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Madmartigan JC

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  1. Love
    Madmartigan JC reacted to TownerFan in John Williams conducts Filarmonica della Scala, Milan, Italy, 19 June 2022!   
    I still can’t believe this. It’s beyond anything I could have ever dreamed of. John Williams conducting his music in the city where I’m born and where I live, in one of the temples of classical music. Utterly amazing.
  2. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Jay in John Williams conducts Filarmonica della Scala, Milan, Italy, 19 June 2022!   
    I was fully expecting him to do nothing but write and record Indiana Jones 5 in between Carnegie Hall (April 21) and that film's opening (July 29). A trip to Italy in June is shocking to me! I wonder if the main score will be done recording before he leaves, and then maybe a final pickup day will happen after the concert? 
     
    Or if an announcement that IJ5 is being delayed is forthcoming?
  3. Surprised
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Jay in John Williams conducts Filarmonica della Scala, Milan, Italy, 19 June 2022!   
    https://www.filarmonica.it/eventi/concerti-straordinari-concerto-per-milano-19-giugno-2022-ore-20-00
     
    Google Translate of the above text:
     
    SEASON 2022
    EXTRAORDINARY CONCERTS
    John Williams
    DIRECTOR
    19.6.22
    hours: 8:00 pm
    MILAN - LA SCALA THEATER
     
    The Concert for Milan finally returns to its usual appointment in June after being moved to September in 2020 and 2021 due to the health emergency. The great concert under the stars for the city of Milan and for Italy has never stopped and in 2022 it returns with a legendary interpreter. As one of the best known composers in US history it is not difficult to remember John Williams like John Philip Sousa, Aaron Copland or Leonard Bernstein. The career of success and recognition includes a conspicuous list of awards including five Academy Awards, numerous gold and platinum records. With two Emmy wins, three Golden Globe wins, twenty-five Grammys, Williams is arguably one of the most respected film composers, author of iconic scores that have become famous thanks to titles such as Star Wars, Harry Potter, Indiana Jones, Jurassic Park and many more.
  4. Haha
  5. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Ludwig in What's JW's "danger motif" (recurring idea)?   
    How about the Ludlow Motif?
     
     
  6. Haha
    Madmartigan JC reacted to crocodile in What's JW's "danger motif" (recurring idea)?   
    Because you asked for it.
     
     
    Karol
  7. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Smaug The Iron in Do you prefer for LLL's Jurassic Park and Harry Potter Soundtrack Collections to be limited or not?   
    They should never be limited. If you are a new John Williams fan you should have the right to have the complete score of your favorite scores in a legal way. 
    I never hade the opportunity to buy the Jurassic Park Collection so I had to downloade it illegaly instead. If it was unlimited I would be happy to buy it because I would own the set legaly and I would support La La Land Records. 
  8. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Holko in Do you prefer for LLL's Jurassic Park and Harry Potter Soundtrack Collections to be limited or not?   
    In other words, "am I a selfish asshole" vs. "do I want art to be presented properly and accessibly". LLL should get on the digital train after Varese and Intrada, and convince JW too, including the booklets digitally too, THEN limited physical releases would be acceptable. I was insanely lucky to find this site just when all I wanted (or was about to find out I wanted) was about to come out or still available.
  9. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Jay in Hook - 30th Anniversary Double Vinyl coming November 2021 from Mondo Records   
    - It isn't complete.  There is music you can hear in the film that isn't on it, as well as unused music that turned up in leaks that isn't on it...and even music on the original OST release that isn't on it!
    - It isn't chronological.  This is subjective of course, and many may like the programming choices just fine, but many find it odd that some cues only appear as bonus tracks, or that album tracks that combined cues from two different parts of the movie were retained in the main program
    - The sound quality isn't consistent.  The release fluctuates between 3 different sources: 2011 transfers of some sort of unearthed tapes, the album master, and the final film's music stem.  That source sounds noticeably worse than the other two, even to people who don't normally notice these types of things, and contains volume fluctuations and edited passages as needed for the film itself
    - They didn't recreate the intended performance edits out of what they pulled from the 2011 transfers.  So if JW recorded a cue 5 times and his approved version used in the film used 40 seconds of take 5, 10 seconds from take 3, 20 seconds from take 2, and then the rest from take 5, the same cue on the LLL set might just be take 5 throughout.
     
