Jump to content

oierem

Members
  • Posts

    533
  • Joined

  • Last visited

Reputation Activity

  1. Like
    oierem reacted to Andy in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    This has been a gripe I’ve had since Temple of Doom where Jones would use his whip every 5 minutes and then floss his teeth with it.  
     
    It’s part of the character! If you were describing the character to someone unfamiliar, whip would be in your first sentence. 
     
    So here we have Ford with limited capacity for the stunts and action. The bullwhip is the perfect solution! The pistol too for that matter. At least we had the small gunfight in DOD. 
     
    But there should’ve been a lot more whip cracking.  
     
    I need to do a whip count for each movie. Like a body count for slashers. 
  2. Like
    oierem reacted to Fabulin in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    My take on the film:
     
    In general:
    +++ Ford's acting!
    ++ Phoebe Waller-Bridge's acting
    ++  I think the film excellently balances between Indy's grit/toughness and vulnerability. I liked the exchange about the watch being a memento for Indy's father. You could feel for Indy just being an old human being not having the energy to suffer everybody and everything being unkind to him. In many such small moments an excellent movie that could have been tried to raise its head. Ditto the 'my friend just got murdered'. Or fixing the engine problem and smiling. Or managing to climb the cliff but having Helena show some care (which also sets up her later care for him in Syracuse).
    + Helena was not overpowered; she tried to take charge of action scenes with varying success, did not overshine Indy, I liked very much how balanced it was between them and I think the filmmakers did a good job in telling "that episode where Indy goes on an adventure with his goddaughter" kind of story. For example: the scene where Helena and Teddy discuss who is really in charge, and Indy is a bit more.
    ++ It's a personal take that can be wrong, but it seemed to me Williams wrote and used Helena's theme in a way that vaguely reminded me of a kind of quaint woman-centered adventure from the 1950s/1960s, or a later throwback film like Passage To India. For whatever reason I generally felt that Williams generally wrote a bit in the spirit of Maurice Jarre for this film.
    + starting from Morocco the film found its footing.
    + I enjoyed Sallah's cameos. I realized it would be too contrived to have him be present during the adventures, and I low-key liked how they presented him simply as a family man and a friend adding a bit of positive energy to the film.
     
