John Williams' new HAN SOLO AND THE PRINCESS arrangement (Debuted 2018)

[ocelot 508]

Firstly, this is badly played. They aren't in tune in many places and not very in sync playing, so I can't wait for a really beautifully played and well balanced version to listen to. Structurally it is sound and beautifully arranged. 

 

I said this in another post. About a month or so after the passing of Carrie Fisher, they mentioned that Williams was writing a tribute for Princess Leia for the end titles. I bet this was it but they then decided to just include that little piano moment instead. 

[1977 1,743]

17 hours ago, Jay said:

 

Absolutely, yea.  I look forward to hearing it in Boston and Tanglewood!

 

Hopefully that means the rest of us will be able to hear a decent quality performance/recording on WKRB!

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

6 hours ago, ocelot said:

I said this in another post. About a month or so after the passing of Carrie Fisher, they mentioned that Williams was writing a tribute for Princess Leia for the end titles. I bet this was it but they then decided to just include that little piano moment instead. 

 

Agreed.

[crocodile 7,990]

10 hours ago, Philippe Roaché said:

My heart was pounding the whole time. It was the most erotic theme of the saga. Up until then, at least.

Across the Stars is such a sleazy and thirsty piece of music. You need a shower after listening to it. Pure filth!

 

Karol

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

The ominous bridge section is amazingly sexy.

[rough cut 1,714]

I just heard it the one time, but was it my imagination or did it have a lot of allusions to previous SW pieces...

 

I mean bits and pieces sound like TPM and AOTC. Or am I crazy?

[Chen G. 3,944]

Well, the prequels are very much the sound of contemporary Williams, so any new rendition of the theme will inevitably carry that sound. Also, Adams holds that Across the Stars alludes to Leia’s theme, to which the love theme is a close relative, indeed, and it also carries a similar sentiment to both those themes.

 

I don’t think there’s any real reference to something specific from the other episodes in there (except Leia’s primary theme, of course), though. It’s just stylistic similarities.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

I love the Eiger Sanction reference!

[Chen G. 3,944]

Actually, re-listening to it, there are portions that remind me of Rey’s theme. Although again, it doesn’t go any further than “female characters get feminine music.”

 

Logic would have him connect it to Kylo’s material, a-la Across the Stars in the end-credits and the Imperial March. But I’m more than fine with enjoying the theme for what it is.

[Amer 2,080]

As I said before, I find it uncanny than he didn't use any motif from Leia's theme. I just feel that its exclusion is to focus entirely on the Solo Character and this just might be the very new theme Williams was working on for SOLO. It has to be. If it is then expect this new arrangement to appear on the SOLO ost too!

 

And hopefuly Williams once done with Episode 9 will decide to do anew Anthology compilation album which would likely include this version too. but time will tell.

[pete 906]

Much as I'd love to hear new arrangements of it in a new score, I just can't see Williams using this in the Han Solo film.

 

I just have a faint hope that Williams decided to revisit a few themes for a new release of concert themes ala the Star Wars Trilogy CD released on Sony in 1990. Flag Parade please!

[Tom 4,640]

Yeah, I agree. I cannot see this actually being the new theme.  It just does not seem amenable to a kickass, hero version, which one would assume is what the new movie will require.  I would love to see a new 2cd release of concert themes, but I cannot see him doing this until IX is in the bag--at which point we might have run out of time. 

[Amer 2,080]

I'm sure the Han Solo theme motif could be reprised in some way in the score but its hard to tell at this point what it eventually may be. 

[King Mark 3,626]

you guys realize it took 20 years for Williams to make a third compilation of this themes and Keith Lockheart did one compilation.

