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2012 Oscar Discussion Thread (Tintin and War Horse nominated for Best Original Score!)


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#81 Elmo Lewis

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 01:45 AM

I really don't get the hatred for Reznor on this board.

But anyway, it's nice to see that unlike Spielberg, Williams still hasn't lost the Academy's respect. Any note he puts to paper gets nominated.
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#82 indy4

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 01:46 AM


i was also surprised it wasn't nominated for animated feature, but then after thinking about it, I understand it being excluded ... the film was so plot driven; there weren't any places where we focused on Tintin's character, etc. But excited about the nominations, even if he loses.


I don't know why I should be excited about this.
Williams delivered two of the Top 5 scores of 2011 (if not of the Top 3, but I see why people wouldn't agree with that), a nomination was inevitable. Hell, Williams would have been nominated had he blown his nose with a piece of stave paper and have it recorded (it's good enough for Reznor, no?).

Tintin was not a guaranteed nomination. THe only other music nomination it has is from an awards show that only celebrates animated films. And in 2008 KotCS wasn't nominated, which IMO is superior to Tintin. Regardless, it's certainly superior to Williams blowing his nose.
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#83 KK.

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 01:52 AM

http://music-mix.ew....o/?iid=rcfooter

We get it, your precious Reznor didn't get nominated but your bashing of Williams was uncalled for and absolutely ridiculous. And the irony of this article is laughable! If Williams' music is interchangeable, then what does that make TGWTDT?! And how the hell can slap on a score like one for War Horse onto a picture like Tintin?! One of the few years that the oscars hit it close with the noms and we get idiots like these guys...

Absolute rubbish.,.





i was also surprised it wasn't nominated for animated feature, but then after thinking about it, I understand it being excluded ... the film was so plot driven; there weren't any places where we focused on Tintin's character, etc. But excited about the nominations, even if he loses.


I don't know why I should be excited about this.
Williams delivered two of the Top 5 scores of 2011 (if not of the Top 3, but I see why people wouldn't agree with that), a nomination was inevitable. Hell, Williams would have been nominated had he blown his nose with a piece of stave paper and have it recorded (it's good enough for Reznor, no?).

Tintin was not a guaranteed nomination. THe only other music nomination it has is from an awards show that only celebrates animated films. And in 2008 KotCS wasn't nominated, which IMO is superior to Tintin. Regardless, it's certainly superior to Williams blowing his nose.


Alas, the fact that he got nominated for Tintin is what blew his chances out of the water... :(

#84 Red

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 01:58 AM

How in the world was Giacchino not nominated for Super 8?
Do you like John Williams? His early work was a little too jazzy for my taste, but when Jaws came out in '75 I really think he came into his own, commercially and artistically. The whole album has a clear, crisp sound, and an air of consummate professionalism that really gives the pieces a big boost. He's been compared to Jerry Goldsmith but I think John has a far more leitmotif-driven style of composing. In '82 John composed this, E.T., his most accomplished album to date. I think his undisputed masterpiece is "The Magic of Halloween", a theme so catchy most people don't listen to what it means. But they should, because it's not just about the pleasures of childhood and the importance of friendship, it's also a personal statement about the man himself. Hey Paul!
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#85 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:08 AM

Marginally.



i was also surprised it wasn't nominated for animated feature, but then after thinking about it, I understand it being excluded ... the film was so plot driven; there weren't any places where we focused on Tintin's character, etc. But excited about the nominations, even if he loses.


I don't know why I should be excited about this.
Williams delivered two of the Top 5 scores of 2011 (if not of the Top 3, but I see why people wouldn't agree with that), a nomination was inevitable. Hell, Williams would have been nominated had he blown his nose with a piece of stave paper and have it recorded (it's good enough for Reznor, no?).

Tintin was not a guaranteed nomination. THe only other music nomination it has is from an awards show that only celebrates animated films. And in 2008 KotCS wasn't nominated, which IMO is superior to Tintin. Regardless, it's certainly superior to Williams blowing his nose.


Marginally.

