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Showing content with the highest reputation on 10/01/20 in all areas

  1. Between the approving comparisons of writers for the Washington Post -- a "dirt sheet" to which I now proudly count myself as a contributor! -- to literal Nazis, to what I can only interpret as a mocking emulation of a gay lisp in several above posts, this thread is getting really gross. I mentioned it up-thread, but when you see yourself implicitly compared to Joseph Goebbels, when that man was in fact responsible in part for murdering members of your family, then you begin to wonder whether this is an online community you want to participate in. The article in question is misguided and intellectually embarrassing enough as it is without these shit-posts. There's plenty of solid dismantling of its stupidity done a rhetorically responsible way in this thread and for that I'm grateful. You can criticize bad music analysis without resorting to infantile homophobia or your personal political axe-grinding.
    7 points
  2. There are more pressing issues than Star Wars music is racist and here's why John Williams sucks Like how my city is under attack by my own country because CHINA GOOD and FREEDOM BAD. I'm grateful to have encountered John Williams' music at a young age, or else I would've ended up becoming yet another brainless slave. Would I love to see a Hongkonger become a Hollywood composer? Yes! Am I an aspiring composer/student? Yes and I'd love to work for Hollywood even tho It's quite impossible given my financial situation. Another can of tear gas fired. Yippee. In AOTC, there is an entire chase scored with music infused with Asian influences. Asian music employed to convey a sense of heroism in an exciting Hollywood chase scene! Is that racist? No! SW is about the fight against tyranny and injustice. Nothing in Star Wars is as bad as the bigotry on display in my country. Another can of tear gas fired. Yippee. So Guy Who Writes Click-Baity Articles For The Washington Post, stop selling your death sticks, go home and rethink your life.
    6 points
  3. Approaching the Throne (OST), Parents (FYC), Coming Together (FYC), The Force is with You (OST), and Farewell (OST) make for a very satisfying climatic listening experience that is rooted in drama rather than spectacle. Probably my favorite stretch of music combining both albums.
    6 points
  4. There's no way to slice this article's contention to be viewed in any favorable light. You're either for the freedom of artistic expression through cultural appropriation, or you're creating more boundaries by saying who can and can't use what instrument and in what manner they're used for. You're throwing intent and context away. Yeah, I'm pretty sure the subtextual connotations of Williams, Shore and modern film composers appropriating Eastern instrumentation isn't just nefarious, but some form of blind ignorance to their oppression and othering of minorities... Yeah right. What's Jazz then when composers other than African Americans write it or play it? Or by extension film scoring, a beautiful melting pot of genre, culture and artistic expression when you reduce it to these strict cultural boundaries? The reason this article has me so riled up is that when real progress is made in areas where these issues are better fought, you have these articles that unceremoniously take a swipe at low hanging fruit and in doing so take a giant step back and proactively weaken the legitimacy of other arguments for it.
    5 points
  5. I guess Howard Shore is racist for his orchestration of Smaug's music. Jackson should have fired him and hired a dragon to compose that theme!
    5 points
