The Hobbit Film Trilogy Thread

[Quintus 5,399]

The "look" of these new films is one of the main reasons why I've become disinterested in the series. But I think Lily looks pretty good there.

[Incanus 5,713]

Looks kind of video-gameish...

what a revelation! half of AUJ looked video-gameish:(

I somehow picture the AUJ Goblin Town design meeting going at some point like this:

Level 7: The Goblin Town: While fleeing from the Goblins and when you have chosen Gandalf press X on the controller repeatedly to release a nice CGI boulder to wipe out the goblins in front of you. Press A for the Dwarves to add some speed to the CGI boulder.

[Jay 37,271]

Desolation of Smaug Trailer Approved; Runs 2:01; Will likely be attached to Man Of Steel

http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2013/06/06/72754-bbfc-approves-the-hobbit-the-desolation-of-smaug-trailer/

[Incanus 5,713]

Great news!

Although I might just see it on the internet once it ends up here.

[Brónach 1,301]

Looks kind of video-gameish...

what a revelation! half of AUJ looked video-gameish:(

I somehow picture the AUJ Goblin Town design meeting going at some point like this:

Level 7: The Goblin Town: While fleeing from the Goblins and when you have chosen Gandalf press X on the controller repeatedly to release a nice CGI boulder to wipe out the goblins in front of you. Press A for the Dwarves to add some speed to the CGI boulder.

That scene actually felt a bit incoherent in the film. Cut to this, cut to that. That's why it doesn't actually work.

[KK 3,307]

It was fun though, to some degree.

[crocodile 7,979]

The only scene I can remember from the film was Gollum's cave sequence. The rest has gone fuzzy.

Karol

[Jay 37,271]

The prologue was awesome

[crocodile 7,979]

Maybe but the HFR made it look like a 1980's BBC television production. Hence, the impact is not there for me.

It doesn't seem to have that kind of effect on the scene I mentioned. Maybe because of the dark environment.

Karol

[KK 3,307]

The Hobbit prologue was awful. ..one of the worst parts of the film.

[Jay 37,271]

I only saw it in HFR on my 2nd viewing. When I saw it at midnight in good ole' 2D everything looked great

[Brónach 1,301]

It was fun though, to some degree.

Nah, it had no progression. And it had no scary factor. I liked the "that'll do it" line, though, I feel that somehow, that humour does fit with the story.

[Incanus 5,713]

It was fun though, to some degree.

Nah, it had no progression. And it had no scary factor. I liked the "that'll do it" line, though, I feel that somehow, that humour does fit with the story.

Yeah the whole sequence lacks any kind of real tension. It's all light and fun. Even though PJ was making a lighter film he might have at least given us a rudimentary sense of real danger the Goblins pose to the Dwarven company. Not a scratch on any of them during the whole escapade.

To quote Dwalin: You got to be joking!

[KK 3,307]

I only saw it in HFR on my 2nd viewing. When I saw it at midnight in good ole' 2D everything looked great

Even in 2D it looked pretty bad (but much worse in HFR). The big problem was the colour grading. I guess Jackson was trying to pay homage to the successful tone of the original prologue in FotR, but it looks awful and cheap.

Second, the content and designs in this prologue aren't nearly as interesting. The Dwarven design (the halls, the dwarves, the machinery, etc.) weren't too good, look as if they came from some cheap B-movie Tolkien-knock off fantasy. The story in itself with Bilbo's narration wasn't very gripping to be honest and just seemed like a lot of exposition, even for a LotR film.

It's a poor opening that sets the film up for mediocrity/average-ness right from the start

[Incanus 5,713]

I found the prologue hit and miss. Bilbo's narration sounds to my ears somewhat clumsy, the designs of both Dale and Erebor quite impressive but I still can't fathom why Dwarves, the image of practicality would build such elaborate death trap of a kingdom with penchant for enormously narrow walkways without any rails and a certain death plunge awaiting somewhere hundreds of feet below as everything is built on some enormous abyss. Plus their machinery and tools were in some shots outrageous, clearly born out of PJ's love for excess.The green colour scheme is also a bit puzzling if at times looks nice in some shots. The sequence looked better in 2D. But at least Thror and Thrain had good long Dwarven beards. And the music is brilliant.