Man, KOTCS was released in 2008 and wasn't nominated in 2009!
KOTCS didn't receive a single nomination in 2009 because it was a trainwreck of a movie and Williams was probably unfortunate for belonging to the magic circle of Lucas-Spielberg.
JW isn't capable of writing truly bad music, but KOTCS is certainly inferior to Tintin in any, every, way.

And JW heavily used material from the early Indys (Flight From Peru direct quote multiple times, Ark Theme, Marion's Theme), making the nomination even less likely.

Of course Tintin wasn't a sure nomination, I didn't imply that it should be. I said that either WH or Tintin should have gotten the nomination, making it at least realistic for JW to win.

But I guess you could copy-paste any conversation on here that was going on in 2006, when the first Santaolalla disaster happened.

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#86 chuckster312

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:28 AM

I really don't get the hatred for Reznor on this board.

But anyway, it's nice to see that unlike Spielberg, Williams still hasn't lost the Academy's respect. Any note he puts to paper gets nominated.


I suppose Hans Zimmer is much more superior than these two?

Which makes me curious, how old was this site?

#87 Faleel

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:38 AM

but KOTCS is certainly superior to Tintin in any, every, way.


Fixed!

Among all the things I have done in my short and pitiful life, becoming an inside joke on JWFAN is the one I'm the least proud of.


The additional passage was interesting but not really something I would consider absolutely essential.


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#88 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:43 AM

At least in Tintin, Williams didn't re-record the temp track for the main theme note for note.

KOTCS offers some of the blandest action music since Attack of The Clones.

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#89 KK.

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:44 AM

KOTCS is a great score but Tintin is waay better :D

#90 Faleel

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:47 AM

At least in Tintin, Williams didn't re-record the temp track for the main theme note for note.

KOTCS offers some of the blandest action music since Attack of The Clones.


Atleast in KOTCS, you can actually remember the score after you listen to it, CHA!

KOTCS is a great score but Tintin is waay better :D


KOTCS in expanded form, beats Tintin to a pulp.

Among all the things I have done in my short and pitiful life, becoming an inside joke on JWFAN is the one I'm the least proud of.


The additional passage was interesting but not really something I would consider absolutely essential.


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#91 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:49 AM


At least in Tintin, Williams didn't re-record the temp track for the main theme note for note.

KOTCS offers some of the blandest action music since Attack of The Clones.


Atleast in KOTCS, you can actually remember the score after you listen to it, CHA!


Yeah, for all the painful flashbacks to Raiders you had while listening to it.


KOTCS in expanded form, beats Tintin to a pulp.


Tintin in complete form is a tighter and more coherent listening experience than the OST of KOTCS.

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#92 Faleel

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:50 AM

Um, no, for the awesome Boom-tss!

Among all the things I have done in my short and pitiful life, becoming an inside joke on JWFAN is the one I'm the least proud of.


The additional passage was interesting but not really something I would consider absolutely essential.


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#93 KK.

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:50 AM

KOTCS offers some of the blandest action music since Attack of The Clones.


Since Attack of the Clones? That score has some great action.



At least in Tintin, Williams didn't re-record the temp track for the main theme note for note.

KOTCS offers some of the blandest action music since Attack of The Clones.


Atleast in KOTCS, you can actually remember the score after you listen to it, CHA!


I can remember Tintin VERY well. Some truly memorable themes in there!


KOTCS is a great score but Tintin is waay better :D


KOTCS in expanded form, beats Tintin to a pulp.


Tintin still wins in my book :P

#94 Faleel

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:51 AM

oh yeah?

Among all the things I have done in my short and pitiful life, becoming an inside joke on JWFAN is the one I'm the least proud of.


The additional passage was interesting but not really something I would consider absolutely essential.


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#95 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:52 AM

Um, no, for the awesome Boom-tss!


Yeah, boom-tzz, whata genius it takes to write those!

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#96 Faleel

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 02:58 AM

Whatever, Crystal Skull/Irina's theme is much better than the Unicorn theme!

Among all the things I have done in my short and pitiful life, becoming an inside joke on JWFAN is the one I'm the least proud of.


The additional passage was interesting but not really something I would consider absolutely essential.