    That's a rough outline of it that hopefully gets the point across about why so many people desire a new edition done over from scratch by Mike.
  10. Confused
    Madmartigan JC reacted to JohnnyD in Hook - 30th Anniversary Double Vinyl coming November 2021 from Mondo Records   
    Dammit! Well, that’s disappointing. Really disappointing. 
  11. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to QuartalHarmony in Hook - 30th Anniversary Double Vinyl coming November 2021 from Mondo Records   
    I openly admit I’m grasping at straws here, but note that (ever the tight-lipped diplomat), he doesn’t say he hasn’t been working on one, just that one is unlikely to be released this year.
     
    I know how desperate this makes me sound, but I’m among my people here, right? You feel me.
     
    [mopes quietly in dark room]
     
    Mark
  12. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Jay in Hook - 30th Anniversary Double Vinyl coming November 2021 from Mondo Records   
    When Dan Wallin recorded The Last Crusade, he put walls up (acoustic separators) between instrument sections.  So even though the orchestra was the same size as Temple of Doom's (and many of the players were the same), the resulting recording sounds smaller because of this recording technique he chose to use.
     
    On top of this recording technique, it seems that even if nice proper analog tape was running to capture every take of every cue (let's hope this is true!), he edited the score digitally, meaning 1989-era digital technology lost a lot of the clarity those theoretical analog tapes would have held.  Since the OST album and Concord expansion were both assembled from these 1989 digital mixes, we are hoping that analog tape will be uncovered and freshly transferred and a new Crusade album could be rebuilt from scratch from that.
     
    But even if that happens, it's unclear just how much of an impact Wallin's recording technique would have no matter what original source material is used.
  13. Haha
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Bounty95 in Rise of Skywalker suite with Detroit Symphony Orchestra   
    They probably leaked that 30 CD Star Wars boxset as well and none of us noticed! 
  14. Haha
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Kasey Kockroach in Danny Elfman's SLEEPY HOLLOW (1999) - 2021 4-CD Expanded Edition from Intrada Records   
    First few posts of a new release: omg now the listening experience lasts six hours and you can hear coughing, FINALLY 
     
    Later: There two milliseconds where they accidentally spliced in the sound of tasmanian devil screeching, intrada is so dumb and lazy I want new disc and I want it now anyway when are they going to expand this other score
  15. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Doug Adams in JW is writing a new violin concerto for Anne-Sophie Mutter - "Violin Concerto No. 2"   
    I'll put in online for free after FSM has reached its subscribers. Short version: 
     
    -It's a lot to digest
    -It's great
    -Williams and Mutter are without equals
    -It's gonna be hard to get this behemoth into the standard rep 
  16. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Thor in THE EIGER SANCTION (1975) - 2021 2-CD Expanded Edition from Intrada Records   
    Not necessarily. There are certain types of sound that fit certain types of music. I don't subscribe to the notion that everything "old" needs to be run through contemporary tweaking techniques to sound as clean and modern as possible. The baroque jazz melancholy on display in EIGER befits a slightly muffled or high treble sound.
  17. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to crocodile in R.I.P J.W. Rinzler, Star Wars & Indiana Jones Author/Historian   
    RIP.
     
     
    His books were the very golden standard of how you handle making of publications. Stunning attention to detail and giving you an almost fly on the wall type of an experience. I did enjoy his later books too. Still need to finish the Aliens one. 
     
    I do hope his making of The Shining book will see the light of the day. It has been announced a couple of years ago and is supposed to be his most throughly researched work yet. 
     
    And I do look forward to his biography of Howard Kazanijan that's coming out in September. 
     
