GoodMusician
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Posts posted by GoodMusician
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On 1/3/2020 at 8:22 AM, bollemanneke said:
I'm posting this question here because it concerns the recording sessions.
I was just listening to Diagon Alley take 569a and have a few questions.
1. Did they really record this passage at least 569 times?
2. At the very beginning of the cue, you can hear the orchestra's pitch shifting, like someone is tinkering with the speed of a vinyl during playback. How can that be explained?
3. The cue ends when the orchestra is suddenly muted, but the celesta keeps playing. What's going on there?
My understanding of the tech and why you're hearing the pitch shifting and cut outs is probably due to how the board was being handled.
I always understood that since they changed from one take to the next, it might cause a slight dip in the playback speed as they transition from take to take. Normally you wouldn't roll through the takes so you wouldn't be privy to this sound but since he's rolling from take to take, you hear it.
As for the orchestra being muted except celeste, i think it was a similar thing. They meant to end the take at that moment and perhaps to say "this is the end of the take" they muted the groupings of all instruments but I guess the celeste was on a separate grouping and didn't get muted?
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3 hours ago, TSMefford said:
Gonna agree with Roger here. This kind of mastering process is done on nearly all score releases whether you notice it or not. Original releases and the Expanded releases after. And this is nothing. You should see a Hans Zimmer release under the waveform view. I will also add that touching 0dB is perfectly fine. It's when you exceed it that it becomes clipping and a problem. And seeing the waveform with my own eyes, it certainly looks like other techniques were used rather than a simple limiter as Roger said. More is required than a simple normalization as well.
I will just say that this release sounds beautiful. No clipping, no distortion, which is true of most professional releases. The mastering is not an issue when it comes to buying this release. I'll also say, I should've done some more investigating myself before posting what sounded like a mix error, but is also present in the film. So that is also not really an issue. I see today this information about different takes and what not and happy to hear Roger mention something about offering a solution to that even though they don't have to.
It's a great release folks.
This is why I don't just buy any release these days. I try to be mindful of whose doing it and their techniques / attention to detail. The Loudness wars continues taking its toll on so many great releases.
For example, I LOVE the score to The Lion King but between disregarding an award winning mix and then overboosting the crap out of it, it's just not worth buying the Legacy release. The wav form looks like a pop song. -
Well, I have been meaning to get ProTools afterall. Not because I don't know how to master my own compositions/CD's mind you, but because it is such an industry standard.
There may be no discernable distortion, but I really don't like the idea of boosting something and limiting it. I get wanting to add volume of course--and the dynamics of the pieces vary greatly--but honestly some minor normalization could have protected the peaks. -
hmm It doesn't look to me like anything was done past boosting it up cause it still registers as clipping in audacity. If it were limited wouldn't it not show?
It just looks like they boosted it up. This caused the clipping but nothing was done to prevent that or to preserve those peaks. It just clips. Distortion wise I don't hear much but I don't get why you couldn't just normalize it a little. It seems lazy to me to boost it and clip it... -
Comparing the OST and the New Release, here are the most obvious examples of over boosting / clipping:
Track 02
Track 04
Track 07
Track 08
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1 minute ago, The Big Man said:
Holy shit, so glad I skipped this. These labels, they ruin everything.
I'd like someone else to confirm what I'm seeing:
(rough estimate of times)
Track 1 - [1:17]
Track 2 - [8:18 / 8:45 / 9:20 / 9:40 / 10:04]
Track 4 - [2:54 / 7:10]
Track 5 - [3:03]
Track 6 - [3:02 / 3:12 / 4:55]
Track 7 - [4:30-4:40 / 8:02 / 8:28-8:30 / 9:27 / 10:35]
Track 8 - [4:53-4:55]
Track 3 and Track 9 didn't show as clipping although they are pushed RIGHT to the limit. -
hmm... is there a particular reason why nearly every track is over boosted until it clips?
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I think its fair to say I'm enjoying a good amount of these! the past two have been quite nice! Good job!