  6. My return flight from NYC last summer departed at JFK in the evening and had a brief stopover in Zurich. I arrived at home at about the same time it is now. So depending on when Williams's flight departed and whether it's a direct flight, he might be here already or still on his way. Anyway, here's my own photo of the poster at the Musikverein, now complete with "sold out" sticker:
    4 points
  7. Look, I'm all about people learning to respect other cultures and people from different backgrounds. I'm all about giving opportunities for less favored people, specially the ones from under-represented cultures, to shine on culture, sports, business, politics, etc. I come from one of the most unequal countries on the world. Right here, the culture from indigenous and black people are being torned apart by the white, Christian elites, with religions like "Umbanda" being hunted mercilessly all over the country. That said, this woke culture has evolved (or, actually, retroceded) from something that could bring new opportunities to minorities to something resembling a witch hunt, on which the smallest details are enough to label a person or a work of art racist, homophobic, transphobic, etc. Thanks to social media and this terrifying XXI century monster called Cancel Culture, people are hysterically sensitive and outrageous about small and silly stuff. The worst part: it is having the exact opposite effect than what it was intended for. Instead of making people more aware of the difficulties that minorities face, it makes them angry and revolted to see their idols being attacked by some opinion columnist or a Twitter mob. It's ridiculous! So, either the "woke people" wake up (lol) and starts realizing that their angry tweets and articles are having the opposite effect, or they'll end having amassed more antipathy than sympathy for minorities.
    4 points
  8. God this is such a weird thing to even have to broach on a place like JWFan... "Woke" simply means aware. That's it. "Stay Woke" is basically a call to pay attention to what's out there and looking to hurt you and yours. Over time it came to mean something more like "pay attention to political happenings and cultural movements seeking to make life worse for you or your friends," and through that usage, the term became first overused (as any popular bit of slang will) and eventually rendered meaningless by its transformation into a meme. At that point, it became demonized on top of losing its meaning, by people not just upset at the obnoxious overuse of the term, but also by the notion other people might actually believe in progressive ideas and movements, and whose cynical nature leaves them inclined to regard such statements or discussions as purely performative and "fake" for the sake of earning internet points from fellow "virtue signalers." At this point, the only people who still even use the term "Woke" are people who more or less the reject the entire concept of "Social Justice" (another term with a long history in America that has only recently become demonized and rendered useless by people made uncomfortable by its modern usage) and are mockingly/ironically deploying the term to diminish and demean the people who might have once earnestly used the descriptor. I'm honestly really surprised how often this sort of ugly, antisocial, and dismissive discourse tends to pop up here, of all places, a site dedicated to enjoying the music of John Williams, but hopefully this might help a few people out? I don't know. But there are lots of ways - more constructive ways, as more than a few posters here have shown - to engage with how poorly thought-out and badly written this thinkpiece at the Post is than to indulge in... whatever all the rest of this ugly stuff is.
    4 points
  9. 4 points
  10. Why do we care anymore? Star Wars died in 1997. The grave was set afire in 1999. The ashes of that calamity were pissed on in 2002, in the form of CGI Yoda jumping around like a goblin from a fever dream.
    3 points
  11. Thor

