Dole

I think Children of Men was the one that got robbed last night in that category. You're right though. I'm sure there's hundreds or maybe even thousands of people talking about any category at the Oscars.

Kind of funny too that the Music Branch voted to rescind Nino Rota's nomination for The Godfather because it contained some music he'd written years earlier considering what won last night. I just wish they'd be consistent.

I hadn't posted since I left for work this morning, and since there were 20+ new replies when I got back, I felt as the thread starter I should at least respond. I didn't mean that as an attack or anything. I understand you're just replying. I was just saying that if people want to debate who's the better composer, Morricone or Williams, that's fine. But as for the question of who deserves an honorary Oscar more, it's a no-brainer once you understand what the award is for. It's confusing and I think some people here don't realize that an honorary Oscar isn't meant as a lifetime achievement award in the traditional way of thinking like the American Film Institute or Golden Globe lifetime achievement awards are designed.

Look, basically it's an award that is used to recognize either 1. Some significant one-of-a-kind contribution to the film industry (i.e. Robert Redford starting Sundance, the Modern Museum of Art starting a film collection, Elia Kazan helping to bring method acting and cutting-edge work to film, etc.) 2. The Academy f***ed up and didn't give you as much attention as you deserved for some reason or another (i.e. Cary Grant deserves credit for being Cary Grant; We're sorry that all of your scores didn't win great composer Alex North; Alec Guinness is a phenomenal actor who deserves more than one Oscar because right now he has as many Oscars as Goldie Hawn; Henry Fonda, Paul Newman, Peter O'Toole, Alfred Hitchcock, Stanley Kubrick, Akira Kurosawa, Robert Altman, Ennio Morricone and Stanley Donen are all extremely gifted filmmakers and should have an Oscar for their work because we haven't ever awarded them a competitive one; We're sorry that we called you a Communist and made you flee the country Charlie Chaplin because you are a genius and we should have known better; etc.). Does John Williams deserve a lifetime acheivement award for his work? Sure. Is that what an honorary Oscar is? No. Williams is not neglected by the Academy (he has the second most nominations of anyone in history and 5 Oscars sitting at home already) and he hasn't really made some kind of awe-inspiring, magical, one-in-a-kind, revolutionary contribution to the film industry (he's a good composer, but he hasn't exactly reinvented the medium or something). John Williams is a household name and is the most recognized composer in Hollywood history and as much as we all here think he should have won about twice as many Oscars, he's fared much better than equally fine composers such as Max Steiner, Jerry Goldsmith, and poor Bernard Herrmann who got half of his nominations after he'd already died. Why do we keep beating this dead horse?

The Music Branch is a strange bunch. In the 1940's a song called "The Last Time I Saw Paris" was nominated and won for Best Song despite the fact that it was well known that the song had been composed and published years earlier and was therefore ineligible for even a nomination. Even the song's composer said he thought it wasn't fair and that he had voted for a different nominee that year. So it goes...

Oh my God!!! That's sad and hilarious and creepy all at the same time. What is he doing?

Yes, but that's an award strictly for being a good producer. And unlike the honorary Oscar or the humanitarian award, the Thalberg Award isn't actually an Oscar. It's a bust of Thalberg's head. I think it would be nice if they gave him an actual Oscar statuette to honor his acheivements in writing, directing, founding of companies that consistently turn out excellent contributions to film, and his overall creativity.

It has nothing to do with all 6,000 members meeting in a room somewhere and agreeing. It has to do with a majority of people filling out their ballots and voting for the winners in the same categories. Obviously a majority of members voted for both The Departed for Best Pic, Scorcese for Best Director, and Hudson for Best Supp. Actress (because they all won). Those voters would have noticed that they'd shut out Babel in the major categories and so they vote for it in a category like Best Score that, in a year like this where there is no clear winner like Star Wars or Jaws, they could care less about. But, again, people liked Babel. I haven't heard a single enthusiastic word about any of the other nominees, except for maybe a couple for The Queen, while I've heard a surprising amount of pundits and critics talk about how much they love the music, and one guy about how many of his friends and family picked up the album after hearing his promo. I think this is a case closer to Star Wars than to Finding Neverland (Now that was a year no one seemed to particularly care for any of the scores). You might be right. I don't have any Hollywood connections so I have no clue what Academy members liked or didn't like. Maybe they all did love Babel. To be honest, I don't know too many people (in flesh and blood) who like film music (or have seen Babel for that matter) so it's hard for me to say who genuinely liked what. Personally, as someone who loves film music and movies, my vote and my heart are still with Desplat's The Queen.

