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The OFFICIAL The Dark Knight thread


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But that's part of the criteria of an award-worthy score--any great score. If it's going to win, it should fulfill both functions of enhancing the film and being an outstanding piece of music in its own right. They are right to consider both.

Anyway, the multi-composer thing is a moot point, as others have said. The music itself isn't Oscar-worthy--and I wonder if the healthy dose of reworked passages from Begins could be a strain on eligibility/winningness.

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But that's part of the criteria of an award-worthy score--any great score. If it's going to win, it should fulfill both functions of enhancing the film and being an outstanding piece of music in its own right. They are right to consider both.

If you're critiquing a score for best original score, how it stands up as a listening experience on its own is completely irrelevant. There are scores that do wonders in the film, but suck on their own, and vice versa.

Then I certainly hope not...it isn't used much throughout the score, however, so hopefully the Academy members will see this.

It's got the Raiders March, it can't be nominated. But who knows, considering that they like to break their own f*cking rules, it could happen.

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Now re-using cues, such as the grail theme, Marian's theme and the Flight From Peru version of the Raiders March might disqualify it. Also depends on how much they were used.

You can re-use themes if it's a sequel but there has to be a certain percentage of original music.

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There is no problem with quoting a previous piece of music here and there. And the other themes that you mentioned were completely relevant to the story. John Williams would have been crazy not to use those themes. Oh, and "Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith" would have been disqualifed if they were that strict, right?

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The "Flight From Peru" quoting I could see being a bugaboo for a KOTCS nomination. TDK does have more of the prevalent repurposed passages, though, and that could also be an issue.

But that's part of the criteria of an award-worthy score--any great score. If it's going to win, it should fulfill both functions of enhancing the film and being an outstanding piece of music in its own right. They are right to consider both.

If you're critiquing a score for best original score, how it stands up as a listening experience on its own is completely irrelevant. There are scores that do wonders in the film, but suck on their own, and vice versa.

I'm not talking about a "listening experience" per se, I'm talking about the quality of the music. A score may do wonders in the film and suck on its own, and a score may suck in the film and be a great listen, you're right on that. But that's why those scores shouldn't win. The best score is going to fulfill both qualities.

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The Oscars have constantly set double standards for scores in regards to the rules of submission. I'm sure some of the anger felt towards them is based on their personal choices, but a lot of it has good reason.

Having said that, I always look forward to the Oscars every year.

Now re-using cues, such as the grail theme[...]might disqualify it.

I can see the Academy members now:

- "This score is invalid due to Williams' use of previous material in the score, such as the Grail Theme."

- "Wait...that'd be Henry's Theme, actually."

- "Sort of. It's actually the motif for Henry and Indy."

- "It's the theme for the father and son. It works for Henry/Indy or Indy/Mutt."

- "The B Melody is the Father/Son bit, the rest is the Grail Theme."

- "You guys are wrong, it is the Illumination Theme..."

No other theme has sparked such controversy, confusion, and mystery among the ranks of John Williams addicts.

Or better yet, Indy 4 will be disqualified for JW's tracking of "Ah, Rats!!!"

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My anger towards the Academy is a constant thing, even if the people I want to win end up winning. With that being said, I still watch them every year, well, because I love film.

For those who don't want to go searching for it:

B. ELIGIBILITY

1. The work must be specifically created for the eligible feature-length motion picture.

2. The work must be the result of a creative interaction between the film maker(s) and the composer(s) or songwriter(s) who have been engaged to work directly on the film.

3. The measure of the work's qualification shall be its effectiveness, craftsmanship, creative substance and relevance to the dramatic whole.

4. The work must be recorded for use in the film prior to any other usage including public performance or exploitation through any of the media whatsoever.

5. Only the principal composer(s) or song writer(s) responsible for the conception and execution of the work as a whole shall be eligible for an award. This expressly excludes from eligibility all of the following:

(a) supervisors

(b) partial contributors (e.g., any writer not responsible for the over-all design of the work)

© contributors working on speculation

(d) scores diluted by the use of tracked or pre-existing music

(e) scores diminished in impact by the predominant use of songs

(f) scores assembled from the music of more than one composer.

6. The Executive Committee shall resolve all rules interpretations and all questions of eligibility.

7. It is within the sole and confidential discretion of the Board of Governors to determine what awards, if any, shall be given.

It puts composer with an (s) at the end on more than one occasion. Does that imply that more than one composer can work on a score? I think it does, but then you get that rule towards the bottom that says only 1 composer.

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Yes but Williams basically started fresh and Hedwig's theme was the only returning theme, at least that's all I can really recall. Now COS would have been disqualified because of the re-use of music from SS.

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In all honesty, while KOTCS may end up being one of the better scores composed this year it still isn't Oscar worthy.

I think that says more about the sad state of film music.

Chances are it will be nominated.

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A majority of the damn films that will be up for awards on Oscar night haven't been released yet.

True. Most Oscar-contending movies are released in the fall and winter.

And we are in the fall and winter seasons. In a month and a half you'll have all of your contenders released.

And tell me a year in where Williams has composed a score and has not been nominated.

I cant recall any recent one.

There's a first time for everything.

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Since non of the prequel scores were nominated I highly doubt this one will be.

I thought JW didn't submit those for consideration?

I specifically remember that Revenge of the Sith was submitted. Granted, Williams had already garnered two nominations for more serious scores, so it's understandable that Star Wars was the odd man out.

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