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Posts posted by Hlao-roo
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Sleepers is a fantastic score on many different levels. Williams captures the organic feel of Brooklyn using the electronic bass and percussion with piano exceptionally well. The computerised voice effects are used to tremendous effect during the Wilkinson Prison sequences, exemplifying the inner turmoil the boys had to experience during their ordeal.
Hell's Kitchen is certainly the highlight of the score as it has the atypical Williams concert structure, but the score as a whole is definitely one of his best! Anyone fortunate enough to see him in 1998 at the Barbican with the LSO will remember the latter stated cue being the first encore piece, a wonderful surprise that was!
The Football Game has a slight Moriconne feel to it, but is ultimately stamped with some excellent Williams brass flourishes. The Trip To Wilkinson has a driving menacing bass line that hints at the future.
Saying The Rosary is a masterful cue, that works even better with the film. I remember when I first got the score back in '96, thinking that the latter stated cue was very original and different for Williams as it had an almost Monestary-like tone. Father Bobby's Decision displays yet another genius scene of scoring, as De Niro is being told what truly happenned to the boys in prison, the dialogue fades - the camera slowly zooms in and Williams score takes full control whilst De Niro's facial expression tells us a great deal but is enhanced by the driving strings, french horn and flute.
Ultimately it is the Reunion theme that truly captures the heart and tragedy of the story. This heartrending 9 note motif leaves us feeling very sentimental for the boys (& girl) as it accompanies shots of their childhood innocence together. James Thatcher's always stunning horn solos are at their best here, with a glorious top C being reached as part of the closing statement of the reunion/finale cue.
I think this is a good lesson is scoring a dramatic film and is a highly recommended score to any Williams, or orchestral music fan.
The Philips album features great sound quality (the ever-reliable Shawn Murphy), about 56 minutes of score (almost complete) and is not terribly hard to find.
Great review, thanks!
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I may get burned by this, but I think the recent williams is way better than the williams of the early 80's (which was also brilliant)
And I may or may not get burned by this, but I think the recent Williams is way worse than the Williams of the late 70s to early 80s (most specifically, 1977-1984), and not because he has a more 'mature style' like some say (I think his style has been very mature for more than 30 years), but because his latest efforts lack the brilliance and genious of his scores from the 'golden era' (by far).
Just my opinion
I'm not quite as critical of Williams's '90's efforts as Ricard is. O.K., scratch that -- the 1990's is by far my favorite decade of JW compositions.
But then...the millenium hit (starting with 2001), and somehow JW has completely lost his touch. His scores are still above-average, but they're certainly nothing near the stuff that got me into his music in 1997 (when I started collecting soundtracks).
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Hidden treasure. "Hell's Kitchen" blew me away the first time I heard it. And it begins with a dark, rhythmic synth motif very much in the spirit of the "pre-crime" motif from Minority Report, if I remember correctly...
The only JW score that can put me to sleep is Always. The dream-like sequences with Hap are enough to cure anyone's insomnia.
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To be honest, the only other De Palma film I've seen is Mission to Mars, which left me in the cold (no pun intended)...in part because of the distracting little idiosyncracies of Morricone's score.
The Fury is a bit outside my tastes, but as I've tried to listen to Williams's score within the context of the film, I've gained something of heightened appreciation for both the picture and the music...
And yes, it's a crazy, crazy finale.
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Joe, I think it's called fuzzy math...
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Nothing John Williams has composed this millenium can touch The Patriot.
Yeah, yeah, so he rips off the fifth movement theme from his American Journey score, which was itself ripped from "Dry Your Tears, Afrika" (Amistad). And he does steal a bit of Born on the Fourth of July for a few seconds. And he pulls off some handy Copland imitating (predictably). And JW probably employed some behind-the-scenes muscling to push Arnold off the project...
All of that said, The Patriot is still Williams doing what he does best: bold in-your-face brass fanfares; lush, lyrical, heart-rending string writing. It really lets loose and plunges deep emotionally in a way no JW score has since.
Every cue seems to have something new to say, as though Williams were thoroughly inspired every step of the way, unlike A.I., in which the atmospheric rambling from one track to the next descends into utter redundancy, or Harry Potter, where the excessively bountiful mickey-mousing points to significant overscoring on Williams's part.
The only frequent criticism of this score with which I'd agree is that sometimes it goes a bit over-the-top; its obtrusiveness became an overbearing distraction even during some of the battle scenes, some of which Williams was brave enough to score in a celebratory tone.
Indeed, perhaps the only praiseworthy characteristic of John Williams's two 2002 scores is their more faithful commitment to the term "underscore." Perhaps it's Williams finally surrendering to the already ear-splitting sound effects. Perhaps it's Williams being a bit more thoughtful, allowing the music to draw attention to itself only when necessitated by the on-screen action -- say, the otherworldly vocals of Deborah Dietrich that almost seemingly emanate from and suffuse the recurring visions of the pre-cog Agatha.
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I love the 2nd symphony, it's classical heavy metal It's up there with his best. I wish he did more like it, here is a sample for those people who'd like to know what we are talking about
http://mfile.akamai.com/3171/wm2/muze.down....asx?obj=v10428
Morn - Who has more Prokofiev in his classical music collection than any other composer and thinks that his ewok theme is great
Yeah, don't you just love how Williams loves to "innovate the past"...
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What I've always wondered was why John Neufeld was credited as "Orchestrator" in the original album release of Nixon (yes, in the liner notes).
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8O
There is a difference between emulating and stealing you know
Yeah, emulating = John Williams, and stealing = James Horner. That's what we choose to make of it.
(to you programming nerds out there, or at least C++ nerds, note that those are assignment operators, not equalities)
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8O
Morn - Who thinks that is one of his best symphonies.
