James Horner Appreciation Thread

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

It is difficult to describe the vibrant, attractive and emotionally evocative music that James Horner has composed in a way that does it justice - because his music is just that damn good. Granted he's somewhat of a controversial figure because of plagiarism accusations and the fact that he breathes fire when criticizing peers or others in the biz', but who cares? He applies the music so well that those issues don't really matter.

It appears Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan is his most popular score on this board, but there's so much more to his broad palette, including the fantastical Krull, the action-packed and militaristic Aliens, the ballet-like beauty of The Land Before Time, the Irish wails and tragic romantic splendor of Titanic, the rolling pianos of Deep Impact, the colourful Spanish flair and excitement of The Mask of Zorro, and the fluttering and delicate romance presented in The New World, and many, many others.

Come on, Horner fans! Deep in the oceans of your hearts, you know Jamie is a legend that hasn't fallen to the wrath of Hans.

[AI 0]

He has written some great film scores, Aliens, Braveheart, Cocoon, come to mind.

[publicist 4,643]

I sincerely hope that "The Life before her Eyes" and "Boy in the striped Pyjama" have more than synth-augmented piano doodlings.

If anything, Horner is probably one of the last 'old pro's' - and i think his productivity isn't sinking because he's offensive to Holywood, but rather because he's just lost interest to compete for fascinating assignments like 'Transformers 2'.....

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

The man can write excellent music, I'll give him that.

[David Coscina 3]

I've been on a Horner kick lately and bought A Beautiful Mind, The New World and Spiderwick Chronicles. All are immensely enjoyable listening experiences. Horner is also one of the few composers that imbues some real depth in his orchestrations. I believe he continues to work in the old fashioned manner when using orchestra- that is, writing his scores down on manuscript. It was interesting to see some Behind-the-scenes shots of the Braveheart scoring sessions. The LSO were playing hand-inked parts. NOT parts spit out by a notation program. Interesting. OF course that was 1995. We have come a long way in the last 13 years (gosh has it been that long???).

[Morlock 11]

I used to like The New World. Until I heard Doyle's Hamlet.

[Ollie 1,059]

I used to like Horner until I started listening to Prokofiev.

I miss old school Horner. Up until 1992 he was good, ever since then he's just not listenable.

[Delorean90 42]

I sincerely hope that "The Life before her Eyes" and "Boy in the striped Pyjama" have more than synth-augmented piano doodlings.

If anything, Horner is probably one of the last 'old pro's' - and i think his productivity isn't sinking because he's offensive to Holywood, but rather because he's just lost interest to compete for fascinating assignments like 'Transformers 2'.....

"Transformers - Original Score Album (James Horner)"

Now that's something I wish I could have in my collection. That would've been the highlight of the film, I'm sure, and the finale cue would've been incredible--one more slam-bang finish!

The Rocketeer is my favorite, personally, and there's some really nice stuff that hasn't been released from it. I need to get TWOK and TSFS.

[publicist 4,643]

I miss old school Horner. Up until 1992 he was good, ever since then he's just not listenable.

Why anyone who loves broad orchestral scores could overlook the joys of scores - even if it just amounts to parts of them - like 'Perfect Storm', 'Zorro' or 'The Missing' is beyond me.

It's not that Horner has turned into Randy Edelman by 1992 and an elaborate epic/action piece like i. e. 'Escape' from 'Four Feathers' is something i gladly would take over some of the more acclaimed pieces by Elfman, Williams or Newton Howard.

Horner certainly is a joke as a composer often enough, but some of this grossly exaggerated reactions come off more than petty.

[Morlock 11]

Horner comes off as petty, which is a shame, since it clouds over cases when he actually has something useful and informative to say.

[Trent Hoyt 13]

Horner really can write some lush beautiful scores. He is my 2nd favorite living composer. It is a shame that he tends to repeat himself so much because it is obvious that he is capable of so much more. Apollo 13 really needs to see a proper release, the original OST is simply terrible. Most of the cues have jarring edits inter spliced with useless dialog from the film, its a shame because it is one of his best scores.

[odnurega1 0]

Horner comes off as petty, which is a shame, since it clouds over cases when he actually has something useful and informative to say.

Do you have any links to any online interviews in which Horner shows his "pettiness"? I would be interested in reading them.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Horner, at his best, is pretty hard to beat.

By anyone!

[Morlock 11]

Horner comes off as petty, which is a shame, since it clouds over cases when he actually has something useful and informative to say.

Do you have any links to any online interviews in which Horner shows his "pettiness"? I would be interested in reading them.

