Nick Parker 3,040 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 29 minutes ago, publicist said: 'Rebellion is Reborn' is a great stand-alone piece. It's only the people who can't separate it from the movie that perceive the themes not working together. Musically i see absolutely no problem. Interesting that you consider it great, I took you as being more critical of Williams' recent stuff. What do you like about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 It's just a good, stately and elegantly written cue (and wins especially through the combination of the more urging rebellion theme with the sweet and optimistic counter-theme). I'm not that much of a fan of the composting in TLJ but if anything, it shows Williams having fun, even if that means that he has stopped thinking beyond the legacy of these scores after 2005 (both new scores are rather amalgams of the old 6 parts, with 'Rey's Theme' the only really noteworthy new inclusion). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Rebellion is Reborn is a very fun concert piece. It has a warm, broad, optimistic melody contrasted by a driving rhythmic motif with pretty frenzied string writing. It all builds together to a wonderful conclusion. Jurassic Shark 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,024 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 I've gotta say I've been quite taken by The Adventures of Han after watching the film. It's definitely an earworm now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artguy360 1,843 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Rebellion is Reborn is also much more tightly constructed. Listening to the Boston Pops concert, it is immediately clear how much more refined RiR is compared to AoH. That's not to say that I dislike AoH but it is a little messy. The opening has no relation to the rest of the piece, some of it's climaxes aren't built up in a satisfying way, and the false ending has a The Adventures of Mutt kind of feel to it even though the rest of the piece doesn't have that same kind of romp fun tone to it. BrotherSound 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,943 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 2 hours ago, publicist said: It's only the people who can't separate it from the movie Well, this is film music, you know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Jeez.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviazn 273 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 3 hours ago, artguy360 said: Why are you constantly cringing? Do you have some kind of facial tic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aescalle 122 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 The Rebellion is Reborn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewy 2,372 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 The Adventures of Han Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,024 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 The Rebellion of Han Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewy 2,372 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 3 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said: The Rebellion of Han Much better title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 The Adventures Reborn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,024 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 The Misadventures of Lady Proxima Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 In Duo: A Star Wars Story, I hope we meet her sister Centauri. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 I voted for Rebellion is Reborn. I love how the two melodies play off each other and trade back and forth, doesn't feel slapped together at all for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 32 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: I voted for Rebellion is Reborn. I love how the two melodies play off each other and trade back and forth, doesn't feel slapped together at all for me. Yes. Its a superb tour da force of the films new themes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balahkay 627 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Has Williams ever combined two film themes into a single concert arrangement before (aside from end credit suites, of course)? Is this new for him? I really don't recall... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 3 minutes ago, someonefun124 said: Has Williams ever combined two film themes into a single concert arrangement before (aside from end credit suites, of course)? Is this new for him? I really don't recall... The original "Han and the Princess" did this with Leia's theme Falstaft 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Technically Raiders March consists of two themes. It was Spielberg who advised JW to just use both. Josh500 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,024 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 So does the Superman theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Just now, Jurassic Shark said: So does the Superman theme. The Superman theme has the love theme too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,024 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 24 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said: The Superman theme has the love theme too Indeed. It has too many themes! Just cut a few. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Stefancos said: Technically Raiders March consists of two themes. It was Spielberg who advised JW to just use both. Not to mention that the concert arrangement includes Marion’s theme in the middle. 2 hours ago, Not Mr. Big said: The original "Han and the Princess" did this with Leia's theme Yes, I love that, though I would say it is a quote of “Leia’s Theme” within a piece wholly dedicated to “Han Solo and the Princess”. It’s not an arrangement of two themes in the same way as RiR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 The way Williams bounched the different themes around is pretty unusual though. One could argue he does something similar with Rey's Theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Five Tones 302 Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Well, they appear in my SW playlist back to back because I put RiR at the end of TLJ as it didn't fit anywhere else for me. It feels like one of the end title medleys. Otherwise, kind of apples to oranges but I prefer listening to AoH. On 5/26/2018 at 4:33 AM, filmmusic said: I think the theme itself, the one at 1.41-1.57 with that harmony, is the best action theme in the tonal language Williams has written since...Duel of fates I think. I love that chord at 2:59, classic high flying Williams. The theme is tonal, but it doesn't have a set harmony. What happens at 1:41 etc. is a possible harmonization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 The Rebellion Is Reborn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,624 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 On 