Jump to content

THE LAST JEDI - OST Album MUSIC Discussion (No Movie Spoilers)


Jay

Recommended Posts

No, he's referred to it that way multiple times over the years.

 

On another note, here's an excerpt from the film version of the end credits. Did it really have that awful edit between the TIE Fighter reprise and Rey's Theme? I don't remember that:

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why are there two people having a stroke in front of the screen?

2 hours ago, crumbs said:

And although the film seems light on new material upon first listen, there's at least 4 significant new ideas that I've picked up on:

  • Rose's Theme
  • Luke's Island Life Theme
  • New First Order Motif/Fanfare (first heard in Escape and reprised throughout the complete score)
  • Admiral Holdo's Theme (mostly unreleased)

I'm only at page 7 of this thread but these are just my initial thoughts.

 

 

Which is Haldo's theme? Can you point out a moment in the score?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

Which is Haldo's theme? Can you point out a moment in the score?

 

This theme, which is seemingly mostly unreleased:

 

28 minutes ago, filmmusic said:

Also, which is the new order motif?

 

Appears several times with this cool fanfare, some unreleased:

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You can't hear any relationship at all? 

 

The first motif is repeated early in the film in an unreleased cue, and the latter has a few variations later on to accompany that giant weapon.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/15/2017 at 7:26 PM, artguy360 said:

 is the new band music actually meant to be diegetic like the cantina band music or just an intentional stylistic shift?

 

There are no on-screen performers that I saw.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, filmmusic said:

Also I haven't listened to a Morricone score that has the intricate texture and orchestration of a Williams or a Goldsmith or a Horner etc. score.

This plays a part too, because these musical procedures take time to write.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

57 minutes ago, Muad'Dib said:

 

 

This is a great cue (didn't know that score/film), but still I wouldn't change my mind.

When I say intricate I mean mainly contrapuntal (contrary to homophonic which is this cue), like we would find in many parts in Hook, or eg the counterpoint in Arlington etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, crocodile said:

OK so I listened to the album three times now after watching the film twice.

 

Overall I like it. It has an amazing amount of vigour and enthusiasm. Williams hardly sounds his age. The OST is a nice summary of score's major ideas and moments (while missing some important moments). But I have to say there are some things that bother me still. One, there is WAY too much Force theme. And second, some of the sequences really lack coherence. They are extremely energetic, yes, but so incoherent sometimes. I am just baffled by some of transitions in the big battle sequences and end credits. Do you think it is because Williams had to conform his material to a constantly changing cut?

 

Karol

 

I think it's very possible since Williams was show an early cut of the film.  Also, the film itself is very chaotic and all over the place jumping from one scene to the next and from character to another within a single scene.  I noticed quite a few instances were building music had to be then silenced because the scene was over.  The music had to be very sharp and quick to fit the editing style.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's very much like Danny Elfman's Justice League in that respect. Just ever changing tempi and different ideas colliding with each other with very little consequence. Maybe it's just best to leave all films to Zimmer's and Junkie XL's as they can just cover up all the creases with warm blanker of their sound design? ;)

 

Karol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/14/2017 at 7:01 PM, TheUlyssesian said:

What's the rhythm in the last minute or so of The Spark.

 

It was used in the final trailer from 0:30 onwards.

 

 

So the trailer did debut new material from JW.

 

 

On 12/14/2017 at 7:17 PM, Jay said:

 

The Imperial March.

 

 

Is it though?

 

First of all having seen the film I think it cannot be the Imperial March because there is no context for it?

 

And secondly the main rhtym goes

 

C - G# - F in staccato terms and then

CC - G#G# - FF when it is more insistent.

 

The imperial march goes

 

F - F - FF - C# - G#F - C - G#F

 

If you pound out the last 3 repeating notes it is still

 

C# - G# - F which isn't quite the same as

  C - G# - F

 

Isn't it different enough to be almost called a new rhtym or motif?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Breadstick Basilisk said:

Is @Jay or anyone going to do a theme appearances/track analysis post or thread? Just curious. Hearing lots of repeated motifs and mini-themes; trying to track down where they are all found and who/what they likely represent. 

http://www.jwfan.com/?p=10287

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just out of curiosity, I checked the TFA OST and I'm assuming it may be the same with the other OSTs, but they don't list the actual instrumentalists in the Orchestra. I noticed Don Williams did the Timpani for The Last Jedi. How many other Star Wars scores (apart from Rogue One) has Don worked on?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, so I saw the movie yesterday and am listening to the OST as I’m writing this.

