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DarthDementous

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  1. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to mrbellamy in Michael Giacchino's Rogue One: A Star Wars Story (2016) - 2022 Expanded Edition now available   
    He's even ripping off JW's infatuation with Rey!
  2. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Not Mr. Big in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    I really love the action music in Tina and Newt Trial/Let's Get the Good Stuff Out/You're One of Us Now/Swooping Evil
  3. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Alex in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    Well I really enjoyed this. Makes me kinda sad that JNH didn't get a crack at the main series.
  4. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to leeallen01 in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    1:30 is like Williams and JNH had a melodic love child. It's the perfect spirit of both of them.
     
    Adore this piece.
  5. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to mrbellamy in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    Dunno, don't think so!
     
    Just finished my first listen....yeah, this is pretty wonderful.
     
    I have to stop short of calling it truly great atm because these 72 minutes felt kind of scatterbrained to me. Themes at the beginning disappearing, new melodies appearing seemingly out of nowhere at the end with these huge statements. So I hope the rest of the score fills in the blanks.
     
    But wow this has some great moments, that first track did not represent the best of this score at all. So much color, the action music IS fun, those surprising bursts of dance-like energy in "The Erumpent" and "Tina and Newt Trial etc." The dark/atmospheric underscore has cooler stuff going on than I expected from the first track. Definitely felt an emotional arc hinted at here which again I hope becomes more defined with the complete score because I sense there's some key stuff missing from this program. Even so, that big moment around five minutes into the 12-minute track resonates. 
     
    Oh yeah, and I only caught two "Hedwig's Theme" references: the one we already heard in the main title, and then a quick nod to the B theme toward the end of the second track.
  6. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to leeallen01 in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    With every film series that Williams scored, I'm sure every film maker with a brain at least asks him just in case. I'm sure he was casually asked about Rogue One, Jurassic World, and Fantastic Beasts. And I'm sure he didn't say "NO!" Instead he no doubt humbly and eloquently declined by saying that other composers should be allowed to have a go at such fun material. 
  7. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to DemonStar in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    I like how there's quality writing and instrumentation even in the quieter cues like this, instead of just filler music like we get in a lot of scores. I'm eager to listen to the entire album, especially that long 12 minute track.
     
    The interview is really nice to read.
  8. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to mrbellamy in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    Third track:
     
     
  9. Like
    DarthDementous got a reaction from DemonStar in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    the more I analyse this track the more hope I have for the film. this really does feel like a return to a more Williams style scoring in ways more than superficial resemblance. barring the sound of the some of the strings, I'd be able to accept 0:21 to 0:53 as Williams himself. another thing that is showing is the commitment to memorable themes. I'm not very fond of short motifs so to hear a lovely long theme like 0:53 that actually sticks in my mind is very encouraging, and coincidentally I think one of Williams' specialities is in long themes. 
  10. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to TheUlyssesian in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    The books are dark in a superficial way. They are extremely imaginative but are still ideal for younger audiences because of how simplistic they are, simple in their world views, with clearly defined good and bad sides, the moral rightness of the good side firmly established etc. etc. Simplicity and directness is a luxury often lost in adult fiction (but adult fiction offers other pleasures). The books need not be didactic, but in a way they are as they teach values of tolerance and are this ideal for young readers (depending upon how you want them raised).
     
    So basically dark is an extremely misapplied euphemism for adult, the two do not mean the same thing at all (somebody tell this to the DC film fans). 
     
    Now adult books are actually those which kinda liberate the reader from the above simplicity and plunge the reader into the bewildering ambiguity and complexity of adult life. When nothing is clearly defined, when there's no good or bad, when morality becomes subjective and not absolute and when heavy uncertainty infuses every action and thought - that is when you know you are reading an adult novel because you have to think. And think with the realization that there is no one answer. 
     
    I think the Harry Potter books are entirely uncomplicated and very good for kids and young adults. The cleverness in plotting of the earlier books also render them pleasurable to adults.
  11. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Pieter Boelen in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    Yep, that really does work very well!
    Though really, I doubt I'll ever get used to Second Dumbledore....
     
    What I wouldn't give to see the Potter films as they should have been!
    Williams and Richard Harris for the entire series. Scripts somewhat closer to the books.
    Actual cool wizard battles instead of "wisps of smoke circling each other".
    A variety of strange magic and that sphinx during the Third Task plus the tap dancing scene in the Ministry of Magic.
    The fountain of gold figurines coming to life and buildings jumping out of the way of the Knight Bus. The list goes on.
    That is imagination at its best and it would have been absolutely incredible!
     
    For me, anyway.
    Might not have sat so well with the "regular young adult crowd" though.
    But then.... I was never a regular young adult! 
  12. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Pieter Boelen in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    Sounds about right! 
     
