DarthDementous

Now, that's not a fair accusation. I've gone through a lot of comics that Lucas seems to have been through: as far as I can tell, his research STARTED with the Weird Worlds comic-strip, which adapted several Burroughs stories, and only then got into the actual Burroughs' paperbacks. Later on, he and his artists also looked into some recent Flash Gordon strips, works by Moebius and others. And he was certainly inspired by the works of people who illustrated many of these pulp works, including Frank Frazetta, Kelly Kae Freas, John Schoenherr.
 
Furthermore, Lucas had a particular way of working where he drew on literary sources, but processed them through movies: so Dune led him to thinking in terms of Lawrence of Arabia and Metropolis, Galactic Patrol led him to thinking in terms of James Bond and 2001, Princess of Mars got him thinking of The Searchers, The Stainless Steel Rat got him thinking of Casablanca, Tolkien made him think of Disney films, et cetera...
 
Flash Gordon has obvious similarities to Star Wars, and certainly a primary source for Lucas, especially the third serial, Flash Gordon Conquers the Universe. But, as I'm sure you'll agree, the relationship is less one of the specifics. Look at the main characters: Flash, Dale and Zarkov. A simple-minded person could say "Well, they're just Luke, Leia and Ben." But anyone who watched the serials would know that's absolutely false equivalency. Lucas is influenced by Flash Gordon, but he by no means rips-off Flash Gordon.
 
That's not to say Flash Gordon isn't a crucial, primary source for Lucas, from the initial instigation to pursue the project, to its name "Star Wars" (Lucas would have known Flash Gordon as "Space Soldiers"), to the whole basic vernacular of rayguns (although in Lucas' film they look more like vintage pistols) and landspeeders (Luke's is straight out a then-recent Gordon strip) to the basic concept of a rebellion against a tyrannical emperor, and some of the (more minor) environments in the sweep of the films like Cloud City and the Gungan city.
 
 What's more, the ramshackled look and the basic approach of metaphorically taking scraps from other movies and books and hitching them together are from Flash Gordon moreso than any other space opera property.  Another hugely important influence of Flash, which is of the essence for JWFan, is the score: the idea of doing a symphonic score and many of the specific choices of the temp-track, which obviously sent Williams down certain avenues, comes from Flash Gordon.

It's called representation Yavar.
 
Cal Kestis was a godsend for us Gingers.
 
 
😉

Oh no! People on the internet are cranky about Star Wars!

Oh yes, very much so! The Empire Strikes Back is also along those lines: its really mostly The Ewok Adventure and, to a lesser degree, the original film, that are in that more Tolkienian vein.

I was going to spend way too much time replying to this. Thanks for letting me know I don’t need to bother.
 
TCW tackles a lot of different ideas without forgetting it’s a mash up of Flash Gordon and Thunderbirds. Andor is shot and edited like a modern tv show that happens to have TIE fighters in it. 

that I agree with, this is less a fairy tale as it is a cautionary tale. which I would argue, is something Lucas already started to do with Star Wars come the time of the Prequels where we start to see a bit more Dune influence with the idea of the pressure of being the 'Chosen One' being a cursed chalice that leads to tragedy as opposed to a noble higher-calling that leads to a positive transformation of the self

I think that's ultimately what it comes down to. that Star Wars 'feeling' has undergone a lot of change both in Lucas' own works and also the expanded material, the latter of which I'm reasonably familiar with. so when something like Andor comes along, because of my recognition of how Star Wars expanded beyond its initial scope, this still feels within that expanded scope. I think in the past I've referred to this as the closest example of an adaptation of a work from the old expanded universe and I still stand by that

I was actually rather fascinated by RLM's recent Andor review and their suggestion which I think I agree with, that in the mainstream in order for a series like Star Wars to survive and grow you have to ditch the black and white simplistic fairtytale framing because that is doomed to create repetitiveness and staleness, instead opting to shine lights on parts of the series the movies didn't pay much attention to. the more sci-fi aspects, the more political aspects (something that hilariously the Prequels actually fleshed out very little). this is exactly the kind of revolution that happened with the expanded universe, so I'm not surprised in the least that this is resonating with the more mainstream audiences that weren't familiar with what happened in those less popular mediums
 
it's darkly ironic to me that after ditching the material that figured this out decades ago, it took some years of floundering until what currently remains a fluke, to stumble upon this phenomenon again. if Leslie Headland really gets the EU as she says she does, she'll recognise that the Acolyte needs to fulfill pretty much the same role that the Bane Trilogy did which is to paint a far more nuanced version of the Jedi and Sith ideological conflict, and present compelling villains that have a rather fleshed out philosophy and even make you question your own morals at times

that I agree with, this is less a fairy tale as it is a cautionary tale. which I would argue, is something Lucas already started to do with Star Wars come the time of the Prequels where we start to see a bit more Dune influence with the idea of the pressure of being the 'Chosen One' being a cursed chalice that leads to tragedy as opposed to a noble higher-calling that leads to a positive transformation of the self

