The Doctor Who Thread.....

[Greg1138 3]

Yeah - SLIGHTLY sticky one for the good Doctor.......

....but the real question is.......

....will you Vote Saxon?

[John Crichton 4]

So he's been revealed already, has he?

Yes - and if ever Oscars were given out for acting on the small screen, Derek Jacobi would deserve one for that performance..........absolutely, gobsmackingly incredible.........and you will LOVE this season........even the low points have been great........

BTW - it was a little unnecessary, but I loved the way they worked a bit of the "Torchwood" backstory into this episode....as well as some of the music from it!

The official site has a short clip of the regeneration, I couldn't help but watch.

Buuuuuuuuut, there is one small nitpicky thing I have to bring up here. One of my favorite things about the new series is how loyal they've been to original series continuity, and it was clearly established that: a. Time Lords are not immortal, they have 13 lives and then they do die; and b. The Master has used up all his lives and has had to go to extreme measures to stay alive (as in The Keeper of Traken). So, how did the Master regenerate? I'm not picky about what the explanation is, as long as there is one. Just a quick one, knock it out, get on with the story, and I'm happy.

[Greg1138 3]

Good point well made....

[John Crichton 4]

Well Greg hasn't popped in here yet so I guess I'll go first this time. Thanks to *mumble cough* I've seen both the last 10 minutes of Utopia (all that mattered) and all of The Sound of Drums. Holy freaking crap. The Master's return could not have been more perfectly handled. Once again perfect continuity with the original series (even the correct Time Lord costumes!) while developing the characters in new and interesting ways, and the questions posed in my earlier anal fanboyish post were all answered in a single sentence. David Tennant and John Simm have great chemistry. And Simm is a very different Master, not cold, calculating and reserved, but exuberant, relishing every bit of his evilness, and at times really very funny, and it fits perfectly well with where the character is now. There's lots, lots more I could say but I'll wait until I've absorbed it all a bit more, but for now, wow...just wow.

[Greg1138 3]

Yep - you got your questions answered nicely, didn't you?? A surprisingly good explanation actually, and it was great to see a modern version of the the High Council uniform - Gallifrey was a fantastically realised sequence full stop....The Sound of Drums was a great episode....not as good as some this season, but John Simm's psychotic performance and some unexpectedly delightful scenes (The Doctor and friends discussing the problem over a bag of chips, The Master and The Doctor holding a "summit" via mobile phone, the discovery by the Doctor that Captain Jack works for the Torchwood Institute and several others) tipped this waaaaay over the standard of many episode from previous seasons....and a wonderful cliffhanger to boot......

John - when you say the last 10 minutes of Utopia is all that matters, I urge you to get hold of the rest - there is some backstory in there regarding Captain Jack which I have a feeling is going to become very relevant sooner or later....plus it's a thundering good episode anyway!!!!!

Here's looking forward to the finale....

Greg

[John Crichton 4]

John - when you say the last 10 minutes of Utopia is all that matters, I urge you to get hold of the rest - there is some backstory in there regarding Captain Jack which I have a feeling is going to become very relevant sooner or later....plus it's a thundering good episode anyway!!!!!

Well, all that matters Master-wise anyway, which is the main thing I'm concerned about right now. I am looking forward to seeing the rest, but I can wait until it airs here. Hopefully I'll be able to get a hold of Last of the Time Lords in the same manner, there's no way I can wait until we get to it on Sci-Fi.

A few other thoughts;

- I loved the way the Master's wife was realized. I expected her to fill a very cliched role, that she would be totally ignorant of who/what he is and what he was doing and would end up betraying him somehow. Instead, she not only knows all about him but is 100% behind him as he works to exterminate the human race! [M. Night Shamaylan]"What a twist!"[/M. Night Shamaylan]

- I love love love the theme that Murray Gold has composed for the Master, not so much realizing the drumbeat but the psychotic strings he puts underneath it in really key moments. The last part of Utopia is challenging The Impossible Planet/The Satan Pit (an absolute masterpiece score in an old-style Hollywood vein) as my favorite Who score so far.

- BUT, who's frelled up idea was it to have that rock song playing at the key point of the whole episode? Ugh.

And I've decided to have myself a little classic series Master marathon while all this is going on too. I'm finishing up Terror of the Autons tonight, and have The Mind of Evil, The Deamons, and The Sea Devils on tap.

[Richard Penna 3,676]

Well it's ended again, and what a finish! Some very nice twists, again great music, and a nice little laugh at the end... Captain Jack...The Fa..?? hehehehehe

[Quintus 5,399]

As a Brit, why couldn't I care less about Dr Who? I almost feel it's my duty to like the thing, but no.

