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Most likely a coincidence. That said, this does underscore the important scene when Kylo becomes Ben again, and he was named after Obi-Wan. 🤷🏻‍♂️

Johnny, You might be misinterpreting the thread title. Igger is simply claiming that the melody is the same as the beginning of Obi-Wan's theme, not that JW literally score the scene thinking of Obi. Clearly, the notes are the same. I would say that these ideas are bump around JW's head in a sort of "this is SW music sort of way," and it, whether intentional or not, become the theme for Obi when he sat down to write it.

Not being critical but have you considered that expansions might enhance your opinions of these scores and make you want to listen to them more often? That's been my experience with almost every Mike Matessino expansion; after hearing his expanded presentations I almost never revisit JW's album presentations. And scores I never listened to in OST form (Always, Presumed Innocent) suddenly got heaps of airtime after being fleshed out with expanded presentations. All 3 of the scores you mentioned were revelatory experiences in expanded form. And in the case of Minority Report, the improvement in sound quality alone made the score more listenable.

I wonder what the one that wont be named thinks 🙃

I don't listen to her Loki scores on their own, but it was definitely a far far superior effort to Obi-Wan and definitely enhanced the show.

I love Donnybrook. The woodwinds from 0:50 onwards, especially that staccato bassoon, is delicious. As delicious as cookies, I daresay.

@karelm For ROTJ, 'Jedi Rocks' is handled the same as the 'Cantina Band' source cues--no orchestra is playing on stage, the music is coming from the film's audio track. However, the music for the 'Victory Celebration' sequence (as well as the sequence where the Ewoks 'escort' our heroes to their village) is performed on stage with live percussion-- rattles, xylophone, bass drum--but no live choir.

From @mstrox's own words: That definition of yours doesn't even begin to work, because it implies looking things through purely the lens of a minority is inherently a dour experience. Does it look like a movie like Nope is dragging me through the mud due to its cast and crew? Are some of the latest DLCs from Guilty Gear Strive talking down to me just because they happened to feature trans/nonbinary characters? I wouldn't think so, so you're dangerously close to just admitting the mere existence of these particular groups bother you (which I will stress I don't think you're intending to do, because I lack the awareness to understand how this can come across to the uninformed). I would actually argue the Oscars used to be much closer to the proper definition of woke, simply because the historical/regular dramas that we made fun of for being the easy ticket to a nomination were much more about those subjects than what gets nominated now, which often tends to superficially resemble what people ask for, just for the sake of the higher ups hoping the masses shut up afterwards (instead of making truthfully meaningful choices). I never liked these particular discussions much, because it's ultimately a very meaningless critique to anyone that isn't a select few trying to subconsciously create the notion that these concepts are an issue in the first place. I get told it wouldn't matter if the characters were white or straight in regards to criticizing a shallow product, yet even the small differences in how I see someone perceive two aesthetically different but ultimately similar in feel projects is astounding. I recognize there is an issue of "new" things feeling so sudden and front loaded (to which I'll admit a few in these spheres don't always do a good job at priming a casual viewer for), but there's just so much one can do before they eventually go "it's all here to stay, so you might as well get used to it."

Those are definitely the opening notes of Obi-Wan's theme. Nice find.

Never did.

Honestly I don't think the music direction was her fault, blame the showrunners. She's done some fine work in the past and she even said in interviews all her classic-sounding themes were rejected

Probably hearing things... but found this little melody from the first movie similar to Franglen's new theme.

Because it's great

☑️ People flying ☑️ People falling ☑️ People flying catching people falling ☑️ People smashing people into walls ☑️ People getting smashed into walls ☑️ Electric bolts of electric magic being shot at people ☑️ Said bolts being deflected ☑️ Shots of people landing in "hero" stance ☑️ Heroes "assembling" shot ☑️ Villains emerging from rifts in the sky/ground ☑️ Villain in voice-over saying ominous/threatening things ☑️ Cars being thrown & overturned (cars MUST be thrown) ☑️ Scary looking CGI creatures doing CGI things ☑️ Third act massive destruction in major metropolitan city by scary looking CGI creatures doing CGI things and people flying around, falling, smashing into walls, throwing cars and sending magic electric bolts. Extras fleeing. ☑️ Sly pop-culture reference. Occasional quip/snarky humour to let us know we just don't take any of this as seriously as you do. Now, seriously give us your Dollars, Pounds, Euro, Yen & Yuan! Rinse & repeat. And don't forget to put your phone on silent. Never change Hollywood, never change.