I have only once seen James Horner praise another composer's work. Ever. If he mentions someone else, it is generally with some sort of negative connotations. His valid observations about Troy (on his FMR interview) were clouded because of his harsh words about Yared (even though, they also are arguably valid points). Just about any time he mentions Williams or Goldsmith, it will be to highlight his modern approach. He lacks humility and gets very defensive very fast.

[Maglorfin 196]

Notorious and despised though he often is, Horner is still one of my favourite composers and has definitely done some great things for film music in the past. My all-time favourite Horner soundtrack is without so much as a second thought Aliens, a masterpiece which he will in my opinion never be able to surpass. True, the man could've restrained himself from reusing so much of his stuff all the time and use "the real thing" rather than electronics from time to time, but apart from that, he's a great composer and I often enjoy listening to his soundtracks.

[Morlock 11]

I love Horner's work. It's just very hard to discuss his stuff. Talking about his Hornerisms is futile, yet it's almsot impossible to avoid. I enjoy a great deal of Horner work.

[Ray Barnsbury 8]

Lots of great scores, though not as many in recent years. Some favorites are The Land Before Time, Glory, The Rocketeer, and Legends of the Fall. It's clear that I really need to get Star Trek II, as popular as it is.

[Marian Schedenig 8,193]

Sneakers is his best score, and Brainstorm is pretty damn cool, too.

[Melange 446]

Horners work is music I grew up with just as much as Jerrys and Johnnys. He was scoring several movies of the time.

I remember watching Star Trek II in the cinema, and that scene where they enter the Genesis cave with Horners music.

Aliens of course was a movie big amongst me and friends in my teen years, and the impact of his music on us was great.

Today, along with STII, my favourite Horner score is his work for Brainstorm. It is very clever stuff.

Yes there are some of the standard 'horner' moments in there, but for the rest of it he really wrote some experimental and beautiful score for the more supernatural scenes, akin to Corigliano's work on Altered States. A wonderful score.

[Red 75]

I'm a big Horner fan. Some of my favorite scores of his are Glory, Legends of the Fall, and Braveheart. It saddens me that he that he has lost his touch in the past 10 or so years, but we'll always have the 80's (up to the mid-90's). Maybe it's a sign of the times.

[Melange 446]

"I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"

We simply get more complex and cunning. 9-12 is a good age for more innocent friendships

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I had a lot of friends of that age.

Unfortunatly the restraining order ended that last year.

[Henry B 50]

For all his missteps and burnouts, Horner is one of the few remaining composers (and orchestrators) in the same league as Williams.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Not since 1997, when he poured all he had into Titanic.

[Red 75]

Well, all he had left.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

I miss old school Horner. Up until 1992 he was good, ever since then he's just not listenable.

For all the respect I have for you Mark, I will have to say the last phrase is the stupidest thing ever spoken.

He is still extremely listenable (Apocalypto excluded), that's always been a trademark of his sound, it's very easily listenable.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

I miss old school Horner. Up until 1992 he was good, ever since then he's just not listenable.

For all the respect I have for you Mark, I will have to say the last phrase is the stupidest thing ever spoken.

He is still extremely listenable (Apocalypto excluded), that's always been a trademark of his sound, it's very easily listenable.

He is so easy a listen that his music enters from one ear and goes out from the other

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Well, all he had left.

What he had left captured the heart of 25 million people!

[Maglorfin 196]

The Legend of Zorro is sometimes better than its predecessor, I daresay. :lol:

[Melange 446]

I had a lot of friends of that age. Unfortunatly the restraining order ended that last year.

Oh what a shame

What he had left captured the heart of 25 million people!

What is this? A tag line for a movie trailer? I can imagine it spoken in a veeeery deep voice.

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

Another thing caused by his self plagiarism is that taken on their own (and to a Horner newbie), nearly all his scores are pretty delightful.

[nightscape94 965]

I enjoy a core set of scores of Horner's.

[indy4 155]

I think Horner's pretty good, but I only have 6 of his scores.

[Koray Savas 2,251]

He's a decent composer. I'd rank him in between the good and the bad.

Commando. Always a refreshing score. Gotta love the steel drums!

[Indiana_Fett 0]

I love some of Horner's work. I'm 16 right now, and I can recall how much Horner and Williams' scores for We're Back! and Jurassic Park (respectively) affected me as a kid. If it wasn't Williams or Elfman that attracted me to film music as a kid, then it was Horner. He did a lot of movies that I used to watch as a kid, Fievel Goes West, The Land Before Time, Cocoon, The Rocketeer, Casper. Very interesting to find that certain sections of music were almost chiseled into my mind when going back to some of his works. For now though, The Rocketeer, Star Trek II, and Legends of the Fall are some of my most listened to scores, so I guess he's doing something right.

