La-La Land Records' HOOK (2CD Expanded) Anticipation thread

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You Are The Pan with that amazing film version choir???

[Incanus 5,713]

La-La Land did all they could. I applaud them for even getting the score out there again in any form other than the OST. We are getting some of JW's greatest moments ever within this set.

Yes. I am sure that without JWs input this would have been extremely comprehensive with everything on it they could legally put on the set.

But the complete Ultimate War is worth the price of the set alone.

You Are The Pan with that amazing film version choir???

My guess is that it will be on the release since You Are the Pan is marked containing previously unreleased music.

[Romão 2,274]

If I were the composer, I'd have my reservations as well with using an insert inside a fully formed tracked (that was only put there in the first place to fit the film). It's the same thing as that Nazi march insert in the Belly of the Steel Beast. It serves its purpose in the film (in the case of Hook the insert is not as jarring, admitedly, it actually sounds good), but I can perfectly understand JW's reservations in including. I still rank JW very highly as an album producer. This set seems to be pretty much perfect

[TownerFan 4,983]

"Smee's Plan" should contain the portion for the deleted scene 'Believe Your Eyes' (aka "Goodnight Neverland") which John Takis talked about on the radio special, while "Pan is Challenged" is the cue for the training with the Lost Boys (minus the song). Am I right?

[Nemesis 244]

the "My Name is Wild Bill Kelso.. and don't you forget it!!"- shouts seperated, not as overlay.last track on CD2 maybe 30secs after the the End Credits' last note.

well... I doubt the food insert will be included that way on that album,..so, anyway....

Nice find, never got that

[Incanus 5,713]

"Smee's Plan" should contain the portion for the deleted scene 'Believe Your Eyes' (aka "Goodnight Neverland") which John Takis talked about on the radio special, while "Pan is Challenged" is the cue for the training with the Lost Boys (minus the song). Am I right?

Pan is Challenged could be the unused music for Rufio's appearance but it might also be Pick 'Em Up as you suggest. And you are probably right about the Smee's Plan containing that Good Night Neverland piece.

EDIT: Since Jason confirmed in his post below that Rufio's entrance music is on another track it seems Pick 'Em Up is Pan Is Challenged.

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No "When You're Alone" instrumental version??? :crymore:

It's one of my favourite pieces of music of all time.. oh man, that sucks.

I know, I know, glass half empty...

[Romão 2,274]

John Williams did not include that insert flourish in the concert suite of the Never Feas either, so he clearly prefers the track to flow as it was originally written

[Jay 37,249]

Now I wonder what this is:

10 Prologue (alternate)* 1:35

It's an alternate version of the Prologue!

Seriously, it's simliar to the trailer music we all know and love but...... different!

I just want to know if the Never Feast has the Food Appears Insert or not

It does not.

I wonder whether the sound quality here is (noticeably) superior to the OS album...

I think the previously unreleased cues sound BETTER than the OST

10 The Arrival Of Tink/The Flight To Neverland** 6:03

I guess this is the film version.

It is

Anybody really stupid enough to throw away their original Epic album just because this one came out?

There are actually TWO bits on the OST that aren't on the new set, so hold onto it! (Not to mention the OST has that cool picture of the deleted rowboat scene

I am guessing You Are the Pan contains the choir mix of the Face of Pan music and thus is marked contains previously unreleased music.

Correct

-i thought in other releases they kept the original cue names, here they didn't.

Nope, they didn't. And they are surprisingly similar to the names chosen for the Concorde bootleg. Since Didier C Deutsch was the producer of this release, I assume he is the one who chose all the titles. I should have asked him when I interviewed him

-You are the pan: again the 2 cues together and not seperately in chronological order..

All OST tracks were retained. Therefore Granny Wendy and Hook-napped each feature 2 cues out of chronological order like always as well.

-the entrance of rufio is missing or is part of "from mermaids to lost boys"?

It's in "From Mermaids To Lost Boys"

-Missing the end of hook cue?

That cue starts in "Sword Fight" and ends in "Farewell Neverland"

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Anybody really stupid enough to throw away their original Epic album just because this one came out?

There are actually TWO bits on the OST that aren't on the new set, so hold onto it! (Not to mention the OST has that cool picture of the deleted rowboat scene

You Are The Pan Album Version and Flight to Neverland Album Version?

