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Movie Talk 2012 Films Christopher Nolan

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#721 TownerFan

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 04:18 PM


I respect Zimmer for venturing into some new territories. His one note Joker theme was very original and very effective, despite what some say. As a composer I love the guy. As an influence on film music, he's awful.


I mostly agree with what you said, except for the original part

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cXWtFknQlg


:eh:

#722 Matt C

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 04:21 AM

He can do symphonic scores when he puts his mind to it. I believe he succeeded with the Da Vinci Code.


Absolutely. But Nolan shares the blame for the direction of the new Batman music too. He wanted more textural stuff, and not letting Zimmer accentuate the emotion and action more often (which is what film music is for!). There are other ways to do a Batman score without emulating Elfman, Goldenthal or Walker.

Sound design and a few chords strung together doesn't really cut it for me. Zimmer is capable of and has done much stronger work.

#723 Delorean90

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 04:27 PM

Perhaps partially, but Zimmer has stated in multiple interviews that he was pushing against the big hero theme and things like that, and I recall reading one where he was resisting against the more Romantic elements, which is why so much of the more tender and lush string elements from Begins are MIA in The Dark Knight.

#724 Chaac

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 04:36 PM

Just paste The Matrix score into the film. Done.

#725 Delorean90

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 04:39 PM

My God, Don Davis would've been freakin' PERFECT for these movies.

#726 Chaac

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 04:40 PM

Everytime I hear The Matrix I think "BATMAN!!"

#727 KK.

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 06:03 PM

Wow, I never thought of it that way! But you're right! Don Davis' sound for the Matrix would have been just perfect for these Batman films!!!!

I miss Don Davis and his voice in the film score world. I was talking to Broxton about it, according to him, Davis is searching for gigs. But after having been absent from the industry for so long (thanks to his opera amongst other things), he's struggling to get a a spot for a film. Apparently he's been trying quite a bit too :(

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#728 Jay

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 09:20 PM

That's really sad. The closest he's gotten lately is orchestrating Toy Story 3

#729 crocodile

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 09:22 PM

I want him back. I like everything I heard from him. There are some influences here and there (Horner orchestrator for a number of years), but there is also a clear and interesting voice in there.

Karol
"Modern, serious music has become embroiled in an intellectual discussion that has no place in music. Certainly, the great composer of the past were geniuses and used their intellect, but only to serve their emotions and guide their craft. Not to dictate to them what they should or shouldn't write" - Michael Kamen, 1995

 


#730 Koray Savas

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 09:32 PM

Zimmer's done with his Gladiator ways, he said so himself. He wants to focus on doing more with less, and working with texture in music. What he's talking about with Rises is most likely the chant heard in the trailers. There's a recorded one and then there's one where he combined people's recordings from UJam, an idea obviously borrowed from his collaborator from On Stranger Tides, Eric Whitacre.

Oh, and Zimmer got Joker's theme from Hannibal.
"Close Encounters to me is as good a piece of concert music as the 20th century has produced. Everybody fixates on... the Superman fanfare, or Star Wars - Main Theme, or the Raiders March. It's what happens after that, it's not the big popular hook where you go: 'My God John Williams is a genius.' Y'know it's the stuff which is maybe less hooky and less hummable, but is great art." - Hans Zimmer

#731 crocodile

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Posted 25 February 2012 - 09:52 PM

I bet you had that smug Marion Cotillard expression on your face when you typed that last bit, didn't you?

Karol
"Modern, serious music has become embroiled in an intellectual discussion that has no place in music. Certainly, the great composer of the past were geniuses and used their intellect, but only to serve their emotions and guide their craft. Not to dictate to them what they should or shouldn't write" - Michael Kamen, 1995

 


#732 BloodBoal

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Posted 26 February 2012 - 09:10 AM

I bet you had that smug Marion Cotillard expression on your face when you typed that last bit, didn't you?

Karol


:lol: I can totally picture that.

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#733 Delorean90

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Posted 27 February 2012 - 01:39 PM

Wow, I never thought of it that way! But you're right! Don Davis' sound for the Matrix would have been just perfect for these Batman films!!!!

I miss Don Davis and his voice in the film score world. I was talking to Broxton about it, according to him, Davis is searching for gigs. But after having been absent from the industry for so long (thanks to his opera amongst other things), he's struggling to get a a spot for a film. Apparently he's been trying quite a bit too :(


I'm just imagining something like the end of "Anything is Possible" closing out the Batman trilogy. Damn.

I hope he gets something soon. I watched The Matrix recently and was struck by just how well developed a score it is. And the ending as originally scored is just spine-tingling.

#734 Matt C

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Posted 28 February 2012 - 01:54 AM

Perhaps partially, but Zimmer has stated in multiple interviews that he was pushing against the big hero theme and things like that, and I recall reading one where he was resisting against the more Romantic elements, which is why so much of the more tender and lush string elements from Begins are MIA in The Dark Knight.