 

The updated Han Solo and the Princess will probably be on a  City of Prague  or budget Japanese compilation, if were lucky to get a studio recording at all

 

my guess we'll be stuck with a concert bootleg/internet radio broadcast  for a loooooog time

 

There's some You Tube videos of the Cincinnati Pops performing TFA tracks...maybe we should keep an eye out for that too

[Chen G. 3,944]

5 hours ago, Amer said:

As I said before, I find it uncanny than he didn't use any motif from Leia's theme. I just feel that its exclusion is to focus entirely on the Solo Character and this just might be the very new theme Williams was working on for SOLO. It has to be.

 

ITS NOT HAN’S THEME.

 

If anything, it’s another theme for Leia, first, and a theme for her romance with Han, second. I wouldn’t be surprised if the timing of its unvailing has to do with Fisher’s death.

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

It's definitely the theme for Harry's wand.

[Giftheck 916]

I have no connection to the old one as I've never heard it, but I really like this arrangement and hope to hear an official recording of it someday.

[Amer 2,080]

3 hours ago, Chen G. said:

 

ITS NOT HAN’S THEME.

 

If anything, it’s another theme for Leia, first, and a theme for her romance with Han, second. I wouldn’t be surprised if the timing of its unvailing has to do with Fisher’s death.

Ironically Williams interview with Craig L.Byrds Published in the 1997 FSM magazine-Williams called it Han's Theme. Of course in the very same issue Lukas Kendall even wrote an dissertation that Han Solo doesn't have a theme. But this new arrangement here is devoid of Leia's theme thus making it uniquely rendering  it as Han's Theme. Come to think of its its the only motif we have for Han even though it represents a love theme between Han and Leia.

[Chen G. 3,944]

1 hour ago, Amer said:

Ironically Williams interview with Craig L.Byrds Published in the 1997 FSM magazine-Williams called it Han's Theme.

 

He didn't call it Han's theme, he mentioned "Solo's music". In that more broad sense, yes, the theme also applies to Han Solo, because its the theme of Leia's and his love affair. But it isn't "Han's theme", per se. Its really such a fleeting comment, and in an interview so far removed from the time of Williams' work on the first three Star Wars films, that you can't really read too much into it. The next sentence he says is: "it’s one thing really in my mind, a lot of it[...]You’d be testing my memory to ask me how I used them all and where [laughs]."

 

I get it, people really like Han Solo in the Empire Strikes Back and they marvel at the fact that Williams didn't dignify him with a theme. But all this re-interpertation of his work in order to find such a theme is getting a bit silly.

 

Musically, its so heavily based on Princess Leia's theme (itself a love theme of sorts) that there is really no point connecting it specifically to the character of Han Solo. If anything, its a secondary theme for Leia, first. Look at the way its used in the Last Jedi, as well as multiple other applications throughout the series: its used just as often (if not more) with the princess, herself, than it is with her and Han, or just Han. As I said, this new arrangment even reminds me at times of Rey's theme. Why? because both her and Leia are feminine characters and they get feminine music. Han Solo - not so much.

 

I think the cause for this new arrangment is Fisher's passing (which, if its true, would weaken your argument further), and it sure as hell can't be the new theme for Han Solo because, as it is, its the very same theme from Empire Strikes Back. Sure, its varied. But its the same leitmotif nonetheless. So, the fact that Williams is writing a new Han Solo theme that isn't this theme, is all the evidence we need to put this "Han's theme" nonesense to rest.

[Balahkay 627]

I've always wondered how Williams goes about who/what will get a theme.  I imagine directors/producers help with that decision as well.  Luke, Leia, Vader, Kenobi, Yoda, Emperor, Rey, Ren, etc. have themes.  Even the droids and Lando have musical identities in TESB.  But nothing for Han and Chewie, who are major characters in the saga. 

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

Chewie is just a sidekick who frankly isn't that important.

[Chen G. 3,944]

29 minutes ago, someonefun124 said:

I've always wondered how Williams goes about who/what will get a theme.  I imagine directors/producers help with that decision as well.  Luke, Leia, Vader, Kenobi, Yoda, Emperor, Rey, Ren, etc. have themes.  Even the droids and Lando have musical identities in TESB.  But nothing for Han and Chewie, who are major characters in the saga. 