    Actually, I'm 30 now and I'm not going to deny that I LIKE the Harry Potter books.
    Those and the Hornblower series are probably my favourite series of books ever because of how much I enjoy reading them.
    They're quite well written, are entertaining, often pretty darn clever and yet also contain a lot of truth.
     
    I never liked those adult covers for the Potter books though. Same goes for the US ones.
    But the UK children versions are pretty great by my reckoning!
     
    And for whatever reason, I always appreciated the early Potter films far more than the later ones.
    Because of them being more child friendly? Or despite of it? I honestly do not know.
    Maybe it truly is just because of John Williams' glorious music for them!
  13. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to mrbellamy in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    He just seems really insecure about Harry Potter not being taken seriously enough and overcompensates by trying to characterize them as even bleaker than they are. On the Fantastic Beasts IMDb forum he made a thread about the fact that the film and all the Harry Potter movies were labeled "family" on IMDb in addition to being included on a Wikipedia list of kids' movies but that Star Wars movies aren't considered "family" on the site, and he also seemed to indicate that he tried taking off Potter and/or adding Star Wars to the Wikipedia list but his edits kept getting refused by whoever was moderating the page.
     
    I mean, I get that. I think it's probably deemed not quite as "cool" for adults (more specifically adult men) to like Harry Potter as opposed to something like Star Wars, LOTR, DC, Marvel. I think there's less of that now than there was before the back-half of the series came out and the films started getting PG-13 ratings, though. When the books were first coming out in the 90s there was a lot more condescension, mockery from stand-up comedians etc about middle-aged dudes reading Harry Potter on the subway, to the point where Bloomsbury even put out more subdued-looking "adult" covers for the series in the UK. 
     
    I think Casey/hihihi's looking at it the wrong way, though. I think it's a great thing that the Harry Potter series is generally considered suitable for 10-year-olds, because it does push those boundaries. People always complain about the fact that children's entertainment lacks edge, isn't confronting them with reality in a way that's appropriate, isn't helping to engage their sense of empathy through moral issues and dilemmas. Potter is great for that and I think that's something that I do commend Yates for toward the end is that he did manage that line between PG and PG-13 pretty well. It's interesting to me what a 10-year-old would think about a movie like Deathly Hallows: Part 1. Surely many would find it too boring or scary to finish but I bet it blew a few young minds, to see a movie that quiet and still for long stretches. That'd be their first time experiencing an aesthetic like that.
     
    Aside from the literal, the darkness isn't really my problem with Yates so much as the bleakness. Harry Potter was never bleak in my eyes, it was always hopeful, compassionate, and exuberant. Yates's sensibilities always clashed for me whenever he would try to introduce a little slapstick or jokey dialogue, whereas in the book it felt about right when McGonagall transfigured a bunch of school desks to charge into battle even when some brutal major deaths were a handful of pages away. It was just a matter of tone and energy and dynamism. I wanted to see Neville heroically scream "DUMBLEDORE'S ARMY!!!!" to the crowd. I wanted to see Harry put his arm around Ron, holding back tears after destroying the locket. There were still worthwhile moments like that in the films, but I still felt something missing in crucial moments, some palpable fear or joy or anger or passion. The emotional highs felt suppressed, the lows dulled. Of course writing, performances, music, editing, cinematography, sound design all factor in.
  14. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Jay in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    @Dcasey98 - You were banned for 3 weeks for insulting board members with foul language which isn't allowed here.  You're also not allowed to create a second account ( @hihihi12345) to get around a ban (or for any other reason), so I've added another week to your ban.
     
    You're welcome to come back when your ban is over in a month and and continue to discuss things civily, but if you break the rules again, either by insulting members again or by creating another account (or for any other reason), you'll be perma-banned.  
     
    Your duplicate account has been suspended forever.
  15. Like
    DarthDementous got a reaction from leeallen01 in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    the more I analyse this track the more hope I have for the film. this really does feel like a return to a more Williams style scoring in ways more than superficial resemblance. barring the sound of the some of the strings, I'd be able to accept 0:21 to 0:53 as Williams himself. another thing that is showing is the commitment to memorable themes. I'm not very fond of short motifs so to hear a lovely long theme like 0:53 that actually sticks in my mind is very encouraging, and coincidentally I think one of Williams' specialities is in long themes. 
  16. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to leeallen01 in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    Absolutely. A great way of putting it. I think he captures that uneasy magical feeling well in the first piece of this track; 'Tina Takes Newt In,' especially the frantic Williams-esque strings at 0:21, and the lovely, intriguing theme at 0:53. 
     
     
  17. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to TheUlyssesian in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    Completely agree. I always  thought Hedwig's Theme has an absolutely wonderful undercurrent of malice to it which is so very necessary for this world. And it is the main franchise theme!
     