[Richard Penna 3,676]

[John Crichton 4]

Well thanks to a certain popular video sharing website I've been able to see Last of the Time Lords before the Beeb had it taken down (like The Sound of Drums was less than a day after I watched it). My only real complaint is that I wish there was more focus on the Doctor and the Master and less on Martha and her family, but I know that RTD was wrapping up Martha's series-long arc there so I understand why he did it that way. The first part of the episode was, ...well it wasn't bad, ...what's the word I'm looking for? Pedestrian? Ordinary? Very likely just a casualty of high expectations, it may improve with subsequent viewings.

Well I suppose I'd better spoiler font this paragraph, just in case:

But it wasn't until the last 20 minutes or so that it really became something special. The scenes between the Doctor and the Master were just beyond splendid (see my sig), the scene where the Master refuses to regenerate in the Doctor's arms is Tennant's best performance to date, he had me in tears. Seriously. More classic series continuity references, great, and I like where both Jack and Martha are going. And what a total lack of a happy ending for the Doctor, if anything it was the most tragic outcome possible. And I like the bit with the ring at the end, the Master is too great a character to get rid of, good move to get something in there that could lead to another resurrection explanation.

Oh, and will someone please tell Murray Gold that just because it's the finale that doesn't mean that the orchestra is supposed to all-out blare through the whole episode. This isn't a Bruckheimer film for pete's sake. The cue over the funeral pyre was just wrong, wrong, wrong.

And now, starting this Friday, I can see Series 3 from the beginning. Sci-Fi is airing both The Runaway Bride and Smith and Jones in a 2 1/2 hour block this Friday night, if there are any Americans other than me interested.

[Greg1138 3]

I've been avoiding this thread like the damn plague for 3 days!!! Only just got to see the episode......and Mr Crichton, I think you're absolutely spot on.....

After the first quarter of an hour or so, I was thinking "Hang on, is this the right bloody programme?????".....seemed like I was either watching a rough cut or it had changed title to The Jones Show......

......but what I thought was disappointingly becoming the single lowest point of the season transformed into perhaps the very, very best.

Stunningly tragic, emotional, joyful, oh - the words can not do this justice really - absolutely bloody superb. This 3rd season has, I feel, been generally the most formulaic, but absolutely the most consistently entertaining and exciting season so far. My only worry is that the bar has been set too high now and can it go any higher???

SPOILERS AHOY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well - the promise of a new companion for the 4th Season, Martha's impending work at Torchwood with Captain Jack/Face of - oh, whoever!! (before her return to the Tardis), a possible return of the Master, the "Most Ambitious and best Christmas Episode yet!" (according to RTD, and the rumours regarding Kylie Minogue taking a starring role in that special have now been confirmed), can all, I think, only bode well for the future of Who, Torchwood, and - dammit - the human race!!

Greg

[John Crichton 4]

Well - the promise of a new companion for the 4th Season...and the rumours regarding Kylie Minogue taking a starring role in that special have now been confirmed

And now all those people that wanted Catherine Tate to stay on after The Runaway Bride (I think they were out there) have gotten they're wish: she's going to be back full-time in Series 4 as the new main companion.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/news/cult/n.../03/46831.shtml

[Greg1138 3]

Yes - just spotted this......not sure how I feel about this - The Runaway Bride, for me, has been the lowest point of the new Who so far - how much of this was to do with Tate I'm not sure though.......but so far, I have had difficulty in seeing Ecclestone, Tennant and Billie Piper in their respective roles, so I will hold my judgement on this for now!!

[pixie_twinkle 48]

I couldn't stand Donna Noble in TRB. She was just a whiner, and an irritating one at that. Oh well, after three fantastic seasons I guess the run had to end. I am going to find it tough to watch through a whole season with her character.

[John Crichton 4]

Well having now seen The Runaway Bride (Good stuff, but not to the epic level of The Christmas Invasion. Nothing wrong with getting a bit smaller though.) I'm cautiously optimistic about the whole Donna as a regular thing. There's potential there, as long as her, er, bitchiness is toned down. It's good for an occasional laugh but gets old real quick. And it'll be good, I think, for the Doctor to have a female companion that isn't in the 18-25 demographic, a nice change of pace.

Besides, RTD and his gang have built up lots of trust these last few years, so I'm willing to give it a shot.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

Besides, RTD and his gang have built up lots of trust these last few years, so I'm willing to give it a shot.

That's actually a very good sentiment. I really should hold off until I can see for myself how they approach her as a regular character. After all, I remember being miserable when I heard they'd cast Billie Piper as the companion, and look how wrong I was on that one!