That's a shame. All superhero films should be contractually required to have a big theme... even a more realistic take on Batman should've had one. Textural and murky sound doesn't cut it.

I'm hoping Zimmer will embrace more romantic and more emotional elements for this film, since Catwoman/Selina Kyle (and likely Cotillard's Miranda Tate) will be the love interest and this is the final Batman film for this particular cast & crew. Zimmer needs to back away from the wall of sound and go for the emotional impact.

The choral element for Bane is very unusual and out of the box... so that seems like a step in the right direction.

#735 Chaac

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Posted 28 February 2012 - 02:44 PM

He could go the At World's End route again.

#736 Matt C

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Posted 28 February 2012 - 05:19 PM

He could go the At World's End route again.


That would be great. Zimmer really needs to tap that Thin Red Line/Da Vinci Code vein again for TDKR.

... I'm listening to Mask of the Phantasm right now. The main theme fits Nolan's Batman to a T... someone should cut a video using footage from all three movies.

#737 Delorean90

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Posted 28 February 2012 - 11:37 PM

I've messed around with that a bit--not actually made a video, but, for instance, the first part of "The Promise" goes nicely with Bruce leaving Rachel's car and throwing the gun into the river. And, even though it doesn't fit with all the dialogue, "Batman's Destiny" over the end of TDK is very nice.

#738 Richard Penna

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Posted 28 February 2012 - 11:58 PM

Wow, I never thought of it that way! But you're right! Don Davis' sound for the Matrix would have been just perfect for these Batman films!!!!

I miss Don Davis and his voice in the film score world. I was talking to Broxton about it, according to him, Davis is searching for gigs. But after having been absent from the industry for so long (thanks to his opera amongst other things), he's struggling to get a a spot for a film. Apparently he's been trying quite a bit too :(


Surely there are directors/producers who would kill to get someone of Davis' stature!

Too high a fee maybe? There's definitely still demand for traditional scores - just not in the bigger films these days.

#739 Red Rabbit

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Posted 29 February 2012 - 01:44 AM

To me, Mask of the Phantasm will probably always be the best score written for a Batman film. I enjoy Elfman and Zimmer/Howard's work to varying degrees, but Walker did the best theme.

I really enjoyed the score to the game Arkham City. It was a bit like Walker meets Zimmer.
Do you like John Williams? His early work was a little too jazzy for my taste, but when Jaws came out in '75 I really think he came into his own, commercially and artistically. The whole album has a clear, crisp sound, and an air of consummate professionalism that really gives the pieces a big boost. He's been compared to Jerry Goldsmith but I think John has a far more leitmotif-driven style of composing. In '82 John composed this, E.T., his most accomplished album to date. I think his undisputed masterpiece is "The Magic of Halloween", a theme so catchy most people don't listen to what it means. But they should, because it's not just about the pleasures of childhood and the importance of friendship, it's also a personal statement about the man himself. Hey Paul!
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John Takis' Complete Hook Analysis


#740 KK.

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Posted 29 February 2012 - 02:01 AM


Wow, I never thought of it that way! But you're right! Don Davis' sound for the Matrix would have been just perfect for these Batman films!!!!

I miss Don Davis and his voice in the film score world. I was talking to Broxton about it, according to him, Davis is searching for gigs. But after having been absent from the industry for so long (thanks to his opera amongst other things), he's struggling to get a a spot for a film. Apparently he's been trying quite a bit too :(


Surely there are directors/producers who would kill to get someone of Davis' stature!

Too high a fee maybe? There's definitely still demand for traditional scores - just not in the bigger films these days.


I don't think its that. I'm sure Davis would reduce his fee if he couldn't get any gigs. I think the problem is just that he's been gone from the industry too long, so now a lot of other composers have a lead in getting spot on the industry. Davis sort of lost his former fame and probably became kind of forgotten with his absence. And considering how the industry has become a lot more competitive now, Davis is a player whose really behind in the game...

I'm seriously hoping someone will give him a job (even the Wachowski Brothers seem to have moved on... :()

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#741 Delorean90

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Posted 29 February 2012 - 01:25 PM

To me, Mask of the Phantasm will probably always be the best score written for a Batman film. I enjoy Elfman and Zimmer/Howard's work to varying degrees, but Walker did the best theme.

I really enjoyed the score to the game Arkham City. It was a bit like Walker meets Zimmer.


I agree on both counts. I feel Walker has the theme most comprehensively true to the character. Elfman's tackles the mysterious, mythical and exciting sides of Batman wonderfully, but I think Walker's theme manages to touch on that along with capturing the heart behind the symbol. The Zimmer/Howard two-note theme and Molossus theme both probably have potential beyond their implementation in BB and TDK, but I don't think any of that material approaches the nailing of the actual character and his facets in the way that Elfman and Walker did.