    Karol
  18. Really Sad
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Manakin Skywalker in R.I.P J.W. Rinzler, Star Wars & Indiana Jones Author/Historian   
    Star Wars, Indiana Jones Author JW Rinzler Dies at Age 58 (gizmodo.com)
  19. Like
    Madmartigan JC got a reaction from Tom Guernsey in What the blogs say vs. what actual Classical Musicians actually say.   
    Agreed! I think you're right on.
     
    Also, I really enjoyed that book. Ross is one of the very few music writers on classical music savvy about popular genres and willing to judge each music on its own terms. I think it's not a coincidence his interview with John Williams from last year was one of the most interesting ones, going beyond the tired usual questions.
  20. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to ragoz350 in RESTORED ISOLATED SCORE: Star Wars Saga (Unused Music Restored To Picture)   
    Anyway, I decided to collect all cues from Battle of Naboo sequence in one video. In fact, there is nothing new here, just wondering how it looks and sounds all together. All unrecorded/unreleased fragments are my mokaping. Many thanks to @Permanent Waves for the restore videos (especially for Take To Your Ships, I wouldn't have guessed how to sync it).
    Important notes:
    The most unclear sync of the second half of the 6M4 The Big Army cue (the appearance of Darth Maul), this scene has clearly been heavily reworked. I had to skip the beginning of the duel, because it's not clear what should be between the 6M4 and 6M5 cues.
    I also used 6M11 End Of Darth Maul cue, which is a new ending for the 6M10 cue, and was already written for the final cut. The earlier version lacked a short scene with the gungans, and the Maul's death underscores in much more optimistic way.
     
    6M1 The Armies Face-Off (-2:06) 6M1X Randy's Forest Mist (0:29-0:50) 6M2 Lazer Fight (2:08-3:15) 6M3 Take To Your Ships (3:15-4:46) 6M4 The Big Army (4:46-7:06) 6M5 Droid Battle (7:11-9:42) 6M6 Up The Wire (9:42-10:21) 6M7 The Great Dual (10:21-13:14) 6M8-9 Qui-Gon's Noble End (13:14-15:34) 6M10 Blowups And The Death Of Darth Maul (15:40-17:10, w/o original ending) 6M11N End Of Darth Maul (17:09-end)
     
    Btw, I just realized that the 6M1 insert (Randy's Forest Mist) appears to have been written for a different version of the cue (which sounds in the movie), but I don't know the truth.
  21. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Tom Guernsey in What the blogs say vs. what actual Classical Musicians actually say.   
    One thing that seems quite likely with fans who dismiss JW etc. is that they probably don't actually know his music beyond the well known concert arrangements and famous themes, but have no appreciation of the rest of each score. The ability to write such complex, musically satisfying, thematically engaging music which both satisfies/reflects/emphasises/whatever the emotional thrust of the scene while also matching the picture is quite an achievement in itself. It would be churlish to watch a sequence such as the Asteroid Field from Empire and not conclude that it's a terrific orchestral scherzo in its own right, but manages to follow the drama of the sequence with breathtaking deftness but without sacrificing musicality. But I bet most of the classical snobs just think of the Star Wars main theme and just conclude it's all brassy fanfares and Korngold derived themes, plus pick out all the odds and ends that owe a debt to Stravinsky, Holst, Shostakovich etc.
     
    I'm currently reading The Rest is Noise by Alex Ross (NYT music critic) and it's a very interesting canter through 20th century classical music, but you do get the impression that anything that isn't breaking new ground isn't all that worthy of consideration. Everything has to have an exciting new musical language else it's just derivative, but then that's how you end up with serialism, atonality and other experimental music etc. in an attempt to find ever new areas of compositional, which, let's face it, few people actually enjoy. But then there are plenty of accomplished classical composers who didn't really write anything especially groundbreaking that classical fans lap up.
     