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

I also think that he is one of the few current composers who really know and understand the orchestra.

[indy4 155]

STII is fantastic, as is Titanic.

Apollo 13 is great.

I love "The Machine Age" from Bicentennial Man.

And I really need to listen to Casper and Field of Dreams more often.

[Ollie 1,059]

I miss old school Horner. Up until 1992 he was good, ever since then he's just not listenable.

For all the respect I have for you Mark, I will have to say the last phrase is the stupidest thing ever spoken.

He is still extremely listenable (Apocalypto excluded), that's always been a trademark of his sound, it's very easily listenable.

Seriously as much as you criticize Williams for his musical changes you can honestly tell me Horner's music is not stale and bland.

I mean it sounds like he's composing in his sleep, a few sections from this score, a few from this score and put them in a pot an there you have a new Horner score. You may want to hear it but not me.

A score doesn't have to be dissonat or atonal for one to call it unlistenable.

[Hitch 57]

Like Melange, I too was captivated by Horner's music on the big screen. Having seen STAR TREK 2, 3, KRULL, COCOON, ALIENS in my early years really got me into film scores in general. Incidentally my first soundtrack LP was ST2 and ALIENS was my first cassette tape. I've always had a deep love for Horner's music. There have been some magnificent scores (KRULL, THE LAND BEFORE TIME), gentler scores (THE MAN WITHOUT A FACE, TO GILLIAN, THE SPITFIRE GRILL). The only score I don't particularly like (and I told think I'm not alone in this) is PATRIOT GAMES. Maybe I'm not a synths fanatic but it doesn't do anything to me and using Khachaturian's Gayane Adagio again doesn't help it. I did laugh this morning while preparing lunch and listening to my ipod playing on the stereo which was playing DEADLY BLESSING. I wonder what Jerry Goldsmith thought of him ripping off his OMEN score I never mind the fact he repeats himself over and over again. Who cares if he borrows heavily from other composers??? Who hasn't!!! Won't ever stop me buying his cds. I'll be true Horner fanatic till my dying day.

Hitch's favourite Horner scores:

1980s: ST2, KRULL, THE NAME OF THE ROSE, ALIENS, WILLOW

1990s: CLASS ACTION, SNEAKERS, THE MAN WITHOUT A FACE, BRAVEHEART, TITANIC

2000s: THE PERFECT STORM, IRIS, HOUSE OF SAND AND FOG, AVATAR

Long live James Roy Horner

Can we start a James Horner petition to get STAR TREK IV re-scored??

[Melange 446]

The only score I don't particularly like (and I told think I'm alone in this) is PATRIOT GAMES.

Oddly enough, I think I'm alone in quite liking that score

[Hitch 57]

The only score I don't particularly like (and I told think I'm alone in this) is PATRIOT GAMES.

Oddly enough, I think I'm alone in quite liking that score

The minorities always have their say, don't ye?? What I meant to say if I had proof-read my own typo is that "I think I'm not alone in this". Sorry for the inconvenience caused.

[Trent Hoyt 13]

I watched Deep Impact today and outside of the rolling piano in the main theme its your typical lush Horner score. Its an Apollo 13 ripoff with small bits of Titanic thrown in for good measure. Its an average score but still an enjoyable one.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Patriot Games wasn't great because I'd say the film would have put Jamie to sleep.

[David Coscina 3]

I lost touch with Horner's stuff around the late '90s but Spiderwick Chronicles actually got me back interested in his music. Even though some of his recent offerings recall his exciting material from his earlier scores, I was bowled over by the SKILL that he has for orchestrating. Aside from Williams, I honestly think he's the best composer for orchestral scores out there now. One has but to listen to how he works with the orchestral choirs to hear how adept he is. He's also the only composer who can write a 15 minute cue and make it sound musical and a development from a single idea rather than a mash of unrelated musical ideas like so many posers with a bunch of bright shiny MIDI toys who know little to nothing about how a real orchestra operates.

It wasn't until I was able to hear Horner's music again that I was startled by the vast gulf that separates him from, oh, let's say the John Ottman's or Brian Tyler's of the film score world. Sorry but there really isn't much to debate on this one as I'm sure fellow musicians like Marcus and Jesse would agree.