This is not my experience in most cases. There are exception like Amistad or The Lost World, which I did not like as OST, but grew on me in expanded form, but normally it is just more of the same or similar. Either I like it or not. If I like it, great, bring it on. If not, eh not so much. Indeed with Always and Presumed Innocent the expanded soundtrack did not change much in my perception of the music. Those 2 are really the reason that I am now more selective, since I did not listen to them any more after the first 2 listens just after purchase. Just same old, although Always has a nice alternate that I like, so it is not a total loss.

John Williams: My Life In Turtlenecks

And the cookies.

I'm convinced by now Babylon will win the award. I felt Williams had a very good chance a few weeks ago, but there is no momentum left behind his work for The Fabelmans. The stars just aren't aligned anymore in his favor. Despite this: I really enjoy his work for The Fabelmans and regard the main theme as one of his most beautiful compositions. And that is more important to me than another Oscar win.

I wish they'd remake this as a fight sequence with better choreography than the original, but actually make it feel like something George would've shot in 1976. I hate every lens flare, modern camera trick, and usage of RotS music in this video.

No self-respecting Williams fan can be without this, just sayin'

In these contexts, “Woke” means “things I don’t like that I am scared to confront the reasons why”

yeah but his clip still sounds like the opening of ObiWan

Graham Foote (and his ensemble) did the vocals for "Living in The Age of Airplanes", and then the "Pandora" attraction music, but he did NOT work on Horner's Avatar score in 2009. The vocalists who carried over from the 2009 Horner score are Clydene Jackson, Terry Wood (you see them in the behind-the-scenes material on the Blu-ray) along with Carmen Twillie and Lisbeth Scott (Scott also performed on Amazing Spider-Man as well)

John Williams with Yo-Yo Ma Tuesday Feb 20, 2024, 7:30 PM Performance Details John Williams Conductor Yo-Yo Ma Cello Williams Cello Concerto Williams Selections from film scores With an astonishing five Oscars and 25 GRAMMY Awards, John Williams is one of the most beloved composers of all time, having written unforgettable music for the screen as well as the concert hall. Join Williams and long-time friend Yo-Yo Ma for a performance of the composer’s sublime Cello Concerto, along with selections from some of his beloved film scores. https://www.philorch.org/performances/our-season/events-and-tickets/2023-2024-season/verizon-hall/john-williams-and-yo-yo-ma/

It's a beautiful - but windy - day in Burbank! Clear blue skies are a nice change from the snow and rain. 5 Hour till the start of taping!

I think Azkaban only tours where a choir can be booked

Plus Zimmer won the Globe and the BAFTA so he was already the frontrunner by Oscar night I think there's a chance All Quiet wins BAFTA so it could end up being a bit of a toss-up. The British voter base seems to really be pushing that one uphill since the movie in general didn't get nominated by the other US awards, so I would still be suspicious of it winning the Oscar. If Hurwitz or Son Lux win BAFTA then Oscar is probably theirs to lose. Overall my most likely to least likely would be Babylon, EEAAO, Fabelmans, All Quiet (but if it wins BAFTA then I'd at least put it third), and then Banshees which is the only one that feels like there's no chance, even though it is a Best Picture frontrunner. Effectively, though, I think Babylon and EEAAO are pretty much the only ones in the running.

Very enlightening thread and a reminder of the wondrous sound that JW conjured for the prequels -- a soundworld that remains peerless even in his own body of work. But my eyes keep getting tripped up over the cue title. I'm sorry, but is it supposed to be "The Armies Face Off" or "The Armies' Face-Off"? Is face off used in the noun or verb sense?? 'Cause it sure as shit can't be both at once. Well, there you have it -- the only criticism toward JW I'll ever come up with.

A2 has passed Infinity War. https://variety.com/2023/film/news/avatar-2-fifth-highest-grossing-movie-infinity-war-1235503362/

This does look fun. I really enjoyed the first. But I'm mostly watching this for Helen Mirren & Lucy Liu. Mostly because it's probably not going anywhere in the future

An entire trailer with no Greg?

I know, it was a veiled attempt to poke fun at those for whom it's full, symphony orchestra or death...

It’s an honor just to be nominated

I don’t know how you do it, @Jay!

My purchases of the expanded WotW and MR were some time after their release, but in neither case were they important or significant purchases for me (bearing in mind my fandom of JW is pretty casual compared to most here). I primarily got them to free both scores from Williams' meddling and to get the best possible sound quality. I was astonished at how bad the OST of Worlds sounds compared to MM's expansion. There's a limit - no MM expansion is going to make me enjoy a score I didn't like in the first place, but for those cases where I've had an OST for a couple of decades and I like the bulk of it, I'm probably going to get the expansion eventually.