    Braveheart

    You're absolutely right. A modern masterpiece! Here's a story for ya: When I attended the Horner concert in Vienna a few years ago, with the composer present, I was seated next to a young girl (Horner was actually sitting just right in front of me, to the right). On her lap was a poster of BRAVEHEART of some kind, probably something she wanted signed. As the BRAVEHEART music was performed, I could clearly see she was moved to tears. As a consequence, I was moved to tears too. I mean, I've always loved the film and score, but to see that young girl, she couldn't be more than 14-15 years old, react so strongly to a score that was written way before she was born, I just found immensely moving.
    3 points
  12. Some interesting variations on the Victory theme here (0:59 - 1:22), with a sense of trying to find its ultimate form in terms harmony and intervals (i.e. in Farewell), ending quite unresolved before the Resistance theme enters by contrast in its most formal guise. But always that cell of note - falling second - note.
    3 points
  13. Over time it came to mean, "be hysterically sensitive towards and hysterically sensitive about literally everything and anything."
    3 points
  14. According to Mike Matessino JW is on the plane to Vienna today! https://filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?pageID=4&forumID=1&threadID=138909&archive=0
    3 points
  15. "Parents" and "Coming Together" are incredible tracks. I hope the FYC releases in lossless sometime soon.
    3 points
  16. And the examples he doesn't ignore, he gets wrong! I mean, Darth Maul has a motif, but it's not Duel of the Fates, which is an action set-piece -- an apocalyptic one, for sure, but not an explicit portrait of "evil." Maul's actual theme is a growly chromatic thing that is thoroughly Western in compositional sensibility. As are all the themes for all the other main villains: Vader, the Emperor, the Death Star, the Imperial Motif, the Droid Army, Gen. Grievous, Kylo Ren, the First Order, and on and on. The only villain to get a vaguely exotic-sounding theme is Jabba, and his musical characterization is probably more saliently made by his source music, which is a twisted Baroque minuet, than his tuba theme! If anyone is interested in actual good film music cultural criticism, there's plenty out there. In particular, if you want an essay on how good & evil are conveyed stylistically in this series, the standard is still James Buhler's 2001 article "Star Wars, Music & Myth." It was written pre-prequels, and there are parts you may disagree with, but on the whole it's the model for sensitive, musically-literate analysis of the broader social and political implications of Williams's music.
    3 points
  17. Here's my analysis of the new themes in The Rise of Skywalker (beware: spoilers present!) http://www.filmmusicnotes.com/new-themes-and-their-meaning-in-the-rise-of-skywalker/ Enjoy!
    2 points
  18. https://estonianworld.com/culture/arvo-part-was-the-worlds-second-most-performed-living-composer-in-2019/
    2 points
  19. My rationale is that the guidance by the academy is always and always to consider the score in context and vote based on that. Everyone and their mother in Hollywood was going to see Star Wars Ep 9. So visibility was not going to be a problem (that is what a Oscar campaigning is basically, making sure members see your films). But there was 1 extraordinary circumstance - which was that the date for the shortlist was before the release of the film. So as a stop gap, Disney released the FYC score to the music branch so that they could include it in the shortlist. -- This actually breaks protocol, because technically the music branch members put Williams on the shortlist WITHOUT watching the film and hearing the score in context. But I think this was a professional courtesy extended because of the sense that of course it is going to be one of the 15 best. So he kinda sorta got a free shortlist mention. But not the nomination. The nomination he will have to win by impressing his peers. -- I have seen this happen 1 other time. In the VFX category which also works in the similar 3 step process. The Hobbit film (don't remember which part) was not locked and the VFX were not done and the shortlist deadline was before the film. So the studio basically submitted the trailer and the VFX branch shortlisted it with the rationale that of course it was going to have one of the 15 best VFX of the year. It did eventually win the nomination.
    2 points
  20. Fargo

    Braveheart

    I credit this movie (and Empire Strikes Back) to forming my love for film score. When I was a kid, I would watch this movie almost every Sunday, late in the afternoon, with my dad. He’d be taking a nap on the couch and I’d put the VHS of this on, and we’d just watch it. Maybe a little conversation before the Nap took him over, talking about our week, how everything is going, etc. They were great times. Now I can’t watch this movie or listen to the score anymore without remember those afternoons. I’m sure it was equal parts music, action, violence, and nudity that made me love the movie so much.
    2 points
  21. Edmilson

