Luka 242 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 For me, a score that doesn't have at least one theme that I can recognize in multiple tracks usually doesn't appeal to me. I find the come back of themes so interesting. Especially when it's arranges a little bit different each time. But sometimes, I also feel like some scores don't have enough material and sound all the same throughout. What do you guys prefer, a score that has themes that come back more often or less often? Where is the balance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,480 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 Melodies and leitmotives all the way! Well that’s why I love John Williams’ music. Even in his more little scale score, there’s always interesting things in the variation of themes. Fabulin and Luka 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, Bespin said: Melodies and leitmotives all the way! Well that’s why I love John Williams’ music. Even in his more little scale score, there’s always interesting things in the variation of themes. He was so proud of his variation, he had the Jurassic Park credits play twice on the album! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chen G. 3,948 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 More than eight recurring statements of a theme per hour is around about where it seems to get repititive for me; but it also depends on how varied the material is, and whether it’s counterbalanced by other material. The best works have two memorable themes, so that no one theme is relied upon too much. Luka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datameister 2,041 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 Balance is indeed the key word for me. My favorite scores tend to encompass a wide range of emotions that are presented in a fairly consistent musical "language", drawing on at least a few different themes. Something like Raiders would be a good example. You've got action music, horror material, triumphant marches, a love theme, misterioso passages, tongue-in-cheek mickey mousing, you name it. But it all fits together as a very coherent experience, and although there 6 or 7 major musical ideas that are used frequently, the settings are all very unique, and the music between breaks things up further. Luka and Jay 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 Baby's Day Out by Bruce Broughton is an unfortunate example. Delightful score, easily one of Brucey's best themes...but holy cow, will the complete score released by Intrada make your ears go numb. Very few scores can carry 80 minutes, and this isn't one of them. What was frustrating is that there wasn't an OST in the first place, so it's difficult to spot just how Bruce would have properly presented this had he the chance for an OST playlist. I managed to find a good balance at 49 minutes myself. Otherwise, you'd be doomed to hear the same two themes over and over and over and over... Same issue with Broughton's The Rescue, though I only felt the need to take off eight minutes from that one. Luka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Luka 242 Posted October 17, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2018 After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... Oh, sorry, this is just how repetitive this score is, it got to my brain 😂 (And I'm only 1/4 in!!) Bespin, mstrox and The Illustrious Jerry 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 Carpenter scores are better off in compilation albums rather than individual releases. Similar can be said for Silvestri. Luka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick1Ø66 4,708 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 1 minute ago, Luka said: After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... You can say that again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Loert 2,511 Posted October 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2018 The word "repetitiveness" is very vague in the context of music. Is minimalism repetitive? Yes. But the idea behind minimalism is that sparse, yet noticeable changes in musical material make a greater impact than constant changes. So it makes little sense e.g. to take Glass' "Einstein on the Beach" and criticize it for being too repetitive and not sounding like a R. Strauss opera. In some ways this is like asking a painter "How much white is too much white?" or a writer "How much dialogue is too much dialogue?". There is no correct answer - if there were, it wouldn't be art. As for themes in music, I really do not care how many themes there are, or how often they are repeated. To me, the question of themes are at a level of analysis which is not really connected to the fundamental elements of music. There is both "good" and "bad" music which contains themes (or no themes) in all sorts of different ways. This is really more of a question relating to drama than to music. I enjoy both athematic music... and thematic music... ...as long as it's done right! Brundlefly, Will, Cerebral Cortex and 4 others 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,480 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 @Luka I love the first two Halloween movies (since my adolescence), but it never came to my mind to listen to their scores. Why? Well, it's obvious that it would be repetitive. I know the theme, it's enough. Luka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 The Indiana Jones theme tends to get on my nerves in large doses. I prefer to think of Short Round's theme in Temple of Doom as the main theme (hence I'm in no rush to own Raiders or Last Crusade's albums). Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Disco Stu 15,495 Posted October 17, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted October 17, 2018 I thought maybe this was more of a meta question about JWFan itself. Kasey Kockroach, SteveMc, Bespin and 2 others 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bespin 8,480 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 Just now, kaseykockroach said: The Indiana Jones theme tends to get on my nerves in large doses. I have to read the rules of the forum, but I'm pretty sure you CAN'T say that. Will and Chen G. