leeallen01

Yeah it looks like 1.9 billion after this weekend, and 2 billion next weekend. Guess the top 3 biggest 5th weekends at the box office of all-time? 1) Avatar 2 Avatar: The Way of Water 3) Titanic Cameron lol.

I've never seen it anywhere. Only online weird illegal copies.

Staying with LOTR. The removal of Saruman from ROTK in the theatrical cut is insane to me. The entire summation of his character and setting up the rest of the film is lost.

Everything I said makes sense. Streaming services are the death of physical media because people have been trained to not want to own physical copies anymore, as it's all on a platform, thus things are forced to go onto it or die, because their current home is killed by streaming, and therefore they are never released for people to own. My argument is not directly at the non-release of this one score. I didn't know they lost money. So that is understandable. But my argument is at the reason why they lost money. And that is because of the state of media release in general. It's an overall complaint at this state we are in, where people are being conditioned to not physically own anything anymore. Everything is slowly disappearing to places where you wont own anything and a company can just change and take back what they want, even if you bought it. Soon we will have no DVD's, CD's etc and it'll all be digital purchase that they will probably stop you from downloading, so you have to listen to it on THEIR platform and they can change or remove it at will. That has already happened with streaming. I have to have netflix if I want to watch Stranger Things for example, and watch it exclusively on there. I can never own my own copy. That is what makes me mad.

No CD? seriously? Come on. All this talk of Seth being a traditionalist and his incredibly classic and traditional filmmaking on the Orville, especially with the music appreciation, and then he goes and releases a score without physical media?! I'm sick of this destruction of the physical world. Everything doesn't bloody exist anymore. No doubt we'll never get Season 3 on DVD either because of damm streaming services. BULLSH*T

Great video. It seems like such an obvious change to make the film vastly better.

I asked him on twitter about hearing the full Songchord and he said it's a question for Jim haha.

Just about to post that interview haha. Some great new information; like how he has actually written a longer Songchord to include the story of the entire Sully family, not just Neteyam and Kiri that we hear in the current one.

This topic has become more exploratory than my original post, which is great. It creates new ideas and conversations. I was going for a more, "wow, imagine if that scene was kept in the theatrical cut. The movie would have been radically different" type thing. Or even "I think that scene completely ruins the story. Imagine if it was cut out, then the film would be so much better." But these examples brought up are still very interesting. I guess to explore this random and confusing concept further, going outside of a single scene, to perhaps just a writing concept itself; the entire concept of an elderly Rose telling the story of the Titanic, immediately tells us she survived, and therefore all tension or fear of her survival is removed, and by extention, we may be able to infer the death of Jack, as her granddaughter doesn't know him.

Another example could be the Phantom Menace, where Qui Gon tells Anakin about the Midichlorians. That scene fundamentally changes the entire message behind the force and arguably the entire spirit of Star Wars. It not only changes the Phantom Menace itself, but it changes the entire original trilogy.

I guess it's a difficult idea to get across because every single film has a scene that changes the entire story for better or worse. I guess the idea of this thread is a meta analysis about 1 particular scene that either severely effects a film for good or bad. Predator is an extreme example (you are immediately told the threat will be an alien.) But scenes that are not as impactful, but still change an entire films story or intent are also acceptable to discuss.

I'm sure this has been discussed over the years, but thought a separate topic concerning any film, and even tv shows that are either make or break on a single scene that fundamentally changes an entire story for the better or worse. The obvious is Predator. The inclusion of the spaceship in the opening is a terrible idea in my opinion. It immediately tells you there's an alien, instead of discovering that along with the characters. Not knowing what the hell is hunting them is far more powerful, but we already know it's an alien, and the removal of that scene would improve the film for me. Also, I was watching Aliens, which in fact made me consider this subject. In the longer cut, we see Newt's family and her reacting to the facehugger. This scene was smartly cut from the standard edition by Cameron, because the entire discovery of Newt being alone and her then opening up to Ripley about her family, is fundamental to the suspense and character of her story. Also not seeing any of the colonists makes it far more creepy and shocking as we see the base for the first time in ruins. We are seeing it through the characters eyes for the first time, instead of already knowing what it all looks like and exactly what happened to them. By seeing Newt early on before the characters meet her, we might be expecting her to be alive. Another huge scene in the extended cut is of Ripley finding out her daughter is dead after Ripley spent 57 years in cryo. This scene not being in the standard edition is the opposite of the Newt scene, as this is a mistake from Cameron. The entire story of Ripley's character in Aliens (outside of her overcoming her fear) is about motherhood. The audience knowing her daughter is dead makes her connection to Newt even more powerful and gives it a larger meaning. And an honourable mention to the cut scene of the turrets running out of ammo in the hallways. That is just utterly terrifying and badass. Anyway, are there any other examples of this that anyone can think of, where a single scene can change an entire film for the better or worse.

