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Howard Shore's The Desolation Of Smaug (Hobbit Part 2)

Score Talk 2013 Scores The Hobbit Howard Shore Tolkien

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#1561 Faleel

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Posted 31 October 2013 - 10:41 PM

Wait, what?

Which one? #3? it would make sense.



well my words is made of fire time to burn

 

 

Among all the things I have done in my short and pitiful life, becoming an inside joke on JWFAN is the one I'm the least proud of.

The additional passage was interesting but not really something I would consider absolutely essential.

 


#1562 Once

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Posted 31 October 2013 - 10:45 PM

Wait, what?

Which one? #3? it would make sense.

No, the first one. I thought it was a known fact.

SafeUnderHill, why don't you link to your source when you post quotes? This one sounds a bit out of context and I would love to read more. :)



#1563 gkgyver

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Posted 31 October 2013 - 10:54 PM

Here's a nice quote from Conrad Pope.

Well, Emmanuel, that there is any music in this picture as thrilling as ROTK is for you, the composer and others to judge. My only hope is that justice has been done to the composer's vision and that the music we've made in Wellington doesn't disappoint him or the audience. Mine is a job ( as I often say) that one can only do "wrong"-- much like turning pages at a recital. Do it right and everybody says "But , of course---easy enough". Do it wrong, and you're an idiot. Hopefully, we all turned the pages properly. We'll see.

Also, he worked on Pirates of the Caribbean!

Now, with what he says here, can we see it as confirmed that Shore was not directly involved in the recording process in NZ? "Not involved" as in "not there in person".

After all, he says he hopes that the work THEY did in NZ will please the composer.
It all appears very fishy still ...

I wonder what crazy process TABA will be.

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#1564 KK.

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Posted 31 October 2013 - 11:46 PM

 

Wait, what?

Which one? #3? it would make sense.

No, the first one. I thought it was a known fact.

SafeUnderHill, why don't you link to your source when you post quotes? This one sounds a bit out of context and I would love to read more. :)

 

 

It was a reply on FB to someone who said something along the lines of "I hope this music is as awesome as RotK". It was a week or 2 ago I believe.


 

[–]CerebralCortexan[] 0 points

11 minutes ago  

Is there any truth to the rumours that you were physically ejected from Wellington Town Hall and had your baton torn from your grasp by Sir Conrad of Pope when you refused to do reprise the Revelation of the Ringwraiths for Thorin vs Azog II in BOTFA?

[–]Howard_Shore[S] 1 point

a minute ago  

No truth to it. Hahah!

 


#1565 Once

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 09:37 AM

Thanks!



#1566 Luke Skywalker

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:02 AM

 

Here's a nice quote from Conrad Pope.

Well, Emmanuel, that there is any music in this picture as thrilling as ROTK is for you, the composer and others to judge. My only hope is that justice has been done to the composer's vision and that the music we've made in Wellington doesn't disappoint him or the audience. Mine is a job ( as I often say) that one can only do "wrong"-- much like turning pages at a recital. Do it right and everybody says "But , of course---easy enough". Do it wrong, and you're an idiot. Hopefully, we all turned the pages properly. We'll see.

Also, he worked on Pirates of the Caribbean!

Now, with what he says here, can we see it as confirmed that Shore was not directly involved in the recording process in NZ? "Not involved" as in "not there in person".

After all, he says he hopes that the work THEY did in NZ will please the composer.
It all appears very fishy still ...

I wonder what crazy process TABA will be.

 

wow.

 

I mean shore has not even listened to the music?

 

At this rate TABA will be themes by howard shore, music arranged (or adapted) and conducted by Conrad pope... :heartbreak:



I hope Episode III is Called 'Revenge of the Sith'

#1567 BloodBoal

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:06 AM

Also, he worked on Pirates of the Caribbean!

 

If you're trying to reassure people by saying this, it's not going to work!


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#1568 SafeUnderHill

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:07 AM


Wait, what?

Which one? #3? it would make sense.

No, the first one. I thought it was a known fact.