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thanks for sharing that one! i'm not sure what to say about the first part. It good but it didn't evoke Williams fully to me. Might take another listen. It almost sounds like something from a silent film, which is great! like the cue is technically more difficult and interesting!
The 2nd one, I felt like although it made sense to come in at the conjuring of the dark mark, it might have needed a lead in? The rest was pretty spot on! -
No worries! And I agree whole heartedly with your approach!
I actually am curious, have you discussed how did you all go about spotting this / breaking down when/where/what you covered and when? Did you rely on how the film had been scored for timing/styles or just start fresh?
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Just listened through! I have to say I enjoyed alot of the expansions. I can hear how you honed in on how Williams would do things. I think the hard part with the films is that ideas like the Portkey, for example, should almost be more... magical? glorified? take a moment to exist outside of the film (ala diagon alley or aunt marge's waltz) those moments of pure magic and excitement. But the film kinda powers through it so you aren't left with much except a twirl and hurl lol I feel like that could have been a fun moment to create something separate but I also understand the confines on the film really prevent too much of that.
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17 hours ago, Once said:
You wrote this?! Wow, it brings back memories! I used to listen to these three cues a lot, especially "Dedalus, Dursleys and Dudley".
I had them in my iTunes archive (which I lost in 2012), but I couldn't remember where exactly I had downloaded them, and I've often wondered if the composer in question had scored the rest of the book. Very cool to re-listen to these.
aww! that's kind of you heh...
One of these days I may need to revive that project. I always enjoyed it. I dunno if I'd try to compose to the book like I had been or switch to the film...
and ooo! Next tracks! -
God... looking back, I wrote this stuff 10 years ago (posted on soundcloud 5 years ago)
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yes, i do recall hearing that. I also remember there was something odd about it at the time but I dont' recall what it was... too much time has passed lol
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what a fun project. I had at one point tried something very similar. But it was scoring Deathly Hallows after reading the book (this was before the film had even been announced as a two parter so well before it was made).
As I read it I had a STRONG idea of how the music SHOULD sound, HIGHLY influenced by Williams. I even wrote two new themes that I'd only begun to explore but never really did complete the project and then the film came out and it was... so vastly different... it wasn't really usable anymore.
Good luck on your work! I'm anxious to listen to more. -
I did join in 2005, but I don’t frequent much anymore. I’ve moved to ... another forum and Discord.
Im not home to upload to my gdrive but I’ll share my track list at least till I can.
I did join in 2005, but I don’t frequent much anymore. I’ve moved to other forums and Discord.
My sets are like this:
Raiders (all except 1 track fit on 1 disc)
Temple of Doom (Is 3 discs for all alts and overlays)
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I never really use JWFAN so I had NO idea about this thread. I kinda skimmed it so I’m sorry if I repeat things. I’ve also only personally worked on Raiders and TOD but here are my thoughts:
-Rescan to avoid pitch correction issues present in both TOD and Raiders
-Rescan to hopefully reduce the issue present in several reels of TOD where a high pitch leader tone seems to have bled into the tape (perhaps find a better source?) To fix this I in essence isolated that tone and digitally deleted it from the audio files but it leaves a really odd gap in the spectrum which would be noticed.
—Raiders
-Raiders: not much unreleased material is left but for starters that alone would be a big expansion. (the rolling ball, Marion in the pit, source music)
-The fidelity of the tapes doesn’t seem too amazing (a product of its time) but a remaster would probably bring out a lot more detail and help make it “future proof”)
-I would love any extra stuff, alternate takes of cues or things showing Williams really working towards a final product. Interviews were great on the old set and would be nice but aren’t necessary ESPECIALLY in lieu of new music!
—Temple of Doom
-Temple of Doom has so much material that’s unreleased but is also difficult to release due to music being written literally over music. Ideally! I’d like the layers isolated.
ie: the band source not mixed with the orchestra, the dinner source isolated from the orchestral layers, the sacrifice sweeteners tacked on at the end / beginning of the sacrifice music and not layered, etc)
-Including the alternates such as the original opening to Slalom into Mountain, the different travel iterations, the pieces only heard in the LEGO games, the full “Fortune and Glory” cue, etc.