    On that note, I'm going to listen to Carmina Burana, that should piss somebody off.
  22. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Nick1Ø66 in What the blogs say vs. what actual Classical Musicians actually say.   
    I remember being vaguely insulted when I first read the liner notes in the Star Wars Soundtrack anthology, there was a line in there saying something like "hopefully the music of Star Wars will lead listeners to seek out more sophisticated fare". 
  23. Like
    Madmartigan JC got a reaction from Tom Guernsey in What the blogs say vs. what actual Classical Musicians actually say.   
    When considering these dogmatic views of film music I thinks it's relevant to consider film itself as a medium has suffered this. Not only is it relatively recent (barely over 100 years old), but film as an art form didn't have a proper critical theory that could analize it as an artistic unit Auteur Theory came up in the early 50's.
     
    Therefore it is still rarely regarded as highly as the traditional arts (literature, painting, sculpture, music, theater, etc.). Not that I agree with this, at all. But I have repeadtly noticed that films critically considered more 'artistic' often have some form of validation through a one of the traditional arts beign directly referenced. Be it a nod to a classic painting/work of literature, the use of classical music, etc. As if the cinematographic art wasn't enough to substantiate the film's own artistic merit. 
     
    If views on the artistic merits of Cinema are so biased, what chance does music composed specifically for this medium have of beign considered 'artistic' by these people? Add on top of that, that music often requires little more that simple craftmanship to fit the basic standards required to accompany the film; and (at least in the case of Hollywood) is produced within an industry with technical restrictions and very palpable economic goals.
     
    On top of it all, Williams is directly referenced with some of the most popular and highest grossing franchises in Hollywood history.
    Morricone, coming from the more 'artistic' european cinema, has often been more kindly regarded in that respect. And the discussions on the recent release of JW's Images, also reflect how his most un-Hollywoodesque work has often received praise from the same critics who defaced his more accesible scores.
     
    I don't endorse or agree with any of this, but it's the current reality. It doesn't really bother me, since I can enjoy all works for what they are, regardless of classification.
  24. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to Tom Guernsey in What the blogs say vs. what actual Classical Musicians actually say.   
    I think I've finally reached a place of contentment (a "who gives a fuck?" type place) about what other people think about music I like (or don't like). However, I do find the those snarky classical music fans who turn their noses up at film music are kinda tedious and generally rave about music that almost nobody outside their niche enjoys. OK, so hard core film music fans are a relatively minority, but I have colleagues who have film music ring tones... OK, it's Hans Zimmer, but hey, nobody's perfect ;-)
     
    I actually love a huge range of classical music (over 2,000 albums worth according to my iTunes library)... mostly Beethoven onwards, but with a heavy emphasis on 20th century Russians and Scandinavians, including both the super famous ones (I have 9 Rite of Springs... Rites of Spring?) and plenty that even some very well versed classical fan friends have never heard of, but who write marvellous music which is neither trite nor excessively demanding. What's most annoying is that they often have interesting things to say and recommendations about music that might be of interest but the close mindedness is kinda annoying enough to put me off bothering.
  25. Like
    Madmartigan JC reacted to SteveMc in What the blogs say vs. what actual Classical Musicians actually say.   
    Film music by itself is not necessarily classical music, just as a song is not necessarily a lieder.  It depends on composer and intent.  Who is the composer?  Did he or she have formal or informal training in the classical tradition?  If yes, in writing the score, did he or she have a kind of artistic intent that transcends the film? 
    Sometimes the distinction is obvious.  Folks like Vangelis and Zimmer have artistic intentions in their scores, but their work is rooted more in popular music than classical.  Korngold and Rozsa and Herrmann were classical composers, and all their scores are clear compositions.  Sometimes the distinction can be a bit more subjective.  Steiner had classical training, but his scoring style was bit more in the direction of light music.  But, then, someone could dismiss Vivaldi as light music and I'd find that very wrong.  
     