[Greg1138 3]

For ayone followng life in the Whoniverse....it has been confirmed that season 2 of Torchwood wil not air until early 2008, and following the broadcast of Season 4 of Doctor Who later in 2008 there will be no new season filmed for the following year - instead, 3 specials are to be broadcast in 2009 instead of a full season, and Season 5 will then air in 2010!!!!!!!!! Whilst Tennant will star in the 3 specials, there is no news yet on his involvement in Season 5....

Do I smell something afoot?

[John Crichton 4]

Interesting....You Brits love your specials, don't you?

The rumors were pretty rampant that RTD was leaving after Series 4, now he can use these three specials to transition. There'll probably be a regeneration, too. If the BBC doesn't get Steven Moffat to take over the show I'll lose all respect for them.

Oh, and Greg, have you seen the rumors involving a Children in Need special this year? Written by Steven Moffat and co-starring.....

Peter Davison

!

[Greg1138 3]

Nope - that's a new one on me......he has been involved in other Doctor Who stuff for the past 6 or 7 years....it would not surprise me if this was true.....and I have to say it would be something I would look forward to - though a full-on story rather than a 10-minute spot would be even better....

[John Crichton 4]

though a full-on story rather than a 10-minute spot would be even better....

Yes, that was my first thought too. A two parter even would be best.

As far as the "year partially off" goes, it looks like it's due to David Tennant landing the lead role in the Royal Shakespeare Company's latest Hamlet production, running the second half of 2008. That makes this a great compromise, allowing Tennant to do both rather than forcing him to choose.

[Greg1138 3]

Although given that the mystery guest is one of several people still involved in the Whoniverse, I haven't ruled out a modern "Five Doctors" yet

[John Crichton 4]

There's no way I can say anything about this pic without it being a mass of gushing nonsense, so I'll let it speak for itself:

It's written by Steven freakin' Moffat, and my only complaint is that it's just a Children in Need special rather than a full episode. And we get to see it in less that a month!

There's lots of Series 4 rumors at the moment, but I'm hesitating to comment on them since I don't know how much Greg and James (and whoever else) follow them.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

What's Tristan Farnon doing with Dr. Who?

[John Crichton 4]

I forgot, here's the Beeb's official write up on it, though they still aren't revealing much.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

Who's that chunky guy in Peter Davison's costume?

Seriously, this is very exciting! Now if only they can persuade Tom Baker to put on a wig, dust off his hat and scarf, and get back into the Tardis! You just know he'd be bloody brilliant! He may be a bit on the large side these days, but he still has those eyes, and that voice!

"You are insane Davros! Britain, Britain, Britain!"

[John Crichton 4]

YouTube has been a great resource for me to watch some classic Who stories that I don't have, and while trolling around looking for some a couple of weeks ago I stumbled on a 10 minute or so sequence of Tom Baker's scenes from Monarch of the Glen. He's still got it, even though there's a lot more of him.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I stumbled on a 10 minute or so sequence of Tom Baker's scenes from Monarch of the Glen. He's still got it, even though there's a lot more of him.

Bring back Dickie Briers, ALL IS FORGIVEN!

[Greg1138 3]

There's lots of Series 4 rumors at the moment, but I'm hesitating to comment on them since I don't know how much Greg and James (and whoever else) follow them.

Cool piccie - I am lookin forward to it, but yes it would be nice to do this properly and have a full episode.....but I guess it might open a doorway or two?

As far as Rumour Control goes, all I know at the moment is what is on the official site: Sontaarans, Eastenders Cast members, Kylie, the usual.....

[pixie_twinkle 48]

There's lots of Series 4 rumors at the moment, but I'm hesitating to comment on them since I don't know how much Greg and James (and whoever else) follow them.

Cool piccie - I am lookin forward to it, but yes it would be nice to do this properly and have a full episode.....but I guess it might open a doorway or two?

As far as Rumour Control goes, all I know at the moment is what is on the official site: Sontaarans, Eastenders Cast members, Kylie, the usual.....

And of course the return of a very popular baddie played by Ben Kingsley! That's inspired casting, as long as it's true.

[Greg1138 3]

Hmmmmm - hadn't spotted that rumour before, but it looks well-founded......inspired casting indeed, though I can't help wondering why Terry Molloy would't be returning.....do the makers really need that little bit extra publicity? Oh well - either way - Kingsley is a superb choice and would certainly be up to the challenge of showing off his acting chops through tha mask!

[pixie_twinkle 48]

I'd far rather have Kingsley than Molloy. You sent me an excellent audio clip of Molloy a year or so back, Greg, and he was good. However, I've always been unimpressed with his performances on the TV shows. He seems too shouty and thug-like. Michael Wisher was so perfect with his purring evil voice that would occasionally rise to a Dalek-like rage!

Imagine Gandhi in a Dalek base. Oh yes!

