14 replies to this topic

[movieprof]

In the fall I'll be teaching a college course on the history of film music, and I was hoping someone here could point me to some useful academic or mainstream articles on Williams' work with Spielberg. We're devoting a few weeks to different director/composer relationships, and I have been searching various databases for articles on Spielberg/Williams to no avail.

I'm less interested in brief, biography-driven pieces (or newspaper articles). Mostly I'm looking for some meaty pieces that analyze their films and styles.

Anything and everything will be considered...so thank you all in advance for any help!

[WilliamsStarShip2282]

STAY AWAY FROM ANYTHING WRITTEN BY KATHRYN KALINAK. Shes written atleast two books, that i know of. In one of her books, she does and analysis on Williams score for Empire Strikes Back. A complete abomination, she should be embarassed. But, if you speak french, theres actually a book written about Williams.

http://www.amazon.fr...40244937&sr=1-2

[filmmusic]

Why stay away from Kalinak WIlliamsStarShip?
I have her book, although I've read only the ESB chapter.
I don't remember anything embarassing about it..

[Ren]

Will you be touching on any history like Erno Rapee or JS Zamecnik? I have loads of info pre1939 I also have some topical things about herrmann, composition for non musicians, and the like.....

[Thor]

I think Kalinak's book is fine. I have it and used it in my own thesis.

Of course, you have the three(?) books about JW now -- none of them in English -- that are seemingly based on academic treatises, but I have no idea about their quality or how deep they go.

One of the analysis chapters in my own thesis was actually about Williams' E.T. score -- mostly related to the concept of 'spectacular ecstasy', or as I put it -- the difference between narrative engrossment and audiovisual experience.

But now that I think about it, I haven't encountered many scholarly treatments of Williams' music over the years -- it's all been 99% biographical data in some form or fashion. Which is a shame, because it's the aesthetic interpretations that are really interesting. Anything else, I can find on Wikipedia etc.

[MSM]

This looks to be interesting, though maybe not enough in depth for you. It has an entire chapter on JW and the revival of the symphonic score.
http://www.amazon.co...y of film music

[filmmusic]

This looks to be interesting, though maybe not enough in depth for you. It has an entire chapter on JW and the revival of the symphonic score.
http://www.amazon.co...y of film music

according to a friend of mine that read it, nothing exceptional, or new. just the same that have been written over and over, and not an entire chapter on Williams as it seems..

[movieprof]

Thanks everybody!

Believe it or not, I've already put the Cooke book on my syllabus. It's definitely useful and covers a lot of ground. It's amazing to me that there isn't a single monograph on Williams. Scarecrow Press has been doing an admirable job publishing individual case studies of films with richly detailed score analysis along with a broader historical reading. Sadly, no Williams work...yet.

I'll try my hand at the French book and see what I can translate -- if anything, I might be able to draw on it for some lectures.

There is no shortage of writings on Herrmann and classical Hollywood composers such as Steiner and Korngold. But Goldsmith, Williams, and even Morricone haven't received sustained analytical treatment (as some of you can probably attest to).

[WilliamsStarShip2282]

Why stay away from Kalinak WIlliamsStarShip?
I have her book, although I've read only the ESB chapter.
I don't remember anything embarassing about it..

Well, I have "Settling The Score", and she writes that the melody is a major progression over minor chords.....which isnt at all correct. She said the melody sounds minor even though its major. The first chords are G minor, Eb minor and then back to G minor. If you dont believe me, just check out the sheet music or score. Also i sat in her class once.....and we were listening to Rotas " La Strada". The theme is a pretty melancholy tune, for a few reasons, but the only reason she said was that it was " sad because the melody is going down". That is an exact quote, btw

Thanks everybody!

Believe it or not, I've already put the Cooke book on my syllabus. It's definitely useful and covers a lot of ground. It's amazing to me that there isn't a single monograph on Williams. Scarecrow Press has been doing an admirable job publishing individual case studies of films with richly detailed score analysis along with a broader historical reading. Sadly, no Williams work...yet.

I'll try my hand at the French book and see what I can translate -- if anything, I might be able to draw on it for some lectures.

There is no shortage of writings on Herrmann and classical Hollywood composers such as Steiner and Korngold. But Goldsmith, Williams, and even Morricone haven't received sustained analytical treatment (as some of you can probably attest to).

yeah, its really a shame there isnt much.