SafeUnderHill, why don't you link to your source when you post quotes? This one sounds a bit out of context and I would love to read more. :)

Well it's on his Facebook page so not everyone has access. His response was to someone saying how amazing some ROTK moments were. If you want to find it, it's in the comments to his post about leaving the NZSO at the end (with one more day of choir recording to do).
I love hindsight.

BloodBoal "In any case, I like what I'm hearing about Azog. All reviews (even the bad ones) mention him as an awesome villain. Can't wait to see him (although I'm not really happy with the fact that it seems the whole "undead" business was true)."

Early AUJ review "Special attention must be given to the musical score of the film, both for original pieces (such as Misty Mountains, the haunting yet stirring theme for the Dwarves) and incorporation of the themes from Lord of the Rings. The musical cues go a long way to reinforce the connection I mentioned above. While the Misty Mountains theme pervades the film, there are also ties to the Shire, the Ring and even a heroic bit of music that I wont spoil here, but will come as a welcome surprise. "
Once "I wonder what part he's talking about." gkgyver "Probably the eagles." Once "Oh right!"

#1569 crocodile

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:08 AM

wow.

 

 

I mean shore has not even listened to the music?

 

Pope said that he hopes Shore is happy with... page-turning. That's all he said.

 

Karol


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"Modern, serious music has become embroiled in an intellectual discussion that has no place in music. Certainly, the great composer of the past were geniuses and used their intellect, but only to serve their emotions and guide their craft. Not to dictate to them what they should or shouldn't write" - Michael Kamen, 1995

#1570 SafeUnderHill

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:09 AM

It's in the comments of his post on 25 October at 00:00.
I love hindsight.

BloodBoal "In any case, I like what I'm hearing about Azog. All reviews (even the bad ones) mention him as an awesome villain. Can't wait to see him (although I'm not really happy with the fact that it seems the whole "undead" business was true)."

Early AUJ review "Special attention must be given to the musical score of the film, both for original pieces (such as Misty Mountains, the haunting yet stirring theme for the Dwarves) and incorporation of the themes from Lord of the Rings. The musical cues go a long way to reinforce the connection I mentioned above. While the Misty Mountains theme pervades the film, there are also ties to the Shire, the Ring and even a heroic bit of music that I wont spoil here, but will come as a welcome surprise. "
Once "I wonder what part he's talking about." gkgyver "Probably the eagles." Once "Oh right!"

#1571 BloodBoal

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:11 AM

Well, Emmanuel, that there is any music in this picture as thrilling as ROTK is for [...] the composer [...] to judge. My only hope is that justice has been done to the composer's vision and that the music we've made in Wellington doesn't disappoint him or the audience.

 

It all suggests Shore hasn't listened to the music yet! Oh my god!


TheLastHobbit_zps7ca46810.png


#1572 SafeUnderHill

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:15 AM


 

Here's a nice quote from Conrad Pope.

Well, Emmanuel, that there is any music in this picture as thrilling as ROTK is for you, the composer and others to judge. My only hope is that justice has been done to the composer's vision and that the music we've made in Wellington doesn't disappoint him or the audience. Mine is a job ( as I often say) that one can only do "wrong"-- much like turning pages at a recital. Do it right and everybody says "But , of course---easy enough". Do it wrong, and you're an idiot. Hopefully, we all turned the pages properly. We'll see.

Also, he worked on Pirates of the Caribbean!
Now, with what he says here, can we see it as confirmed that Shore was not directly involved in the recording process in NZ? "Not involved" as in "not there in person".

After all, he says he hopes that the work THEY did in NZ will please the composer.
It all appears very fishy still ...

I wonder what crazy process TABA will be.
 
wow.
 
I mean shore has not even listened to the music?
 
At this rate TABA will be themes by howard shore, music arranged (or adapted) and conducted by Conrad pope... :heartbreak:

I'm quite reassured knowing that PJ and Shore went through each scene spotting the music, or the themes and atmosphere. I'm sure Shore has written music for all of the scenes too with a pencil, but maybe not arranging it for full orchestra or getting it synced to the film. Of course though, I don't actually know.
It's better it's themes by and composed by Howard Shore than orchestrated and conducted by him though, even though we want him to do all three.