 

Well, Lando doesn't have a theme for himself. Its the Cloud City theme. It doesn't follow Lado into Return of the Jedi, for instance. And the Droid motif is practically limited to Empire Strikes Back, so its not a very good example.

 

I don't think there is a rational. consistent method to who and what Williams writes and doesn't write themes for. Hell, even Howard I-write-a-theme-for-every-single-thing-I-see-on-screen Shore didn't write individual themes for, say, Pippin, or Elrond or (initially) for Gandalf the Grey.

[JackPat 0]

Is it just me, or does this reference Liesel's theme from The Book Theif? That could be an interesting connection to make between Leia/Han and Liesel/Rudy.

[Balahkay 627]

55 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Chewie is just a sidekick which frankly isn't that important.

 

So are the droids and they got at least something even if it's only for one film, but as Chen said, there seems to be no reasoning.  Chewie gets the short end of the stick anyway.

 

47 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

Well, Lando doesn't have a theme for himself. Its the Cloud City theme. It doesn't follow Lado into Return of the Jedi, for instance. And the Droid motif is practically limited to Empire Strikes Back, so its not a very good example.

 

I don't think there is a rational. consistent method to who and what Williams writes and doesn't write themes for. Hell, even Howard I-write-a-theme-for-every-single-thing-I-see-on-screen Shore didn't write individual themes for, say, Pippin, or Elrond or (initially) for Gandalf the Grey.

 

I associate the Cloud City theme with Lando since it works for his character and also because he runs the city.  It makes sense it doesn't follow him into ROTJ since he ditched Cloud City in TESB but I'm sure Williams logic was different at the time.  My point with the droids was that they were given their own musical identity even if it was for one film.  Solo basically shares a theme with Leia.  As you said, there's no rhyme or reason it seems.  In most instances, I suppose to comes down to what inspires Williams when he sees the film.

[1977 1,743]

1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Chewie is just a sidekick which frankly isn't that important.

 

Chewie didn't even get a medal.

[Chen G. 3,944]

12 minutes ago, someonefun124 said:

 I suppose to comes down to what inspires Williams when he sees the film.

 

Beyond that, Williams isn't prone to writing a large number of themes. To his mind, a very dense score isn't terribly accessible. So, often the film will have more charaters and other important plot elements than Williams is ready to write themes for. It just so happens that within this self-imposed constriction, he didn't get around to writing a theme for Han.

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

29 minutes ago, JTWfan77 said:

 

Chewie didn't even get a medal.

 

I guess they will make a standalone film to explain this important detail.

[1977 1,743]

1 minute ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

I guess they will make a standalone film to explain this important detail.

 

Stop giving them ideas!

[mstrox 6,647]

They already addressed it in-canon, so they won't conflict with it now!  https://www.amazon.com/Star-Wars-Chewbacca-Gerry-Duggan/dp/0785193200

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

They're just being racist towards wookies.

[Faleel 5,342]

8 hours ago, someonefun124 said:

I've always wondered how Williams goes about who/what will get a theme.  I imagine directors/producers help with that decision as well.  Luke, Leia, Vader, Kenobi, Yoda, Emperor, Rey, Ren, etc. have themes.  Even the droids and Lando have musical identities in TESB.  But nothing for Han and Chewie, who are major characters in the saga. 

Threepio potentially had a horn motif related to him in ANH.

[The Five Tones 302]

It's gorgeous. Definitely some Golden Age nostalgia (vaguely a la Sabrina etc), but also bittersweetness related to all things sequel trilogy including Fisher's passing. The final five-note variation in the climax sounds a bit Across the Stars with its resigned natural minor feel. I think this will grow on me, let's hope he commits it to recording in his time left, or at least supervises. I wanted to like the Marion arrangement more than I did, I don't think he was inspired beyond the gesture of doing it. This feels like he was on a roll, maybe with an idea for a Fisher tribute or farewell to the characters that didn't fit onscreen... thus the beauty of concert arrangements.