[Jay 37,249]

Anyknow know what this is?

Exit Music (unused) * 1:42

It is Williams original intended ending to the End Credits. In the final film, it was replaced by music tracked from Tink's Arrival and "Farewell Neverland"

Interesting to see Hook's Blues, referring to the scene where he tries to commit suicide, in the bonus material section. This could be the "repetetive material" Williams did not present in the listening experience. I am glad it still found its way into this set though.

Yes, it is that scene and yes, I suspect it was moved from the main program to the bonus track section at Williams' request

And I wonder if Hook-Napped will be presented in the reversed order as on the OST.

Indeed they are still reversed.

The length of SMEE'S PLAN suggests that it's paired with HOOK'S BLUES, while the alternate just is another version.

No. There's only one version of "Hook's Blues". The extra length in "Smee's Plan" refers to the fact that the "Believe Your Eyes" cue has been added to the track.

some music for deleted footage they alluded to in the interview.

Both deleted scene cues are on the new set.

Pick 'Em Up (Pan's training montage underscore) is not on the release I suppose.

It is not.

The End of Hook should appear at the end of Swordfight, right? Or is it at the beginning of Farewell Neverland? It's the only piece I can't account for here, but the 5 minutes of the swordfight would be my bet.

It begins in Sword Fight, and ends in "Farewell Neverland".

well, so "no more Hook"-music is included in swordfight, and the unreleased "Farewell"music is something we don't know... or is it the Never-Feast Insert?

The "No More Hook" portion of the "The End Of Hook" cue is included in "Farewell Neverland"

[publicist 4,643]

Well, that settles it, then. Whoever is in desperate need of the food insert certainly knows how to get it.

[Jay 37,249]

Okay, now let's talk about the NEW MUSIC that's included here!!

What's your Top 5 cues/tracks?

For me personally, the tracks I've been listening to most are the ones that had material I had NEVER heard before (or never heard clean before), so "Banning Back Home (Film Version)", "Pirates!", and "Prologue (Alternate)". As far as the other tracks go, they sound SO MUCH BETTER than the bootlegs it's great to hear all the detail of the original recordings. Every track is great!

Does "Presenting the Hook (film version - extended)" play as exactly as heard in the film or does it contain unused material as well?

It contains the unused "Slicing the Hand" cue

In the radio show they said there is a deleted scene for which Williams composed music that should go between Peter wandering in the Pirate Town after arriving to Neverland and meeting the pirates that attack him for his shoes. Tinker Bell pulled Peter aside and sliced his hand with her dagger or something like that to convince that it was all real since Peter still had hard time believing he was in Neverland. That is why his hand is suddenly bandaged in the film. So my bet is that this is the unused piece of music restored to its right place.

Correct

If the track "Pirates!" on the new album is the same as the track of the same name on the boot it's from the scene where we see ook for the first time.

Correct!

"A Portrait of Wendy" --> "The Stories are True Pt. I (FIlm Version")

"Wendy Tells Peter the Truth (partly unused)" --> "The Stories Are True Pt. I (Alternate)" plus "The Stories are True Pt. II".

Exactly correct!

You Are The Pan with that amazing film version choir???

You seem to be a bit confused. The album track "You Are The Pan" is comprised of two film cues: First, "You Are The Pan", which has choir in the film and has always had choir on the OST as well. That cue is followed by "The Face Of Pan" from earlier in the film - that cue does NOT have choir in the film OR on the OST, but Williams did originally intend to have choir there, and that has been restored on the new CD.

"Smee's Plan" should contain the portion for the deleted scene 'Believe Your Eyes' (aka "Goodnight Neverland") which John Takis talked about on the radio special, while "Pan is Challenged" is the cue for the training with the Lost Boys (minus the song). Am I right?

Correct about Smee's Plan. Wrong about "Pan Is Challenged". "Pan Is Challenged" is the music for the catapult scene.

John Williams did not include that insert flourish in the concert suite of the Never Feas either, so he clearly prefers the track to flow as it was originally written

Yea, I am sure it was Williams' choice to not include the Never-Feast Insert anywhere on the new CD.