Well, Emmanuel, that there is any music in this picture as thrilling as ROTK is for [...] the composer [...] to judge. My only hope is that justice has been done to the composer's vision and that the music we've made in Wellington doesn't disappoint him or the audience.

 
It all suggests Shore hasn't listened to the music yet! Oh my god!

He must have some involvement in the CDs though right? Those are his chances to put versions he prefers.
I love hindsight.

BloodBoal "In any case, I like what I'm hearing about Azog. All reviews (even the bad ones) mention him as an awesome villain. Can't wait to see him (although I'm not really happy with the fact that it seems the whole "undead" business was true)."

Early AUJ review "Special attention must be given to the musical score of the film, both for original pieces (such as Misty Mountains, the haunting yet stirring theme for the Dwarves) and incorporation of the themes from Lord of the Rings. The musical cues go a long way to reinforce the connection I mentioned above. While the Misty Mountains theme pervades the film, there are also ties to the Shire, the Ring and even a heroic bit of music that I wont spoil here, but will come as a welcome surprise. "
Once "I wonder what part he's talking about." gkgyver "Probably the eagles." Once "Oh right!"

#1573 crocodile

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:22 AM

 

Well, Emmanuel, that there is any music in this picture as thrilling as ROTK is for [...] the composer [...] to judge. My only hope is that justice has been done to the composer's vision and that the music we've made in Wellington doesn't disappoint him or the audience.

 

It all suggests Shore hasn't listened to the music yet! Oh my god!

 

No, it doesn't.

 

Karol


Films On Wax
 
"Modern, serious music has become embroiled in an intellectual discussion that has no place in music. Certainly, the great composer of the past were geniuses and used their intellect, but only to serve their emotions and guide their craft. Not to dictate to them what they should or shouldn't write" - Michael Kamen, 1995

#1574 BloodBoal

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:23 AM

Yes, yes it does! We're doomed!


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#1575 crocodile

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 10:27 AM

We were sentenced to die the moment we entered this world, so that's nothing new!

 

Karol


Films On Wax
 
"Modern, serious music has become embroiled in an intellectual discussion that has no place in music. Certainly, the great composer of the past were geniuses and used their intellect, but only to serve their emotions and guide their craft. Not to dictate to them what they should or shouldn't write" - Michael Kamen, 1995

#1576 Doug Adams

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 11:35 AM

Shore wrote every note you'll hear, same as ever. He writes themes away from picture, then writes the actual compositions to picture. It's the same process he's always used.

 

At the same time, he supervised the orchestration and the recording. This is a newer part process, however, he's implemented it to a lesser degree on his last couple of projects (going all the way back to Hugo), so it's not entirely new. No one noted a signifcant difference in sound then, and no one will notice one now.

 

Does the NZSO sound like a different ensemble to discerning ears? Sure, a bit -- but no more so than the sound of the LPO changed over the years as membership changed. The ensemble that played FOTR wasn't exactly the same as the ensemble that played TTT, etc. If you picked up on this, you'll notice a slightly different sound to the group. If you didn't notice this, you won't notice anything here. The engineers, etc. are all Middle-earth vets, so they've made sure the sound flows seamlessly. 

 

Does the conducting change the sound? Well, not really, to be honest. Shore's principal job as a session conductor is to make sure that the ensemble understands the overall concept. So Shore worked with Pope through much of the summer -- and continuing through the fall -- to make sure he understood the concept. A session conductor is obviously not playing with tempo or even with interpretation, because that messes with the sync and the mix. It's a different gig. Even most of the balance comes from the ears in the booth. 

 

And though it's getting silly, I will reiterate, Shore is entirely healthy. Saw him last month, and he looked better rested than I do on the Hobbit appendices ... speaking of ...

