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He'll phone in his contractual requirements via satellite ;)

:lol:

Well he would be seeing just about as much of his co-stars that way as he would while standing in front of a green screen in another part of the studio.

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I don't understand why that happened. I mean, unless they had to shoot both places at the same time, they could have put some of the other actors sitting at the correct height around Ian so he could act with somebody (and later only extract him and put him with the dwarves in the shot with the scenery.)

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Also the 3D cameras have somehow made certain style of shooting impossible or at least challenging. I think PJ stated that as one of the reasons for ditching the miniatures. Could it be that the cameras have something to do with it as well. Also forced perspective might be more difficult if not impossible with them perhaps?

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This film has a main character played by Martin Freeman and a fun cast of characters and solid foundations for a plot and CGI of the year 2012. I don't think the technological risks will make it feel Phantom Menacey at all. The problem will likely be the digital colour alterations or the overuse of studio shooting for exteriors. Which is something many won't care about. Still it seems they shot quite a lot outside anyway.

Honestly, the reviews for this thing are gonna be frightening.

But this is true, though.

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Hobbit Uproar: Animal Abuse Allegations Pelt Filmmakers; PETA Planning to Protest

http://uk.eonline.com/news/364318/hobbit-uproar-animal-abuse-allegations-pelt-filmmakers-peta-planning-to-protest?utm_source=eonline&utm_medium=rssfeeds&utm_campaign=imdb_topstories

Bunnies of Doom have already claimed untold victims!

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oh and i think PETA are too extremist to my tastes. After all it seems the production company took measures when problems arose.

thanks.

since KK did a joke for bloodboal with that i thought it was a hoax :)

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thanks.

since KK did a joke for bloodboal with that i thought it was a hoax :)

KK did not do a joke for Bloodboal, the wrong link was accidental and he posted "Fixed" a few minutes later.

I wonder, if this film ends halfway through what would have been the first film of two, and it clocks ten minutes under FOTR, does that mean there were going to be hours of deleted scenes?

Halfway? Not even close. More like half an hour before it would have when it was 2 films. Likely they just put back in approx 15 minutes of deleted scenes into Film 1 when they lopped off the last 30 minutes and that's why the film is 2:45 instead of 3:00 it would have been were it still 2 films. I wonder if there will even be EE versions any more

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That is longer than an hour. And think that makes now a second film. Meaning they were going to shoot a shitload of material that would have been discarded because it didn't fit in a four hour film.

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You're insane, LeBlanc. The Dwarves meeting Beorn, then the journey through Mirkwood, the attack of the spiders, the Dwarves being captured by the elves and Bilbo rescuing them all in half an hour? Sounds more like an hour to me (or at the very least 40 minutes).

Wow you're right. That could very well be an hour or more of stuff.

How in the HELL did this film balloon to 2 hours, 45 minutes once all that was taken out? They must have put back in every last thing that hit the cutting room floor. I think this is going to be a very slow-paced film.

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Yea, what the hell is the climax of the second film? I'm sure the entire Battle of Five Armies will be in Film 3, and Film 2 will include up to at least Bilbo's entire encounter with Smaug including leaving with the arkenstone.... so what the hell is the big action finale of Film 2? Maybe the expulsion of Sauron from Dol Guldur?

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That is longer than an hour. And think that makes now a second film. Meaning they were going to shoot a shitload of material that would have been discarded because it didn't fit in a four hour film.

That doesn't make the second film. That probably makes about one third of the second film. Remember that it's called The Desolation Of Smaug, so the Dwarves will reach the Lonely Mountain in this one. You'll have Laketown (with characters like Bard and the Master of the town that will be fleshed-out, then the journey to the mountain and Bilbo meeting Smaug. Whether we'll see Smaug attacking Laketown in this one is uncertain for the moment)

Maybe they'll try for the originally predicted "seeing the Lonely Mountain ending" for the second one.

Think you have Beorn, the other White Counicil meeting, Mirkwood, invented scenes in Mirkwood, the river, Bilbo on top of a tree, Gandalf with someone else in Dol Guldur doing whatever, the Dwarves captures by spiders, Bilbo rescuing them (his big moment so it can't be done so fast as it would be if you comprise all this in an hour), the dwarves encountering the elves, presenting the whole elven business with the King wanting the treasure, the dwarves in prison, probably some sort of battle at Dol Guldur (there's a orc villain there and everything), then Bilbo and the company escaping from the elves and looking at the Mountain, maybe arriving on Laketown. Maybe them leaving Laketown but that would be more anticlimatic.

It wouldn't be as different in rythm from the first one. Maybe a bit shorter.

Then everything else in the third film.

But it's too complicated! It seems it would be natural to bring Smaug into the second film, but not to have most of it in there. If you put too much into the second you're missing ideas for the third and the other way around. And there aren't much appropiate places for splitting the story... And spliting Smaug material? He should be continuous! You don't end the story in the middle of the Smaug part, then continue later! Much less risk making a film out of twenty pages!

Yea, what the hell is the climax of the second film? I'm sure the entire Battle of Five Armies will be in Film 3, and Film 2 will include up to at least Bilbo's entire encounter with Smaug including leaving with the arkenstone.... so what the hell is the big action finale of Film 2? Maybe the expulsion of Sauron from Dol Guldur?

I think if the follow the book, Gandalf has to finish his business before he reappears. I'm sure PJ is having the big ending at the Mountain, with Bolg as the main villain. Not in a location for a side plot.

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Wow. There are actually a lot of possibilities aren't there.

Is there any chance the original banner showing all the way up to the barrels was never meant to show everything in Film 1? Nah, it must have because they later revised it to only show where we know for sure Film 1 ends now.