But I think we will be more outraged by Dain Ironfoot and his mohawk and battle boar in the upcoming films.

[Brónach 1,301]

I wouldn't have had a prologue. That part could be told less pompously inside Bag End.

It actually works better because you don't know Dwarves are going to show up, or a dragon, or anything. W e discover everything at the pace of younger Bilbo.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

She looks great!

Red head!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,713]

I think those issues with references to the past are the exact problem LotR creates for this new trilogy. How much do they rely on nostalgia and nods and commenting on the connection to the older material and how much of the film is new and fresh. AUJ sets things up with a lot of references, starting the whole movie with a frame story set during the eve of Bilbo's 111th birthday party. The two sequels do have the opporturnity to explore really some completely new ground as Rhovanion or Mirkwood or Long Lake are an unwritten page as far as LotR films are concerned.

[Brónach 1,301]

Desolation of Smaug Trailer Approved; Runs 2:01; Will likely be attached to Man Of Steel

http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2013/06/06/72754-bbfc-approves-the-hobbit-the-desolation-of-smaug-trailer/

This trailer will have to be really awesome to get me really excited for this trilogy again. I still have interest in it, obviously, but nowhere near as much as I had before the first film came out.

My interest in this film feels like my Hobbit libido had suddenly dropped and I didn't really care anymore. Like I kinda follow it superficially because I used to do it.

Re: Gandalf's boulder. I actually like it. I like the wizard trying stuff or being "creative". It fits perfectly with the tone of The Hobbit. However the moment is ruined by the far too obvious CGIness of the boulder, the goblins and the background. And the scene does feel like a bunch of unrelated shots put one after the other, this is why it looks like it's so easy to take stuff out of it and it remains the same anyway. The worst offender is when Thorin says to cut the ropes without any sort of setup about what's actually going on.

This is the most repetitive thing to say, but I'm watching parts of the film on youtube and I keep seeing all these little things that are spot on everywhere. Like the Goblin King's voice and way of speaking.

"Spies?!Thieves?! Assassins?!"

"Dwarves, your malevolence!"

[Incanus 5,713]

Oh no! This trailer would have to be some pretty strong Hobbit-viagra then to get you back on the bandwagon.

The whole boulder sequence is cheesy as hell even by this film's standards. It feels forced, done because Gandalf had to be active in the scene and that was the only thing they could come up with. Plus the flood of plastic non-lethal comical Goblins makes it pretty much a redundant chase. Moria was made dangerous and poignant by Gandalf's death, showing real danger and consequences even to the most powerful character of the fellowship. As far as the general feel goes, the Goblin Town sequence is just a fun running romp through the caves in comparison.

[Brónach 1,301]

Anyone else feel that the moment where Gandalf slays the Goblin King could simply cut then back and create an ellipsis to when we see the company running away from Bilbo's viewpoint? More elegant.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Smeltington 1,436]

The prologue was much too nostalgic for me, and felt more like an excuse to bring back Bilbo and Frodo from LotR (and to mirror the FotR prologue) than anything else. It felt unnecessary and I found myself wishing they'd just cut to young Bilbo and get on with it.

I was okay with most of the Goblin Town antics - gags like the ladder or the boulder were appropriate, IMO. Didn't like the CG goblins or the goblin king's last words. Like most of the movie, this whole sequence was reminiscent of a sequence in FotR, but lacked the weight of its FotR counterpart, and contributed to the overall "LotR-lite" feel of the movie.

[Brónach 1,301]

I've got a better idea for my edit...

Changing the order of things?

Of course, one thing is trimming like mad, and another going one step further and experiment with editing to make somet things look like something else.

this whole sequence was reminiscent of a sequence in FotR, but lacked the weight of its FotR counterpart, and contributed to the overall "LotR-lite" feel of the movie.

