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Datameister

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  1. Thanks
    Datameister got a reaction from KK in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  2. Thanks
    Datameister reacted to BrotherSound in Prisoner of Azkaban cue sheet?   
    No problem! Those are the only new ones I caught, but here's everything (my notes are in brackets):
     
    Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban (In Concert)
    Complete Cue List
     
    Act I
     
    1M1 Opening III
    1M2 That's A Lie
    1M4 Aunt Marge's Waltz
    1M5 Parents Portrait
    1M6-1M7 The Empty Playground - The Knight Bus
    1M8 The Knight Bus Ride
    1M9 Newspaper Headliner - Second Collision
    1M10 Pub Source
    2M1 The Book Attacks
    2M2A Discussing Black
    2M3 The Train to Hogwarts
    2M4 The Dementor Appears
    2M5 Double Trouble [including 'Something Wicked Intro']
    2M6 Dumbledore's Warning
    2M8 Double Trouble March
    2M9 Rainy Nights, Dementors, and Birds
    2M10 You Have the Grim
    3M1 Double Trouble on the Hill
    3M2 Befriending the Hippogriff
    3M3 Riding the Hippogriff
    3M4 Bonding with the Hippogriff and Sir Cadogan Again
    3M5 Kids Inspect Newspaper etc
    3M6-3M7 Snape Dresses Up - The Spider - The Snake - Clown Out of the Cupboard
    3M9 Revealing the Bridge
    3M10 Remembering Mother
    3M11-3M12 The Portrait Scene - The Great Hall Ceiling
    4M1-4M2 Quidditch [4M1 = 'Page 394'?]
    4M3 Woods Walk and Bird's Flight
    4M5 Up The Stairs
    4M6 Snow Fight
    4M7 The Elves Song [A Winter's Spell]
    4M10 Brief Snow Scene
    4M11 Explore Your Past
    4M12 Opening the Trunk
    4M15 Harry and Voices
    4M16-4M17 Dueling the Dementor - Insert for Patronus Light
     
    Act II
     
    4M18 Entr'acte - Solo Flute
    5M1 Buckbeak's Sentence
    5M2 Reading the Map
    5M3 The Mention of Pettigrew
    5M5 Pt.1 The Crystal Ball
    5M5 Pt.2-5M6 The Crystal Ball - The Executioner
    5M7 The Walk to Buckbeak
    5M8-5M9 Buckbeak is Sentenced - Scabbers Runs
    5M10 The Whomping Willow
    6M1-6M2A Entering the Shrieking Shack - The Confrontation Scene - Part 1
    6M2B The Confrontation Scene - Part 2
    6M2C The Confrontation Scene - Part 3
    6M3 [No title]
    6M4-6M5-6M5AN Sirius and Harry - Werewolf Scene - First Frozen Lake
    6M7-7M1-7M1A Reviewing the Recent Past - Viewing the Recent Past - Saving Buckbeak
    7M2 My Dad Conjured the Patronus
    7M3-7M4 Buckbeak Saves the Day - Watching the Past - The Patronus Light
    7M5 The Rescue of Sirius
    7M6 Sirius Final Scene - Turning Time Back
    7M7 The Whomping Willow
    7M8 Jungle Jazz Room [source, composed by Steve Grey]
    7M9 Lupin's Departure
    7M11-7M12-End Credits Potter Titles - End Credits
  3. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Richard Penna in The Rise of Skywalker final trailer MUSIC discussion   
    I'm watching friends (who are Williams fans) geek out about the trailer music on Facebook. Like @Tom said, this stuff gets produced and used because moviegoers eat it up.
     
    I actually really enjoy some of the trailer music for the sequel trilogy - mainly the theatrical trailer for TFA, plus some of the variations on Williams' TFA themes in the trailers for TLJ. There's a part of my brain that responds to the rest of it, too, but it usually gets drowned out by the louder part of my brain that's tired of the formula. Modern trailer music is like fast food. We isolate the elements that we desire with our most primitive instincts - salt, fat, pop chord progressions, broad unisono horns - and then we exaggerate those elements' presence past the point of recognition. This triggers our brains' reward systems...at least until you've had so much of it that you're ready to puke and go find yourself a nice salad.
     
    Incidentally, I could really go for a burger right now. And I can't get the TFA trailer music out of my head.
  4. Thanks
    Datameister got a reaction from igger6 in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  5. Thanks
    Datameister got a reaction from Fabulin in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Sure! I should have time later today, I think.
  6. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Evanus in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  7. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from igger6 in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    You misunderstand me. I don't presume to know the story behind every scoring choice here, and my goal isn't to point fingers between the composer and the director. All we can really judge is the end result of their collaboration - and of course that's extremely subjective. Passages that sound natural and coherent to you may strike other listeners differently. That's the nature of music.
     