Williams has a kind of melodic and harmonic language that unifies all the “good guy” music in Star Wars; so themes from that theme group are bound to sound similar, especially when we’re dealing with two pieces of music that were conceived at close proximity.

This has been mentioned before; isn't this just the first bit of the Anthem of Evil theme? EDIT: Also, these notes are nothing unique, but rather a JW trademark: "Main Title and Escape" 4:34, "The Supremacy" 1:22, "The Quidditch Match" 3:47, "Ludlow's Demise" 1:36, I could go on and on...

I hate to burst your bubble, but that is NOT Obi-Wan’s theme. This cue scores the scene when Kylo Ren becomes Ben Solo, when he speaks to the memory of his father, Han Solo. What you are referring to is the Ben Solo theme, a slight variation of Kylo Ren’s theme. You need to change the title of this topic; not accurate at all.

And my memory is that most of the underscore that actually used Williams' theme was written by Ross, wasn't it?

She was closer to working with him than I have ever been

Wasn't it revealed that she never worked "with" him, just on the same project?

And people say commas aren't important.

Even though "The Map Room: Dawn", and "The Miracle Of The Ark", are two distinctly seperate cues, they are still the two greatest cues in the Indiana Jones film series.

(!SPOILERS FOR BOTH VIDEO GAMES!)

I don't like these statements. People should be nominated for what they did, not for who they are. We should absolutely have more female composers in high profile jobs, but this positive discrimination just doesn't work.

Even when I don't 100% understand the storylines, this show has a vividly realised fantasy world to wallow in. And sometimes, that's enough. How spectacular it looks is good news for Doctor Who, as HDM's production company (Bad Wolf) will also be making it.

The Phantom Menace is tops. Empire comes close and Star Wars is timeless but nothing touches Phantom. It opened the imagination in ways none of his other Star Wars scores come close to doing. I think the Droid Battle should be talked about with the same reverence as Battle in the Snow.

It is wild how much of a time capsule this score is. It immediately took me straight back to that era. I was worried an OST wasn't going to happen so I'm glad to hear it has! I'll be honest - I'm disappointed in the Main Title, it feels a bit like a hodge podge. Almost like he has written something cohesive and someone asked, last minute to include the latin influence in there. It just doesn't flow for me, kind of starts and stops. Really love the first two scores - they're so fun, so I'm happy to have some more in that collection. The show is certainly fun to watch, although it has some moments that are an insane stretch even for the world of National Treasure.