And Arkham City's score, as with the other facets of the game, was a big improvement over its predecessor, I thought.

#742 Matt C

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 04:23 AM

I'm bored...



Someone cut a nice music video (using only Batman Begins footage) using John Williams music. Wish he did one for TDK too.

#743 Jay

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 04:49 PM

Dark Knight Rises gets a PG13

http://www.huffingto..._n_1411860.html

#744 Stefancos

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 04:50 PM

Naturally! Thats were the money is!

#745 Matt C

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 06:33 PM

And the PG-13 is warranted, on account of Anne Hathaway's outfit alone...

http://www.superhero...rk-knight-rises

Holy moley! Nolan certainly amped up the sexuality with this film.

#746 Chaac

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 06:36 PM

The high heels ruin it a bit. Can one fight in high heels? Looks impractical. I like everything else about the picture except that. So close.

#747 Stefancos

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 06:40 PM

You'd be surprised what some women can do when wearing heels.

#748 Chaac

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 07:32 PM

Fighting Batman? I am impressed!

#749 lonzoe

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Posted 11 April 2012 - 11:58 PM

Posted Image

#750 E.T. and Elliot

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Posted 12 April 2012 - 12:07 AM

I hate the designs of everything in these movies. The exception is Joker.

#751 Matt C

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Posted 23 April 2012 - 03:00 AM

I hate the designs of everything in these movies.


Did you look at all the Catwoman pics? If you loved the 1960s TV series, Nolan mostly used that template for Hathaway's Selina Kyle... which is very hot. The front pic of her on the EW cover isn't flattering at all.

And what didn't surprise is that WB will attach the final trailer for the movie on all releases of The Avengers (regular 3D, 2D, and IMAX 2D/3D). Not surprising since WB did the same thing for Nolan's past two movies on Marvel Studios releases.

#752 Trent Bennett

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Posted 23 April 2012 - 07:21 AM

I love how a lot of people like myself miss Don Davis in the composing ring. I too wish he would return to writing film scores. He'd probably blow Zimmer and other Media Ventures guys out of the water for the new stuff coming out.

I'm not surprised Zimmer basically copied one piece of music for The Dark Knight.

Have you guys forgotten what Horner did for The Search For Spock? :P
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#753 KK.

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Posted 23 April 2012 - 07:25 AM

The more I think about it, the more I keep thinking about how perfect Davis would have been for the Nolan's Batman trilogy. Dammit, it sucks when the industry prevents such talent to really prosper! It really sucks about the Davis situation (as can be read about above). I hope the man can get a major gig soon!

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#754 Matt C

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Posted 30 April 2012 - 11:17 PM

The final viral marketing gimmick for TDKR has come, which resulted in participants finding trailer screens for the new, final trailer (it debuts this Friday on all prints for The Avengers):

http://www.comingsoo...stillslarge.jpg

I like the "Hope is Lost" and "Faith is Broken" taglines. Really gives the series closure.

#755 Koray Savas

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Posted 30 April 2012 - 11:55 PM

The more I think about it, the more I keep thinking about how perfect Davis would have been for the Nolan's Batman trilogy. Dammit, it sucks when the industry prevents such talent to really prosper! It really sucks about the Davis situation (as can be read about above). I hope the man can get a major gig soon!

I don't think it would have mattered if Davis was still composing regularly or not.
"Close Encounters to me is as good a piece of concert music as the 20th century has produced. Everybody fixates on... the Superman fanfare, or Star Wars - Main Theme, or the Raiders March. It's what happens after that, it's not the big popular hook where you go: 'My God John Williams is a genius.' Y'know it's the stuff which is maybe less hooky and less hummable, but is great art." - Hans Zimmer

#756 KK.

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 12:03 AM


The more I think about it, the more I keep thinking about how perfect Davis would have been for the Nolan's Batman trilogy. Dammit, it sucks when the industry prevents such talent to really prosper! It really sucks about the Davis situation (as can be read about above). I hope the man can get a major gig soon!

I don't think it would have mattered if Davis was still composing regularly or not.


No, it wouldn't have. Even if Davis was composing regularly then, Nolan wouldn't have gone with them. But that doesn't change the fact that Davis would have been a great choice for the films.

We can only hope he lands a gig soon.

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#757 Northwest21

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 12:44 AM

I hear Don is digging his occasional conducting gig with The Matrix Live. Although, I don't think there are many concerts in the pipeline this year...

#758 KK.

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 04:14 AM

Well, the new Dark Knight Trailer is out:

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#759 Joey

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 04:20 AM

I'd say it looks good but it's cut so rapidly you can't tell a damned thing.
If it isn't high concept the it's not worth watching believed the pseudo superior one.

#760 Chaac

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 04:22 AM

That's a very good trailer.

Orange, blue and white. :)





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