5/29/2018 at 11:43 AM, Stefancos said: Technically Raiders March consists of two themes. It was Spielberg who advised JW to just use both. I'm a bit doubtful about this spielberg claim I just see the middle theme as the bridge, like he did in Star Wars and Superman and even Olympic Fanfare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holko 9,499 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 You can find it in multiple interviews: JW wrote two options for the main theme, and Stephen said these are both great, why not use both? So one became the main theme, the other the bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,943 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 On 29.5.2018 at 6:43 PM, Stefancos said: Technically Raiders March consists of two themes. It was Spielberg who advised JW to just use both. Yeah, but since they were both alternates of each other, they end up serving the same leitmotivic purpose so you can't really think of them as two separate themes (in the leitmotivic sense) anymore. As Spielberg himself said: one is the main theme, and the other is the bridge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Five Tones 302 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 6 hours ago, Chen G. said: Yeah, but since they were both alternates of each other, they end up serving the same leitmotivic purpose so you can't really think of them as two separate themes (in the leitmotivic sense) anymore. As Spielberg himself said: one is the main theme, and the other is the bridge. Spielberg is right of course, but why not consider them Indy A and Indy B just as with Luke? The B seems to have its own life in cues like Desert Chase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,943 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 But, having been conceived as an alternate to the main theme, it doesn’t have its own narrative purpose. In Luke’s case, the secondary theme is more lyrical and evokes his adventures and perhaps even his softer side. With Indy it’s just an Indy theme, and than...another one. So there's no narrative justification to refer to them as separate leitmotives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Five Tones 302 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 Perhaps, but in this case it's the harder working of the two themes, more Indy on the ropes. The graceful 3-4-5 opening of Indy A becomes a more angular 3-5-4 in B (or vv in terms of composing timeline). Indy A is 8 measures long (10 with the ending), and Indy B 14 measures. Both have strong melody but also a strong harmonic progression, and the B has a more push and pull character on both counts. I guess given my comments about Luke I'm still going to say I see it ultimately as one piece with a main part and a long, complex bridge, while happily inviting debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,943 Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 No argument, although it is interesting subject to discuss. Like I said elsewhere, those longer themes are tricky to dissect (from the standpoint of a leitmotif-oriented analysis) and there's a lot of subjectivity there. The Five Tones 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted June 1, 2018 Author Share Posted June 1, 2018 18 hours ago, Chen G. said: ....and there's a lot of subjectivity there. I think this is all subjectivity. There's no accounting for taste, after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTenma 116 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I voted for 'The Rebellion is Reborn', I enjoy both themes there more. I think that Rose Theme is quite good and very close to the Williams of the 80s style. I also like 'The Adventures of Han', that also has a 80s-adventure-theme-flavour but... It hasn't grow on me yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrScratch 294 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 On 6/1/2018 at 6:10 AM, DrTenma said: I voted for 'The Rebellion is Reborn', I enjoy both themes there more. I think that Rose Theme is quite good and very close to the Williams of the 80s style. I also like 'The Adventures of Han', that also has a 80s-adventure-theme-flavour but... It hasn't grow on me yet. This. DrTenma 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crlbrg 381 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 On 5/26/2018 at 10:33 AM, filmmusic said: I think the theme itself, the one at 1.41-1.57 with that harmony, is the best action theme in the tonal language Williams has written since...Duel of fates I think. And the harmony in 0:57-1:12 The Five Tones 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Five Tones 302 Posted June 5, 2018 Share Posted June 5, 2018 20 minutes ago, carlborg said: And the harmony in 0:57-1:12 Yes - a bit of a variation on the B theme, what Falstaff (Lehman) in the Adventures of Han thread called a "free episode." crlbrg 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellaeon 593 Posted June 13, 2018 Share Posted June 13, 2018 Han Hero Theme Han Searching Theme Each theme fares so much better singly. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted June 18, 2018 Author Share Posted June 18, 2018 So far, 82 people have voted.... And it's very close. But I'd say Han is the winner here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 I disagree with your conclusion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted June 18, 2018 Author Share Posted June 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, Stefancos said: I disagree with your conclusion I disagree with the majority too. I personally like Rebellion more. But this is what the people have voted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 I disagree that this is what people voted. Its obviously rigged! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted June 18, 2018 Author Share Posted June 18, 2018 Just now, Stefancos said: I disagree that this is what people voted. Its obviously rigged! Trump won. And now this. Obviously, Russian hackers are at it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 No, i think Jason alters poll results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted June 18, 2018 Author Share Posted June 18, 2018 Just now, Stefancos said: No, i think Jason alters poll results. I'm just surprised that 82 people even voted in this poll... Seems like a whole lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 You are even more blind than I thought you were if you believe 82 people voted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh500 1,615 Posted June 18, 2018 Author Share Posted June 18, 2018 10 minutes ago, Stefancos said: You are even more blind than I thought you were if you believe 82 people voted! So how many did vote, according to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted June 18, 2018 Share Posted June 18, 2018 Open your eyes! Its there for you to see if you want to! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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