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasey Kockroach 2,344 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, Bespin said: I have to read the rules of the forum, but I'm pretty sure you CAN'T say that. When other hero themes pop up in other scores, it's always HECK YEAH HERE WE GO WOO-HOO I'M PUMPED When I listen to ToD and the Indy theme pops up, it's more "Oh, yeah, time for this. Yep. Meh. Not feeling the power." I like the Indy scores, but the Raiders March is the least interesting aspect about them. I like pretty much everything surrounding that theme. 4 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: I thought maybe this was more of a meta question about JWFan itself. Wanna talk about Last Jedi? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Illustrious Jerry 3,356 Posted October 17, 2018 Share Posted October 17, 2018 On a recent note, The Landing from First Man has been commented on by some as repetitive. But if you listen close, it's an extremely layered track, with the strings prancing about the front, percussion keeping up the beat, and the whole orchestra weaving through each note so seemlessly. I think it's to beautiful to be too repetitive. I was was alos thinking about this mockery I heard of The Raiders March where instead of ending off the melody with: Ba-baba-ba Baba-ba Baba-ba Babba-ba-ba da It was: Ba-baba-ba Baba-ba Baba-ba Baba-ba Baba-ba Baba-ba Baba-ba Babba-ba-ba da Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 I will say I've grown an appreciation for scores that use "pieces" as a theme for someone or something rather than a melody to be shaped upon the situation at hand. I've said this before (sorry for being repetitve), but I consider using a theme and varying it over and over again to be very egregious; it can be a composer's very lazy crutch to add "coherence" and "identity" to a work. For example, this: Great melody, very effective. Okay, pretty cool, I guess. Were you really that afraid people would listen to this and say "Hey, this is incongruent with the score, I need more glue to know this is Twilight Princess"? I think a melody is a tool, not a prerequisite for music to be good, and when you slap it around so much, regardless of how "varied" it is, it cheapens it. SteveMc 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 6 hours ago, Luka said: After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... After writing this post, I ironically started listening to the original Halloween soundtrack by John Carpenter... Wait, what soundtrack are you listening to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Anyone else remember a thread where a guy said someone kept driving through his neighborhood cranking the Halloween theme? HP1 features Hedwig's theme a bit too much in the first act. It's like a pop song with a good hook but they just overuse it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Anything ever written by Hans Zimmer for any Nolan film ever. Luka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datameister 2,041 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 7 hours ago, kaseykockroach said: When other hero themes pop up in other scores, it's always HECK YEAH HERE WE GO WOO-HOO I'M PUMPED When I listen to ToD and the Indy theme pops up, it's more "Oh, yeah, time for this. Yep. Meh. Not feeling the power." I like the Indy scores, but the Raiders March is the least interesting aspect about them. I like pretty much everything surrounding that theme. Wanna talk about Last Jedi? IMO, Raiders is much more tasteful in its use of the march. I love TOD's score, but I certainly don't think of it as the best at using the Raiders March. The first film doesn't feature it quite as often, and the statements that are present are less zany and more...well, heroic. Its first big appearance as Indy escapes from Peru is nothing short of magical, IMO. Seconding the comment about Hedwig's theme in the first half of SS. Someone went a little crazy with their use of the trailer music in the temp track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpy 4,145 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Repetition is useful for reinforcing ideas or passages of music, but its applications are where it is tested. I never followed the criticism of the repetitive usage of Hedwig's Theme in HP1 until I watched the film recently and thought 'oh god, enough is enough Johnny!' sometimes I can give a pass for the repetitive usage of leitmotifs, and that might have something to do with whatever mood I'm in when watching the film or listening to the score, other times it's like a sore thumb - where the variations aren't varied enough or the music is tracked again and again (Doctor Who editors I'm looking at you). How much of repetition is informed by the choices of the composer or the filmmakers? Chen G. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,336 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 20 hours ago, Horner's Dynamic Range said: Anyone else remember a thread where a guy said someone kept driving through his neighborhood cranking the Halloween theme? Deja Vu On 11/1/2014 at 12:06 AM, Horner's Dynamic Range said: Does anyone remember the thread where someone was freaking out because some guy was driving around the neighborhood cranking the theme from Halloween? Luka and Bespin 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 18 hours ago, gkgyver said: Anything ever written by Hans Zimmer for any Nolan film ever. Posts like this from gkgyver are too much repetitiveness. Luka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Anyone else then?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Anyone else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 2 hours ago, TGP said: Posts like this from gkgyver are too much repetitiveness. Only that I'm the catchy theme, in contrast to your plodding ostinato figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 It's true; I suffer from gkgyver earworms constantly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,510 Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 . Luka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 Duel of the Fates was the most requested music video on TRL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 2 hours ago, gkgyver said: Only that I'm the catchy theme, in contrast to your plodding ostinato figure. I would not liken myself to a catchy theme by any stretch but you are certainly far more the plodding ostinato these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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