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#97 king mark

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:00 AM

I'd rather have a complete release of KotCS than Tintin...by far

#98 Faleel

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:01 AM

I'd rather have a complete release of KotCS than Tintin...by far


Unless Tintin C&C had a uber cool concert version of Tintin's Heroic theme right? ;)

Among all the things I have done in my short and pitiful life, becoming an inside joke on JWFAN is the one I'm the least proud of.


The additional passage was interesting but not really something I would consider absolutely essential.


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#99 Matt C

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:09 AM

The list of nominees is an absolute joke. It's nice to see Williams still being acknowledged by the Academy, even if he doesn't win. Ditto for Kristen Wiig (who doesn't like her?), Annie Mulmolo and Melissa McCarthy.

But Extremely Loud and Jonah Hill getting nominated? Really? And to top it off, Tate Taylor didn't even get a Best Director or Best Adapted Screenplay nod for The Help. What a slap in the face.

#100 indy4

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:21 AM

KotCS is more cohesive than Tintin. Tintin is certainly more thematically complex, but I'm not sure it really needs it. Does the Unicorn theme and Snowy's theme have to be linked to Tintin's theme? It doesn't hurt the score, but I'm not sure it helps it that much. KotCS, on the other hand, picks a few themes and spends more time developing each one. The relationships make more sense. A bigger problem is the emotional one - Tintin has just a little too much ADD, at least during some of the action cues. KotCS feel more natural and organic.

They're both great scores, mind you. But I prefer KotCS, although not by much.
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#101 Jay

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:24 AM

I smell a poll

zNlRTkr.jpg


#102 indy4

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:40 AM

Tintin would win it, for sure.
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#103 KK.

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 03:48 AM

Because it deserves to ;)

#104 Incanus

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 05:15 AM

Congratulations to Maestro for 2 nominations!

And as many have said he has about a snow flake's chance in hell to win this year. But he has made history with 47 nominations. Way to go Johnny! :)

Ars superior est vita hominum.

 

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#105 Josh500

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 08:39 AM

But the nice thing about it all is that we get to hear Bill Conti (or whoever is in charge of the Academy orchestra this year) conducting pieces from "Tintin" and "War Horse"... :)

#106 Alejandro

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 08:44 AM

Maybe The Artist and Hugo will cancel one another out and War Horse will sneak through!!

Deadline Hollywood's Nikki says, "Alexandre Desplat did eight scores last year and got zero Oscar love. John Williams does two and gets both in. He’s a god and the gods rule in this category."

#107 Josh500

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 08:47 AM

Actually I am starting to think that JW will win this year. I certainly have a better feeling than I did in 2006 (MoaG, Munich) or 2005 (PoA).

Just a hunch.

But he's been so much in the news lately (all this Spielberg/Williams collaboration reports and articles), the Academy has to take notice. And also, like somebody already mentioned, this is the year he will turn 80. It'd be a nice birthday gift for the maestro!

#108 chuckster312

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 08:52 AM

Well Elmer Bernstein was 80 when he was nominated for his score in Far From Heaven. Still, fingers croseed.

#109 Koray Savas

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 09:58 AM

But he's been so much in the news lately (all this Spielberg/Williams collaboration reports and articles), the Academy has to take notice.

The Academy took notice in 1967.
"Close Encounters to me is as good a piece of concert music as the 20th century has produced. Everybody fixates on... the Superman fanfare, or Star Wars - Main Theme, or the Raiders March. It's what happens after that, it's not the big popular hook where you go: 'My God John Williams is a genius.' Y'know it's the stuff which is maybe less hooky and less hummable, but is great art." - Hans Zimmer

#110 Josh500

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 09:58 AM

HUGE CONGRATS to Mr. Williams on his 46th AND 47th Nomination!

This is a great day for all of us.
Both of Mr. Williams scores got in!


Hey, but John Williams has now broken the record for most nominations for Best Score, right?

I believe Alfred Newman got "only" 45 nominations (although he won 9)!

#111 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 10:33 AM

I'd rather have a complete release of KotCS than Tintin...by far


Well, that could be because Tintin is close to complete.