 

It was hard to pick up the new themes from watching the films. It really is a nostalgia trip musically! Much more than the movie, which is pushing Star Wars into new territory and pushing the new characters front and center.

 

As a first impression, without having heard the full soundtrack release, I think I’ll have a hard time telling the tracks from one another. It seems they all blend the themes for Kylo, Rey, Leia and The Force in endless variations.

 

That doesn’t make it a bad soundtrack though - in any way. Probably, a lot of these variations will end up being favorites of mine.

 

Oh, and Rebellion Is Reborn, which is playing now, seems fantastic!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Chen G. said:

What, in a fleeting mention in that interview, 15 years removed from Return of the Jedi?

 

There is no thematic material for Han, as a character. The love theme belongs more to the princess, musically.

 

Right. It's silly to say that a lush romance theme belongs to a character who is a swashbuckling intergalactic criminal with 'situational' ethics. The only way it works for Han at all is in conjunction with his relationship with Leia.

 

2 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said:

Is it though?

 

First of all having seen the film I think it cannot be the Imperial March because there is no context for it?

 

And secondly the main rhtym goes

 

C - G# - F in stucco terms and then

 

 

Playing stucco music is a skill I've never been able to master. The stuff gets everywhere, and before you know it everything is just covered with a brittle crust.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

42 minutes ago, BTR1701 said:

 

Right. It's silly to say that a lush romance theme belongs to a character who is a swashbuckling intergalactic criminal with 'situational' ethics. The only way it works for Han at all is in conjunction with his relationship with Leia.

 

 

Playing stucco music is a skill I've never been able to master. The stuff gets everywhere, and before you know it everything is just covered with a brittle crust.

 

Thanks for detecting the typo. : D

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Breadstick Basilisk said:

Is @Jay or anyone going to do a theme appearances/track analysis post or thread? Just curious. Hearing lots of repeated motifs and mini-themes; trying to track down where they are all found and who/what they likely represent. 

 

Here's part 1 of Jack's analysis of the OST:

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay I have to ask! It's driving me crazy. Where have we heard that brass run before? The one that happens just before the TIE-Fighter Attack music hits in 'Battle of Crait?' I swear it's from Empire, perhaps during the Hoth sequence?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

Okay I have to ask! It's driving me crazy. Where have we heard that brass run before? The one that happens just before the TIE-Fighter Attack music hits in 'Battle of Crait?' I swear it's from Empire, perhaps during the Hoth sequence?

 

That brass run? Right film, wrong cue. You're thinking of "To Hyperspace".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, BTR1701 said:

 

"Battle in the Snow" from EMPIRE prominently featured two grand pianos, pounding out that bellicose ascending and descending triplet figure that heralded the advancing Imperial walkers.

Yes I know; that wasn't my point. I was replying to the comment above mine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the midst of my third listen now!

 

Terrific score, needless to say. I love the prequel-esque action writing, from the ROTS-like heroic fanfares to the classic Quidditch/Anderton's Escape ostinato. I hope there will be more on the FYC. 

 

Rose's theme is beautiful; really struck me when I watched the film. The new island theme is cool as well - I love how it sounds similar to Rey's theme (the playful "intro chords" section of her theme). 

 

This score made a much better first impression on me than TFA, probably in part because I was already familiar with many of the themes. It was great to hear the old themes. I thought Ren's primary theme in particular was used to great effect, as well as of course the March of the Resistance (speaking of that theme, I did notice that one cue in the second half of the film was a direct copy of the Resistance base planning fugal stuff, which I loved - unfortunately it's not on the OST this time either). 

 

I thought the TIE Fighter Attack use was really effective. In the theater I was practically about to starting bobbing my head when its pounding beat started.

 

The source music was fun, although my favorite musical moment in that track has to be these awesome chords for when the city comes into view. I loved them as soon as I heard them in the theater. Sound like a Williams concert work!!

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/13/2017 at 1:23 PM, king mark said:

The sound quality seems above average too

I can't find my liner notes for TFA but the musician list for TLJ looks bigger than what I remember for TFA.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just saw the film and really enjoyed the score (no surprise).  I love the use and incorporation of retro themes from the original and prequel trilogies that felt further developed.  A prefer this mix to that of The Force Awakens.  Not quite as wet at the prequels and not quite as dry as The Force Awakens.  Some clear references to the dark side beckons and of course a lovely return to Princess Liea's theme.  Overall, very high quality and enjoyable action oriented score.  There might have been a few too many references to the Force theme (more is less with that theme) but that is a nitpick.  Some interesting instrumentation.  I thought I heard a contrabass clarinet which I am not sure was used in a previous JW Star Wars film.  I am listening to soundtrack now but one thing I thought while watching the film is there weren't many overt uses of synth or clusters.  (EDIT: Ok, listening to the soundtrack now, "Old Friends", there is a cluster...they are there).  Not too many polychords (two simulatenous tonalities) which were more prominent and part of the DNA of the original trilogy but of course plenty of extended harmonies (dominant 7, flat 6, etc) which is very much part of JW's style.  I think this score is more stylistically retro than The Force Awakens which is interesting since that film was quite retro.  For example, listening to track 4 "The Supremacy" at 1:20 those strings playing fast passages in octaves was common in the original trilogy but not really in The Force Awakens (as far as I recall). 

 

For example compare the strings here:

 

to these strings from ESB and you'll see they are cut from the same cloth:

 

 

This really does feel like a Star Wars score freshened up.  I am just loving it as I listen probably more so than The Force Awakens which I also thought was quite strong.

 

I kind of dig that these two films of the new trilogy are clearly directed by yougish fans of the original trilogy.  They use elements of the original but make it there own too.  Rain Johnson more so but JJ Abrahms had a very tough task to create the first non-Lucas Star Wars feature and he frankly did a better job on this than he did on Star Trek. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

33 minutes ago, karelm said:

Some interesting instrumentation.  I thought I heard a contrabass clarinet which I am not sure was used in a previous JW Star Wars film.

 

 

Oh, it's been used before. A quick check shows an Eb Contrabass Clarinet in:

 

ROTS: Yoda Falls/Boys Continue; Yoda to Exile; The Immolation Scene

ATOC: Zam's Dirty Trick

TFA: Jedi Steps & Finale

 

I'm sure there are many others but I don't have time to look through them all.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, probably more accurately was this was the first time I noticed it while watching the film.  As I listen to the score, there are many clusters which I mentioned not noticing in the film but I think what I meant was more like cluster progressions which now at half way through my post film listen I haven't heard.  Basically the "what the hell was that chord?" moments that I felt in ESB, ROTJ, WotW (yes, yes, different film) but I felt it was an important element of "that Star Wars sound".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm still just totally blown away by the opening cue. Surely top 2 for Star Wars openings ever? You can tell Williams is having way too much fun playing with his older themes right from the start.

 

It really redefines the way people will look at TFA, when they realise the themes were never meant to mature or really develop throughout that film, bar Rey and Poe. We all just expected another prequel scenario where he jettisons most of the older themes.

 

Wonder if the short turnaround played a role here. Less than twelve months between finishing TFA and starting TLJ.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, crumbs said:

And yeah, the last minute of The Spark has to be the most perfect combination of visuals, direction and music Williams has been involved with for well over a decade. I can't even describe how I felt watching this sequence unfold, after the most heartbreaking reappearance of Luke & Leia (first time in 34 years!). There is just no other living composer who could've written anything better for that scene; utter perfection right down to the last note.

 

To say the entire crowd was in awe watching this sequence would be an understatement. The level of engrossment in the theater was palpable, due in no small part to the music. I don't recall a single moment in TFA, not even Solo's death, with this level of filmic aspiration. Probably the only thing from TFA that comes close, so far as perfect synergy between music and images, would be Jedi Steps?

 

Well-said. I couldn't agree more. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, DarthDementous said:

dear god, that motif might be the most exciting, most Star Wars-y fanfare punch-the-air-fuck-yeah moment I've heard single the original trilogy. I can't state how much I love it, and when I think that it couldn't get any better it just builds to a crescendo - simply sublime.

TLJ is what I always wanted from a new Star Wars score. I wanted for it to sound fresh, exciting, propulsive and energetic but still just ooze Star Wars - and TLJ delivers on all those fronts for me. even the more I listen to Rose's theme in the concert suite 'The Rebellion is Reborn' it sounds like it could've easily been written for the OT, particularly how its treated so innocently instrumentation wise like Luke's theme - talk about a revitalisation!

I'd also like to draw attention to how much the end of 'The Spark' is what I so wanted that TFA was missing in that parade grounds sequence. where the music just goes so beautifully bombastic and dramatic to really heighten the sequence, and the building nature of it reminds me of a combination of the unreleased music for the parade grounds as well as the 'Chamber of Secrets' cue from well, the Chamber of Secrets.

I just know I'm in for a treat when my first experience of the score is positive and my love for it just keeps building on-top of that, what a great time to be a fan of John Williams!

 

Yes, yes yes to all of this! That motif in "Escape" is probably my favorite piece on the entire score. I wish it showed up more in the album.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.