    He has of course gentler melodies which are more wholesome -like his family theme and hogwarts theme and wondrous world theme. But hedwig's theme definitely has menace as it should. Even the double trouble theme - it has a sense of mischief and a touch of the macabre which are very fitting.
     
    To use a single word, I think Williams music was very clever. Something which normal composers would not usually bring to a film.
  18. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Pieter Boelen in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    There's a lot of humour in the books and they're very funny often enough.
    I gave only one specific example of a notable contrast between "light" and "dark"; there are of course far, far more examples.
     
    As far as I can tell from the actual book as written, it is a Death Eater using a tap-dancing curse.
    What you say there is nowhere in the books. Maybe it's one of those Pottermore things; I wouldn't know as I haven't kept up on that at all.
     
    So basically what you're saying is that my fond memories of reading fun, magical books named "Harry Potter" are completely false?
    They're actually pure, nasty dark, virtually no fun at all and are therefore by my definition "as shit as they come"?
     
    I'm not saying the books are inherently light. And I don't agree they're virtually completely dark.
    What I AM saying though is that both the light and the dark are there. And thank goodness for that!
    That is what creates actual contrast and therefore vastly increases their actual poignancy.

    We can debate all day over the exact percentage of "light versus dark", but that is truly as pointless as it comes.
    Maybe it is 50% light, 50% dark. Maybe the numbers are different. My point is that there is enough of the one to contrast the other.
    There is enough dark to make the books serious enough while there is also enough light to provide contrast and prevent them from becoming depressing.
    And that is a good thing!
     
    I never claimed that the books are actually "childish" and "silly" anyway. And I most definitely did not criticize the books for that either.
    Quite the opposite. In fact, I was complimenting the excellent contrast in that example I provided.
     
    Pretending the books are mostly dark, dreary and depressing (those are really just the same thing for me!) as you do is quite false though.
    I honestly don't know what books you read, but I most certainly read very different ones.
    And I'm very glad I did, because apparently I wouldn't like your versions one bit!
     
    I will gladly bash films for being 100% dark to the exclusion of any light any day of the week.
    Surely there must be people who actually like that for whatever maddened reason.
    After all, those films are still made and apparently make money too.
    But I will not ever appreciate them.
     
    I can acknowledge though that there can be films where 100% dark may work.
    But even such truly serious films about subject matter that is as dark as it comes, such as Schindler's List and Saving Private Ryan, are not without their beauty.
    And those are really the ones where an overbearing presence of dark would make actual sense!
    In Harry Potter though, that level of darkness would be completely out of place.
     
    In the end though, this is pure personal preference. I cannot stand needless amounts of darkness and never will.
    There is enough of that in real life (just look at the news!) and I've experienced enough of it to last me a lifetime.
    I don't need it also in my fantasy adventure films.
     
    Anyway, your post is quite massively entertaining.
    By the sounds of it, Harry Potter is darker and grittier and should be taken more seriously than, say, The Lord of the Rings!
    After all, even LotR has lightness and humour and fun in it! As far as I'm concerned, Harry Potter (at least the books) has more.
    And that is (one of the reasons) why I find the HP books far more readable and enjoyable myself.
     
    Long story short: Darkness does not equal good and light does not equal bad.
  19. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Loert in Rey's Theme – John Williams' Best Theme Yet?   
    I couldn't find a link on Youtube, so I had to resort to Spotify, which is less than ideal because not everybody has access to Spotify. But I wanted to get at least some people to hear the reference.
     
    That comment was more tongue-in-cheek really, because I was just trying to point out that Williams may as well have been thinking more of Kennan than of Stravinsky when writing The Dune Sea of Tatooine. After all, the album on which that recording was presented was released in 1959 and it's not impossible that Williams, being the Howard Hanson fan that he is, listened to it at some point!
     
    Anyway, that "floating chords" motif which people keep attributing to Stravinsky's The Rite of Spring (as if Stravinksy was the inventor of it and Williams "stole" it from him) did not start with The Rite of Spring anyway. It is certainly at least taken from the introduction to Debussy's Nocturnes:
     
     
    Now, Nocturnes was published in 1900, and we know that Stravinsky knew and studied Debussy. This is very evident in the beginning of Stravinskly opera Le rossignol, which he started working on in 1908. The strings chords in the beginning are strikingly similar to that of the clarinet chords at the beginning of Nocturnes. There are other similarities throughout the opera with Nocturnes.
     
    Stravinsky did not borrow that Nocturnes passage in quite the same way in his next ballets, though elements can certainly be traced. For example, the beginning of his Firebird has a similar feel to the Le rossignol intro (muted strings playing "rhythmically straight" notes) which in turn can be traced back to the Nocturnes. Oscillating chords feature prominently in the final tableau of Petrushka. And finally, of course, in the second part of the Rite of Spring, which is what everybody compares The Dune Sea of Tatooine with.
     