    Details:
    - I didn't like the 1944 prologue (confound soft reboots, including music reuse) or the New York very much (perhaps I saw too many set photos and had unrealistic expectations).
    - The horse chase was kind of pathetic. I don't know how to express it better. I don't think it was necessary for the film to point out the datedness of escaping on horseback.
    + The audience in my theater did chuckle though when Indy said the subway was faster, so I guess that landed.
    - ambiguous FBI / CIA ties of the bad guys that make it confusing early on just who was giving orders or in general what to expect from them
    + the bad guy gang was just good enough as far as the mooks went, even if the characters were not as easy to tell apart as the bad guys from Raiders, Temple, or Crusade
    + The hotel brawl scenes were fun. Reminded me of the bar fight in POTC: Dead Man's Chest.
    +  The Tuk-Tuk escape from that comedy genre gangster in love with Helena. LOL
    + Teddy was well-written and well-acted. He didn't feel annoying, forced, or too in/competent. That one scene of a set up of him probably being able to fly a plane later sufficed for the pulp genre.
    - Did Helena try to get Indy killed underwater by leaving him to the eels and then changed her mind? I didn't quite get that scene.
    - Banderras character was kinda a waste, dragged into the story only to get killed (the disposable pilot / thanks for the ride / selfless friend trope)
    + singing Beethoven's 5th in the cave. Random stuff like this helps keep a series fresh. Reminded me of such moments in TLJ.
    + giant goon (Oliver Richters) died a bit like the spider alien from Treasure Planet, outsmarted by the kid. Not what I expected, but fair enough xD
    - the real pilot waking up in the back of the kid's Cessna felt like seeing a clear fix to a plothole that was not introduced yet (how would a kid regain control of an airplane in freefall)
    + Voller seemed intelligent, with my favourite moment being when he realized the validity of Indy's warning and tried to turn the plane back. In general I loved the tension right before they entered that portal, and the tension immediately after. The film had several top notch scenes, but sadly also many just decent and quite a few weaker ones.
    + the Syracuse battle was a fun idea, reminded me of the battle from the third Mummy movie.
    -- but the plane just circling around and getting flak from ballistas felt a bit aimless. Missed opportunities in that final act.
    - Archimedes interacted with the McGuffin plot but didn't feel impactful (unlike the Grail Knight), and the supporting characters in the ancient era (the guy with a bow, the random Roman officer) seemed pointless.
    + Indy talking in Greek. I like to think about it as a little pay-off to Henry Jones Sir's forcing his son to practice Greek in Crusade.
    + Helena being shown as vulnerable by knowing some Greek but not as well as Indy. Part of that balancing.
    + Ford's acting out the character's motivation to stay in the past just to watch was good, for a second you could imagine him staying being an ending that would make sense to the character, but I also liked how the nonverbal sentiment Helena tried to express was acted out. Unpopular opinion, but I kinda bought the punch to the face Indy got. I thought it was cartoony kind of funny, like hot shoes after stopping the mine cart or rolling out of a fridge. Indy is not just the kind of character who can be flawed and get hit, but also inherently the kind of character that can be the butt of slapstick. I preferred the film to end more like ROTJ than like TLJ, with him surviving.
    -/+ I didn't like the reunion with Marion in KOTCS and I wasn't excited about another one here, but Ford's acting throughout the film made it seem fitting. I smiled at the idea of a simple, down-to-earth romance scene between two old characters. I also like how Helena smiled and disappeared from the picture at a right moment. This, plus Sallah-coming-and-going felt like a well-cooked mood soup.
    + I liked the final close-up on the hat being pulled back through the window and the screen turning into a contracting circle (like Star Wars OT, only slower, cartoon style). Precisely for that kind of light final note I wanted Indy to live another day.
     
    Overall very different from but probably better than KOTCs (a film I like for what it's worth); it's about on par with an archeology-themed flick like National Treasure to me. Would watch again sometime.
  3. Like
    oierem reacted to Bayesian in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    Saw it last night. My initial reaction to this movie is positive—a solid 3 out of 4 stars. Lots of action, very well cast, and perfectly spotted. JW’s score was a gem throughout and I thought it was mixed nicely. Unlike many others here, I didn’t find the lifts or near-lifts distracting or disappointing. Every scene had the right kind of music, confirming that JW hasn’t lost a single step in his advanced age. At least a dozen times during the movie, I caught myself being gobsmacked at the fact that a 90-year-old man wrote every note I was hearing with a pencil on paper. (And, yes, there were a lot of notes to be heard, played on instruments many of today’s film composers appear to have forgotten still exist—like woodwinds, for instance.)
     
    I sort of share the growing consensus here that Indy wasn’t really done right by the plot or script. It was deflating to see Indy broken by the loss of his son and his marriage and worse still not to see him recover his mojo by the end. The story arc, however, did make more poignant and believable Indy’s desire and willingness to remain in the past, and I thought that Mangold did an OK job landing that story beat—although I really wish we could have seen what Spielberg would have done with that, because he would have nailed it. 
     
