DarthDementous

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The fact that it's not purely orchestral and that it doesn't reprise any of Williams' themes doesn't make it a bad score. A good score has to enhance and support the emotions of the scenes it accompanies and I think Andor's score does that in quite a few sequences, like the ghorman massacre.
 
And there are indeed several themes. Some of them might not be as instantly memorable as most already established in the saga but that doesn't make them bad in my opinion. The ghorman theme and the yavin theme are two of the standout incorporations this season for me.

Watching Andor in amongst a re-watch of the sequel trilogy, it's almost like the reverse of Star Trek: TNG. The TNG movies are all (OK... mostly) action and adventure type stuff that goes more for fighting and space ship battles, whereas the TV show took a much more thoughtful and serious approach, with only occasional fighting and space ship battles.
 
Andor and Rogue One lay out just how much it took to get to that point. I guess that's where it almost feels like a disconnect between those and A New Hope, but it's ANH that sticks out as being the unrealistic entry.
 
The original films and sequel trilogy feel oddly small compared to Andor. Of course everything is being told in reverse, but you don't get nearly the sense of galactic scale watching ANH as you do from Andor. It's essentially half a dozen people taking down an entire empire and their massive space station.
 
The prequels give a bigger sense of scale but the political stuff is all kinda stilted in a way that it isn't in Andor. Mon Mothma's speech in Andor would likely have been a cringe-fest (as the kids say) if George Lucas had written and directed it.

Er...no.
 
Setting aside the fact that the appearance of the school changed throughout the films, it also looks different depending on which illustrated edition of the book you have, which game you're playing, etc. 
 
People may have any number of visions of Hogwarts in their mind, but everyone pictures Harrison Ford when you say Indiana Jones.
 
 

...is this not just classism? you've identified certain English accents as the 'default' way for how English should sound and used it as a measure to compare others from and then have deemed the ones that differ as lesser

I can't fathom how in the context of a universe like Star Wars this would break your immersion

what's more 'someone you would walk past down the shops' is exactly the point of Andor, these are all just regular people in extraordinary circumstances

Me too!!! It's ridiculous how little recognition he garnered...certainly by Season 2 smh
And I recognized so many names and faces in the finale...great to have all those people brought back...always been a big fan of Tonc
This, this, this! I kept rewinding and cackling with glee at Gough's performance. Fantastic!
Speaking of which, I was quite taken by April Woods' performance as Kleya in the flashbacks...I thought she really captured the spirit of Dulau's character.
Agreed. I found the finale to be somewhat disappointing.
This is why I wasn't surprised to be simultaneously pleased and disappointed with the season...really wish we got the five seasons instead of the two...did not do the characters and storylines much good to cram them into three episode arcs.
I've seen people say that Andor improves R1 but having watched episodes 10-12 and R1 in one straight shot, I can't say my impression of the film was really impacted at all by the series.
I think it's clear from the film that Galen either didn't have anything specific (hence the information about the Death Star schematics being on Scarif) or if he had an idea, it was somewhere in the holomessage not played because of the power outage. Regardless, I don't think he had any expectation of being retrieved by the Rebellion.

you couldn't pinpoint the theme that plays in the intro of every episode? really?

I rewatched Rogue One now with the full context of Andor and I hated it. I could rant for hours as to why but I'll just say that everything was so much worse than I remembered, and my last feelings towards this movie was 'meh'. it feels like a bad adaptation of the show which is hilarious considering it came first

you couldn't pinpoint the theme that plays in the intro of every episode? really?

you couldn't pinpoint the theme that plays in the intro of every episode? really?

Sorry, just finished the series, IMO atrocious soundtrack for both seasons, irrelevant themes (i even cannot pinpoint andor’s) and complete irrespecfullness of the music that came before.

B2 was happy and that's all I needed to know

So rather than accept what we are shown on screen that the Millennium Falcon goes to Yavin IV presumably because that is where Leia wants to go you think that Han already knew where it was and went there against Leia's wishes?!?
 
