Composer Threads James Newton Howard thread

[LSH 1,062]

3 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

The only clue for me that JNH was in a hurry for me is that some of the action sequences recycled the same core idea to an extent, meaning that once you've got a couple of them, you don't really need the others for a representative listening experience.

I agree with this. You only really need the New York finale action material - it contains all the riffs from earlier on, including the T-Rex Fight stuff.

 

Still a phenomenal effort. Looking back,  it’s too easy to imagine this film being left with something totally mediocre had it been given to someone else without the inspiration JNH clearly had. So he really does deserve all the praise he’s gotten.

[leeallen01 2,179]

I like how he said he scored King Kong. He basically backwards engineered it. He scored the final Empire State Building set-piece first, then went back to the start, using the core ideas from that finale as major thematic material.

 

The finale is full of almost every emotion and events, like action, tragedy, mortal danger, sadness Etc. So it goes from full power orchestra to small solo voice, all in 15 minutes. So to write that was a great time saving and instinctual method that gave him a great blueprint.

[GerateWohl 5,159]

37 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

I like how he said he scored King Kong. He basically backwards engineered it. He scored the final Empire State Building set-piece first, then went back to the start, using the core ideas from that finale as major thematic material.

That's a quite good creative approach in general, I think, to start with the most inspiring culminative scenes of the movie and work backwards from there.

[Richard P 4,265]

16 hours ago, LSH said:

Still a phenomenal effort. Looking back,  it’s too easy to imagine this film being left with something totally mediocre had it been given to someone else without the inspiration JNH clearly had. So he really does deserve all the praise he’s gotten.

 

The film came at the right time with a director who has Spielberg's standard for good music and a composer who delivers quality orchestral music when he's asked for it. You're right that with a different director and shall we say, a more RCP-flavoured composer it could've turned out very different. It would be so easy to just plaster the film with a fairly generic soundscape.

 

I've also wondered whether part of an agreement for composing a replacement score is the promise of the studio funding whatever album the composer wants. Particularly this one recorded in L.A with a massive orchestra and choir - that's going to be about as expensive as it gets.

[Cristian 66]

The Beauty Killed the Beast suite is without a doubt some of my favorite music by JNH ever. What a stunning way to end the album, everything come togheter so well, it's like a great coda to a great symphony. 

[filmmusic 2,259]

20 hours ago, Cindylover1969 said:

The Prince Of Tides

One more vote for this, that I think unfortunately is not liked around these parts...

[Cindylover1969 53]

Just now, filmmusic said:

One more vote for this, that I think unfortunately is not liked around these parts...

That was the first soundtrack of his that I bought. But the first time he really caught my ear was when I went to see The Package.

[Cristian 66]

35 minutes ago, filmmusic said:

One more vote for this, that I think unfortunately is not liked around these parts...

I like it but not quite to be in my top ten. Top 20 maybe.

[filmmusic 2,259]

37 minutes ago, Cindylover1969 said:

That was the first soundtrack of his that I bought.

Mine too! In cassette! 

 

I have seen The Package but I can't say I remember anything about the score..

[Cristian 66]

Next year marks the 20th anniversary of the release of the movie King Kong. Are there any chances for an expanded release of the score? Do you want an expanded release or you are happy with the 2005 album?

[Jay 39,754]

If it was recorded in the US, it's impossible for the specialty labels to license because of AFM fees for all scores recorded after July 2005

[Jurassic Shark 13,360]

The Steiner is superior anyway.

[GerateWohl 5,159]

On 10/08/2024 at 9:15 PM, Thor said:

 

Interesting list, and also that you've omitted his best score, and one of the 10 best scores written in the history of cinema (WATERWORLD).

I listened to this again and cannot comprehend why anyone would put that score into any top ten list apart from maybe a top 10 list of WATERWORLD scores and even then there shouldn't be more than ten of them.

But that's probably because I am kind of allergic to that RCP sound which JNH managed to overcome fortunately in later years.

 

What is so special about this score?

 

[Thor 8,504]

33 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

What is so special about this score?

 

Everything!

 

Love the swashbuckling stuff, love the awe-inspiring ("The Bubble" is the best underwater religioso track this side of the THE ABYSS finale), love the exotic/ethnic colours and instrumentation, love the electronic bits. "Swimming" is one of the best film music tracks written in all of history, perfectly capturing the feeling, sound, temperature and viscosity of water. Goosebumps and tears galore! It's a long album, for sure, but rarely a boring moment.

 

It also helps, of course, that I've adored the film since it came out (against all critics...that just reinforced my love!), have seen it probably 20 times, and it's one of the first soundtracks I got on CD. So enormous personal, nostalgic connection as well. Listening to it brings me back to a fond time in my life, and in my film music exploration. I try not to listen to it too much these days, though, so as not to "over-use" it.