    To clarify my position, though, a few things. Firstly, I'm talking about the film score as it was written and recorded; the fact that the OT and PT scores also suffered heavy editing is a non sequitur.
     
    Secondly, the fact that Williams directly quotes past films' concert suites in major ways (Yoda's theme, Leia's theme for her flight to safety, Rey's theme for her following Luke) is really unusual. I can't think of another Williams score that does that. I can't help imagining someone sitting in a room, assembling the temp track, seeing an album track called "Princess Leia's Theme", and thinking, "Perfect, let's use that for her big moment!"
     
    Thirdly, I wasn't trying to suggest that old recordings have been reused. When two pieces of recorded music are edited together, it can be hard to make the transition sound natural and musical. The benefit of completely re-recording such an "edit" is that you can sometimes write material that smooths out the transition. My position is that there are too many unnatural, unmusical transitions in the score that bear all the hallmarks of originating in an edited-together temp track from which Williams did not sufficiently stray - whoever's choice that was.
     
    Side note: To be fair, I'm judging this score against the oeuvre of my favorite all-time composer, so I'm going to be harsh. I still like TLJ better than most of what's coming from other composers these days, and there are parts of it that I think are truly superb.
  8. Like
    Datameister reacted to mrbellamy in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    It’ll honestly be pretty interesting to have two Abrams scores to compare to TLJ and make certain judgments about what really seems to distinguish 7/9 from 8, if anything. Or maybe ROS will have more in common with TLJ than TFA which would be interesting in itself. Also having it become clearer what separates each of the three, and what the commonalities are....not to mention just being able to start summing up the sequel music as a whole compared to the OT and prequels. The discussions will be gloriously obnoxious.
  9. Thanks
    Datameister got a reaction from A. A. Ron in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  10. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from oierem in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  11. Thanks
    Datameister got a reaction from Smeltington in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  12. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from MikeH in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  13. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from DarthDementous in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  14. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Chen G. in What changes would it take for you to not consider TLJ the worst of SW scores?   
    Ditch the temp track. That's the number one thing. There are sooooo many passages that simply quote previous films (or albums) verbatim, often with editorial choices from the temp track delivered with awkward literalness. There's a big difference between penning a new yet nostalgic rendition of Yoda's theme and...well, slamming the beginning and end of the concert suite together and calling it a day. Most of the individual instances of this are fine, but in aggregate they really hurt the score, especially the first time I saw the film. No other Star Wars score is like this.
     
    The next thing is related - stop using the Force theme every 2 minutes, especially as an adagio horn solo over solemn strings. It's absolutely beautiful writing. Hearing it every other scene cheapens it.
     
    Then we move on to the actual new material. I'm sorry, but I just do not like the wishy-washy underscore heard mostly in the Achoo (I've given up spelling the name) scenes. I also think there are a few too many instances of loud brass triads planing chromatically in the action music...it's a quintessentially Star Wars device, but it feels slightly overused here.
     
    Things to keep: Canto Bight (glorious), Rose's theme (perfectly serviceable), the new theme for Luke in exile (sadly underused), a lot of the action music (great energy), The Spark (just wonderful from beginning to end), and the overall sound (not as dry and small as TFA - more Star Wars-y). There's probably more. I do like the score, in spite of its flaws. But boy, it would not get me excited for any hypothetical future Johnson/Williams collaborations.
  15. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from The Five Tones in The Rise of Skywalker final trailer MUSIC discussion   
    I'm watching friends (who are Williams fans) geek out about the trailer music on Facebook. Like @Tom said, this stuff gets produced and used because moviegoers eat it up.
     
    I actually really enjoy some of the trailer music for the sequel trilogy - mainly the theatrical trailer for TFA, plus some of the variations on Williams' TFA themes in the trailers for TLJ. There's a part of my brain that responds to the rest of it, too, but it usually gets drowned out by the louder part of my brain that's tired of the formula. Modern trailer music is like fast food. We isolate the elements that we desire with our most primitive instincts - salt, fat, pop chord progressions, broad unisono horns - and then we exaggerate those elements' presence past the point of recognition. This triggers our brains' reward systems...at least until you've had so much of it that you're ready to puke and go find yourself a nice salad.
     