Speaking of honorary Oscars, I wonder if the banter among Lucas, Spielberg, and Coppola last night will remind the Academy to give an honorary Oscar to Lucas in the next couple of years. Despite the "raping your childhood" thing that people profess on this board, you have to admit that Lucas is one of the most influential filmmakers in history, not just for Star Wars, Indiana Jones, and American Graffiti, but also for creating ILM, Skywalker Sound, and THX. And as much as I admire Woody Allen, there's no way that he deserved the Best Director Oscar over Lucas in 1978. Best Screenplay, yes, but Director, no.

It has nothing to do with all 6,000 members meeting in a room somewhere and agreeing. It has to do with a majority of people filling out their ballots and voting for the winners in the same categories. Obviously a majority of members voted for both The Departed for Best Pic, Scorcese for Best Director, and Hudson for Best Supp. Actress (because they all won). Those voters would have noticed that they'd shut out Babel in the major categories and so they vote for it in a category like Best Score that, in a year like this where there is no clear winner like Star Wars or Jaws, they could care less about.

Ok, that made me laugh... I give up.

I don't think people should be jumping on the Academy as a whole. We all agree that the average Academy voter knows jack about film music (or VFX, or Sound Editing, etc.). It's the Music Branch's fault for nominating Babel in the first place. They're the ones who are supposed to know about film music and are trusted with coming up with five Oscar-worthy nominations. The Academy voter has to fill out his or her ballot thinking that any of the five nominees in any category is worthy of winning. Blame the Music Branch, not the Academy that voted for it.

Well there was gunfightin' in them Westerns. If you're not shootin Injuns in a Western, the cowboys have to be shootin one another like in Unforgiven or High Noon. No gunslinging in Brokeback Mountain. I suppose you could make a horror film without killing anybody off onscreen but it would be strange. Brokeback can be a Western, I concede that, but it doesn't fit into the stereotype of that genre. Just because the main character wears a cowboy hat and/or the film takes place on a ranch in the West doesn't make it a Western. Midnight Cowboy has "cowboy" in the title and Jon Voight wears a cowboy hat in the film but it's not close to being a Western.

I know it's been described as a Western but it really doesn't fit the stereotype of that genre. If Ledger and Gyllenhaal were attacked by Indians while they were on the mountain, then maybe I'd be more comfortable classifying it as a Western. I guess it can be a Western, just an atypical one.

And the Oscar goes to... Gustave Santaollala for Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince!

Well I guess you could put it in that category.

The orchestra can't know the winners ahead of time because occasionally they make a mistake. They played the wrong music when (I think) Black Hawk Down won an upset in a category a few years back. It was probably hard for them to hear over all the screaming as soon as the first name was announced.

The thing that really put the whole Gustavo win in perspective for me was that the audience applauded the loudest during the Morricone tribute when the orchestra played his theme for The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly which wasn't even nominated by the Academy! 400 plus film scores and the man has 6 nominations! It's all quite silly.

I think this year was another case of the Best Score Oscar being a "make up" award. Babel was totally shut out in every other category. I think that helped Santaowhateverhisnameis. Voters didn't want the film to go home empty handed so they threw it the Oscar for scoring just like in the past (Brokeback Mountain, Finding Neverland, etc.)

I'll defend his win for Brokeback Mountain until the day I die. But Babel? Babel?!?!?!?!?!!? That's f***ing ridiculous! Another sad day for the score category.

North and Morricone both deserved their honorary Oscars. Combined they have 5 fewer Oscars than John Williams.

Isn't the win for POTC the first win by Lucas' Industrial Light and Magic since...well a long time? The last ILM movie I remember winning FX was Forrest Gump over a decade ago.

Wow! The Pixar films lost in both animated categories. That's a shock.

Al Gore needs to cut back on more than emission standards. He didn't look too good.

The In Memoriam segment is a joke some years. If they're concerned about time, they should cut out half a dozen of the film montages they show throughout the event and focus on the montage that really matters...the one where they pay their respects to people who dedicated their lives to filmmaking. I remember a few years ago, Oscar-nominated actress Dorothy McGuire (Gentleman's Agreement, Old Yeller, The Swiss Family Robinson, etc.) wasn't in the segment after she died. Her family said they were disappointed but that it was probably a mistake. When asked about it, the Academy had the nerve to say it wasn't a mistake. They had to make cuts for time's sake. Of course I think that was the same year that Aaliyah died and she was in the segment having done all of two or three films. Oh well. RIP Shirley Walker