[John Crichton 4]

I always enjoyed Molloy's performances on TV, he had to work against a lot of bad writing (Davison's Dalek story in particular is an unmitigaed mess, although the scene where he contemplates killing Davros is superb). I know Molloy's been involved with the character still with the audios and on stage but I've never seen/heard any of it. I can't see any reason not to bring him back, but again I trust RTD and co. to know what they're doing.

[Greg1138 3]

The Doctor Who website has announced that Peter Moffatt, director of several stories in the 80's (including The Five Doctors) and one of the guiding lights and contributors behind the DVD releases, has passed away.

[John Crichton 4]

He will be missed.

On a better note, something we haven't mentioned here: it's been announced that the classic series villians returning in Series 4 will be....the Sontarans.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

A friend of mine sent me a pic of the new-look sontarans and, well, I don't know what to think. It looks ok, but for me the absolute classic sontaran was the flatter-domed head in Sontaran Experiment. It looks like they've modelled the new sontarans more off the Invasion of Time sontarans.

Wow, I just realised how geeky I just sounded.

[John Crichton 4]

At least the collars aren't hanging off like in The Two Doctors. Overall I like it. Very true to the classic look.

John- joining the geekiness

[pixie_twinkle 48]

I'm on a big Ben Kingsley kick right now. We rented "You Kill Me" a few nights ago (very good!) and I just bought Gandhi. I really hope there is some truth to the Dr Who rumours.

[John Crichton 4]

I hope you're right, I still can't see anyone but Terry Molloy in that role. But he certainly does have the history and the chops.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

I'm not trying to be mean to Mr Kingsley, but take a long look at his face. Then take a long look at the original Michael Wisher Davros. Notice anything?

[John Crichton 4]

Hmmm, you may be on to something there.

[Greg1138 3]

Indeed - much as though I would like Molloy to return, Kingsley would be genious casting...I hope the rumours are true too....

[pixie_twinkle 48]

I honestly believe that the make up and costume guys from the mid 70s were the best in the series history. That Davros mask/make up is fantastic! It stands the test of time really well. Other great creature costumes from around that time were the Zygons (who I REALLY hope return!), and the Krynoid (in all of it's manifestations, even the giant cabbage one was scary!)

Of course, there were a few flops too, the giant rat being maybe the worst. But even with the rat the animatronic skeleton was very good, it was only when they put the fur coat on it that it looked silly.

[John Crichton 4]

Anything's better than Kronos in The Time Monster.

BTW, I just got home with my brand spankin' new copy of Series 3, which was released today in the US.

[Greg1138 3]

For anyone that missed it - you can watch the Children In Need mini-episode "Time Crash" HERE.....

.....and I gotta say - it's bloody superb......"Check out this bone-structure, Doctor, 'cos one day you're going to be shaving it!".....just one of the great lines (along with the various references to vegetables) in this 7 minutes of pure magic!

[John Crichton 4]

For anyone that missed it - you can watch the Children In Need mini-episode "Time Crash" HERE.....

Honestly you're better off going to YouTube (like I did). I think you can only watch it off that if you're in the UK and the BBC's streaming technology is still firmly stuck in the late 90s.

As for the episode itself, I'm with you Greg, I loved every single second of it, from "Excuse me, pardon me...what?" to "Not a lot of men can pull of a decorative vegetable" to "Oh, here they come, the brainy specs!" to Belgum to "You're....a fan!" to "Has he still got that rubbish beard?" to the whole "I loved being you" moment. Thank you, once again, Mr. Steven Moffat. And, of course, Graeme Harper, Peter Davison, and David Tennant.

[Greg1138 3]

Verity Lambert - the lady who first brought Doctor Who to the screen all those years ago, has passed away aged 71. She was also responsible for programmes such as The Naked Civil Servant, Jonathan Creek, Minder, Rumpole of the Bailey and GBH. She was due to receive a Lifetime Achievement Award at the Women in Film And Television Awards in December.

She passed away the day before the 44th Anniversary of the very first broadcast of Doctor Who.

That's an amazing TV Producer the UK has lost.....

[pixie_twinkle 48]

This is very sad news. She was still quite young, only in her early 70s.

[John Crichton 4]

RIP

[pixie_twinkle 48]

Just watched Time Crash on YouTube. Great stuff!

[Greg1138 3]

Going back to a slightly earlier topic on his thread - I read a newspaper article yesterday that stated that RTD and the clan were disappointed with their inability to sign a major star to play a bad guy in the three Season 5 movies. It stated that their big three - which included Sir Ben Kingsley (!) - had all fallen through......

It did however state that it looked like Billie Piper was coming back for the movies, and that the series of movies would start with her hunting down the good Doctor to thwart an invasion of earth caused by the Doctor's own adventures in previous episodes.