In an interview, Franglen mentioned something about completing the score late and not being able to get it out officially for awards stuff to hear it properly. So maybe that means no nominations for this award season? Not sure.

I've heard there's an alternate cut floating around. The iceberg apparently didn't make the cut.

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!

Well, if some of you end up seeing the re-release, I hope you enjoy your time together.

The action scoring is just getting better for me with every listen. Like this piece for example - It has a very catchy, rhythmic repeating phrase on strings that drives the piece, with accompanying percussion, and then it'll just explode into the most glorious heroic version of the Family Theme at 1:50. And we even get another couple of Family Theme variations later at 2:37 in a defeated way, and finally again at 3:08 as it tries to hold on, but the full theme can't make it. Brilliant musical storytelling.

There were no HFR showings near me, but I did want to check out that format. I do remember, however, that The Hobbit was distracting in HFR, so I'm not too disappointed that I didn't get to experience it. I prefer the standard film format anyway. I had the best experience and most emotional engagement when I saw it in 2D standard.

I'd like to see it in black and white. Might add a fresh visual perspective.

I heard that yeah it a few interviews he mentioned rewriting the action music. It seems he went more thematic with the action scoring, like Horner, but was told to maybe make it more brutal and non-melodic, to strip the RDA and humans in general of melody, and give them a more technological, industrial soundscape, and keep the grand thematic writing to the pure nature and Na'vi. I've been listening to a lot of Franglen interviews on the score and got some juicy info throughout. E.g. In the first Avatar score with Horner, for the rhythmic drumming beats behind some of the Na'vi music, Franglen actually recording himself beating his chest, and that is in fact what we hear in the final score. Also, the Songchord performance from Zoe Saldana was recorded live on-set, and the final audio in the film is actually the live recording on the Performance capture stage. It wasn't re-recorded in a recording studio. He also mentioned that he has written music already for the 3rd film, and that of course he held back from fully developing certain themes in the 2nd film, because of their importance going forward with the characters development. I assume he is referring to Kiri, as her theme seems like the one with the furthest to go with more development. I also wondered personally why it sounded almost triumphant at some of the moments during the Tulkun Hunt, and Franglen said that was intentional. They decided the music should show the tragedy, but also the sick fun that the hunters were having killing the mother and her calf, so Franglen made the music feel like a sick triumphant tragedy, which is illustrated perfectly below at 4:41-5:00 in 'The Hunt' -

I really love the soundscape that Franglen created for Payakan. Those moments when Lo'ak wakes up on his back, and then when we get the iconic poster shot in the thumbnail of the video below of Lo'ak and Payakan essentially holding hands in the wide shot. The soundscape of 'awe' really sells the majesty and size of the Tulkun. The imagery and score has a powerful religious quality to it. You can almost hear the church organ. Heard at 0:10 and 3:15 -

I used to go to the cinema at least once a month many years ago. Not only are films getting far worse since 2016, but I don't see the point of the cinema any more unless it's for films made for the cinema experience. Avatar is made for that. Like Endgame was. It was an event. It meant something to go and see it. A massive film made only to see on the biggest screen with the best sound system. I've seen The Way of Water 3 times already. I just go and see it in all its formats and funnily enough standard 2D was the best experience because I focused on the characters and story more. Indie films can just be watched at home. In the last 3 years, I've only seen The Batman and Avatar in cinemas. I was done with Marvel after Endgame, and will only go back to the cinema for the next Avatar and perhaps if the next Bond film looks good.

My calculations based on current percentage of decline would make it earning another 560 million overseas and 210 domestically for a 770 million more worldwide. Add that to the 1.71 billion currently, and it makes 2.5 billion. Who the hell knows though with monsters like this.

Based on the numbers and its week to week decline percentages, it is impossible for it not to gross 2.5 billion. That is now a statistical lock. Only pulling it from theatres will stop that now. But if it has even stronger legs than now, going forward, it could reach 2nd all time ahead of Endgame. So Avatar 1 and 2 would be 1 and 2 all time haha, that would be ridiculous.