    Incidentally, I could really go for a burger right now. And I can't get the TFA trailer music out of my head.
  16. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Smeltington in The Rise of Skywalker final trailer MUSIC discussion   
    I'm watching friends (who are Williams fans) geek out about the trailer music on Facebook. Like @Tom said, this stuff gets produced and used because moviegoers eat it up.
     
    I actually really enjoy some of the trailer music for the sequel trilogy - mainly the theatrical trailer for TFA, plus some of the variations on Williams' TFA themes in the trailers for TLJ. There's a part of my brain that responds to the rest of it, too, but it usually gets drowned out by the louder part of my brain that's tired of the formula. Modern trailer music is like fast food. We isolate the elements that we desire with our most primitive instincts - salt, fat, pop chord progressions, broad unisono horns - and then we exaggerate those elements' presence past the point of recognition. This triggers our brains' reward systems...at least until you've had so much of it that you're ready to puke and go find yourself a nice salad.
     
    Incidentally, I could really go for a burger right now. And I can't get the TFA trailer music out of my head.
  17. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Remco in The Rise of Skywalker final trailer MUSIC discussion   
    I'm watching friends (who are Williams fans) geek out about the trailer music on Facebook. Like @Tom said, this stuff gets produced and used because moviegoers eat it up.
     
    I actually really enjoy some of the trailer music for the sequel trilogy - mainly the theatrical trailer for TFA, plus some of the variations on Williams' TFA themes in the trailers for TLJ. There's a part of my brain that responds to the rest of it, too, but it usually gets drowned out by the louder part of my brain that's tired of the formula. Modern trailer music is like fast food. We isolate the elements that we desire with our most primitive instincts - salt, fat, pop chord progressions, broad unisono horns - and then we exaggerate those elements' presence past the point of recognition. This triggers our brains' reward systems...at least until you've had so much of it that you're ready to puke and go find yourself a nice salad.
     
    Incidentally, I could really go for a burger right now. And I can't get the TFA trailer music out of my head.
  18. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Florian in Jerry Goldsmith's AIR FORCE ONE - 2019 2CD Varese Deluxe Edition   
    Finally listening to this now. Meeeeee liiiiiiiiiike. I know the main theme well and I've seen the film several times over the years, but this is my first time listening on album. Glorious.
  19. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Incanus in Jerry Goldsmith's AIR FORCE ONE - 2019 2CD Varese Deluxe Edition   
    Finally listening to this now. Meeeeee liiiiiiiiiike. I know the main theme well and I've seen the film several times over the years, but this is my first time listening on album. Glorious.
  20. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Demondm810 in MINORITY REPORT- 2CD Expanded Edition from La-La Land Records now available   
    Ordered, along with Rosewood.
  21. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from bollemanneke in Harry Potter 7CD Collection - MUSIC discussion   
    I highly doubt it - I feel quite certain it was another trailer cue Williams did (and which was also rerecorded as the end of the film's prologue and the first view of Hogwarts).
  22. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Arpy in Harry Potter 7CD Collection - MUSIC discussion   
    I highly doubt it - I feel quite certain it was another trailer cue Williams did (and which was also rerecorded as the end of the film's prologue and the first view of Hogwarts).
  23. Thanks
    Datameister got a reaction from Will in If you got to sit down and talk with JW, what would your top three questions be?   
    I'd be most interested in his composition process. To what degree does the music exist in his head before he even touches the piano keys? How long a stretch of new music can be hold in his working memory before committing it to paper? Things like that.
     
    The ultimate dream would be to actually sit in as he wrote something - with permission to ask the occasional question, but otherwise just taking it in.
  24. Thanks
    Datameister got a reaction from Arpy in If you got to sit down and talk with JW, what would your top three questions be?   
    I'd be most interested in his composition process. To what degree does the music exist in his head before he even touches the piano keys? How long a stretch of new music can be hold in his working memory before committing it to paper? Things like that.
     
    The ultimate dream would be to actually sit in as he wrote something - with permission to ask the occasional question, but otherwise just taking it in.
  25. Like
    Datameister got a reaction from Ii2 in What are the best lightsaber fights on Star Wars movies?   
    Like many of you, I'm partial to ESB, TPM, and TFA, with ESB probably topping it. I just love the way it's shot - really beautiful and interesting cinematography. And the choreography strikes a nice balance between realism and coolness. Love the pacing as well. TPM is fun for the spectacle and visually arresting acrobatics. TFA is great for the opposite reason - it really leans into the duel as part of the characters' story, serving up a less flashy, more realistic approach. And I love that the glowing lightsaber props actually illuminate the surroundings. I wish every film before it could have had that.
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