the Heroes in the bass at 0:57. This cue is incidental, with various swells and developments. The orchestration sometimes uses colours Williams’ seemed to have previously reserved only for Potter or more whimsical/magical films. The cue builds up to a full, wonderful rendition of Rey’s Theme at 2:42. Luke on the Island Theme re-occurs in what I believe to be a clearer rendition at 3:35. Parts of the cue are slightly coloured akin to the mid-reels of RoTS (e.g. Anakin’s Betrayal), in my opinion.

03 Revisiting Snoke

Ominous underscore. Williams has got them monks again doing their thang. Expect tremolo swells, and relatively subtle renditions of Kylo Ren’s Theme (both parts) as well as The Imperial March. Again, some innovative orchestration here. Epic & lively ending involving Kylo Ren’s Theme.

04 The Supremacy

Starts with sleuthing underscore that develops gradually. March of the Resistance appears 0:48, which gets developed with increasing urgency. The cue becomes more frenzied, as Williams’ famous action 2-4-3-5-1 (minor) ostinato gets used excitingly. Great string-work develops, which is really a development on the Kylo Ren chase music established in TFA, and reminiscent of other Williams action cues (e.g. The Moon Rising in A.I.). The craftsmanship in the string writing is striking (a bugger to play, though).

 

The cue takes a turn at 2:03, where we hear Princess Leia’s Theme played over ominous, dissonant harmonies. Shortly after, we hear another, more uncertain and intimate solo harp rendition of Princess Leia’s Theme before the orchestra continues to boldly develop the narrative, interspersed with references to the Force Theme.

 

The cue ends with a fragment of Rey’s Theme.

05 Fun with Finn and Rose

The track begins with the first appearance of a gentle rendition of a fragment of Rose’s Theme. It’s a simple melody, but quite memorable, with a Celtic, feminine aesthetic that I felt Rey’s Theme also had.

 

At 0:52 we get a light-hearted rendition of the B section of The March of the Resistance, which develops a bit and involves the A part too. Princess Leia’s Theme re-appears with clarity at 1:35.

 

Overall, mostly incidental underscore here. Shout out to the innovative, fresh ending – where did that come from, Johnny?

06 Old Friends

The cue begins with a subdued rendition of The Force Theme, which gets a full play-out before the tone develops into something more light-hearted and impressionistic, with Luke’s Theme peppered in. Princess Leia’s Theme again appears delightfully and magically at 1:12.

 

The second half of the cue is more sparse, with a fragment of Rey’s Theme, ominous sounding gestures leading to Kylo Ren’s Theme, and more whimsical Williams story telling. At 3:00 the new Luke on the Island Theme returns.

 

Again, there is some wonderful eerie orchestration and colours here. I think it’s great that Williams is still innovating.

07 The Rebellion is Reborn

The cue begins with a lovely and full rendition of Rose’s Theme – triumphant and broad, before developing into a fragment of Rey’s Theme. The Luke on the Island Theme returns, interspersed with Rose’s Theme.

 

The track has an exciting and optimistic feel. It ends with a fantastic, bold, optimistic outro using Rose’s Theme. I imagine pushes the narrative forward very well.

08 Lesson One

Starts light with fluttering strings and winds, before a gentle performance of Rey’s Theme. The cue develops in interesting directions, making use of The Force Theme.

 

The cue becomes very dramatic at around 1:28 with an ominous ostinato-like figure being played by the strings. The cue swells to a gigantic, cliffhanging end.

09 Canto Bight

Begins with a lovely fanfare with some interesting harmonic stuff going on.

 

Prepare yourself for the source music which references Aquarela do Brasil, but don’t let the steel drums put you off. This track actually turns into something very creative, funny and funky – reminiscent of Jazzy stuff from Tintin, CMIYC, and The Knight Bus.

 

I love the boogie-woogie bass synth - it's coloured so amusingly. Pretty hilarious.

 

10 Who Are You?

The track begins mysteriously, with a mention to Rey's Theme. The tone becomes more ominous. More underscoring involving sparse, eerie gestures. Great dissonant harmonies and colours are crafted by Williams. At 2:10 the energy suddenly increases, starting with a short rendition of the Rebel Fanfare and Luke's Theme. 

 

11 The Fathiers

This is a fun action piece. I immediately pick up on a 'swashbuckling' feel here at the beginning, reminiscent to some of the Tin-Tin material. The cue is full of exciting gestures, horn rips, swirling violins, off-beat xylophone hits, healthy doses of Boom-Tzzz and rapid-fire trumpets. At 1:02 a fragment of Rose's Theme briefly appears. At 1:28 Rose's Theme appears again, but this time it really lifts magically and gets a chance to soar.

 

The track has a great energy - exciting, optimistic, almost whimsical in parts in a Potter-esque style. Williams effortlessly develops the narrative with his usual key changes and rhythmic variations. There's a lot going on here.

 

12 The Cave

Low harp-pedal and ominous gestures begin this dissonant cue, immediately creating an uneasy feel. The dissonances and timbres are slightly reminiscent of the Dagobah material from ESB, in my opinion. The cue continues for a while oscilating between moments of rising, orchestrationally-innovative gestures and eerie silences.