 

No, Shore did not sit down for a new face-to-face interview for the appendices. Part of that was due to schedule (most of the appendices material was shot during the spring and summer when Shore was working on DOS; part of that due to the fact that sometimes people just don't enjoy having a camera shoved in their face. Shore is a pretty private guy. Despite the fact that he knows everyone in the industry, his inner circle is relatively small. There's a reason he lives in a forest. He likes quiet. Many composers do, which is hardly surprising.

 

The musical emphasis in this years appendices was songs, anyway. That was always going to be the focus, Shore or no Shore. I was asked to speak a little about the songs and to speak a little more about Shore's work, which I was happy to do. I've watched the doc once with my wife, and I showed the first few minutes to my parents, and that'll probably be the last time I look at it. I hate seeing myself on camera. But, it's good! The emphasis is definitely on the songs, but I believe the tentative plan is to do more in-depth score discussion next year.

 

I know that these threads last longer and are more entertaining when we all resort to exaggeration, in-character posts, and negativity that requires responses, but please try to remember that this is how ugly rumors get started. And rumors are strong currency in the fan community. Making a joke of a person's health is never cool; there's no way to sugar-coat that.

 

I don't stop by here that often -- though I stop by often enough to see who's making fun of me ... gotta keep the "naughty list" up-to-date! ;) But, if you have questions -- the type that I can actually answer -- feel free to flag me on Twitter (@DougAdamsMusic) or on the blog (www.MusicofLOTR.com)

 

I don't want to dissuade conversation here, but maybe all these "curious," "suspicious," "doom," posts could give way to actual material discussion if you'd just ask! I'm not scary. Just look at me in the appendices doc ... I'm really just a scrawny musician-type with access to interesting people. 

 

Ok. Horse out.



#1577 Jay

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 11:43 AM

Awesome post Doug, thanks for stopping in.

I agree with everything you suggest.

Everyone, to Doug you listen!

#1578 TownerFan

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 11:45 AM

Thanks, Doug.



#1579 Bilbo Skywalker

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 11:56 AM

Thank you Doug!


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#1580 gkgyver

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 12:34 PM

This should certainly clear things up.
Going back to "material discussion", I wonder if DoS will be more of a Nordic sound, like TTT was more sprinkled with Nordic influences compared to FotR.

"You think they wear those tight-fitting clothes just so some other bride can say 'Gee your hips look succulent'? The good-looking ones know we're looking, they love us to be looking, and god bless 'em, they're carrying the rest of their sex!" - Al Bundy


#1581 Incanus

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 12:59 PM

Thank you Doug once again! That made things much clearer and hopefully lessens the need for wild negative speculation.


Ars superior est vita hominum.

 

"We pop out and come into the world and music is there. We didn't invent it - it's all organised in the atmosphere by divinity or whatever. It's a miracle." - John Williams-

 

I think music is a stream of some kind. It could be blood. It could be water. It could be ether. Whatever it is it seems to be a living, organic force that’s in motion, that serves humanity and is part of humanity and part of what describes us as humans. We sing, play, dance, all the things that we do. And there is a vibrant and great literature we have been given. ... As musicians, we join the stream. We swim in the stream with all the other millions of music makers. It’s a life force, a strong one, surrounding us and we are part of it. -John Williams-


#1582 KK.

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:09 PM

Thanks Doug! Some "jokes" here get a bit carried away as you could tell. I was getting a bit ticked off myself by the whole "Shore never heard the music" thing. So thanks for the being the voice of reason, once again!

 

I think this thread really needs some solid updates to tame wild conspiracy theories!


 

[–]CerebralCortexan[] 0 points

11 minutes ago  

Is there any truth to the rumours that you were physically ejected from Wellington Town Hall and had your baton torn from your grasp by Sir Conrad of Pope when you refused to do reprise the Revelation of the Ringwraiths for Thorin vs Azog II in BOTFA?

[–]Howard_Shore[S] 1 point

a minute ago  

No truth to it. Hahah!