    What of John Williams?  
    You can draw a clear line connecting late 19th century classical masters to him.  Mahler and Strauss to Korngold to Williams.  Rimsky-Korsakov to Glazunov to Tiomkin to Williams.   Add to that a healthy does of native influence from American Jazz.  He studied piano with Rosina Lhévinne, who encouraged him to be a composer  and then studied with Castelnuovo-Tedesco. This is what gives Williams's technique such a compelling quality and the ability to be almost endlessly studied or analyzed.
    But, unlike a good deal of 20th century classical music, Williams's music is overt.  Which is to say  it's main point is often obvious and accessible.  This is a consequence of much of his music being written for films, which is to say, for patrons and an audience that often demands this.  This leads to critiques that Williams's music is thus shallow and subservient, that it represents not the true vision of the artist, but simply reflects the vision of others.  Never mind that obvious and accessible characterized much of the pre-20th century artform, this is declared to be backwards emphasis that further proves the essential point, which is that John Williams is not a classical composer, and nor is any of his music truly classical, concert or otherwise. 
    But this is an unfair academic stance that ignores the essential nature of the art form.  For much of its existence, classical music was written for others.  Wealthy patrons, royalty, aristocrats, superstar performers, a demanding opera industry.  And yet, a great deal of this music is still considered artistic works of integrity and merit, the composers lauded as masters, even if they were partly doing the bidding of others.  Why?  Because the music is judged on its own merit, these factors included in the estimation, but the artistic intention snuck in by the composer also taken into account.  Why can't John Williams be accorded the same consideration?  Those who do judge him by this older standard rather than the narrower academic art cannot be for all crowd often deem him worthy.  There can be honest negative opinions about his work, how it might be too on the nose most of the time, maybe too bombastic, predictable, or how he may not have the greatest structural mastery.  But before you can have an honest opinion about John Williams's music, you need to acknowledge that it is classical, since it is rooted in that tradition, even if it is a branch of that tradition a certain school has declared anathema.  That might be changing, as I will address soon.   
    First, take the example of Bach.  Bach is generally accepted to be one of the all time greats. For much of his lifetime, he was considered a throwback, out of date. For much of his lifetime, he was a hireling.  His greatest works were written for others, often on their instructions and with their interference.  That he was able to thrive in this environment and throw in the mastery and musical complexity that he did is amazing, and the greatest testament to his genius.  Towards the end of his life, he began to have a little more recognition, but still more as a politely respected curiosity than anything.  After his death, the establishment overlooked him.  Only the geniuses paid him full attention.  Finally, when he was dead long enough for him to no longer be passé, he was rediscovered and adored.  
    Williams is not a 1-1 comparison here, he's not in Bach's tier.  But, we see similar patterns repeating themselves.
    Which brings me to my next and final point.  Where exactly does John Williams fit into the classical tradition?  For some, the medium for which he most often writes and the style he uses marks him a member of a breakaway blasphemous sect that is not fit to be called classical, never mind that it has more in common in those respects to what was classical for 200 years than the modernist take.  But this is in fact the outdated view, rooted in a roughly 1920s-1960s modernist stance.  Since then, classical music went through a bit of a revolution.  Postmodernism.  For a point of reference, take postmodernism in architecture.  Roughly, you could divide it into three threads.  Overall a rejection of the formality and perceived coldness of various forms of modernism, Postmodern Architecture offered an alternative.  One thread went for an expressionistic flair, new shapes, unusual forms, shock value even.  This thread felt like a logical extension of modernism in a way.  The equivalent in music would be Ligeti and composers like him.  The second thread I like to call Pop-Postmodernism.  Color, vibrancy, familiar or vernacular forms with a twist.  Musical equivalents:  Glass, Adams, perhaps Morricone.  Finally, a certain neo-traditionalism.  Architects using traditional principles and ornamentation on newer forms, ranging from skyscrapers done in a pseudo- Flemish church style to buildings almost exactly 18th century on the outside, but completely modern internally.  Several post-modern composers have done similar things.  Rouse comes to mind.  So does Williams.  I see his approach as most definitely rooted in postmodernism, his voice one of the most important ones of the movement.  You may not like what is has to say, but would anyone try to call a traditionalist work by a noted architect not architecture?  Perhaps there are some folks who would, but it is rather absurd on its face. 
     
    There, this should be pretty much the final word on the matter.  I would post it on TalkClassical, but I've forgotten my password and can't really be bothered.             
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