 

At 1:35 a flute solo emerges, non-vibrato, quite haunting - still and questioning. The cue proceeds with a kind of romantic string elegy with fragments of Rey's Theme, before arriving at a subdued ending.

 

13 The Sacred Jedi Texts

Begins with a plain rendition of The Force Theme, before transporting to a mysterious, questioning, swirling statement. Yoda's Theme appears briefly at 0:31, before a loud transitional fanfare. The Force Theme makes a loud, dramatic and desperate appearance 1:00, which I found to be very powerful. 

 

We hear a lovely string elegy at 1:43. Another stock appearance of The Force Theme a bit later.

 

The cue ends with the concert arrangement of Yoda's Theme at 2:39.

 

 

... more to come

 

Looking forward to part 2!

[Ricard 2,242]

And here's a YouTube playlist of the OST:

 

 

[Jay 37,258]

8 hours ago, Damien F said:

If people are saying that her theme doesn't sound like Star Wars its probable because her character is quite new for the franchise. I don't recall a major character as optimistic and lovely as her before. 

 

Yea, pretty much.

 

I'd say you can like or not like Rose's Theme, but Williams basically scored her appropriately.

[KK 3,307]

It's a decent theme. Works well enough in context. Just not especially remarkable.

[Jay 37,258]

Yea

[Balahkay 627]

I really like it. I just wish Williams wrote a proper concert arrangement of her theme. I'm surprised that he didn't considering how much it was used in the film.

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

Maybe because it is just a decent theme, not especially remarkable!!

 

.

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

3 minutes ago, someonefun124 said:

I really like it. I just wish Williams wrote a proper concert arrangement of her theme. I'm surprised that he didn't considering how much it was used in the film.

 

I also think Rose's theme would make a good concert arrangement. Maybe JW just didn't have time.

[Balahkay 627]

Maybe if he did write a 3 minute arrangement, people would think it was remarkable.

 

I remember when people were saying the same thing about Rey's theme... Unmemorable and unremarkable.

 

[Jay 37,258]

I'm surprised anyone would think that about Rey's theme, its such a great and classic theme.

[Balahkay 627]

Yes, it's really amazing! 

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

It's indeed very good!

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

These both themes were instant love affair in the cinema where I heard them for the first time!!!

[Tom 4,631]

I always enjoy the contradictory responses to new themes.  Rose's theme sounds like HP and Rose's theme sounds like Anakins or a major version of the Force Theme.  If it is the latter two, then it is SW by definition, right?  

 

I remember people complaining that Rey's theme was too Potterish.  Whether it is similar to HP or not, it is clearly now as much of a SW theme as any other (as Rose's will likely be by the end of IX). 

[Demodex 557]

 Rey's theme is pretty unremarkable and forgettable. When I heard it in the TLJ soundtrack I couldn't remember if that was it or not. 

[BloodBoal 7,538]

When I heard it in the TLJ soundtrack, I wondered what Fawkes' theme was doing here!

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

Rose's theme sounded a bit like a parody of a John Williams theme ala Turboman's theme from Jingle All the Way or David Newman's Galaxy Quest.

[DominicCobb 194]

After listening to the OST, this is definitely a great score, though some things have cemented in my mind about it. I feel pretty confident saying it's lesser than TFA, if for no other reason than it's so light on new themes (each film has had at least one new BIG theme, I guess for this it's Rose's but if that's the case it's the least of them, and a weird oversight on Williams's part considering the film itself). Still, I wonder if that's looking at it the wrong way. It's really TFA Part II and in that regard it is absolutely fabulous.

 

The reuse of the TFA main title is really annoying, though. And the end titles are undoubtedly a let down after TFA, definitely all over the place.

 

One thing I am worried about is the rest of the score. Will we ever actually get it? Considering how this film was spotted (nearly wall to wall), the OST is probably only a little more than half of it. The FYC is a dice roll, and then what? We only got a couple missing TFA cues from the home video release/video game. 

[BloodBoal 7,538]

Since the Disney Blu-Rays have bonus features with 5.1 audio (with the music clean on the rear channels), you can already count on that.

[Holko 9,491]

There's also the music from the deleted scenes we know was written and recorded, and probably a handful of alternates, so the OST may be less than half of everything recorded.

[Jay 37,258]

It's certainly less than half of everything recorded. yea

[DominicCobb 194]

2 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

Since the Disney Blu-Rays have bonus features with 5.1 audio (with the music clean on the rear channels), you can already count on that.

 

On TFA, though, how much did we actually get from the Blu-ray that didn't have sound effects? You Need a Pilot is the only completely clean one I can think of. A couple of my favorite cues are still in rough shape - the first half of The Plan is perfect but then that siren comes in and kills it, Landing at Lightspeed is ruined too. I can't really get past the SFX.

[Remco 685]

18 minutes ago, Demodex said:

 Rey's theme is pretty unremarkable and forgettable. When I heard it in the TLJ soundtrack I couldn't remember if that was it or not. 