 


#1583 Incanus

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:12 PM

Thanks Doug! Some "jokes" here get a bit carried away as you could tell. I was getting a bit ticked off myself by the whole "Shore never heard the music" thing. So thanks for the being the voice of reason, once again!

 

I think this thread really needs some solid updates to tame wild conspiracy theories!

Well we are all victims of the internet age's instant gratification syndrome to some degree. Perhaps we should just be content to wait for the news instead of clamoring them as if they were our birth right. :)


Ars superior est vita hominum.

 

"We pop out and come into the world and music is there. We didn't invent it - it's all organised in the atmosphere by divinity or whatever. It's a miracle." - John Williams-

 

I think music is a stream of some kind. It could be blood. It could be water. It could be ether. Whatever it is it seems to be a living, organic force that’s in motion, that serves humanity and is part of humanity and part of what describes us as humans. We sing, play, dance, all the things that we do. And there is a vibrant and great literature we have been given. ... As musicians, we join the stream. We swim in the stream with all the other millions of music makers. It’s a life force, a strong one, surrounding us and we are part of it. -John Williams-


#1584 KK.

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:20 PM

That too. I wasn't demanding them of course. Just pointing out that our impatience along with the lack of news are probably major reasons for the speculation on this thread.


 

[–]CerebralCortexan[] 0 points

11 minutes ago  

Is there any truth to the rumours that you were physically ejected from Wellington Town Hall and had your baton torn from your grasp by Sir Conrad of Pope when you refused to do reprise the Revelation of the Ringwraiths for Thorin vs Azog II in BOTFA?

[–]Howard_Shore[S] 1 point

a minute ago  

No truth to it. Hahah!

 


#1585 Jay

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:21 PM

If the press release for the CDs doesn't come out today, I suppose it won't be until at least Monday that it does....

#1586 Bilbo Skywalker

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:23 PM

If the press release for the CDs doesn't come out today, I suppose it won't be until at least Monday that it does....

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=CHNJPsCDSqo


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#1587 SafeUnderHill

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:25 PM

Looking forwards to reading Adam's monster post!
I love hindsight.

BloodBoal "In any case, I like what I'm hearing about Azog. All reviews (even the bad ones) mention him as an awesome villain. Can't wait to see him (although I'm not really happy with the fact that it seems the whole "undead" business was true)."

Early AUJ review "Special attention must be given to the musical score of the film, both for original pieces (such as Misty Mountains, the haunting yet stirring theme for the Dwarves) and incorporation of the themes from Lord of the Rings. The musical cues go a long way to reinforce the connection I mentioned above. While the Misty Mountains theme pervades the film, there are also ties to the Shire, the Ring and even a heroic bit of music that I wont spoil here, but will come as a welcome surprise. "
Once "I wonder what part he's talking about." gkgyver "Probably the eagles." Once "Oh right!"

#1588 BloodBoal

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:26 PM

Who's Adam?


TheLastHobbit_zps7ca46810.png


#1589 Incanus

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:27 PM

That too. I wasn't demanding them of course. Just pointing out that our impatience along with the lack of news are probably major reasons for the speculation on this thread.

Indeed. I was not aiming this at you but rather all of us. In the end the root of the matter is our positive passion for this music that just ends up getting somewhat zany forms, due to the lack of concrete news.


Ars superior est vita hominum.

 

"We pop out and come into the world and music is there. We didn't invent it - it's all organised in the atmosphere by divinity or whatever. It's a miracle." - John Williams-

 

I think music is a stream of some kind. It could be blood. It could be water. It could be ether. Whatever it is it seems to be a living, organic force that’s in motion, that serves humanity and is part of humanity and part of what describes us as humans. We sing, play, dance, all the things that we do. And there is a vibrant and great literature we have been given. ... As musicians, we join the stream. We swim in the stream with all the other millions of music makers. It’s a life force, a strong one, surrounding us and we are part of it. -John Williams-


#1590 SafeUnderHill

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:44 PM

Sshh BB you know I meant Adams'.