 

Might sound hyperbolic to everyone else, but to me it's just perfection through and through. It's been on my top 10 list of scores (not only by JNH, but in general) for 30 years, and will likely stay there until I die.

[Cristian 66]

Thor I'm curious, what is your top ten JNH?

[Frank Vincent 247]

2 hours ago, Cristian Lee said:

Next year marks the 20th anniversary of the release of the movie King Kong. Are there any chances for an expanded release of the score? Do you want an expanded release or you are happy with the 2005 album?

 

1 hour ago, Jay said:

If it was recorded in the US, it's impossible for the specialty labels to license because of AFM fees for all scores recorded after July 2005

 

Unfortunately it was recorded in the US after July 2005.

[Edmilson 9,118]

Yep. Late October/early November if I'm not wrong.

 

1 hour ago, GerateWohl said:

I listened to this again and cannot comprehend why anyone would put that score into any top ten list apart from maybe a top 10 list of WATERWORLD scores and even then there shouldn't be more than ten of them.

But that's probably because I am kind of allergic to that RCP sound which JNH managed to overcome fortunately in later years.

 

What is so special about this score?

 

I wouldn't say this is one of my very favorite JNH scores, but it's an amazing score on its own. Certainly top 3 JNH in the 90s, alongside Wyatt Earp and The Postman (all of them being Kevin Costner movies lol).

 

The action music is among the best he has ever done but the atmospheric music offers a nice of pace of all the bombastic stuff. 

 

And I love the theme that appears on this track:

 

 

[Stark 566]

I need more Postman appreciation here!

[Cristian 66]

5 minutes ago, Stark said:

I need more Postman appreciation here!

One of my favorite scores! Perfect balance between action/adventure and calm/contemplative music. Memorable main theme, one of the best by JNH. I also like the album presentation with long suites, perfect listening experience.

[tomsmoviemadness 3,611]

1 hour ago, Thor said:

 

Everything!

 

Love the swashbuckling stuff, love the awe-inspiring ("The Bubble" is the best underwater religioso track this side of the THE ABYSS finale), love the exotic/ethnic colours and instrumentation, love the electronic bits. "Swimming" is one of the best film music tracks written in all of history, perfectly capturing the feeling, sound, temperature and viscosity of water. Goosebumps and tears galore! It's a long album, for sure, but rarely a boring moment.

 

It also helps, of course, that I've adored the film since it came out (against all critics...that just reinforced my love!), have seen it probably 20 times, and it's one of the first soundtracks I got on CD. So enormous personal, nostalgic connection as well. Listening to it brings me back to a fond time in my life, and in my film music exploration. I try not to listen to it too much these days, though, so as not to "over-use" it.

 

Might sound hyperbolic to everyone else, but to me it's just perfection through and through. It's been on my top 10 list of scores (not only by JNH, but in general) for 30 years, and will likely stay there until I die.

I've never actually heard it before, but your words convinced me that I really should. And check out the film as well. I love a film critics don't. Hahaha

[Jay 39,754]

The score is incredible (easily my favorite JNH score) and the film is good too. 

[Edmilson 9,118]

I saw it for the first time on Netflix a few years ago and I liked it. Nice 90s popcorn flick. Never seen Wyatt Earp or The Postman though.

 

The WE complete score released by LLL a few years ago is pretty good, but it can be a bit "too much". It loses some steam after the first hour or so.

 

That said, some of my favorite tracks are not on the OST, like this:

 

 

[Cindylover1969 53]

On 13/08/2024 at 4:37 PM, filmmusic said:

Mine too! In cassette! 

 

I have seen The Package but I can't say I remember anything about the score..

The Package  introduced me the practice of censoring credits on TV screenings. When I returned to England to live I saw The Package was going the Friday night movie on BBC1 and I looked forward to taping the end credits suite off the TV... and, you can guess.

[Cristian 66]

10 minutes ago, Cindylover1969 said:

 

Great cue! I should revisit the score.

[GerateWohl 5,159]

3 hours ago, Thor said:

 

Everything!

 

Love the swashbuckling stuff, love the awe-inspiring ("The Bubble" is the best underwater religioso track this side of the THE ABYSS finale), love the exotic/ethnic colours and instrumentation, love the electronic bits. "Swimming" is one of the best film music tracks written in all of history, perfectly capturing the feeling, sound, temperature and viscosity of water. Goosebumps and tears galore! It's a long album, for sure, but rarely a boring moment.

 

It also helps, of course, that I've adored the film since it came out (against all critics...that just reinforced my love!), have seen it probably 20 times, and it's one of the first soundtracks I got on CD. So enormous personal, nostalgic connection as well. Listening to it brings me back to a fond time in my life, and in my film music exploration. I try not to listen to it too much these days, though, so as not to "over-use" it.