 

The theme is presented more clear in TLJ than any version in TFA, where it was always a bit buried in sound effects. Major goosebumps when it first appeared in the movie. 

 

Regardless of your personal opinion of it, if you can’t recognize it after 2 years you’ve simply not taken the time to truly listen to it. 

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

If anything, rather than adding more new themes, John needs to kill some. It’s a bit of a leitmotif shitshow!

 

He no longer writes music! Just stitches themes together. 

[nightscape94 965]

Just seeing there's no director's quote in the booklet.  Lame.

[KK 3,307]

1 hour ago, Blumenkohl said:

He no longer writes music! Just stitches themes together. 

 

In the case of this score, I don't entirely disagree.

[filmmusic 1,822]

2 hours ago, someonefun124 said:

I really like it. I just wish Williams wrote a proper concert arrangement of her theme. I'm surprised that he didn't considering how much it was used in the film.

Yes, I wish too.

I think I may have listened to this (track 7) 10 times already, but the juxtaposition of this with the other theme, doesn't work very well for me.

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

Really???

[Fargo 297]

Rose's theme has been stuck in my head for the past two days, I think it's great and on par with Rey's theme. 

 

I still don't know what Dern's theme is or where it appears on album. I definitely didn't notice it in film. 

 

Only two new themes, right? 

[Chen G. 3,940]

There are probably two or three other small motifs somewhere in there. They might not even be on the album.

 

I really like the Rose material. I've yet to see how much presence it has in the film, though.

[Jay 37,258]

5 minutes ago, Fargo said:

Rose's theme has been stuck in my head for the past two days, I think it's great and on par with Rey's theme. 

 

I still don't know what Dern's theme is or where it appears on album. I definitely didn't notice it in film. 

 

Only two new themes, right? 

 

She doesn't have one, that was false early reports.

 

The only 2 major themes are the two that make up the concert arrangement: Rose's Theme and the new Luke / island theme

[Chen G. 3,940]

Shall we call the latter "A master and an apprentice" theme? 

[leeallen01 2,133]

1:28 Death Star Motif?

 

 

[Chen G. 3,940]

Methinks another case of temp track love.

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

2 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

1:28 Death Star Motif?

 

 

 

Oh no, they're building yet another death star...

[Jay 37,258]

10 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

Shall we call the latter "A master and an apprentice" theme? 

 

I dunno.  It first plays when Luke is doing stuff by himself (but Rey is watching), then when they're both together, then a third time when Rey's doing stuff by herself (but Luke is watching)

 

 

 

4 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

Oh no, they're building yet another death star...

 

Don't put it past JJ Abrams to do that in Ep 9!

[leeallen01 2,133]

We can call it the 'First place when Luke is doing stuff by himself (but Rey is watching), then when they're both together, then a third time when Rey's doing stuff by herself (but Luke is watching)' Theme. 

[filmmusic 1,822]

2 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

  It first place when Luke is doing stuff by himself (but Rey is watching), then when they're both together, then a third time when Rey's doing stuff by herself (but Luke is watching)

 

 

This sounded like a description of scenes from an erotic film!

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

2 minutes ago, Jay said:

Don't put it past JJ Abrams to do that in Ep 9!

 

Don't change a winning formula!

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

2 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

We can call it the 'First place when Luke is doing stuff by himself (but Rey is watching), then when they're both together, then a third time when Rey's doing stuff by herself (but Luke is watching)' Theme. 

 

What are they really doing by themselves? I'm curious 

[gkgyver 1,645]

3 hours ago, hornist said:

Maybe because it is just a decent theme, not especially remarkable!!

 

.

 

Finally you get it.

 

And I consider The Rebellion Is Reborn a concert suite. Just not a great one.

[Jay 37,258]

20 minutes ago, filmmusic said:

This sounded like a description of scenes from an erotic film!

 

 

 

17 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

What are they really doing by themselves? I'm curious 

 

This is a spoiler free thread, so:

 

 

It's introduced as Luke goes about his daily routine, before he's decided to help Rey.  It covers him swinging from one mountain cliff to another and getting some fish.  I don't remember the second time it plays, but the third time it plays is when Rey trains with Luke's lightsaber by herself, but Luke is watching from a distance.

[Joni Wiljami 1,206]

39 minutes ago, gkgyver said:

 

Finally you get it.

 

And I consider The Rebellion Is Reborn a concert suite. Just not a great one.

 

You must have noticed it was sarcasm. Two posts above, KK, idiot.

[Muad'Dib 1,800]

2 hours ago, Blumenkohl said:

If anything, rather than adding more new themes, John needs to kill some. It’s a bit of a leitmotif shitshow!

 

He no longer writes music! Just stitches themes together. 

 

Morricone has done the same thing all the freaking time.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

41 minutes ago, Jay said:

She doesn't have one, that was false early reports.

 

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

1 minute ago, Muad'Dib said:

 

Morricone has done the same thing all the freaking time.

 

Word. Nino Rota too.

 

Like even a classic score like Cinema Paradiso is essentially literally just extended concert like theme performances. There's basically no underscore to speak of at all.

 

Williams is atleast far far far far far far from that.