    While we’re on the subject of the third act, the reveal of the Battle of Syracuse was one of the very few times I can recall in my moviegoing experience that I was genuinely taken by surprise and loved it (I count myself extremely fortunate that I forgot there is a track called Battle of Syracuse on the OST.) Mangold handled the uncertainty of that whole sequence brilliantly. Indeed, every shot taking place inside the airplane was basically perfect. (It’ll be a long time before I forget the look on Voller’s face when he realized how badly he fucked up. And then the panic throughout the plane when it dawns on them that their escape window is closing with each arrow hit… I felt like I was going to get stranded in 200-whatever B.C.) I felt stakes in a movie for the first time in I don’t know how long. More stakes than I’ve ever felt in any MCU/DCU movie. More than I felt in the entire Star Wars sequel trilogy. It was bliss to feel that in a movie again. That alone was worth the price of admission.
  4. Like
    oierem reacted to Falstaft in Dial of Destiny: Theme Transcriptions (Updated)   
    Not sure if this warrants its own thread or not, but I've done a first pass at transcriptions of the new themes from DoD. I don't know if we've come up with consensus labels for all of these, besides the obvious for Helena and Voller. Also have little confidence that the Archimedes theme is transcribed rhythmically 100% accurately, or the tertiary Nazi theme harmonically.
     
     
    Helena (transcribed from arrangement that premiered last year):

     
     
     
     
    Antiquity/Antithykera Mechanism (transcribed from "Prologue")

     
     
     
    Antithykera Mechanism (transcribed from "Archimedes Tomb")

     
     
    Antikythera Piano Figure (transcribed from "Battle of Syracuse")
     

     
     
     
     
     
    Archimedes (Transcribed from "Prologue")

     
     
     
    Nazis 0 "Voller" (transcribed from "Airport")

     
     
     
     Nazis 1 "Spirit" (transcribed from "Prologue")

     
     
     
    Nazis 2 "Supremacy" - exotic and furtive (transcribed from "Prologue")

     
     
     
    Nazis 3 "Might" -- chorale(transcribed from "Prologue")

     
     
     
    Nazis 4 "Determination" -- Transcribed from "The Airport"

     
     
     
     
    Syracuse -- Transcribed from "The Battle of Syracuse"
     

     
  5. Like
    oierem got a reaction from Pieter Boelen in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    My take on this is that it works as a self-fullfilling prophecy. Archimedes meets Indy, and therefore, he makes an object that would, in the future, bring Indy to him. 
    I thought that the Dial would stay in the past, therefore becoming a "bootstrap paradox" (Archimedes got the dial from Indy, and later, Indy would get the Dial from his tomb), but IIRC that doesn't happen, does it?
     
     
    I did find that Indy's arc in this movie was the same as in Crystall Skull.
     
    I too found it hard to get into the prologue (mostly because of the music). I felt the movie became better and better afterwards (NY had a nice 70s film noir vibe, and overall I prefer Morocco and Sicily as locations) and the last act was fascinating and crazy. However, I really didn't like the "sudden" ending. The fact that Indy was knocked out denied us of a proper ending to the climax (imagine the emotional swell of the music as we ctually see Indy & co. flying back to the present, while looking back longingly at that ancient time).
  6. Like
    oierem reacted to Andy in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    YES to both @Mr. Who and @Edmilson!!!
     
    There is a real melancholy to the whole affair because of the loss of Indy’s son.  I wish they’d dealt with Mutt the way you suggested.  Because there is no happy ending when a parent loses their child.  So instead of a jubilant ending, Jones and Marion are very much broken people in a much worse place than they ever were.  I guess they were going for a more realistic grounded character, but I don’t know. It made me really sad. If you know someone or have someone in your family that has lost a child, it’s not something you get over and get on with. 
     
    Deep stuff for an Indiana Jones movie. 
  7. Like
    oierem got a reaction from crumbs in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    My take on this is that it works as a self-fullfilling prophecy. Archimedes meets Indy, and therefore, he makes an object that would, in the future, bring Indy to him. 
    I thought that the Dial would stay in the past, therefore becoming a "bootstrap paradox" (Archimedes got the dial from Indy, and later, Indy would get the Dial from his tomb), but IIRC that doesn't happen, does it?
     
     
    I did find that Indy's arc in this movie was the same as in Crystall Skull.
     