Here's my new fan theory:
 
General Draven is responsible for the destruction of Alderaan. (Tarkin is ultimately responsible, of course.)
 
If Draven doesn't countermand Mon Mothma's orders in Rogue One to extract Galen Erso then we grab Galen and we don't have to go to Scarrif. Leia doesn't get on the Tantive IV. She is not sent to retrieve Obi-Wan Kenobi. She is not captured by the Empire. Alderaan is not destroyed to coerce her.
 
I wonder if "torpedo in the exhaust port" was the right way to blow up the Death Star? Was that Galen's plan? Because it takes the lives of all of Red and Gold Squadron AND the abilities of the son of a Jedi Knight. Did he have a less lucky way to take it out that we will never know because Draven ordered Galen's death?
 
Owen and Beru Lars live. Obi-Wan Kenobi is not killed by Darth Vader. Not sure what happens to luckless smuggler Han Solo without a charter to Alderaan. Oh and the Rebels probably get to stay at Yavin.
 
Andor season 2 episodes 9-12: Short answers - Wow. I don't think I had any complaints.
 
I would have liked to have been a little clearer on who Luthen was supposed to be in the "before times". Was he Imperial? I didn't get what "side" he was on. Also de-aging Skarsgard just to be the age he was in Thor seemed to miss the mark. But otherwise I loved those scenes.
 
I wasn't sure if Partagaz was being allowed to fall on his sword for his failure (I think this is true) or if he was the ultimate leak in the ISB. I kept waiting for one of the very smart, very self aware characters to flip. But no, Dedra and Lonni reported to him.
 
Again, the theme throughout the show is that random things happen and people don't always get what they "deserve". So we got a nice little epilogue with Perrin. What happened to MISTER Skuldun I wonder?
 
You know, this show treats Yavin IV a lot like how it read in the original Star Wars. This was THE base. This is where they all were. This was where to went to rebel.
 
Oh, and I think we know as well as we're ever going to: Kino Loy is dead. In Andor: Declassified they did a kind of "remembering the fallen" montage and he was in it.
  
 
I was so damn close.

I already said it in this thread, but I'd love it if people actually watch a movie (all of it) before making conclusions.  I get that's not how the internet works and that we all have to declare something definitively as either the best ever OR utter garbage based on set photos, 2 minute trailers, and posters but holy hell is it frustrating.
 
 

The more I listen to the score, the more I like it. Roberts brought a different vibe than what Britell had done in S1 but it feels like a natural continuation, rather than a complete makeover. He retains some of Britell's themes and introduces a few of really great ones of his own, my favorite being the new Yavin theme. I went through all the volumes in season 2 and did this review on my blog talking about all these themes and how they're developed through the season.
 
And I'm sure on a rewatch I'll notice even more interesting musical details!

While I don't care that much about the recording of Williams' material, the incompleteness of it has a nice symbolic meaning. They will earn their woodwinds once Death Star is destroyed. 😉
 
Karol

Yeah, the music in the end credits caught me a bit off guard but it makes sense they would include some of Williams' music at some point.
 
I really liked the music in these final episodes, particularly the variations on the new Yavin theme and the variations on Luthen's theme through episode 10, which also appears in the title cards. I kinda wish the Yavin theme was what we heard in Rogue One instead of Giacchino's Hope theme, and while watching the movie I was constantly waiting for the Andor theme to show up, but Giacchino's score is still really solid. Love his themes for Jyn and Krennic!
 
Also, I noticed that neither the Luthen theme nor the ISB theme have been included in any of the s2 albums. I guess some of them were tracked but I also think there were some others that were brand new variations. I guess some of Luthen's variations from episode 10 will be included, but it's odd they had completely missed these themes in previous releases.