 

Might sound hyperbolic to everyone else, but to me it's just perfection through and through. It's been on my top 10 list of scores (not only by JNH, but in general) for 30 years, and will likely stay there until I die.

Thanks for your detailrd answer. My issue with JNH's swashbuckling music is that it mostly appears quite random to me. By the way also an issue that I have with Debney's Cutthroat Island.

 

And I understand (what I already assumed) that nostalgia plays a big role in your rating of the score. Anyway, I got a used copy of the OST for 1,20€ (plus shipping), so I can make myself more familar with the highlights of the score.

@Edmilson Thanks for your response, too. I still would say Wyatt Earp is a whole other league of score. That one is really brilliant. 

[Thor 8,504]

4 hours ago, Cristian Lee said:

Thor I'm curious, what is your top ten JNH?

 

I probably did one earlier in the thread (too lazy to check), but at the moment, maybe this?

 

1. WATERWORLD

2. The Saint of Fort Washington

3. Snow Falling on Cedars

4. Restoration

5. Falling Down

6. The Village/A Hidden Life -- cheating, I know, but I consider these two scores siblings in sound and approach

7. Wyatt Earp

8. Grand Canyon

9. Dinosaur/Atlantis: The Lost Empire -- I cheated AGAIN, but same reason as above

10. Promised Land

[GerateWohl 5,159]

This is all I have now from JNH and probably more than enough for me. 

 

Unless one day an Unbreakable expansion comes along.

 

2 hours ago, Edmilson said:

That said, some of my favorite tracks are not on the OST, like this:

 

But Mattie Wants Children is on the OST. Track 5.

[Cristian 66]

7 minutes ago, Thor said:

 

I probably did one earlier in the thread (too lazy to check), but at the moment, maybe this?

 

1. WATERWORLD

2. The Saint of Fort Washington

3. Snow Falling on Cedars

4. Restoration

5. Falling Down

6. The Village/A Hidden Life -- cheating, I know, but I consider these two scores siblings in sound and approach

7. Wyatt Earp

8. Grand Canyon

9. Dinosaur/Atlantis: The Lost Empire -- I cheated AGAIN, but same reason as above

10. Promised Land

Very interesting, diverse and unique list. You like the gritty/urban/electronic side of JNH and also his contemplative/emotional/romantic scores. And of course the action/adventure/fantasy stuff. It shows how versatile JNH is.

[Richard P 4,265]

9 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

This is all I have now from JNH and probably more than enough for me. 

...

Unless one day an Unbreakable expansion comes along.

 

In terms of expansions I'd buy on CD, I can only think of Signs and The Village. JNH is a composer who knows how to build a well-flowing and representative album - he could teach Williams a thing or two about that.

 

My OST collection isn't that different to yours - a few more, few less, but the general theme and taste is similar.

[GerateWohl 5,159]

3 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

My OST collection isn't that different to yours - a few more, few less, but the general theme and taste is similar.

That's interesting. Because otherwise I thought we two have quite opposite tastes on scores.

Always happy to find something in common with people. 

[Edmilson 9,118]

18 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

But Mattie Wants Children is on the OST. Track 5.

Huh. I'm not that used with the OST because I first discovered this score with the LLL 2013 expansion. Glad that JNH liked that piece as much as I did to include it in his original program.

[Cristian 66]

23 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

 

JNH is a composer who knows how to build a well-flowing and representative album 

 

Yes, this is true but he must had a bad day with The Village. Why end the album with The Shed Not to be Used and not include The End Title? This is why The Village begs for an expanded release.

[Stark 566]

I think JNH is the most represented composer among my OSTs, possibly tied with Mark Isham (of all people). I mostly buy expansions/special editions though.

[Thor 8,504]

He used to be good at curating albums. Not so much anymore.

[LSH 1,062]

I don’t think I’ve ever compiled a top ten JNH. I just love so much stuff of his. He wasn't my first discovery in film music but he’s certainly responsible for the rapid acceleration in my appreciation of the artform. 
 

I think Dinosaur was possibly the first time I noticed his music in a film. Then - when I found out he worked with Shyamalan - I was hooked. The period of discovery that followed, in my early teens, was so wonderful. Just score after score of brilliance. Wish I could experience that again. Sad face.

[Cristian 66]

For me he was my first discovery. I got into filmmusic because of JNH with the three scores from the 2000: Vertical Limit, Unbreakable and Dinosaur. I was hooked and of course he became my favorite composer and he remained until this day my favorite. 

[Cindylover1969 53]

No one's mentioned Diggstown (Midnight Sting in the UK). before he did the theme for Emily In Paris he tackled Emily in Georgia (where this is set).