I think that's ultimately what it comes down to. that Star Wars 'feeling' has undergone a lot of change both in Lucas' own works and also the expanded material, the latter of which I'm reasonably familiar with. so when something like Andor comes along, because of my recognition of how Star Wars expanded beyond its initial scope, this still feels within that expanded scope. I think in the past I've referred to this as the closest example of an adaptation of a work from the old expanded universe and I still stand by that

I was actually rather fascinated by RLM's recent Andor review and their suggestion which I think I agree with, that in the mainstream in order for a series like Star Wars to survive and grow you have to ditch the black and white simplistic fairtytale framing because that is doomed to create repetitiveness and staleness, instead opting to shine lights on parts of the series the movies didn't pay much attention to. the more sci-fi aspects, the more political aspects (something that hilariously the Prequels actually fleshed out very little). this is exactly the kind of revolution that happened with the expanded universe, so I'm not surprised in the least that this is resonating with the more mainstream audiences that weren't familiar with what happened in those less popular mediums
 
it's darkly ironic to me that after ditching the material that figured this out decades ago, it took some years of floundering until what currently remains a fluke, to stumble upon this phenomenon again. if Leslie Headland really gets the EU as she says she does, she'll recognise that the Acolyte needs to fulfill pretty much the same role that the Bane Trilogy did which is to paint a far more nuanced version of the Jedi and Sith ideological conflict, and present compelling villains that have a rather fleshed out philosophy and even make you question your own morals at times

I do think Andor is straddling the line in terms of "feeling like Star Wars." It has almost none of the Burroughs-cum-Tolkien "fairytale" touches that had defined the series in the past: its much, much more sci-fi in the usual sense of the word.
 
I don't think any of this is particularly indebted to it being driven by dialogue (although some portions, like the Mon Mothma scenes, do) and I do think the dichotomy that Herr Schilkeman builds relies too much on viewing Star Wars via what George Lucas says he did with it, rather than by what he actually did. Star Wars had always been very reliant on rat-a-tat dialogue, with some characters lik the Droids or Vader all but entirely dependent on it.

Andor has a strong emphasis on visual storytelling. not sure how it's even possible to have missed that

any point about how it doesn't feel like Star Wars needs to explain what feeling like Star Wars even means, you may as well just say 'I wasn't interested in it', it's just going to beg the question as to why specifically

Andor has a strong emphasis on visual storytelling. not sure how it's even possible to have missed that

any point about how it doesn't feel like Star Wars needs to explain what feeling like Star Wars even means, you may as well just say 'I wasn't interested in it', it's just going to beg the question as to why specifically

Better is subjective. For me, Andor doesn't feel/look/sound like Star Wars. George used film holistically, with a strong emphasis on visual storytelling, not just as set dressing for dialog.

https://uk.movies.yahoo.com/movies/star-wars-beau-willimon-co-204420432.html
 
An Andor writer co-writing this, he wrote the Prison Break episode and two others.

I think Andor may have been more cheerful than these two episodes.
 
I mean, they were great. But wow. I don't know what I would have done if they had offed Wrecker. (Ricka.)
 
I'm a little disappointed that Omega is captured again. I suppose it was always going this way, but... It feels like a reset button. Except now we have Crosshair going crazy to bring her back. When Crosshair missed with the tracker my kids lost it.
 
Ok, I just popped on the new soundtrack. Holy cripes! It's so good!
 
 

They might be better than *most* of the live action shows, but none of them is even close to as good as Andor.
 
EDIT after first angry reaction: Hey, if you’ve watched through the prison arc on Andor and think the animated shows are better written, better acted, better told stories… I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree.
 
Yavar

Do I have some books and comics for you!
 
About the point of Acolyte, I heard t the same thing said about Andor before it came out. It could very well end up as you describe it... or it could end up pretty great, it could go either way so there's no point in the question.

Oh wow, that's quite tasteful and also a great track. Bodes well for his ability to adopt other's musical styles
This track is really nice, I've been checking out a bunch of random stuff from his repertoire and I've pretty much liked all of them. Very excited to see what he does with Star Wars

Oh this is quite John Williams-y (or more accurately his influences!
 