I saw a few sketches of Silvestri's early big scores (Back to the Future, Fandango) and the level of detail was certainly not in the league of a Williams or a Goldsmith sketch. Silvestri is a jazz guy and learned to notate mostly on two-staves, with just the main line and chord symbols (G, F#, D, etc.). What was very detailed however were the many sync points with the picture, which were all meticolously notated. Therefore, Silvestri always wrote himself how the music is shaped to the action and its dominant character, with his orchestrator dressing it up orchestrally providing ornamentations and filigree (I think a lot of those early Silvestri scores were written using the Synclavier, so there may have been some coloristic indications too from Silvestri to the orchestrator). That being said, Silvestri became more specific in his sketches as the years went by and did all the orchestrations himself - in pencil! - on a few projects (What Lies Beneath, Cast Away). He's definitely one of the few these days who does mostly all by himself... and this is one of the reasons he scaled down dramatically his film work. You just cannot do it like that anymore in current studio productions, where the film keeps changing every five minutes and you must demo every cue to a committee.
 
As for Bill Ross writing cues for Dial of Destiny, he was properly credited in the end credits for the sole original piece he actually composed ("Pulse of the City"), while the rest of his contribution was adapting and collaging together bits and pieces from the previous Indy scores, plus some more oddities like Minority Report, War of the Worlds and even a bit from 1941 (!). I don't know the specifics of how things were planned, but I seem to remember that originally JW agreed to write and record only a few themes, with Ross using them as template to score the entire film, but then JW ended up scoring several scenes himself, doing a lot more than what he planned (even at his age, the man remained a workaholic). My guess is that the scenes in which we hear those collage-type cues, i.e. the whole prologue, were probably temped by music editor Ramiro Belgardt and used as a guide track for Ross to conjoin cues and provide the occasional transitional bit here and there. I don't really think this can be called "ghostwriting" at all, but it's more of (a hell of an) arranging job--it says a lot that he ended up sharing with JW the credit "Music Orchestrated and Conducted by" in the end credit roll. Again, much different than the routine of contemporary composers who must have a whole staff of helpers in order to get out alive.
 
 
 
I believe Williams is one of the very few who still writes with pencil and paper these days, and not just among film composers, but in general. I only know of Bruce Broughton and Eric Whitacre who still prefer at least sketching on paper with a pencil. Anyway, it's not a matter of who uses old school tools vs. who uses the most recent software and hardware. I think the outcome is what matters. And these days the outcome is often depressing.
 
As for surrounding yourself with helpers and arrangers in order to get out alive, it's common practice and nothing one should be scandalized about. It happened even back in the 1930s and '40s, where there was so much music to be produced. That being said, the work was mostly the product of one single creative mind, at least compositionally. Someone like Goldsmith, who ended up writing even 6 or 7 scores per year back in the 1970s, was truly an exception because a) he was a workaholic whose music literally spilled out of his hands and b) he was a genius. Same discourse apply to Morricone, who cranked like 20 scores per year (even though they were just one theme and a few variations in most cases).
 
What happens today instead is that film composers are businessmen who run their own companies and have many people on staff to work on multiple projects at the same time, because the industry scale ramped up dramatically, with all the streaming services and the likes. I won't name names because I don't want any trouble, but look at the resume of some of the most in-demand composers for film and television and tell me how it would be humanly possible to take care of everything just by one person. I mean, surely some of them are workaholics who burn the midnight oil all week long and don't take holidays, etc. in order to deliver all the cues, including reworks. But it's not a healthy choice of life in the long run, and if you're paid a million dollar per movie, you can definitely allow yourself to use some help from others. Yes, there are extremes of people literally not doing anything but just giving indications to staff and review their work later on, maybe filling in a few bars and then taking all the glory themselves. The industry is full of such tales and sometimes it's hard to sift truth from gossip... But it's a much less romantic job that many of us fans want to believe.
 
Composers who always did it all by himself for the most part don't work for Hollywood anymore these days. It's just not possible within the current system. And sure, for one John Powell who still is capable of writing memorable themes and sophisticated action cues (even within such paradigm and with help from others), there are dozens who compose anonymous stuff that just sits in the background "unobtrusively," as a lot of filmmakers like their soundtracks when they're not made by their needledrops.
 