The thing is, it didn't have to be so reminiscent, and it didn't have to carry the same weight or tone. But the film is schizophrenic.

[Incanus 5,713]

this whole sequence was reminiscent of a sequence in FotR, but lacked the weight of its FotR counterpart, and contributed to the overall "LotR-lite" feel of the movie.

The thing is, it didn't have to be so reminiscent, and it didn't have to carry the same weight or tone. But the film is schizophrenic.

Yes the dead serious darkness of LotR mixed with the fun and at times outrageously humorous lightness of the Hobbit doesn't really work so well in many places in the film. That and the bloat are two of the main problems of the AUJ.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Smeltington 1,436]

I think one of the downsides to all the nostalgia in AUJ is that PJ unwittingly invited even more comparisons with FotR. And it was already in danger of unfavorable comparisons no matter what he did.

[Incanus 5,713]

I just realized something about the upcoming trailer: it'll probably include new music from Shore! That's reason enough to get excited for it! Yay!

Ummm... I think you mean Plan 9.

[KK 3,307]

That's one of the big problems with this film, it's inability to let go of LotR's success. Its too focused on putting in inside jokes and references to the previous films and it often plays to its detriment. The prologue was colour graded to harken back to the softness/darkness of the FotR prologue (which worked great then), but it looks so awfully dated now in this much brighter and lighter-toned prologue....

Sense was sacrificed for the sake of nostalgia.

I just realized something about the upcoming trailer: it'll probably include new music from Shore! That's reason enough to get excited for it! Yay!

I have a feeling we'll just hear another variation of the Misty Mountains theme, nothing more.

[Smeltington 1,436]

I just realized something about the upcoming trailer: it'll probably include new music from Shore! That's reason enough to get excited for it! Yay!

Ooh yeah! I hope we hear some new themes. The score is the biggest reason to be excited for the movie, as well... will we get another two CDs?

[Incanus 5,713]

I just realized something about the upcoming trailer: it'll probably include new music from Shore! That's reason enough to get excited for it! Yay!

Ooh yeah! I hope we hear some new themes. The score is the biggest reason to be excited for the movie, as well... will we get another two CDs?

We could hope so. The previous 2 CD set sold well (I think).

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,713]

I am just reading the History of the Hobbit (Part 1) by John D. Rateliff and it is really fascinating to what depth he explores Tolkien's early drafts of the story, his influences and the background of just about everything in the work. I just came across a very good point in the commentary that hasn't been too much discussed (as Rateliff himself mentions). Namely that the Hobbit was originally told and then written with a very special audience in mind, Tolkien's own sons. This is why the story lacks a fully balanced set of characters, the entire female cast missing, since girly stuff and women aren't of much interest to small boys. And this also translated into the final novel.

It remains to be seen how PJs desperate goal to add female perspective and characters into the story to please modern audiences will work in the end. Galadriel wasn't a too large intrusion but Tauriel might be a whole lot more troublesome and derail the actual main story a bit.

[Smeltington 1,436]

I'm open to new characters, and was hopeful about Tauriel, but based on what we have to go by so far, I'm not so sure anymore.

I did like the addition of Radagast. AUJ needed SOMETHING we'd never seen before, amid all the returning locales and characters from FotR, and I thought he was entertaining.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Brónach 1,301]

I am just reading the History of the Hobbit (Part 1) by John D. Rateliff and it is really fascinating to what depth he explores Tolkien's early drafts of the story, his influences and the background of just about everything in the work. I just came across a very good point in the commentary that hasn't been too much discussed (as Rateliff himself mentions). Namely that the Hobbit was originally told and then written with a very special audience in mind, Tolkien's own sons. This is why the story lacks a fully balanced set of characters, the entire female cast missing, since girly stuff and women aren't of much interest to small boys. And this also translated into the final novel.

