A critical part of the business...some of you dont know...

[pi 0]

When a composer is hired, 9/10 times a director, music supervisor/editor will have a version of the film with music in it allready (from other films), called temp music. Most often a composers job is to tighten and duplicate this music, hence the repetive nature of film music. Most producers wont try something new because they arent gauranteed proven results. SO in 9/10 times the composer has NO opportunity to write "new" music.

i know most of you know this but some of you dont.

move to other boaRD please

[pixie_twinkle 48]

Occasionally you can tell which pieces were used in the temp track by the similarities in the finished score at that point. For instance, Mahler's 6th symphony in the Napolianic scenes in Time Bandits. Kilar's Exodus was clearly used as the temp track for Schindler's Workforce in Schindler's List as Williams' music at that point is very similar to the Kilar piece. Exodus was eventually used as the music for the Schindler's List trailer.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

OK.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

No sh*t, Sherlock!

[BigMacGyver 0]

Good composers can cope with temp tracking. As long as everyone understands the temp track as a tool for communication regarding the direction the music has to take in a scene and not as the bible of all things. Problems come in whenever composers are forced (mostly by producers) to copy a temp track note by note.

[robthehand 3]

Problems come in whenever composers are forced (mostly by producers) to copy a temp track note by note.

Surely you mean "make it the same but different"?

[BigMacGyver 0]

Well, that's the gentle way of putting it, but sadly, in a lot of these cases the "difference" isn't that noticeable.

[Ollie 1,059]

Duh.

[pi 0]

Well it is apparant reading the posts lately that plenty of people didn't know of this or forgot. Do not forget this is a business, people are out to make money, not give all youall precious soundtracks to listen to.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

OK.

.

[Indiana_Fett 0]

Well, it is apparant by reading the posts that many people didn't know this or forgot. Do not forget that this is a business, people are out to make money, not to give you all precious soundtracks to listen to.

I have no idea how you came to this conclusion. Everyone who has posted in this thread seems to know what temp tracking is.

[skyy38 21]

There is a particular place that the baton should go.(Tom Cruise)

However,I think that he would enjoy it too much.

[A24 4,323]

Does Williams get his Spielberg films with a temp track? Somehow I don't think so.

[AI 0]

Yeah but that's the 1/10 situation that pi is overlooking.

[GoodMusician 56]

I think that's how Jurassic Park's theme was born actually...

If you listen to one of the tracks from "Backdraft" used in the trailer, it ends with a very odd statement of the Jurassic Park Theme--or rather, what would become the theme.

It's odd becuase it does not fit the piece at all! I'ts like... wait what?.... Almost as if Hans Zimmer was fated write that, to inspire John Williams to write the Jurassic Park theme.

The Track name is "You Go, We Go." it's the very end.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

James Horner? What?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Zimmer scored Backdraft.

[GoodMusician 56]

You missed the point.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I am miss the point?

[Marian Schedenig 8,153]

You are a mistaken.

[BigMacGyver 0]

Well it is apparant reading the posts lately that plenty of people didn't know of this or forgot. Do not forget this is a business, people are out to make money, not give all youall precious soundtracks to listen to.

Yeah, sorry. We forgot that the industry needs more business mans like Zimmer and his remote control company to compose popular mass ware by copying temp-tracks of their own work instead of artists who know their craft of actually supporting a film with unique musical accompaniment. We are such fools.

Seriously, you tell us to blindly accept the consequences that temp-tracks and over-commericalized thinking in Hollywood causes. That's pure opportunism. That's like saying the purpose of a disease is to kill people so lets not do anything against it.

The original purpose of a score is to support the picture, not to fill producer's pockets. That's the goal that should stand above anything else and that's the last bit of artistic value fans and professionals should defend instead of following the commerce nightmare.

Elmer Bernstein defended it until his last minute, Jerry Goldsmith did it, Bernard Herrmann made it his crusade while Danny Elfman still defends it. These people spoke up against the temp-track practise and that's one important thing that makes them artists and not business mans.

[Ollie 1,059]

I'm sure Williams has films, to include Spielberg's, that are temped by the director.

[pi 0]

Well if you want new stuff watch indie movies, that is where the market with it. Do you think any one below the most extreme producer has any say in the matter? If brockhiemer says temp pirates 2 with pirates one, well there you go. Did u want something new for pirates? well silvestri most likely did it and got fired for it

The glamour days of hollywood are gone with the blockbusters, believe me.

Well it is apparant reading the posts lately that plenty of people didn't know of this or forgot. Do not forget this is a business, people are out to make money, not give all youall precious soundtracks to listen to.

Yeah, sorry. We forgot that the industry needs more business mans like Zimmer and his remote control company to compose popular mass ware by copying temp-tracks of their own work instead of artists who know their craft of actually supporting a film with unique musical accompaniment. We are such fools.

Seriously, you tell us to blindly accept the consequences that temp-tracks and over-commericalized thinking in Hollywood causes. That's pure opportunism. That's like saying the purpose of a disease is to kill people so lets not do anything against it.

The original purpose of a score is to support the picture, not to fill producer's pockets. That's the goal that should stand above anything else and that's the last bit of artistic value fans and professionals should defend instead of following the commerce nightmare.

Elmer Bernstein defended it until his last minute, Jerry Goldsmith did it, Bernard Herrmann made it his crusade while Danny Elfman still defends it. These people spoke up against the temp-track practise and that's one important thing that makes them artists and not business mans.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

So cynical

I still believe there is always room out there for a composer to write a completely original and worthwhile score, temp track or otherwise.

[Richard Penna 3,664]

True, but it's going to take a director/producer team who value artistic values above making. Call me cynical but I don't think that happens very often.

It's a sad fact of life that there are people who think they must make money from everything, and pretty much why most film music is unreleased. It's a little thought I've been having recently, that studios would prefer to deny us music that does exist in vaults because they don't think there's enough demand to make it worth their while to set up a payment/distribution system. And giving it for free for, say, anyone who bought the regular OST would be out of the question, since they would want it on their terms (DRM'd to hell) and would see it as a source of more profit.

I struggle sometimes to think of how music executives will ever be persuaded what a goldmine they have locked away. Why can't the a$$holes just make material available for the sheer creative hell of it? Great PR job guys.

Random rant over

[BigMacGyver 0]

Well if you want new stuff watch indie movies, that is where the market with it. Do you think any one below the most extreme producer has any say in the matter? If brockhiemer says temp pirates 2 with pirates one, well there you go. Did u want something new for pirates? well silvestri most likely did it and got fired for it

The glamour days of hollywood are gone with the blockbusters, believe me.

You are not telling me anything new here but you missed my point. You perfectly realized and summed up the problem but you are accepting it and that's my problem because with an attidude like yours, film music is already lost. I know, it's more easy to say hey, Hollywood is full of money-making bastards who violate art and creativity in favour of dollars but what can I do about it anyways, so I will just consume it and support them, instead of thinking about the problem and speaking up against it. Opportunism. Must be very comfortable.

Instead, I say the solution can't be found within the extreme. You say I should watch indie movies but that's just the opposite extreme of Hollywood's commerce and both suffer from problems. Music for blockbuster films is pushed into mass production regions by producers while indie films don't have big music budgets which can also limit a composer in what he wants to achieve. The solution is to find a healthy middle way between commerce and art that is good enough for all involved. Right now, Hollywood continuously ignores to look for such a middle way. Of course they do so, because looking for it would mean experimentation, moving away from the success-concept, effort and risking box office dollars. On the other hand, box office results aren't that great either since a while apart from one or two films, so they really don't have much to loose.