I don't know how to give you an example of an instance where Andor doesn't contradict the existing material, someone would need to do the opposite

Well Disney is definitely inconsistent in keeping with its own canon. As far as 1-6 go, besides "Somehow Palpatine returned", the characterisation of Luke and the Obi Wan show, Rogue One is maybe the biggest in terms of contradictions. Firstly the Geonosians (or Separatists) created the Death Star "The Jedi must not find our designs for the ultimate weapon. If they find out what we are planning, we're doomed", but apparently going by Rogue One the plans for how this ultimate weapon would operate weren't complete and they needed someone else to finish it, which makes the reveal in AOTC redundant. ANHs opening crawl states rebel spies stole the Death Star plans, not true, one spy, a group of rebel soldiers and at least 3 people that weren't a part of the rebellion infiltrated an Imperial facility to steal the plans. Vader tells Leia "several transmissions were beamed to this ship by rebel spies" which Vader knows isn't true, that the plans were sent to the Profundity then passed to her ship, which is contradicted even more when she feigns ignorance, as if the soldier on the other side of the door that grabbed the plans didn't feel it might be worth mentioning that Vader slaughtered several troops trying to get to the plans that were handed to their ship. There's also that in Rogue One the Death Star is hyperspacing around the galaxy and firing at planets appearing to be fully operational, yet in ANH - "Until this battle station is fully operational we are vulnerable" "And what of the rebellion? If the rebels have obtained a complete technical readout of this station it is possible however unlikely they might find a weakness and exploit it" "...now Lord Vader will provide us with the location of the rebel fortress by the time this station is operational" "The final checkout is completed, all systems are operational" "Princess Leia before your execution I would like you to be my guest at a ceremony that will make this battle station operational" "In a way you have determined the choice of the planet that will be destroyed first " "I have chosen to test this stations destructive power on your home planet of Alderaan", which would all suggest that the station has only just become operational during the events of ANH as opposed to being fully active and firing, even if on a "single ignition" in Rogue One. Then there's the Death Stars weakness, in ANH it's clearly meant to be something the Empire overlooked, yet Rogue One has Jyn find out her father has "rigged a trap inside it" and have her plead before the rebel council (where General Dodoanna is present) to get the plans but this is shot down. While in his debrief Dodoanna says "an analysis of the plans provided by Princess Leia demonstrated a weakness in the battle station... the shaft leads directly to the reactor system, a precise hit should start a chain reaction that should destroy the station.. " No acknowledgement of either Jyn or that the weakness was actually a trap set by her father and the plans confirmed it. Then there's also "we've analysed their attack sir and there is a danger.." so not only have these plans been in Palpatines possession since the start of the Clone Wars, with the Death Stars construction beginning prior to ROTS but they've been altered by Galen to include this weakness,  that by simply figuring out the rebels target that the inbuilt weakness can be detected by the them. Then there's the corridor scene with Vader which I've already explained why it contradicts the OT.
 
As per the article I linked to it's supposedly set 100 years before TPM. I doubt that Yoda who was actively training Jedi at this time would just causally forget the appearance of the jedis' biggest threat. Also they didn't loose a planet. Kamino is located in Wild Space, an area of the galaxy that hasn't been fully explored, and has no representation in the Republic, it being deleted from the archive and no one noticing isn't that big of a stretch. The Jedi Order never requested the Clone Army, it was Sifo-Dyas acting independently who commissioned it's creation but was killed by Dooku, who hired Jango as the template. 
 
The opening crawl also states that getting the plans is the Rebellions first victory against the Empire, so none of the victories in Rebels count. Not even ending it's occupation of Lothal and Grand Admiral Thrawn being lightspeeded into another galaxy was a win for them.

Andor

Andor

That's good news, although I think I have a more positive view on the four new episodes thus far than some.
 
I hope Gold is maybe going to put out a specials soundtrack to coincide with this series' premiere, but given his most recent comments about being pissed at his own fans for "stealing" his music (I'd have a few questions about what sort of security his agent's site has, or why it was stored there to begin with) I wonder what sort of release he's going to do at all. I hope he doesn't become the sort of composer that decides his music is just for the show and say FU to fans that have bought his entire DW discography.

Michelle Ang (Omega) and Temuera Morrison (original voice of the clones and Jango Fett), and the actress who plays the female clone scientist are from New Zealand and have native accents
EDIT: Emerie Karr is voiced by Keisha Castle Hughes who was born in Australia but still a New Zealander, which means she is very likely using her native accent in the show which is distinctly New Zealander
 
Dee Bradley Baker (current voice of the clones) is an American trying to put on a New Zealand accent but it sounds absolutely terrible and more akin to something like an Australian one. That’s where the inconsistency is

Oh wow, that's quite tasteful and also a great track. Bodes well for his ability to adopt other's musical styles
This track is really nice, I've been checking out a bunch of random stuff from his repertoire and I've pretty much liked all of them. Very excited to see what he does with Star Wars

Oh this is quite John Williams-y (or more accurately his influences!
 

Oh wow, that's quite tasteful and also a great track. Bodes well for his ability to adopt other's musical styles
This track is really nice, I've been checking out a bunch of random stuff from his repertoire and I've pretty much liked all of them. Very excited to see what he does with Star Wars

Oh this is quite John Williams-y (or more accurately his influences!
 

Having heard some of his concert output, and the few tracks posted above, I am even more excited about this. I hope they give him the opportunity to harken back to a more space opera classical idiom for this project, something that the concept (hopefully) might ask for. Fingers crossed!
 
Karol