In the parade of themes and direct quotes Williams reused for KOTCS I forgot the Jones Family Theme.
Tintin is alot more original than KOTCS.

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#112 Stefancos

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 10:36 AM

Tintin is completely new. KOCS is surprsingly lazy and by the numbers. The reuse of old music is jarring.

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#113 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 10:42 AM

In my view, KOTCS is as close as Williams ever came to phoning a score in.

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#114 Josh500

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 10:48 AM

KotCS reuses some old music, yes.

But so do the Star Wars prequels, the second and third HP movies, etc. It's got to do with the fact that these are sequels of an established franchise.

KotCS was a great score, with some outstanding cues, written for a mediocre movie. But yeah, Tintin is way better--score and movie.

#115 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 11:00 AM

Come on, comparing PoA and KOTCS isn't fair, they're not on the same level. And Williams didn't score CoS full time, it wasn't his sole effort that year, contrary to KOTCS in 2008. And come to think of it, I enjoy COS way more than KOTCS.

For neither the Star Wars prequels, nor PoA, JW uses established themes in exact quotes from the originals (except for the Yoda/Sidious fight), whereas in Crystal Skull, he took exact quotes and didn't change much about composition or orchestration.
And it goes on to the point where the old themes seem a lot more important than they really are in the score because the rest around it doesn't keep what the themes promise.

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#116 crocodile

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 11:02 AM

I'm not even really following Oscars these days. Couldn't tell who was nominated for what in the past 5 years or so. Nevertheless, I'm happy Williams got a double nod. That's probably as good as winning, as many people already said. The guy doesn't need another one. Been there, done that, if you will. ;)

Good to see Alberto Iglesias among the nominees. Never heard the score on album, but in the film it's absolutely fantastic. In fact, all of them really shine in their films. That's why I completely expected Tintin to get a nom. From all the negative reviews, I expect that War Horse music does the exact same thing. ;)

BTW I'm really happy Janusz Kaminski got a nod this year (and not only because he's my fellow countryman). Haven't seen the film yet (I will next week), but it might be one of his very best yet.

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#117 Thor

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 11:04 AM

I really don't get the hatred for Reznor on this board.


Me neither. It's very annoying. Not just because it's a different opinion than my own, but because they are inserted as 'cheap shots' at every opportunity, even when it really doesn't have any relevance to the topic.

#118 Josh500

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 11:08 AM

Come on, comparing PoA and KOTCS isn't fair, they're not on the same level. And Williams didn't score CoS full time, it wasn't his sole effort that year, contrary to KOTCS in 2008. And come to think of it, I enjoy COS way more than KOTCS.

For neither the Star Wars prequels, nor PoA, JW uses established themes in exact quotes from the originals (except for the Yoda/Sidious fight), whereas in Crystal Skull, he took exact quotes and didn't change much about composition or orchestration.
And it goes on to the point where the old themes seem a lot more important than they really are in the score because the rest around it doesn't keep what the themes promise.


Well, I am just saying that IMO KotCS (the score) is not bad at all. It has some great new themes, and some oustanding standalone pieces (Jungle Chase, Whirl, Departure, etc.). So it uses a couple of pieces originally written for Raiders, so what? The movie, however, is a different matter . . . it was just mediocre, especially the second part. It's hard, maybe even impossible, to write an outstandingly good score for a mediocre movie.

#119 gkgyver

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 11:10 AM

Actually, I don't think it's about Williams *needing* another Oscar.
For me at least, it's about doing justice to the concept of awarding the best score of the year. I could live better with Williams not being nominated at all than with him losing to a greatly inferior score that was boosted for whatever reasons.

This year, it's actually not that bad because The Artist is listenable, but before something like in 2006 happens, please don't nominate him.

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#120 crocodile

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Posted 25 January 2012 - 11:12 AM

I know what you mean.

Karol
"Modern, serious music has become embroiled in an intellectual discussion that has no place in music. Certainly, the great composer of the past were geniuses and used their intellect, but only to serve their emotions and guide their craft. Not to dictate to them what they should or shouldn't write" - Michael Kamen, 1995

 





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