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I'm guessing the Julia Roberts sung "Childhood" is also intentionally absent.

Are the unchanged 'OST' tracks on the new release literally lifted from the OST? Or did they go back to the original master tapes to remaster and re-edit these identical tracks?

[Incanus 5,713]

EDIT Nevermind.

[Jay 37,249]

Pan is Challenged could be the unused music for Rufio's appearance but it might also be Pick 'Em Up as you suggest. And you are probably right about the Smee's Plan containing that Good Night Neverland piece.

EDIT: Since Jason confirmed in his post below that Rufio's entrance music is on another track it seems Pick 'Em Up is Pan Is Challenged.

Nope, Pick Em Up is not on the set. Pan Is Challenged in the catapult cue (it had the same name on the Concorde release)

Anybody really stupid enough to throw away their original Epic album just because this one came out?

There are actually TWO bits on the OST that aren't on the new set, so hold onto it! (Not to mention the OST has that cool picture of the deleted rowboat scene

You Are The Pan Album Version and Flight to Neverland Album Version?

Exactly right!

[Andy 4,070]

Well, that settles it, then. Whoever is in desperate need of the food insert certainly knows how to get it.

I am in desparate need. How do I get it? Did I miss something?

[publicist 4,643]

It seems to be the same cue, only the the leggers named it after the song.

[Jay 37,249]

Does this mean that the track named on some boots Pick 'Em Up is not the same cue as the catapult scene?

"Pan Is Challenged" is the orchestral cue that begins in the film while the kids are still singing Pick Em Up and ends when he lands after being flung from the catapult

[publicist 4,643]

Well, that settles it, then. Whoever is in desperate need of the food insert certainly knows how to get it.

I am in desparate need. How do I get it? Did I miss something?

Well, the much-maligned unmentionables all have it, so someone contemplating suicide because of the missing insert could ask all the people here who seem to have it if they can hum it to him and upload it on youtube.

[Romão 2,274]

Am I the only who's actually happy to have You Are the Pan and The Face of Pan joined together as in the original cd? Specially since the latter includes the choir now. Those two tracks work much better together

[Incanus 5,713]

Pan is Challenged could be the unused music for Rufio's appearance but it might also be Pick 'Em Up as you suggest. And you are probably right about the Smee's Plan containing that Good Night Neverland piece.

EDIT: Since Jason confirmed in his post below that Rufio's entrance music is on another track it seems Pick 'Em Up is Pan Is Challenged.

Nope, Pick Em Up is not on the set. Pan Is Challenged in the catapult cue (it had the same name on the Concorde release)

I just realized I had Pick 'Em Up and Pan Is Challenged mixed up in my head. I have been erroneously speaking about Pick 'Em Up when I meant Pan Is Challenged, the catapult music.

Am I the only who's actually happy to have You Are the Pan and The Face of Pan joined together as in the original cd? Specially since the latter includes the choir now. Those two tracks work much better together

They do share same kind of quasi-religious spiritual atmosphere so they do work well together, even better now that both feature choir, I would imagine.

[Romão 2,274]

Am I the only who's actually happy to have You Are the Pan and The Face of Pan joined together as in the original cd? Specially since the latter includes the choir now. Those two tracks work much better together

They do share same kind of quasi-religious spiritual atmosphere so they do work well together, even better now that both feature choir.

I've always felt that huge choral crescendo really benefits from having that reflective breathing space provided by The Face of Pan. And these are probably the two tracks where the mythic quality is stronger and they both deal with Peter's acceptance of his "mantle", so to speak. They really do work splendily together

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The Face of Pan with choir is my most sought-after cue, can't wait!

However, didn't we hear a vastly different You Are The Pan on the radio show the other day? Where does that fit in? It replaces the original OST version of You Are The Pan completely?

[Faleel 5,326]

that was a concert arrangment from a re-recording CD IIRC

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In fairness to LLL, it seems there's probably only 4 or 5 short cues in the movie not on this set. And maybe 4 or 5 (mostly identical) alternates and a few short inserts? And instrumental versions of songs I guess.

Let's thank the heavens Williams didn't demand Desert Chase-esque microedits to Ultimate War! Still haven't forgotten that one.