 
I don't particularly like what's being shown here. Visually, it looks like every other superhero flick of the last 15 years. Perhaps a little more dashes of colour, but nothing particularly stimulating to my sense. Digital cinematography truly ruined what movies look like.
 
Story-wise, it seems another twist on the Donner/Mankiewicz approach, i.e. putting Kal-El as a God-like being among humans, trying to be accepted as one of them and struggling with the temptation of using his powers to right all the wrongs. I mean, it's basic Superman mythology which has been retreaded countless times in comic books, films and television shows (with incredibly varied results, of course). I was chatting about this with my brother @Poor_Man_S_HirschFeld earlier, as we share a common love for the character since our early childhood days--the issue of putting Superman on screen is that, despite you can amp up to 11th the scale of the threat he has to face, what will keep audiences engaged is his own vulnerability and how he manages to use his unlimited powers just for doing good and not becoming some kind of monster. Here, there seems to be at least a hint of something interesting that may have been explored, i.e. "I'm Superman, I can end wars without giving accounts to anyone." It's the old trope of "the end justifies the means," but on a superhero scale. We'll see how it will play out.
 
Also, there seems to be good chemistry between Corenswet and Broshanan.
 
The less is said about the trailerization of Williams' theme, the better.

The thing about going straight to Rogue One after Andor is the tonal difference, especially in Krennic (also, K2 is nerfed to hell compared to the show). The only moment of the movie where the show really improves it for me is Cassian's little speech to Jyn about what they've done for the rebellion.
 
The finale opted for giving a thematic round-up and closure rather than a "converging storylines" that Season 1 did, and if it wasn't for the performances (it's amazing how there's not a single weak link in this cast), it could've fallen flat.
 
Is this the first time Bail was a bit antagonistic? It felt jarring, but it rounded up his character, so that's nice. It's remarkable that we got origin stories for Luthen and Kleya, and yet we still don't know who they were. Thankfully, every theory going around them was wrong.

Yeah, Dedra's face during Krennic's interrogation accusing her of being a rebel spy were priceless, as she finally realizes her life's work is about to be shattered and no one will care about her. Denise Gough really delivered with her performance, even making you empathize with such a despicable character.

I love how they in this behind the scenes video they edited Luthen's speech from S1 underneath the footage of his final moments. That was fantastic!
 
 
And Krennic was truly awful and terrifying in these final episode. Loved the interrogation scenes with Dedra.

The vibe he gave off, mostly in S1 but here too, was of a poor teacher saddled with the... slow kids' class, perking up when finally someone's not being a boring idiot. I love how they found multiple ways to make up empathise with these Imperial characters.

Watched the finale and jumped right after into Rogue One, and it does feel like a natural continuation of the story. The comparison does highlight some of the movie's flaws, like the rushed pace or some messy structure, plus the fact that the characters are obviously not as fleshed out because of the shorter screen time. Even so, the full context that Andor gives makes the final hour a lot more impactful and intense, and still remains one of the best stuff done in Star Wars. Also, was quite surprised to see that Melshi appears in the film!
 
About Andor, I loved how it was a lot more emotion oriented than focusing on the action. Episode 10 was Kleya's episode, and it suddenly hit me how hard she's had it through all this time, all the suffering and tension, and how she was willing to give her life away so the cause could prosper. Her relationship with Luthen was always subtle but in this episode we finally understand her deep, deep bond, and how hard she was struggling to make her choice at the end. Happy to see characters like her or Vel continue their lives after the events of the show even if we don't know their whereabouts. Not Dedra though, as she finally realized the system of oppresion she was inforcing didn't care about her and her achievements, and was willing to throw her aside as soon as she was deemed worthless or perilous.
 
The final episode connects really nicely into Rogue One, and perhaps it focuses a bit too much on that, but it's still a really solid ending either way, and seeing the final shot with Bix carrying on with her life in a shot that mirrors Cassian's final moments in Rogue One was beautiful and heartbreaking all the same.
 
Some of the finest content ever in Star Wars if you ask me!