    I too found it hard to get into the prologue (mostly because of the music). I felt the movie became better and better afterwards (NY had a nice 70s film noir vibe, and overall I prefer Morocco and Sicily as locations) and the last act was fascinating and crazy. However, I really didn't like the "sudden" ending. The fact that Indy was knocked out denied us of a proper ending to the climax (imagine the emotional swell of the music as we ctually see Indy & co. flying back to the present, while looking back longingly at that ancient time).
  8. Like
    oierem reacted to Holko in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    Archimedes starts making it, sees the finished one in the wreck and gives it back to Indy, finishes it, breaks it, Indy and Vollner find the parts, assemble it, take it back, Indy gets it back from Archimedes, it's taken back to 1969... to potentially be used in the future by anyone else to go back to Syracuse? It's kind of ignored, in the previous movies Indy always loses or gives up the artifact.
  9. Like
    oierem reacted to crumbs in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    My biggest criticism of the film is that Indy doesn't make the choice to go home, Helena makes it for him.
     
    That's... a bold choice to make for your protagonist 5 minutes before the credits roll, robbing them of their agency. There needed to be a moment of self-reflection where Indy realised, as a man of science, he couldn't stay in the past without consequences for the future. All the film needed was a few shots of cowering families huddled together while the battle raged around them. A mother and father consoling a scared child, which provides Indy the epiphany he needed to return home and repair his life with Marion.
     
    There's stronger characterization they could've explored with the Dial. Voller has a very clear motivation for wanting the Dial. Indy... doesn't really have any? Which is very strange, because it seems like the film was setting this up when Basil pleaded with him to destroy the Dial but Indy just kept it? What if he's obsessed with the Dial's power and wanted to use it to save Mutt?
     
    That story might have been stronger, creating parallel objectives for Voller and Indy. Voller wants to kill Hitler. Indy wants to save his son. In true Indiana Jones style, neither get what they want, but the lesson Indy learns is that repairing his life with Marion is more important than changing history to save his son, with all the consequences that would wrought. Maybe the film's emotional climax is Indy having a moral dilemma where he can save Mutt but Voller changes the outcome of WWII, so he has to let Mutt go in order to stop Voller?
     
    I think all this would've landed much more satisfyingly than Voller just dying in a plane crash and Indy getting knocked out and their subsequent return trip happening off-screen.
  10. Like
    oierem reacted to Holko in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    I really think she should have had a heart to heart convo with Indy to sort out their shitty pasts and get closer together. Maybe after the boat escape, after the "that was fun!" "My friend is dead" exchange.
    And I think many people's problem with the ending is that he still remains broken. In fact he might break even more, wanting to give up and stay in the past, but is just forcibly brought back with zero agency.
    In which case the continental drift stuff makes no difference. Or it does and Archimedes miscalculated too? It really overcomplicates itself.
  11. Like
    oierem reacted to Andy in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    Pic for attention. 
    my review is below. 
     

     
     
    I liked it, but wanted to love it more.   It’s very good, and Harrison Ford is amazing. 
     
    I’m still processing it and am seeing it again tomorrow.  Because I really haven’t reconciled what I liked with what I didn’t. 
     
    The action is good, but I don’t care for modern camerawork and CG stunts. 
     
    The prologue was cool but, somehow I was expecting de-aged Indy to be flawless, as it was built up. He wasn’t.  And the direct quotes to other scores in the prologue were quite distracting for a film score fan.  I do NOT like when Williams does a “greatest hits” piece like this when we could’ve had an Indy’s First Adventure train motif, but more gripping and grown up. 
     
    I loved the dial itself. I loved the Archimedean displacement device.  Thanks, 6th grade science class!    I like that as before with the grail and the Ark and the Skull (and I guess the Sankara Stone), the artifact didn’t really work the way the villains hoped it would.
     
    I liked Helena just fine , but was confused as to what really changed her character arc. Her motives were cash and she took advantage Indy to go after the Dial simply for money. I suppose she has some Daddy Issues too. But then she changed and decided she wanted to help piece Indy’s life back together. Why?
     