[Incanus 5,713]

that was a concert arrangment from a re-recording CD IIRC

Yeap. From Williams on Williams album, highly recommended btw.

[Faleel 5,326]

Yeah, I'll have to get this set first, I am agonizing over whether I should purchase this, or the FSM Ben-Hur set.

[Demondm810 397]

Are the Ultimate War inserts present?

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I think it's clear by now that Williams doesn't like film inserts. We didn't get any inserts on the Indy box either.

[publicist 4,643]

I prefer the ULTIMATE WAR inserts to the album version. The cue is hopelessly rambunctious anyway, so a bit more pomp and circumstance do not harm it.

[Jay 37,249]

Nope no Ultimate War Inserts. I suspect Williams did not want them included.

[Demondm810 397]

Excellent. I prefer the flow without them

[Incanus 5,713]

Nope no Ultimate War Inserts. I suspect Williams did not want them included.

It certainly looks that way. And when the logic here is that they honor Williams' original intentions and his wishes as an album producer then most of the radical changes in track order, editing and placement most likely originate from him. But I am glad that some compromises were made as we got some of those bonus tracks on the set.

[Jay 37,249]

Indeed. It was pretty cool to finally hear the Banning Back Home film version without sound effects over it. The piano playing is really impressive!

[Incanus 5,713]

I am extremely happy that the set contains the Exit Music since it is both a fitting close to the score but also contains just a beautiful and emotional rendition of what I have been calling the Neverland Theme.

Also I can't wait to hear the Ultimate War in its entirety. E.g. the beginning of the duel between Hook and Pan has always been one of my favourite film music moments. The spirit, sheer bravado and swashbuckling brilliance of those opening fanfares is pure joy to hear that makes your heart leap with excitement every time.

[LongTallJodie 59]

Looks pretty awesome, as predicted, even with the edits. Of course, my luck forever runs dry: my bank account hit a snag and I can't buy this for another week! AUGH. Hopefully 5000 copies will hang in there for a while.

[Jay 37,249]

I am extremely happy that the set contains the Exit Music since it is both a fitting close to the score but also contains just a beautiful and emotional rendition of what I have been calling the Neverland Theme.

I used to call it the "Memory Theme", but since we now know that it is the melody to a song called "Believe", I now call it the Believe Theme.

the beginning of the duel between Hook and Pan has always been one of my favourite film music moments. The spirit, sheer bravado and swashbuckling brilliance of those opening fanfares is pure joy to hear that makes your heart leap with excitement every time.

Completely and utterly 100% agreed. That moment makes me emotional every time. Only Williams can write something like that.

[publicist 4,643]

We are lucky that the theme isn't spoiled by Bricusse's lyrics.

[TownerFan 4,983]

You know, in the end the only really slight thing that I wish would have been done differently is to present "Remembering Childhood" with "Follow That Shadow" inserted back into it. Of course it can be restored with a minimum of editing work, which is something I'm able to do

[publicist 4,643]

Musically it makes no sense to cut the two pieces, but you're right, Audition will fix it in a few seconds.

[Admiral Holdo 16]

Um... The Face of Pan?

[Incanus 5,713]

Musically it makes no sense to cut the two pieces, but you're right, Audition will fix it in a few seconds.

True. It is a bit odd to have the middle section of the sequences separately before the long track. But nothing some editing won't fix.

[publicist 4,643]

It's not included. Williams does not like it anymore!

[Jay 37,249]

Um... The Face of Pan?

What about it?

[TownerFan 4,983]

Musically it makes no sense to cut the two pieces, but you're right, Audition will fix it in a few seconds.

I understand the logic why Williams prefers to have it separately, as "Follow That Shadow" is the more "cue-y" portion of the sequence. And the album edit flows really well, it's kind of mini-symphonic poem.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,249]

No I still make up my own titles for the themes that didn't come from the song demos

[MissPadmé 17]

I am sooo looking forward to the little fanfare you can here when he says: "What would the world be like without Captain Hook?" :)

[Incanus 5,713]

No I still make up my own titles for the themes that didn't come from the song demos

Are you seriously going to call the Pirate Theme Low Below and Hook's Theme Stick With Me?

I am sooo looking forward to the little fanfare you can here when he says: "What would the world be like without Captain Hook?" :)

Another cool little moment.