    The point I'm trying to make is, this sort of "plagiarism" does not finish at any point. People who do not know any better see a video on Youtube accusing The Dune Sea of copying Stravinsky's "The Rite of Spring", without considering that the situation is more complex. I propose that Stravinsky himself should be accused of a great deal of self-plagiarisms, as well as the Le rossignol introduction being a blatant rip-off of Nocturnes. Because had Williams written that intro as part of a film score instead of Stravinsky, you can be sure that there would end up being a multitude of Youtube videos comparing that and Debussy's Nocturnes, with the comments filled with plagiarist experts denouncing Williams as a "hack". So why shouldn't Igor get the same treatment?
     
    I mean, if you want another case of Stravinsky the plagiarist, have a listen to the Infernal Dance of Katschei from The Firebird. It sounds inspired by the Sabbath of the Infernal Spirits, written by Stravinsky's teacher Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov. But nobody in the classical music scene seems to care. Yet, had Williams composed the Infernal Dance of Katschei instead of Stravinsky, you can bet that people on teh internet would be on his tail before you could say "temp track".
     
    Of course, I don't really believe that Stravinsky should be vilified for plagiarism. He obviously borrowed stole some ideas from other composers (e.g. he admits that when writing the Symphony in C, he had the scores of Beethoven symphonies open on his desk which he used for inspiration). But his musical genius was able to turn these ideas into something unique and that had never been thought up before. At the end of the day, no composer works in a vacuum. They always have some influences. But in Williams' case, there is too much attention being paid to what the influence was, rather than what he does with it. From what I've heard of Williams, he has never out-right copied another composer's work. The first 5 seconds may sound similar and inspired, but then he always goes off in another direction. And if a portion does sound very similar to another composer's work, there is usually a reason behind it, for instance the big "Mars" chords in the SW main titles which are supposed to connote war. (And even then, didn't Holst kinda rip off Mahler?).
  20. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to oierem in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    I agree with that. And I mean it literally.
    The last few HP movies are LITERALLY dark in many places, and you can't actually see what's going on in the screen unless you are in total darkness.
    Contrast that with the darkness of the Emperor's Throne Room in Return of the Jedi, for example: everyone dressed in black in a room full of darkness and yet the image is clear and colorful.
  21. Like
  22. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Pieter Boelen in Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them 5-film series   
    An undercurrent of dark is far better than an overbearing presence of dark.
    Wasn't Dcasey claiming the Potter movies are the best things ever thanks to their darkness in the later films?
    In that case, I agree with his observation that yes, those films did turn darker and darker along the way.
    But for me that is probably the number one reason for my disappointment with those later films.
     
    The books had an undercurrent of darkness indeed. But it was contrasted nicely with light in many spots.
    To the point that the battle in the Ministry involved a Death Eater using a tap dancing curse.
    Silly indeed. But then Sirius dies barely a few pages later, making the contrast even more of a shock.
     
    This was actually one of the triggers for me coming up with the term "modern movie syndrome",
    which is something I truly hate with a vengeance and I cannot wait for that phase to pass.
    These are movies where the filmmakers decided to go dark because of a perceived "darkness = good" logic.
    Also "dark = minimalist = low on emotional resonance".
     
    While some measure of darkness, if applied well, can absolutely be a good thing, the contrast between light and dark is far more important.
    And it seems to me that filmmakers have forgotten about that these days, which is a shame indeed.
    Give us the dark IN ADDITION TO the light as opposed to INSTEAD OF!
  23. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to mrbellamy in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    The thing I immediately liked about this little cue is I think it really captures the jolly menace of the Williams scores. The other composers wrote a lot of nice "magical" stuff but a lot of it to me would either be a little too flighty without an effective dark undercurrent, or else not playful enough amidst the doom and gloom. It's a very subtle thing, Desplat probably got it best IMO in Part 1 with stuff like "Detonators" and the unused "Lovegood" but in general I didn't feel they rode the line quite so effortlessly and enjoyably as with Williams where he just had these endless melodies and textures that could sound so amusing yet also vaguely alien and threatening. That's Potter and this hits a nice sweet spot for me. She's just doing a cutesy trick but even still the music feels slightly skeptical of the magic which is how it should be.
  24. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Richard P in James Newton Howard's Fantastic Beasts And Where To Find Them   
    Nice, but nothing exciting.
     
    So far the only thing setting off alarm bells is the opening cue. I hope that's an anomaly in the score.
  25. Like
    DarthDementous reacted to Bilbo in Star Wars "Rebels" - Kevin Kiner Returns!   
    Kiner was better in TCW when he didn't have JW as a crutch. 
     
     
    Then again, TCW was a better show anyway. 
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