    Teddy was fun, but did they have to have Helena pick him up with a backstory identical to Short Round’s?  Because Shorty he ain’t. 
     
    The villains were all great but ultimately unfulfilling in their destinies.  These were really nasty Nazis. I appreciated Mangold getting in a trigger happy American becoming a Nazi as commentary that not all of them are German. @Holko I think that was the point of him being an American henchman. 
     
    But… he and Voller both deserved a better comeuppance than simply dying in the plane crash.  I mean how many people did that asshole shoot??? He should have had a gory Spielberg style death.  The brute Giant… well how in the world do they have 80 year old Ford fist fight him?  The answer is, they simply couldn’t.  And that made me sad, because the fights with Dovchenko 15 years ago were superb. 
     
    The ending in Sicily… meeting Archimedes reminded me a little of when Bill and Ted met Socrates. I expected Indy to quote “Dust in the Wind” 🤣
     
    I have to listen to the soundtrack on its own. My initial impressions were that it was somewhat buried, but had some nice bits. Not spectacular like Rise of Skywalker for me. It could’ve used one more emotional “Older Indy” theme, like the Rise of Skywalker theme to give the film a little more charm, heart, and soothing the audience that this is indeed the last time with Dr. Jones. 
     
    And here’s my biggest criticism that I hope my next viewing will change my mind.   I think having Indy be simply old and grumpy would’ve been enough to give him an arc.  Killing off his son really hurt to hear.  It was heartbreaking for me personally, which I can get into another time.  And Ford acted it fabulously when he told Helena what he’d do if he could go back in time.  But there was a STRONG undercurrent of grief and sadness that pulled everything down from being as much fun as it could be.  I couldn’t shake it that this hero was truly a broken man throughout most of the movie.  And even reconciliation with Marion won’t bring back their son. 
     
    I know everyone hated Shia. I did not. I think the actor is whacko, but he delivered a fine performance. And last we saw the Joneses, they were quite happy.  This movie ALIEN3’d the characters, which never works well for me. 
     
    I don’t know if killing Mutt was some sort of filmmaker apology to the fans, but I felt it hurt the movie in a way I didn’t see coming. Who’d have thought that the vine swinging greaser would have such a profound impact on this entire film?
     
    I have to accept that Ford is 81 and can’t do his own stunts.  He can barely run and you can see it in the film.  It made me sad. 
    I also missed some of the Spielbergian touches. Mangold is not Spielberg.   This is a film made for adults, not all ages.  But, again that is partially due to the titular hero being an old man.    I did however loved him griping about being old while climbing and his reference to drinking the blood of Kali!  But for a character that can’t run and punch, they could’ve had him use his goddam BULLWHIP a little more!!!!  Seriously, why do the writers hate the whip so much?  Ever since Temple of Doom he barely uses it!!  It’s part of the character’s DNA, not a costume accessory. 
     
    It’s a great story, a good adventure, a bit too long, and one I hope to come to respect and maybe one day adore with repeated viewings. I’ve warmed to Crystal Skull, but I remember walking out of the theater not knowing how I felt about it.  Same with DoD.   I like this movie, but it’s complicated.
  12. Like
    oierem reacted to Knight of Ren in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Score in the film) - SPOILERS ALLOWED!   
    Finally watched the movie and I quite liked it a lot. I'm a defender of Crystal Skull and I would say this one is more or less on the same level, not reaching the level of the original trilogy, but still fun and entertaining and with a couple of unexpected surprises.
     
    I went into the movie having managed to stay away from the soundtrack so I don't know how the presentation will be, but what stood out the most was the different uses of Helena's theme, which is the absolute star in here and it's the melodic element that shines above the rest, which I have to be honest, found a bit anonymous at parts. I think with repeated listenings of the soundtrack I will pick on the secondary ideas, but none of them was as impactful on a first watch like, for example, the Grial's theme or even the Crystal Skull theme.
     