    Braveheart

    5 stars, it's wonderful
    2 points
  22. Since your old one actually says "cancelled", that one gave me a little jump. You should hide it using spoiler tags to make sure people read the text first.
    2 points
  23. That's what people on far right tend to do. But let's be fair. It's just as bad on far left... Karol
    2 points
  24. Welcome to my ignore list for lack of logical reasoning, excess word-salad, and laughable label thinking.
    2 points
  25. Well, depends on the flights. A quick search indicates you can't get direct flights from LA to Vienna so he probably went LA > New York > Vienna or LA > London > Vienna. Seems like the fastest possible flight (with a stopover) is ~14 hours and that's assuming he's not stopping elsewhere in Europe for a couple of days before heading to Vienna. Either way, safe flying and good health to the Maestro! Hopefully that WaPo article wasn't lying around in the terminal before boarding. Seems funny nobody recognized him and snapped a photo in a terminal somewhere (unless he flew a private jet? I've always assumed JW flies commercially, albeit in business/first class).
    2 points
  26. Banned words on this thread from this moment on: “cancel”, “illness”, “apologies”, “unforeseen circumstances”, “deeply sorry”, “regretfully”, “rescheduled”. Thank you for your time.
    2 points
  27. Nobody ever said that, though. Dude. Who is being "needlessly cruel to one of [the forum's] best members"? We all love Falstaft here. If you're referring to the instance of the user who posted the Goebbels image: 1. that person was chastised by Jay awhile ago and 2. that image was in no way directed at Falstaft, anyways... Can we please stop the pearl-clutching? Nobody here is attacking Falstaft. The Goebbels image was dealt with long ago by Jay; why can't you move beyond it? You keep seemingly trying to conjure up outrage for the sake of outrage.
    2 points
  28. I guess they were just force 'sensitive'. 'Hey.... ouch...don't use force....'
    2 points
  29. Cast away not those who are not of a like mind Homogeneous thought will tyranny leave behind Silence no one - Indian, American or Greek Because in a free country everyone gets to speak
    2 points
  30. Jay already called Josh out, though, and since then things have been pretty well-behaved I thought(?). Nobody was comparing you to Goebbels; you wrote a great article about film music, lol. Yes, Josh's comment was over-the-top, but I don't think someone calling out the mainstream media (largely in regards to reporting of news) automatically means that a side-gig arts contributor who wrote an article on STAR WARS music should take offense, as though it were directed at you personally. Everybody here loves you and your contributions both to this forum as well as to film music discussion across the board. Josh very well may not have even known you had written that article for the Post, and I'm sure if you asked him he would say he was not referring to you in the least. No offense, but it seems like you might be reading into things a bit too much. And I didn't read that other comment above as being intended to be a gay lisp, or as being homophobic... Never thought of it as possibly being that, until reading your comment. I think it's a tad unfair to assume that anything spelled out like that is "homophobic". Idk, just seems like some people here are getting a little too offended. Scrolling through the thread, the discourse here seems to be pretty friendly for the most part, save for the few people showing up trying to say that it's somehow not...
    2 points
  31. I would add that the author and like-minded people would say it is not cultural appropriation (or at least not the bad kind), when a non-European descendant composes for an orchestra. Just so dumb. I know we are giving the author too much attention by even discussing this, but we also know that the author represents the logical conclusion to a lot of people's principles on these things--so, I suppose we have to respond.
    2 points
  32. This is a perfect example for what is permeating society anyway: people wouldn't even consider John Williams music as whatever this dirt sheet writer is implying, unless someone told them they should. That's how the game always goes. It's bordering on mind control.
    2 points
  33. Thinking the media is in cahoots to deceive you, the only person who knows the real truth, rather than just being an industry full of frequently dumb people who live in a bubble because they all come from the same socioeconomic background, is a form of faux-wokeness unto itself. And I don’t mean that as an excuse to not read things critically.
    2 points
  34. Even as a liberal, I find the practice of heavily reading into works of art to find minute "problematic" meanings to be utterly stupid and anti-art.
    2 points
  35. (in response to original article) Huh? Which part any of the SW scores is 'expressed in the vocabulary of Chinese, Indian and Middle Eastern music'? Last time I checked, Imperial March sounded pretty Western to me.
    2 points
  36. I have no problem with this type of cultural criticism when it is well thought out. This article just selectively overlooks counter examples like the Imperial March to make a point, and that’s unacceptable.
    2 points
  37. Ha, ha.....some crazy times we're living in if this kind of drivel gets published in a reputed newspaper like the Washington Post. Unbelievable. In a similar vein, let's refute the use of a cymbal in orchestral music, because if you put the cymbal horizontally, it kinda looks like a traditional Chinese straw hat. Racist!
    2 points
  38. He forgot to mention how John Williams is racist because his themes for Lando, Rose and Finn never get re-used in subsequent films. Karol
    2 points
  39. I love how he just completely ignores the fact that "The Imperial March"—arguably the most famous "bad guy" theme in history—is written in the European symphonic tradition. EDIT: It's ironic that such a stupid article about Williams' music for villains would come from the Washington Post, so soon after @Falstaft (hiatus til TROS) just wrote them a really great one about Williams' music for villains...
    2 points
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