[crumbs 14,305]

I wonder if this was his tribute piece to Carrie, potentially recorded during the TLJ sessions but unused?

[Oomoog the Ecstatic 314]

It's not bad or anything but I've heard his styles like this over a thousand times. Not sure what the fuss is over.

 

I'm in the mood for something novel and masterful, yet strange and fast.

[Score 770]

17 hours ago, someonefun124 said:

I've always wondered how Williams goes about who/what will get a theme.  I imagine directors/producers help with that decision as well.  Luke, Leia, Vader, Kenobi, Yoda, Emperor, Rey, Ren, etc. have themes.  Even the droids and Lando have musical identities in TESB.  But nothing for Han and Chewie, who are major characters in the saga. 

 

 

As far as I remember, Chewie is nearly always seen with Han (they form a sort of "a single character") and, when he is not with him, he is together with other more important characters (Leia, Luke) trying to save Han. So, there is nothing that identifies him enough as a separate entity to warrant him a theme of his own.  

 

In the case of Han, this theme we are talking about works as both his own theme and the theme for his love relation with Princess Leia, since most of times they appear together (so, there is no need to use two separate themes), or Leia is trying to save Han (so, it's appropriate to use this theme, whatever we want to call it), or else Han is displaying his skills independently of the Princess (escape from Hoth, end of Asteroid field - after that, the love relation starts and there is no more distinction). It just makes no sense to consider this theme as either Han's theme or the love theme, since the two functions cannot be distinguished from a certain point on. If one really wanted to make this pointless distinction for the sake of giving a single name to this theme, then in my opinion it should be Han's theme, since it is sometimes used independently of the Princess, but never independently of Han, as I have expressed in another thread. 

  

 

[Chen G. 3,944]

It’s used with the princess and independently of Han: see The Last Jedi, or it scoring Leia’s attempts at retrieving Han’s effigy or her distraught when it is taken at the end of Empire.

 

From a musical standpoint, the theme has nothing to do with Han, specifically. If anything, it’s a secondary Leia theme. The first lengthy statement of it just about grows out Princess Leia’s theme.

[Score 770]

25 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

It’s used with the princess and independently of Han: see The Last Jedi, or it scoring Leia’s attempts at retrieving Han’s effigy or her distraught when it is taken at the end of Empire.

 

I have not seen TLJ yet, unfortunately, so I have to postpone giving my opinion on this, however "it scoring Leia’s attempts at retrieving Han’s effigy" and "her distraught when it is taken at the end of Empire" are exactly instances of what I was saying: even when Han is not there, it scores stuff that has something to do with Han. Always (at least, in the movies that I've seen). From a certain point on, you just cannot distinguish the two applications. I'm not saying that this theme has nothing to do with the love affair, of course it has, I'm saying that it makes no sense to distinguish the two functions as a theme for Han and as a theme for the love relation. It would make sense only if there were two different themes, one used for Han before the love relation, and one after it starts. Or if Han was not scored at all with a specific theme before the relation. As a matter of fact, he was scored with this theme. ANH of course, does not count, since JW had not established yet a more systematic leitmotivic structure for the saga (even Darth Vader gets his full individual theme in TESB, which replaced the smaller motives used for the Empire in ANH).  

 

25 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

From a musical standpoint, the theme has nothing to do with Han, specifically. If anything, it’s a secondary Leia theme.

 

But this is your opinion. What is it based on, since there is no other theme for Han? Saying that the theme has nothing to do with Han is logically equivalent, in this case, to saying that you would have scored Han in a different way. Honestly, I'm quite happy about how JW handled it (it's one of my very favourite themes from the saga).  

 

25 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

The first lengthy statement of it just about grows out Princess Leia’s theme.

 

... because both characters are there! Or, because JW is foreshadowing the yet-to-come love relation! As you prefer, but there are no "right" and "wrong" interpretations about this. 