Too self-consciously iconoclastic. The 4th' date=' 5th, and 6th (not to mention the 1st) are much better.
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Well, at least you're not iconoclastically self-conscious...
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Nothing can compare to the TPM end titles, though. Those are incredible. Real witty. You know, pasting the concert arrangements of "Duel of the Fates" and "Anakin's Theme" one right after the other? I don't know of any other composer who could've accomplished that feat.
Hey, and you know, while we're on the subject, I don't think Williams needs to write anymore music for the next film, 'cause we've amassed plent of music already. Good ol' George Lucas and his fellow film and music editors can just dig through all the musical treasures from the last five films and piece them together in some slipshod way. We saw how well it worked with the Battle of Geonosis, didn't we?
It's not as if they'd be doing anything different from what Williams has been doing himself recently. "Anderson's Great Escape" -- a musical highlight of the year? Ha! Not a shred of originality...Williams has been writing the same action music over and over again since Jurassic Park. And "Sean's Theme" must've been some sort of alternate melody from A.I., could've replaced "David's Theme" and achieved same precise effect.
Oh, yeah, and plagiarism is O.K. when it's Williams purposefully making a "tribute" to Bernard Herrmann. Williams could probably re-use an entire score by Herrmann, and everybody would say, wow, what a brilliant homage to Bernard.
No, plagiarism is only bad when Horner does it.
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What magic?! I hate all of you now. You've made me sarcastic and cynical. I shall never return.
Farewell,
Alan
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Excellent Harry, I knew you had it in you. Glad you put the effort into it.
Joe's just saying that because he thinks E.T. is the best score JW's ever written.
- Alan the Cynic
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To me the score is completely unmemorable. It moves me like constipation. Ranks down the low on the list of John Williams score to me. Typical 90's score.
The film is powerful and stunning. It has a great beginning and ending, and a soso middle, but a great war film overall.
Joe,
You're naturally entitled to your opinion, but to say that the score is "completely unmemorable" confers doubt on the idea that you've ever truly listened to the it.
"Hymn to the Fallen"! Even Clemmensen, who, not unsurprisingly, despised Williams's effort much as you do, had to hand Williams some praise for one the most moving works Williams has ever written.
Not memorable. Hmmph. It's even on there twice as one of Williams's controversial album reprises. You have no excuse, Joe. C'mon...
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It's a fantastic score. Shoulda won the Oscar.
Jeff
I agree.
-Strilo
"The Ring Goes South," The Fellowship of the Ring, Howard ShoreYeah, Piovanni's score wasn't bad by any means, but I'm not sure it was even in the right category...
Almost the entire movie plays as a comedy...obviously some pretty bitterly dramatic elements inserted toward the end, but still.
I think Life is Beautiful must be the most light-hearted drama score ever to win the Oscar for Best Original (Drama) Score.
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Yeesh...I am pretty cynical, aren't I...?
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Just for future reference, if you make a mistake with a post, you can go back and fix it rather than posting a whole other post. Just click on the "edit" button at the top right of the original post. :idea:
You're missing the point, Evan. It's all about doing what you can to up your post count...
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So I have Jaws, E.T., Star Wars, Home Alone, Harry Potter, A.I., Batman Returns, Raiders of the Lost Ark, and Jurrasic Park. So my question is what should I get next? I don't have a lot of money, so I need a few really good scores to get. Thanks in advance for all your recomendations.
Many of those scores you mentioned have nice sequel scores: Jaws 2, Return of the Jedi, Home Alone 2: Lost in New York, Indy 2 & 3, and The Lost World: Jurassic Park. Sometimes it's fun to compare sequel scores to the original, even if there's no logic in it.
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Mr. Hobgood dies a martyr...
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Er, what do you mean by "USUAL" happy ending? I didn't find anything particularly "usual" about the ending other than that it conforms to the typical Spielbergian optimism that subsists amid even the most dystopian of settings.
How about everything turned out wonderful for the main character and the "bad guy" is dead.
Do you think the movie would've been "better" with a darker ending (in which the main character's problems remain unresolved)? Just curious.
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This can't be true.... almost every great film composer is jewish?
Careful with your language...it may be mistaken for a revelation of bigotry. Try thinking of a gentler way of expressing your incredulity..
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And I like how it isn't your typical happy ending. I'm sick of happy endings to be honest
Ummmm maybe you did not understand my point. I was saying the ending was the USUAL happy ending thrown into most movies. It also was pretty lousy. Kind of put a damper on the good stuff the movie had.
Er, what do you mean by "USUAL" happy ending? I didn't find anything particularly "usual" about the ending other than that it conforms to the typical Spielbergian optimism that subsists amid even the most dystopian of settings.
And as Morn said, there is a bit of emotional ambiguity at the end, although not to the extent of A.I., whose ending was frequently (and probably erroneously) considered "happy" as well.
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No, Williams has a much higher quality of composition. LOTR? Bah, it has basic orchestration. Davis is better but still not on Williams level. Williams is a true master of orchestration.
Huh huh. Davis, not a "true master of orchestration" ? Stop being blind please. Being a JW fan doesn't mean you can't recognise a good orchestrator. Don Davis is obviously one of the best orchestrators right now. His work on Matrix has a far better orchestration than a lot of Williams' works.
Hellgi
As far as i know, Davis first orchestra work was JPIII, Matrix was done with sinthethizer....
I can assure you that The Matrix is far more than "sinthethizer"...
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Is that true or is it just... coming from a prejustice?
The term is pre-crime. Get it right.
John Williams sues himself...
in General Discussion
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Hands down, the greatest article ever written. I will print it out and frame it.