Based on how much of the book + made up stuff they go through in 2 hours and 45 minutes now, I'm surprised they need to film any extra footage at all to switch to 3 films, seems like they likely already had enough!

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OK Looking at a list of the chapters in The Hobbit, Film 1 now covers the first 6 chapters out of 19, so roughly one third of the book, which makes sense. Had it included through the barrels, that would have been 9 chapters out of 19, so roughly half, which made sense. And if we guess that film also would have been about 3 hours, it looks like they went from about 20 minutes per chapter to about 30 minutes per chapter when they changed things.

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That is longer than an hour. And think that makes now a second film. Meaning they were going to shoot a shitload of material that would have been discarded because it didn't fit in a four hour film.

That doesn't make the second film. That probably makes about one third of the second film. Remember that it's called The Desolation Of Smaug, so the Dwarves will reach the Lonely Mountain in this one. You'll have Laketown (with characters like Bard and the Master of the town that will be fleshed-out, then the journey to the mountain and Bilbo meeting Smaug. Whether we'll see Smaug attacking Laketown in this one is uncertain for the moment)

Maybe they'll try for the "seeing the Lonely Mountain ending" for the second one.

Think you have Beorn, the other White Counicil meeting, Mirkwood, invented scenes in Mirkwood, the river, Bilbo on top of a tree, Gandalf with someone else in Dol Guldur doing whatever, the Dwarves captures by spiders, Bilbo rescuing them (his big moment so it can't be done so fast as it would be if you comprise all this in an hour), the dwarves encountering the elves, presenting the whole elven business with the King wanting the treasure, the dwarves in prison, probably some sort of battle at Dol Guldur (there's a orc villain there and everything), then Bilbo and the company escaping from the elves and looking at the Mountain, maybe arriving on Laketown. Maybe them leaving Laketown but that would be more anticlimatic.

It wouldn't be as different in rythm from the first one. Maybe a bit shorter.

Then everything else in the third film.

No way. I can't see that working at all. The third film would have all the meaty stuff, while the second one would be pretty dull. And why call it The Desolation Of Smaug if we don't even see that place? No. I'm confident the Dwarves will reach the mountain in the second film. Enough stretching with film 1. Get to the real business in film 2, please.

Which means a third film being made mostly of... a battle.

:folder:

I'm okay with them reaching the Mountain. But if Smaug appears in the second film I'll be very scared.

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OK, continuing with my "6 chapters per film" theory, I think Film 2 will end where Chapter 12 does - Bilbo has had his conversation with Smaug, and Smaug takes off to attack Laketown. That can be made into a pretty decent cliffhanger. Then Film 3 opens with Bilbo and the dwarves exploring the Lonely Mountain while Smaug attacks Laketown and builds to the big battle from there

(BTW I edited my previous post because I messed up, read it again now)

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I'm not sure I would like Smaug dying at the beginning of the third film. The film change breaks the tension of Smaug's chain of events.

Yes, yes at all.

Try summing up outline of the third film you mention yourself and you'll see what I mean. The structure of ROTK depends on the story of Frodo and Sam getting to a global climax that involves everything.

That doesn't exist here. You have the great battle... true. You have to make up the "people talking". And after the battle and Thorin's death, the tension of the story is over. There's no great finale with Mt. Doom. The Hobbit has a double peak with Smaug and with Bilbo "betraying" Thorin. In any case, Smaug would be the Pelennor peak and the Battle, Mt Doom. In that case I would see what you mean.

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I'm okay with them reaching the Mountain. But if Smaug appears in the second film I'll be very scared.

Why would they title Film 2 "The Desolation of Smaug" if Smaug does not appear in it?

~~~

The only possibility we haven't brought up is that the extra scenes they are filming next summer all take place after the events of The Hobbit (some sort of bridging thing to LOTR somehow)... so the events of The Hobbit end around 90 minutes into Film 3 and then there is... extra crap for a while.

Nah, I think I'm pretty spot on with my 6 chapters per film idea.

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I'm okay with them reaching the Mountain. But if Smaug appears in the second film I'll be very scared.

Why would they title Film 2 "The Desolation of Smaug" if Smaug does not appear in it?

Because The Desolation of Smaug is a place, not Smaug himself. It refers the area surrounding the Mountain that has been devastated by the dragon in the past.

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I'm okay with them reaching the Mountain. But if Smaug appears in the second film I'll be very scared.

Why would they title Film 2 "The Desolation of Smaug" if Smaug does not appear in it?

The Desolation of Smaug doesn't have to do with Smaug or his death. It's the actual location that Smaug burned and pillaged. So they would arrive to the locale.

EDIT: Looks like Chaac got there before I did.

Anyways, ever since this thing became a trilogy, Smaug was the big roadblock in the production. In a narrative sense, he presents the greatest problem with pacing and the climaxes.

They could end film 2 with Bilbo's conversation and Smaug flying away to Laketown, but to have the primary "villain" killed off in the beginning of the last film.

But killing him off in the 2nd film presents a huge problem in the last film too. It wouldn't be all battle like Chaac said. They would explore Thorin's growing madness over Arkenstone, and Bard's efforts to negotiate with him. Remember, there's still a long way off before all the goblins, wargs and dwarves show up. So it could be a bit like ROTK.

But its the absence of Smaug that will be particularly bothersome. This is the villain that the audience has been told in the first two films to fear and despise. But he's gone for the finale. So are people just waiting for the battle? ROTK in a sense was about the big battle too, but it had Sauron there with the audience awaiting the penultimate destruction of the ring. There's a sense of accomplishment, with that final goal being achieved. How will that play out for There and Back Again.

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if Smaug's death happens at the beginning of film 3, then the best ending for film 2 would be the cliffhanger one with Smaug moving to attack Laketown.

But then something feels wrong about opening a film with Smaug's death scene.

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