Glad he's cleared up that Shore was involved with all stages of creating the score. Also that there will be more score talk for DOS in the appendices. I'm not bothered by the orchestra change anymore and would actually like if they sounded different to the AUJ score (more like the NZSO LOTR pieces), especially in this supposedly great wet-sounding hall they recorded in.
Really want to hear a score snippet! Even if it's just 30 seconds.
I love hindsight.

BloodBoal "In any case, I like what I'm hearing about Azog. All reviews (even the bad ones) mention him as an awesome villain. Can't wait to see him (although I'm not really happy with the fact that it seems the whole "undead" business was true)."

Early AUJ review "Special attention must be given to the musical score of the film, both for original pieces (such as Misty Mountains, the haunting yet stirring theme for the Dwarves) and incorporation of the themes from Lord of the Rings. The musical cues go a long way to reinforce the connection I mentioned above. While the Misty Mountains theme pervades the film, there are also ties to the Shire, the Ring and even a heroic bit of music that I wont spoil here, but will come as a welcome surprise. "
Once "I wonder what part he's talking about." gkgyver "Probably the eagles." Once "Oh right!"

#1591 KK.

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:52 PM

It was always clear that Shore was involved in all the stages of the scoring process. The paranoia here just kind of fogged up the obvious :P


 

[–]CerebralCortexan[] 0 points

11 minutes ago  

Is there any truth to the rumours that you were physically ejected from Wellington Town Hall and had your baton torn from your grasp by Sir Conrad of Pope when you refused to do reprise the Revelation of the Ringwraiths for Thorin vs Azog II in BOTFA?

[–]Howard_Shore[S] 1 point

a minute ago  

No truth to it. Hahah!

 


#1592 gkgyver

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 01:58 PM

I also didn't say he wasn't involved, I said "physically present" at the sessions.

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#1593 Bilbo Skywalker

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:19 PM

From Amazon!

 

 

 

Editorial Reviews
 
The Soundtrack features original score by Academy Award winner Howard Shore. 

The Special Edition of the Original Motion Picture Soundtrack to The Hobbit: The Desolation Of Smaug contains music from the film with twelve extended score cues, bonus track, liner notes by Producer and Director Peter Jackson, extended liner notes by Doug Adams with interactive orchestral sketch signed by composer Howard Shore packaged in a 2 CD hardcover DigiBook.

One of today's most respected, honored, and active composers and music conductors, Howard Shore previously worked with director Peter Jackson on The Lord Of The Rings Trilogy, which stands as his most towering achievement to date. He won three Academy Awards for his music for those films

 


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#1594 Jay

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:23 PM

Always quote your sources!

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FFT1BJ0

#1595 BloodBoal

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:23 PM

Interactive orchestral sketch? Interesting...


TheLastHobbit_zps7ca46810.png


#1596 Bilbo Skywalker

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:24 PM

Always quote your sources!

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FFT1BJ0

Sorry, I got excited :P

 

This is new info though?


Interactive orchestral sketch? Interesting...

Any idea what that even means?


"My armour is like tenfold shields, my teeth are swords, my claws spears, the shock of my tail is a thunderbolt, my wings a hurricane, and my breath death!"


#1597 BloodBoal

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:24 PM

Nope!


TheLastHobbit_zps7ca46810.png


#1598 Incanus

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:25 PM

Interactive orchestral sketch? Interesting...

Indeed. It will be interesting to see what that entails.

 

A good number of extended cues and a bonus piece on top of that. Very nice.

 

I have asked this a while ago but will this also mean that the regular OST tracks might again be a bit different in places than the SE ones?


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#1599 Bilbo Skywalker

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:28 PM

Doug just tweeted about it. I got there faster than him :P


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#1600 Jay

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Posted 01 November 2013 - 03:29 PM

Always quote your sources!

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FFT1BJ0

Sorry, I got excited :P
 
This is new info though?


Yes.

Interactive orchestral sketch? Interesting...

Any idea what that even means?


No.





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Score Talk, 2013 Scores, The Hobbit, Howard Shore, Tolkien

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