    Even so, there was some great action music during the Morocco sequence and the third act had both wonderment and action which I hope are contained on the release. William's quotes of his own material were a bit distracting but not particularly grating, and were nicely interwoven with the rest of the material. I would say the one that stood out the most in a negative way would be Tintin's the Adventure Continues during the auction sequence, because it was clearly similar, but not entirely, and my mind instantly played the original track, which made it a bit distracting.
     
    Just some first thoughts. Now on to listening the album on repeat for a couple of days!
  13. Like
    oierem reacted to Alex in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    I know it’s mentioned a lot, but I’m not sure we really recognise how incredible it is that this music was written and mostly conducted by a 90 year old man. Most people his age are either dead or not eating solid foods. I know we have some legitimate complaints about the album presentation, use of older themes etc, but how many other 90 year olds are active and working, let alone writing a cue like “To Athens”. It is an astonishing achievement whatever you think of the soundtrack. Just listen to the orchestrations in “Tuk Tuk to Tangiers”. A man who statistically should be dead sat down at his piano and came up with that. I remember back in 2015 when we all freaked out because he’d pulled out of writing music for Bridge of Spies and 8 years later he’s conducting at the premiere of the 5th Indiana Jones movie. Blessed we be.
  14. Like
    oierem reacted to crumbs in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    There's definitely more. I heard at least:
    The Portuguese Coast
    The Medallion
    The Jungle Chase
    Indy vs the Russian
    Desert Chase
    On the Tank
    Belly of the Steel Beast
    Airplane Fight
    Plus the Raiders March coda from ROTLA.
     
    Edit: misread your post, sorry. My answer is relevant to the music heard in the film, not the album track.
     
    But to answer your question, 1:54 and 2:09 are lifted directly from Airplane Fight (ROTLA). Not new music.
  15. Really Sad
    oierem got a reaction from iamleyeti in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    Just saw the movie, without having listened to the album yet.
    The score has certainly ups and downs. 
    The best part is how Helena's theme is used: it's used a lot, and in very different ways. It's clearly the main theme of the movie.
    The worst part is the music for the whole prologue. I'm sorry, but it was distracting as hell because every single second of it was reused music from an earlier movie! Every fragment. And each comes from a different cue, pasted together. For me, it sounds very similar to the tracked music for the Battle of Geonosis.
    (I know that this sounds like a sacrilege, but honestly.... I don't think there's such a difference between tracked music and literally reused music in this case....).
    Thankfully, all the other action cues are much better, even though many of them are CLEARLY based on a previous cue (which again, is distracting).
     
     
  16. Like
    oierem reacted to Holko in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    I actually really liked this album on first listen, after the movie. It definitely has a feel, a kind of melancholy but calm tone, perfectly fitting JW at the twilight of his career. I finally grasped Helena, but not many of the other themes yet. I actually dislike the credits Raiders not because I dislike the performance or recording at all, but because I feel it doesn't really fit into this tone at all, it just disrupts it out of obligation.
     
    Who knows how this will change on later listens and after seeing the movie again at home sometime, but for now I'm happy!
  17. Thanks
    oierem got a reaction from Pieter Boelen in SPOILER TALK: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny   
    Just saw the movie. Some quick thoughts:
    (and as a disclaimer, I'm one of the weirdos who liked Crystal Skull)
    -Overall, the movie improved as it went on, Maybe because the first half is heavily featured in trailers, I enjoyed the second half more.
    -No paramount dissolve! No "Germany 1944" (IIRC). No opening credits montague!!
    -Prologue: too dark, too confusing to follow. The music was very distracting, as every single second was reused from another film. It took me out of the film.
    -NY: the music was very cool, very different from usual Indy films. 
    -Morocco: this is were the fun begins! I really liked both Helena and Teddy. The auction scene and the subsequent accion sequence were great fun.
    -Coast of Athens: there were some nice scenes focusing on the characters. But I do feel that this segment could've been shortened/cut.
    -Sicily: great locations, great suspence, great action. I definitely enjoyed this part.
    -Climax: veeeery surprising, I didn't expect how it played out. I loved how crazy it was, and how it dared to do something different. I still do't know if it was brilliant or stupid.
    -As I said, Helena was a great character (and her theme is brilliantly used). And I liked Teddy a lot too (and, despite the billing order, he is clearly one of the leading characters).
    -I felt Indy's arc was a bit pointless, since it's exactly the same arc as in KOTCS. He is old, he feels he doesn't belong anywhere anymore, he gets dragged into an adventure, and gets a family. 
     