[filmmusic]

Why stay away from Kalinak WIlliamsStarShip?
I have her book, although I've read only the ESB chapter.
I don't remember anything embarassing about it..

Well, I have "Settling The Score", and she writes that the melody is a major progression over minor chords.....which isnt at all correct. She said the melody sounds minor even though its major. The first chords are G minor, Eb minor and then back to G minor. If you dont believe me, just check out the sheet music or score.

well.... actually, this is right.
the first phrase of the melody (the first 9 notes or 2 bars) which is very characteristic of the Imperial march theme goes like this :
G-G-G-Eb-Bb-G-Eb-Bb-G

if you watch this carefully it's just an arpeggio in Eb major! (Eb-G-Bb)

But the harmony beneath is minor as you correctly said.
So, we indeed have a major melody sounding minor because of the harmony.
that was what she meant I believe..


and also, about that La strada theme.
It's indeed generally accepted that downward notes motion symbolizes sad feelings.. but of course this is not the only reason.
many things play a role, like the context in which this motion belongs to, the harmony, etc...

[Ren]

Why stay away from Kalinak WIlliamsStarShip?
I have her book, although I've read only the ESB chapter.
I don't remember anything embarassing about it..

Well, I have "Settling The Score", and she writes that the melody is a major progression over minor chords.....which isnt at all correct. She said the melody sounds minor even though its major. The first chords are G minor, Eb minor and then back to G minor. If you dont believe me, just check out the sheet music or score.

well.... actually, this is right.
the first phrase of the melody (the first 9 notes or 2 bars) which is very characteristic of the Imperial march theme goes like this :
G-G-G-Eb-Bb-G-Eb-Bb-G

if you watch this carefully it's just an arpeggio in Eb major! (Eb-G-Bb)

But the harmony beneath is minor as you correctly said.
So, we indeed have a major melody sounding minor because of the harmony.
that was what she meant I believe..


and also, about that La strada theme.
It's indeed generally accepted that downward notes motion symbolizes sad feelings.. but of course this is not the only reason.
many things play a role, like the context in which this motion belongs to, the harmony, etc...

I hear what you're saying. The problem is, the ear hears G as the home note so in a fixed 'do' scenario G (la) is the tonic. That in itself makes the melody sound minor. You don't really hear the G as 'mi' Mi is only the tonic in Phrygian mode.

[filmmusic]

well, I just explained what might Kalinak meant by her words..

but to take it further, i myself would say that if we take only that melody away of its context, away from harmony, away from its continuation, it is indeed a major chord.
i don't think the first thing that would come to anyone's mind would be to put Gminor and Ebminor underneath.
I repeat, if he had ONLY those 9 notes at his disposal (let's say for an exercise in harmony), without knowing anything else!

[indy4]

This looks to be interesting, though maybe not enough in depth for you. It has an entire chapter on JW and the revival of the symphonic score.
http://www.amazon.co...y of film music

If I remember correctly the entire chapter isn't about JW, although there's like a 10 page section that deals mostly with him. Still, interesting book.

[wanner251]

Eb major over g minor?? Sounds like she's just trying to be clever... I once heard someone say that in the song "Dream a Littl Dream of Me", the bridge goes to a German +6 chord.... He was obviously thinking he was being clever.... But cleverly wrong. So I said, "Really? I suppose the following chords are I 6/4 and then V7, right? Last I checked, they're not..." If it doesn't quack like a Ger+6, it's probably a duck.

To even suggest bitonality in the imperial march is pretty silly...

[WilliamsStarShip2282]

Eb major over g minor?? Sounds like she's just trying to be clever... I once heard someone say that in the song "Dream a Littl Dream of Me", the bridge goes to a German +6 chord.... He was obviously thinking he was being clever.... But cleverly wrong. So I said, "Really? I suppose the following chords are I 6/4 and then V7, right? Last I checked, they're not..." If it doesn't quack like a Ger+6, it's probably a duck.

To even suggest bitonality in the imperial march is pretty silly...

Shes always trying to be clever. The funny thing is i think theres an interview when Williams was full time conductor of the Pops, where he explains how the melody of the imperial march is minor