[Richard P 4,265]

On 15/08/2024 at 1:51 PM, LSH said:

I think Dinosaur was possibly the first time I noticed his music in a film. Then - when I found out he worked with Shyamalan - I was hooked. The period of discovery that followed, in my early teens, was so wonderful. Just score after score of brilliance. Wish I could experience that again. Sad face.

 

I'm not 100% sure the first time I heard JNH's music in context, but like you, I wish I could experience Signs, specifically The Hand Of Fate for the first time again.

 

In general I'm not into the earliest work of any composers, given that by and large my comfort zone starts in the mid to late 90s. JNH is a bit unusual though because he's tackled so many genres and types of film that some of his material goes completely over my head, while other times he absolutely smashes it. However, he's one of very few composers where I will consciously listen to anything new that he does - the key thing being that I put myself under zero pressure to like it.

[Gumball 0]

Hello everyone!
I don't know if this is the right topic, if not I apologize in advance.
I have a ticket for the James Newton Howard - Night After Night concert in Philadelphia on September 20th

For those interested you can write me privately, the price would be the same as I bought it for. Seat in row J, a good seat.

 

Thank you 

[Jay 39,754]

James is scoring Paul Greengrass's new movie "The Lost Bus" that's coming out next year, starring Matthew McConaughey and America Ferrera

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lost_Bus

 

It's confirmed by his agency, here:

 

https://www.gsamusic.com/clients/james-newton-howard/

[Edmilson 9,118]

14 minutes ago, Jay said:

James is scoring

 

15 minutes ago, Jay said:

Paul Greengrass's new movie

[Thor 8,504]

I agree that Paul Greengrass doesn't usually allow these big musical canvasses. But it happens now and then. I think their previous collaboration on NEWS OF THE WORLD was good. When whittled down to 36 minutes, it's actually a pretty soulful western score.

[Richard P 4,265]

4 minutes ago, Thor said:

I think their previous collaboration on NEWS OF THE WORLD was good.

 

 

4 minutes ago, Thor said:

 

When whittled down to 36 minutes, it's actually a pretty soulful western score.

 

 

It's a great album - perhaps you have to see the film for some of it to come alive. (Yeah... I know).

 

Greengrass and JNH again - bring it on!

[Edmilson 9,118]

Some tracks from NotW were outstanding: Johanna Returns Home (one of my most played tracks during those Covidian days), A Gift, Castroville... Overall a decent score even if in that Nick Cave & Warren Ellis style of gritty western.

[Cristian 66]

I'm glad and excited for any new JNH project. I just hope that the director won't be afraid of melody and it would let JNH drama sensibilities to shine. 

[Thor 8,504]

1 hour ago, Richard Penna said:

It's a great album - perhaps you have to see the film for some of it to come alive. (Yeah... I know).

 

I've seen the film, of course. The bits I found boring on album were also boring in the film. My whittling brought the score up from disappointing to pretty good.

[Edmilson 9,118]

28 minutes ago, Cristian Lee said:

I'm glad and excited for any new JNH project. I just hope that the director won't be afraid of melody and it would let JNH drama sensibilities to shine. 

I'm happy to see him getting new work as well, but I'm afraid Greengrass is the last director I'd like to see JNH working with (despite the good parts of News of the World). His style is to usually restrain all the JNH melodrama we love and just get from him the most uninteresting music as possible. It'll be his typical suspense/crime thriller with nervous synths, suspense strings, etc.

[Cristian 66]

5 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

I'm happy to see him getting new work as well, but I'm afraid Greengrass is the last director I'd like to see JNH working with (despite the good parts of News of the World). His style is to usually restrain all the JNH melodrama we love and just get from him the most uninteresting music as possible. It'll be his typical suspense/crime thriller with nervous synths, suspense strings, etc.

Yes, this I'm afraid of but at least we can hope this time will be different. It's true News of the World has some great moments so maybe this next project will have more of that.

[ddddeeee 364]

News of the World was a good movie, and this likely will be, too. That probably means a lot more to a 73-year-old JNH than yet another rotten fantasy movie with a score admirably striving to be what the movie isn't.

[Edmilson 9,118]

On 15/10/2024 at 2:57 PM, ddddeeee said:

News of the World was a good movie, and this likely will be, too. That probably means a lot more to a 73-year-old JNH than yet another rotten fantasy movie with a score admirably striving to be what the movie isn't.

You're probably right that later in his career he's doing projects that are more personal to him, like the Shyamalan album, News of the World, All the Light We Cannot See... He probably did the Hunger Games prequel just as "obligation".

 

Still, The Last Airbender and Fantastic Beasts Crimes of Grindelwald are two of the worst movies I've ever seen and yet JNH's music for them is absolutely stunning. If he never does another fantasy/sci-fi blockbuster again it'll be a little disappointing...