  18. Like
    oierem reacted to TolkienSS in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Score in the film) - SPOILERS ALLOWED!   
    I know we need to cut Williams some slack at 91, and we don't know what Mangold wanted *in detail*, but re-recording whole sections from the 80s films doesn't pass as "creating a feel of classic Indy", it's copy-paste. 
    Whether the reason is radical rescoring because of editing, or Mangold wanting this temp rehash, or Williams simply not being able to do it at 91, the result sounds lazy.
    It feels like one of those 80s Superman sequels that repurpuse large portions of Williams' original.
  19. Like
    oierem reacted to crumbs in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Score in the film) - SPOILERS ALLOWED!   
    As a diehard JW fan, the temp track love made the experience frustrating. Direct lifts from Minority Report, War of the Worlds, Tintin, and all 4 previous Indy films. I spent most of the film catching myself asking "where was that 3 second lift taken from?"
     
    I don't blame JW in the slightest, of course. These are immensely complex and time-consuming scores. The fact we still got nearly 2 hours of original score isn't lost on me. If that meant lifting a few bars from other scores, so be it. At the end of the day, Helena's Theme is the hero of the score and it shines the brightest. It's surrounded by a plethora of kickass and totally original music; I just wish the lifts weren't as blatant.
     
    Either way, much like the film, it's a melancholic affair. Knowing this is likely JW's final foray in film scoring. An overwhelming sense of sadness hit me during the credits, just sitting in a near-empty cinema wondering if this was the final time I'd ever hear new JW music in a theater. The film felt like closing a chapter in my life... and if that's the way JW goes out, then what a way to go.
  20. Like
    oierem got a reaction from Pieter Boelen in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    Track 4 is a mix of three different cues, IIRC. The opening comes from Irina's first appearance, the middle portion is part of the end credits, and the ending is an unused version of "The Russians Reappear".
     
  21. Like
    oierem reacted to Damien F in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    Well I learned something new about a 15 year old score!
  22. Like
    oierem reacted to crumbs in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    Yep, it's a bit "chicken or egg" but a lot of JW's concert suites originated as end credits cues in the scores they were written for.
  23. Like
    oierem got a reaction from crumbs in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    That's quite common, actually, and often it's the other way around. A piece is composed for the end credits, and then used, with some modifications, as a concert piece.
    The most obvious example being the Raider's theme, of course. 
  24. Like
    oierem reacted to JNHFan2000 in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Disney Records Original Soundtrack Album) - NO FILM SPOILERS!   
    From 4:09 onwards is a question about Williams. Mangold gives a wonderfully exapansive answer. I really can't wait to see and of course hear that opening sequence.
     
     
     
  25. Like
    oierem reacted to Richard Penna in Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny (Score in the film) - SPOILERS ALLOWED!   
    It does make a difference in terms of people wanting the cue in their playlists, I've noticed. A cue modelled almost entirely on prexisting music, but still newly recorded, and people want it because it's technically 'new' music from John Williams. (and half the board is pretending to themselves that 'of course the maestro never copies...')
     
    But just track the original cue in instead, and now it's 'evil tracked music' despite the creative effect and enjoyment being identical.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.