I found a list of scores recorded at the Abbey Road Studios from 1981 to 2013: Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981) - John Williams Dragonslayer (1981) - Alex North Outland (1981) - Jerry Goldsmith The Dark Crystal (1982) - Trevor Jones The Secret of NIMH (1982) - Jerry Goldsmith Star Wars Episode VI: Return of the Jedi (1983) - John Williams Brazil (1985) - Michael Kamen Ladyhawke (1985) - Andrew Powell Young Sherlock Holmes (1985) - Bruce Broughton Highlander (1986) - Michael Kamen Aliens (1986) - James Horner An American Tail (1986) - James Horner The Last Emperor (1987) - Ryuichi Sakamoto, David Byrne, Cong Su RoboCop (1987) - Basil Poledouris Willow (1988) - James Horner The Land Before Time (1988) - James Horner All Dogs Go to Heaven (1989) - Ralph Burns An American Tail: Fievel Goes West (1991) - James Horner Tom and Jerry: The Movie (1992) - Henry Mancini Chaplin (1992) - John Barry Shadow of the Wolf (1992) - Maurice Jarre The Man Without a Face (1993) - James Horner M. Butterfly (1993) - Howard Shore Interview with the Vampire (1994) - Elliot Goldenthal Little Women (1994) - Thomas Newman Braveheart (1995) - James Horner Copycat (1995) - Christopher Young The Crucible (1996) - George Fenton Brassed Off (1996) - Trevor Jones G.I. Jane (1997) - Howard Shore (???) Lost in Space (1997) - Bruce Broughton Wilde (1997) - Debbie Wiseman Practical Magic (1997) - Alan Silvestri The Prince of Egypt (1998) - Hans Zimmer What Dreams May Come (1998) - Michael Kamen Bicentennial Man (1999) - James Horner Message in a Bottle (1999) - Gabriel Yared Sleepy Hollow (1999) - Danny Elfman Star Wars: Episode I - The Phantom Menace (1999) - John Williams The Talented Mr. Ripley (1999) - Gabriel Yared Captain Corelli's Mandolin (2001) - Stephen Warbeck Chicken Run (2000) - John Powell, Harry Gregson-Williams My Dog Skip (2000) - William Ross Hollow Man (2000) - Jerry Goldsmith Enemy at the Gates (2001) - James Horner Shrek (2001) - John Powell, Harry Gregson-Williams Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within (2001) - Elliot Goldenthal Iris (2001) - James Horner From Hell (2001) - Trevor Jones The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring (2001) - Howard Shore Return to Never Land (2002) - Joel McNeely The Time Machine (2002) - Klaus Badelt Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (2001) - John Williams Gangs of New York (2002) - Howard Shore Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (2002) - John Williams The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (2002) - Howard Shore Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones (2002) - John Williams The Hours (2002) - Philip Glass Lara Croft Tomb Raider: The Cradle of Life (2003) - Alan Silvestri The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (2003) - Howard Shore Sinbad: Legend of the Seven Seas (2003) - Harry Gregson-Williams Cold Mountain (2003) - Gabriel Yared Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (2004) - John Williams King Arthur (2004) - Hans Zimmer Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow (2004) - Edward Shearmer Kingdom of Heaven (2005) - Harry Gregson-Williams Because of Winn-Dixie (2005) - Rachel Portman Wallace & Gromit in The Curse of the Were-Rabbit (2005) - Julian Nott Star Wars: Episode III - Revenge of the Sith (2005) - John Williams The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe (2005) - Harry Gregson-Williams Charlie and the Chocolate Factory (2005) - Danny Elfman The Queen (2006) - Alexandre Desplat The Black Dahlia (2006) - Mark Isham The Omen (2006) - Marco Beltrami United 93 (2006) - John Powell Apocalypto (2006) - James Horner The Water Horse (2007) - James Newton Howard The Golden Compass (2007) - Alexandre Desplat Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (2007) - Nicholas Hooper 3:10 to Yuma (2007) - Marco Beltrami Stardust (2007) - Ilan Eshkeri Spider-Man 3 (2007) - Christopher Young Eastern Promises (2007) - Howard Shore There Will Be Blood (2007) - Jonny Greenwood Shrek the Third (2007) - Harry Gregson-Williams The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian (2008) - Harry Gregson-Williams Defiance (2008) - James Newton Howard Madagascar: Escape 2 Africa (2008) - Hans Zimmer City of Ember (2008) - Andrew Lockington Hellboy II: The Golden Army (2008) - Danny Elfman The Mummy: Tomb of the Dragon Emperor (2008) - Randy Edelman Journey to the Center of the Earth (2008) - Andrew Lockington Fantastic Mr. Fox (2009) - Alexandre Desplat Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince (2009) - Nicholas Hooper Amelia (2009) - Gabriel Yared Astro Boy (2009) - John Ottman Nanny McPhee Returns (2010) - James Newton Howard Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time (2010) - Harry Gregson-Williams Robin Hood (2010) - Marc Streitenfeld Iron Man 2 (2010) - John Debney Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 1 (2010) - Alexandre Desplat The King's Speech (2010) - Alexandre Desplat The Tree of Life (2011) - Alexandre Desplat Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 2 (2011) - Alexandre Desplat The Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn Part 1 (2011) - Carter Burwell Hugo (2011) - Howard Shore The Iron Lady (2011) - Thomas Newman The Pirates! Band of Misfits (2012) - Theodore Shapiro Journey 2 The Mysterious Island (2012) - Andrew Lockington Prometheus (2012) - Marc Streitenfeld The Avengers (2012) - Alan Silvestri For Greater Glory (2012) - James Horner ParaNorman (2012) - Jon Brion Rise of the Guardians (2012) - Alexandre Desplat Skyfall (2012) - Thomas Newman The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey (2012) - Howard Shore Zero Dark Thirty (2012) - Alexandre Desplat 42 (2013) - Mark Isham Iron Man 3 (2013) - Brian Tyler Source: http://musicbehindthescreen.blogspot.com/2013/08/scoring-stages-abbey-road.html It seems hard to find a complete list covering 2013 to present, there are several incomplete sources on the web... There's surely a great amount of work to do here... EDIT: Some more scores are listed here: https://www.malonedigital.com/tomlinson.pdf I can't confirm them all myself, but those ones can be added to the first list for sure: The Final Conflict (1981) - Jerry Goldsmith Monsignor (1982) - John Williams First Blood (1982) - Jerry Goldsmith Amadeus (1983) - Sir Neville Marriner The Right Stuff / North and South (album, 1985) - Bill Conti