It remains to be seen how PJs desperate goal to add female perspective and characters into the story to please modern audiences will work in the end. Galadriel wasn't a too large intrusion but Tauriel might be a whole lot more troublesome and derail the actual main story a bit.

I remember seeing a reverse fantasy cast of TLotR. It was good stuff. Made me think on the representation of women in fiction, although of course TLotR was published in the 50's. Modern medieval fantasy seems to have a lot more of women in it.

[Smeltington 1,436]

I did like the addition of Radagast. AUJ needed SOMETHING we'd never seen before, amid all the returning locales and characters from FotR, and I thought he was entertaining.

The funny thing is that it's all those useless additions that prevented AUJ from offering something we'd never seen before and truly worthwile, such as Beorn, Mirkwood, Thranduil's halls, etc... Cut all the uninteresting additions, and there would have been more time for the really good stuff.

Yeah, if they would have just downplayed all the stuff we'd already seen in LotR a bit (Rivendell, prologue, etc) in favor of getting to Beorn and Mirkwood sooner, that would've worked too. I still appreciated Radagast for bringing something unexpected to the table, but I admit he didn't have much reason to be there otherwise. Of course, how much the Thranduill scenes will differentiate themselves from all the elf material we've seen in LotR remains to be seen, especially with Legolas being brought back.

My hopes for a NEW adventure have already been dashed, so I'm really crossing my fingers for a good 1 or 2-film fan edit when this is all over, so that the new trilogy won't be a total loss (apart from the soundtrack CDs!).

I remember seeing a reverse fantasy cast of TLotR. It was good stuff. Made me think on the representation of women in fiction, although of course TLotR was published in the 50's. Modern medieval fantasy seems to have a lot more of women in it.

There may be other explanations, but it's possible that Tolkien as a male author was just not very comfortable writing female characters.

[Brónach 1,301]

I remember seeing a reverse fantasy cast of TLotR. It was good stuff. Made me think on the representation of women in fiction, although of course TLotR was published in the 50's. Modern medieval fantasy seems to have a lot more of women in it.

There may be other explanations, but it's possible that Tolkien as a male author was just not very comfortable writing female characters.

I don't know the real answer but I've aways imagined the thought didn't simply cross his mind, or it didn't feel weird to him.

[Incanus 5,713]

Tolkien's inspirations for his writings were varied but the mythic sources he used tend to be male dominated, creations of patriarchal societies. Of course you can argue that even Ancient myths had strong female characters, goddesses and heroines of their own right, but still the main focus is on male characters and their exploits. Same goes for the Norse mythology and sagas and Beowulfian world Tolkien knew so well. In a way understanding our European cycles of myths and legends makes understanding Tolkien's writing easier, gives you a possible glimpse of his perspective and way of thinking.

The Hobbit is also deeply concerned with this lore of the past cultures and Tolkien, as John D. Rateliff shows in his book, took some of his inspiration and models from extremely obscure sources in Icelandic and Norse sagas and Medieval and later prose and poetry.

[gkgyver 1,645]

I just realized something about the upcoming trailer: it'll probably include new music from Shore! That's reason enough to get excited for it! Yay!

I don't think it will have new Shore. TTT's first teaser didn't have new Shore as well. I wouldn't get too excited just yet.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[gkgyver 1,645]

ROTK teaser trailer did not have new Shore. The final trailer did.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[gkgyver 1,645]

Yes, I do. FOTR teaser didn't have new Shore, TTT teaser didn't have new Shore, ROTK teaser didn't have new Shore, AUJ trailer didn't have new Shore, DOS teaser won't have new Shore.

AUJ was different because the teaser one year before the film was a preview for the whole trilogy, so they included some Shore to peak the interest.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

I'll accept your apologies when the teaser is released!

[gkgyver 1,645]

I will accept yours, should you give them to me, which I doubt.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

I won't have to.

[gkgyver 1,645]

Unless you change your avatar, I'm going to call you Tauriel from nowon .

[BloodBoal 7,538]

F*** you!