 

You see what I mean? Almost any instance of that theme can be interpreted in both ways, so the distinction does not exist in JW's mind. Otherwise, there would be two different themes. What matters is how the theme is used, and it is used in both ways.

 

 

[Chen G. 3,944]

19 minutes ago, Score said:

From a certain point on, you just cannot distinguish the two applications.

 

Three applications: Han, the princess, and them as a couple. And yes, they are inseparable.

[Jay 37,323]

I like this arrangement a lot.  It's a bit melancholy though, almost like its supposed to be an expression of Lei's reaction to Han dying (lots of sadness/melancholy, but still remembering the good adventurous times) and/or JW's expression of Carrie dying.

 

It's amazing how wholey original it is (for a while you'd forget its the HS&TP theme or even a Star Wars piece) for the most part, until it sounds exactly like the end of TESB for a little bit.

 

I really want to hear a proper, polished performance recorded in a studio.

[King Mark 3,626]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

 

I really want to hear a proper, polished performance recorded in a studio.

 this shot up to the top of my list of things I want

 

It's one of my favorite Williams themes of all time and I have the feeling this performance is not the exact balance that a Williams conducted performance would have.The recording is also very tinny (although above average for an audience recording)

[Cerebral Cortex 3,357]

2 hours ago, Jay said:

I like this arrangement a lot.  It's a bit melancholy though, almost like its supposed to be an expression of Lei's reaction to Han dying (lots of sadness/melancholy, but still remembering the good adventurous times) and/or JW's expression of Carrie dying.

 

It's as if the Gerhardt arrangement is the state of their relationship in ESB and this arrangement is the state of their relationship now.  

[Bespin 8,480]

It's only at the state of a composer who is bored. Please give him another Indiana Jones to score quick!

[crumbs 14,305]

1 hour ago, Cerebral Cortex said:

It's as if the Gerhardt arrangement is the state of their relationship in ESB and this arrangement is the state of their relationship now.  

 

Spot on! This piece seems reflective of the relationship's ultimate fate, as discovered in TFA and TLJ. Melancholic and semi-forlorn romanticism, knowing their union would ultimately result in Han's death

Spoiler

(arguably Luke's as well)

and creating a son who would bring such destruction and pain to the galaxy.

 

And with Carrie now passed, this feels like Williams' elegiac reinterpretation of the theme. It's touchingly bittersweet; I felt the same listening to his recent Face of Pan revision, which sounds like his tribute to Robin Williams. Do we know when he wrote that one?

[1977 1,743]

On 08 February 2018 at 10:28 AM, Chen G. said:

 

ITS NOT HAN’S THEME.

 

If anything, it’s another theme for Leia, first, and a theme for her romance with Han, second. I wouldn’t be surprised if the timing of its unvailing has to do with Fisher’s death.

 

Agree. HSatP has also become a sort of tragic Solo family theme (gets used a lot when Han / Leia / Luke discuss Ben Solo's fall).

 

11 hours ago, Jay said:

I really want to hear a proper, polished performance recorded in a studio.

 

Let's start a petition!

[Quintus 5,399]

I've always considered it to be the music for Han and Leia and I ignore other suggestions. With that said, I don't really think of it as being their love theme either. It's simply a secondary theme for the drama of Star Wars with two of its main protagonists as its focus. 

[King Mark 3,626]

that theme gets used a lot in action scenes in TESB. It's sort of an all purpose theme in that movie

[crumbs 14,305]

Well, Williams himself doesn't consider it a love theme, so...

[Jurassic Shark 12,033]

It's not a love theme, it's an erotic theme.

[Chen G. 3,944]

5 hours ago, king mark said:

that theme gets used a lot in action scenes in TESB. It's sort of an all purpose theme in that movie

 

Because its Han and Leia's love theme, it comes to be the theme of their entire storyline.

[King Mark 3,626]

Now we need a concert version of Willie's theme from ToD