[indy4 155]

Just listened to "The Place Where Dreams Come True" from Field of Dreams, and I really like it. It's very similiar to Elfman's "Finale" from Big Fish, though I don't think it's quite as good.

[Hitch 57]

Just listened to "The Place Where Dreams Come True" from Field of Dreams, and I really like it. It's very similiar to Elfman's "Finale" from Big Fish, though I don't think it's quite as good.

What you really meant to say was "Elfman is a hack and just tries to imitate Horner's style but falls flats on his face because he can't do syrupy very well"

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

Seriously as much as you criticize Williams for his musical changes you can honestly tell me Horner's music is not stale and bland.

I mean it sounds like he's composing in his sleep, a few sections from this score, a few from this score and put them in a pot an there you have a new Horner score. You may want to hear it but not me.

A score doesn't have to be dissonat or atonal for one to call it unlistenable.

Well see, the reason I think that composing in sleep mode is so listenable is because I'm always interested by different iteration of the same idea. I sort of think of it as a pan-career thematic development, and that aspect of it makes it an almost comfort food like thing to me. The basis for his works are very sound.

It's the same reason I think Love Pledge and the Arena is the best of AotC. Yes it's one more stylistic derivative of Belly of the Steel Beast, but it's still good, because it's based on more than just solid material.

It's why I think Insurrection, pastoral and action, is one of Goldsmith's top end scores. He finally takes that damn motif/theme he'd been using and using every score for the end of the 90s, and makes it work. He gives it what it should always have had.

No, they don't blow me away with shock value, nor do they end up being very challenging, but they are still intriguing. Those familiar phrases will never be as magnificent as something newly discovered, but mom's chicken soup will always win over the wife's.

Human's are naturally inclined to enjoy and find comfort in what they are familiar with.

So no, Horner's music isn't stale and bland quite yet, because his foundation is sound. I still felt that familiar tingle when I heard that tension Apollo 13/Titanic piece in Chronicles "Desperate Run Through..."

[David Coscina 3]

I think Horner's Sneakers minimalist theme has been developed over the course of various scores. I can see the bridge between A Beautiful Mind and Bobby Fischer as both dealt with mathematic genius'. The automated machine-like rhythm of this piece also served Bicentennial Man well too. Is this a rationalization for Horner quoting himself ad nauseum. Maybe a little. ALthough I do believe Horner is simply following the traditions that classical composers established long ago where they would have a theme from one piece and re-use it in a slightly different manner in another. I have made my peace with Horner on this point. I also never realized that the Prokofiev Philosopher's piece was actually listed in the Credits of Red Heat thereby exonerating him for that (which I always believed was his most blatant rip off of Prokofiev).

One other thing about Horner. Put on the track "Jenny" from The Rocketeer and tell me that anyone else has ever written something more beautiful or moving in the last 30 years. There are comparable pieces to be sure but this track has got to be Horner's most ambitious love theme. It is beautifully written with some excellent harmonic progressions and a soaring melody that he develops throughout the arc of the piece. Like I said, it's the THE BEST ever but to my mind it ranks up there with anything else written in the idiom. Until Tyler, Ottman, Bates, or any other young film composer writes something of this calibre, they won't get the same level of respect from me as a musician and a lover of film scores.

[publicist 4,643]

I think Horner's Sneakers minimalist theme has been developed over the course of various scores. I can see the bridge between A Beautiful Mind and Bobby Fischer as both dealt with mathematic genius'. The automated machine-like rhythm of this piece also served Bicentennial Man well too. Is this a rationalization for Horner quoting himself ad nauseum. Maybe a little.

Not really. I really like symphonic Horner (some of it, anyway), but i'm simply bored to tears by this very device you're describing. Horner doesn't 'explore' it, he just recycles it and it becomes a joke in the process.

To add insult to injury, in an old 'Soundtrack' issue Horner and Ron Howard joke about other composers and how they just use old music to phone it in. Horner, on the other hand, always tries something new. Since Howard now refuses to use Horner as his composer, i guess the joke's now on him...

[Quintus 5,399]

I've not listened to any of his music for a while now, but I utterly destroyed my Titanic ost in the cd player which played it. Me and the girlfriend at the time watched the movie twice at the cinema and she adored the score as much as I did. In fact I once rated him in the same league as Williams, but that was before the revelations began...

Still, his romantic melodies remain absolutely the best in Hollywood, with something like Cocoon's touching main theme being amongst his cream of the crop. His action stuff is none to shabby either.

But that was then. He's pretty much a none entity nowadays as far as I'm concerned, which is a lazy shame.