-We still dont have a released correct assembly of the finale into credits!!
-I prefer music to be separated and in the case of Temple of Doom so much of the film is scored that MM would need to find appropriate places to split the cues otherwise he’ll have the Episode I EU on his hands. I don’t expect every cue separated, but it would be nice to have those moments. hell, the nocturnal activities into stranglehold is always overlapped in the releases, just giving a moment before the next cue would be ideal.
-Fidelity doesn’t seem to be an issue with TOD but those tones mixed in will be a problem.
I’ve done a rebuild of my Temple of Doom set and I truly feel like until MM redoes the score, it’ll be the best there is.
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What I don't get... is that they made... almost no attempt to actually edit the tracks properly...
And... they tended to use the wrong takes...
This makes me think that this set was made in haste... but what that would HAVE to mean is that they have remastered all the sessions.
IF their intention is to create complete score releases, then this may be a quick cash grab for those who are willing to pay for them (as they're reasonably priced) so that when the 'complete' versions come out at a much more prohibitive price, they will still have made some money off of doing that whole remastering process. -
I don't know about 'Book Thief' but I'm pretty certain William's read Memoirs before he scored that film. If I recall, he gave the book to YoYo Ma (which I think was spoken about in the iTunes exclusive concert he and Williams did) and got him interested in doing the project.
I think Spielberg was suppose to direct it originally but when he fell away as director, Williams' approached the new director, Rob Marshall, saying he wanted to do it and have YoYo Ma and Itzak Pearlman (which he says on the DVD/Blu Ray interview). Rob Marshall not being out of his mind said "yes, please!"
As for 'The Book Thief,' I don't know.
With JP3, he did make the original film music available to Don Davis who speaks of utilizing parts of JP1's score such as "The Entrance to the Park" motif as a source for the 'Mercenary Motif.' I can say they had the original sheet music because they actually performed the End Credits Pt II version so literally that he duplicated a transcription error that apparently never got corrected. This error was played by the Trombones but when the Horns came in, they didn't play it as written--which as a performer and knowing it's mostly the same brass players from the first two films--I can imagine their thought process "wtf? that's NOT the right note! We'll play it right!--and they did it CORRECTLY. So IF Williams had been more involved, that little error may not have snuck in.
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I know William's has announced his involvement with Star Wars but honestly, they're already filming Jurassic World and from my understanding, Williams didn't do JP3 because of a conflict with the scoring of A.I. (I don't remember if JP3's schedule got pushed back at all due to the changes in the script but I wonder if that changed the scoring sessions at all which would have made Williams ultimately available but oh well).
I know he's not known for returning to a series after he's left so I don't hold out hope for him to return, but I would ABSOLUTELY love it if he did. Star Wars hasn't even begun filming yet so I'd really think Jurassic World would be something he could do before Star Wars.
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He made it sound like Universal had really dropped the ball and done it without going through the proper legal channels. I almost wonder if that didn't halt production of an English Blu Ray as it was never released
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OOooo!!! I'm sooo excited for CAPRICA! When I talked to Bear at Galacticon he mentioned there would be some GREAT material on it including the sketch of the theme... he was upset over the French Blu Ray having unapproved isolated music for this which weren't from the approved mixes (some sort of legal thing going on over that too) but this is gonna be so cool! yay!
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That answers that then. I swear I saw one but then again, I was half asleep when I saw this was posted.
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Sry, yes, "My" Christmas Tree...and it does say previously unreleased, but as seen by other comments on this, most people don't realize its on that other album. Just wondered if it had been confirmed as the film version.
Howard Shore's King Kong
in General Discussion
Posted
There's a video where Jackson explains he'd intended it to be an old woman who says is... intended to be played by Faye Wray. But she passed away just before filming began. So it sounds like the decision to use Denham is... almost a "well, we had to use someone."